Education not to blame for BNK48's Nazi moment: Official

[LomSak27]

10 hours ago, Chippy151 said:

 

"The content is left up to the teacher".

 

I would imagine the history teachers themselves are not really interested in world history. So they probably don't teach it.

I would love to know what world history is being taught in Thai schools and who is teaching it.

 

I'm somewhat suspicious of this ... not getting thai teachers off the hook but they do not teach WWII for a reason and that reason is probably a directive, or it was at one time so .... 

 

Same thing for many aspects of thai and SE Asian history. That is not a "teachers" decision. 

That is beside and in addition to if the teacher is interested in history or not.  They have to toe the line and if they don't that would be a reason for firing-removal from a job.

[faraday]

6 hours ago, ozmeldo said:

 

 

I teach Thai kids (yes, oh! the humanity!!!). In fact I teach very smart, well educated Thai students. I can tell you there is not a great deal of time spent on ww2. That is in the best of schools.

 

Great to have a top job isn't it; I used to be in the SAS.

 

????

[alfalfa19]

10 hours ago, ozmeldo said:

How many Thai Jews that fell under the boot of Nazi facism? Zero.

 

How many 'Holocost®' survivors still alive? About zero.

 

Keep the shirt sweetheart.

 

I'm personally not all that concerned about upsetting a bunch of Israeli backpackers.

nvm

[tifino]

Teachers don't bring the subject up, as it is not in the Curriculim therefore not Assessible. They would have to put a Stop to their lesson plan and advise that the following topic for discussion is not going to be touched in the Exam. 

Therefore it would be deemed a troublesome waste of time, and the teacher ends up with a class of bored cocoon sleeping larvae... 

[stanleycoin]

1 hour ago, faraday said:

Great to have a top job isn't it; I used to be in the SAS.

 

????

Didn't i meet you in the bar the other day,  in Pattaya. 

[Emdog]

May be a slight silver lining to this whole flap: perhaps all the attention to this will penetrate the mental haze among Thai young folks if they follow this group. Could learn a smidge about Nazism and all that. Very slight chance, but still a bit higher than zero.

[Chippy151]

1 hour ago, LomSak27 said:

 

I'm somewhat suspicious of this ... not getting thai teachers off the hook but they do not teach WWII for a reason and that reason is probably a directive, or it was at one time so .... 

 

Same thing for many aspects of thai and SE Asian history. That is not a "teachers" decision. 

That is beside and in addition to if the teacher is interested in history or not.  They have to toe the line and if they don't that would be a reason for firing-removal from a job.

Maybe.

I am not convinced that curriculum or the content that teachers actually teach is a priority in the majority of Thai schools.

I am sure directors or principals concern themselves more with school ceremonies and activities, the image of the school, "income" etc.

What the kids are actually learning is way down on the list of priorities.

Sorry, but that is how I see it.

[briansbiology]

Thais avoid teaching world war 2 because lets not forget which side they effectively were on......sweep that under the rising sun carpet 

[kingstonkid]

“The issue occurred because students don’t understand the origin of these symbols, about where they actually came from,” she added.

Teachers are too busy teaching dates and things that students can memorize.

 

The other problem that we have is that the teachers know nothing about international history because they were never taught it.

 

There are no books in the school's international history and for that matter, the kids are not even really taught about Thai history.  Just ask a Matayom student about world Wart 2 or why Kanchaburi is so important to Brits and Aussies

 

[Lupatria]

12 hours ago, Chippy151 said:

While world history subjects including World War II must be taught, even at the elementary school level, no specifics are laid out and the content is left up to the teachers.

Recently I talked to a young fellow from a western European country. He works as a professor at a Bangkok university. I asked him what he is teaching, and almost choked when he answered: political science. We both laughed when I replied, teaching political science in a country under junta rule, and known to be the world champion of coups d’etat is like teaching social science in Saudi Arabia or North Korea. 
I studied education, so my next question was: what is the curriculum of the university in his field? Answer: there is none, every professor has his own plan for teaching. I further asked him if he had to provide his “plan” to the university to get approval, he only answered with a silent frown. 

Regarding the statements of “officials” in the original article with nonsense like this:
“Nitsuda Apinuntaporn of the Basic Education Commission said there’s no need to improve the curriculum.” And “I don’t think it’s necessary to adjust the curriculum, because the content in history lessons are facts that can’t be changed,” she said. “Students learn about it, but they might not be able to remember.” That raises the question, what is their education worth? I also hope the guys in charge for medical science have a more qualified approach.

I suggest she, and her colleagues should try to get a similar job in a western country, to find out first hand about the value of their own level of “education”.

Sorry for the long post.
 

[Lupatria]

12 hours ago, Lungstib said:

If she had just a smattering of local religious education she could have passed her shirt off as Buddhist. This image stands quite proudly on the edge of the highway running toward Tha Ton from Mae Chan and as far as I know no-one has suggested its offensive.

Why should anyone think its offence? They are two different symbols!

For all who don't know how to google, or didn't get the answer from their wives:

 

[wwest5829]

13 hours ago, Lungstib said:

If she had just a smattering of local religious education she could have passed her shirt off as Buddhist. This image stands quite proudly on the edge of the highway running toward Tha Ton from Mae Chan and as far as I know no-one has suggested its offensive.

Look at the Nazi swastika...now look at the symbol above. Same?

[Pravda]

13 hours ago, Lungstib said:

If she had just a smattering of local religious education she could have passed her shirt off as Buddhist. This image stands quite proudly on the edge of the highway running toward Tha Ton from Mae Chan and as far as I know no-one has suggested its offensive.

 

When you make a post like this, then perhaps it's time to stop posting because you have just totally embarrassed yourself.

[Lungstib]

Not being a Nazi, Hindu or Buddhist it seems there could easily be some confusion over symbols. To the best of what is now confirmed as my limited knowledge they are all called swastika or some similar spelling. I wonder why we get confused?

[DM07]

14 hours ago, Lungstib said:

If she had just a smattering of local religious education she could have passed her shirt off as Buddhist. This image stands quite proudly on the edge of the highway running toward Tha Ton from Mae Chan and as far as I know no-one has suggested its offensive.

That is....for the 1000s time...because context matters!

>sigh<

THIS...is a religious symbol, clearly presented in and representing of a religious context!

What the braindead dance- bimbo was wearing, was - clear to everyone with 2 working braincells and a google- image search... A NAZI FLAG, signified by a black swastika, tilted, in a white circle on a red background!

 

[spidermike007]

This is such nonsense. It is about someone deflecting, as usual. Taking responsibility is not something most Thais are very good at. Of course it is about education. And Thailand has a very poor system. Most know that. But some will still attempt to obfuscate the facts. The teaching of world geography and history would go a long way toward dispelling this level of ignorance. 

 

Nitsuda Apinuntaporn of the Basic Education Commission said there’s no need to improve the curriculum in response to the public outcry, which included denunciations from the German and Israeli embassies. How does one even respond to such incompetence, such weakness, such a lack of courage, vision, and fortitude?

 

Face is no doubt, the greatest form of weakness, a human can engage in. Many will say it is societal, cultural, etc. No matter. It is the absolute and complete lack of the ability to introspect, and look within for the source of any problem, shortcoming, conflict, or issue. It is the polar opposite of spirituality, and therefore an absolute scourge on Buddha, and all of the precepts he taught. By practicing face, you are denying your spiritual heritage. You are refusing to man up. To take responsibility for your actions. If a man or a woman cannot, and will not take responsibility for their actions, the problems they create, the mistakes they make, and the issues they involve themselves in, what are they? Are they still an adult? Are they a complete individual, if they allow themselves to be limited by such infinitely small social convention? 

 

Who cares what people think of you? For those of us with high self esteem, it just does not matter. Sure, close friends and family. But strangers on the street? Who gives a rat's butt about this? It means nothing what they think, nor what they say about you. They count for nothing. They are just people, and people you do not know, nor will ever see again. Face is rife with self doubt, and by subscribing to this weakness, and man or woman is made a far lesser person. For those of us with high self esteem, we know who we are. What others think, what society thinks, what a guy or gal thinks, means less than zero.

 

Real men or women, simply own a situation, and take responsibility for their errors or mistakes. Or a bad educational system, in drastic need to improvement! 

Small men, social deviants, or emotional adolescents deflect, obfuscate, attempt to confuse, and do everything in their power to deny that they made a mistake, or that they are responsible in any way, or on any level. They make up narratives about fake news, or alternative facts. Anything to avoid looking within, for the source of the problem. Anything.

[monkeycu]

15 hours ago, Lungstib said:

If she had just a smattering of local religious education she could have passed her shirt off as Buddhist. This image stands quite proudly on the edge of the highway running toward Tha Ton from Mae Chan and as far as I know no-one has suggested its offensive.

Have another look at the symbol, the Nazi's turned it around so its no longer a Buddhist sign.

Or are my eyes seeing it different to others

[dinsdale]

Education or lack thereof. A friend of mine turned at at my apartments when I wasn't there. The owner, an 'educated' person let me know. Asked where my friend was from. I said South Africa. She said "South Africa? But he was white". Try to explain that Africa ISN'T one country with only black people to a Thai. Most will think your're mad.????

[Jingthing]

SPIN SPIN SPIN, I'm amazed that the Jew Mass Media has reached everyday Thailand. The Thai's didn't dondon it because Japan didn't allow it, that swastika was always around Asia. Blame the internet, not the Thais.

Jew Mass Media? That's how Nazis talk.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Trexpat]

15 hours ago, Lungstib said:

If she had just a smattering of local religious education she could have passed her shirt off as Buddhist. This image stands quite proudly on the edge of the highway running toward Tha Ton from Mae Chan and as far as I know no-one has suggested its offensive.

Spiritual Beginning for the Swastika

For the Hindus and Buddhists in India and other Asian countries, the swastika was an important symbol for many thousands of years and, to this day, the symbol can still be seen in abundance - on temples, buses, taxis, and on the cover of books. It was also used in Ancient Greece and Rome, and can be found in the remains of the ancient city of Troy, which existed 4,000 years ago. The ancient Druids and the Celts also used the symbol, reflected in many artifacts that have been discovered. It was used by Nordic tribes, and even early Christians used the Swastika as one of their symbols, including the Teutonic Knights, a German medieval military order, which became a purely religious Catholic Order. But why is this symbol so important and why did Adolf Hitler decide to use it?

 

And here so many of the responders are blaming a lack of education, we as europeans have been taught to despise the symbol because of a decade of misuse, perhaps here they are taught the other thousands of years of more appropriate use. Tolerance and understanding may be the key here.

[HAKAPALITA]

24 minutes ago, DM07 said:

Seriously?

You are trying to defend the Thai- education system?

A system that - among other short comings- produces Hitler - and Nazi - incidents in Thailand on a REGULAR basis?

Hitler themed - hotel rooms, Hitler chicken grills, Nazi- parades in schools, Hitler murals...to name but a few?!

Seriously?

The Thai- education system?

 

Harry looks like  Michael Jackson to me .Not all Jews are Snowflakes, they dont let the Morons worry them.

[tifino]

1 hour ago, IAMHERE said:

SPIN SPIN SPIN, I'm amazed that the Jew Mass Media has reached everyday Thailand. The Thai's didn't dondon it because Japan didn't allow it, that swastika was always around Asia. Blame the internet, not the Thais.

Adolf spun the Roulette wheel... hedging all bets on what he thought couldn't lose!

  -all tokens on red45 white45 and black45, and then spun the wheel backwards;

 -  'aryan not a clue where it was gunna land?

 

 

thankfully the ball eventually landed on the red white and blue in '45

[thaicurious]

14 hours ago, ozmeldo said:

Not really bc it's backwards genius. Maybe you could use the smattering.

Thank you to the good posters who spoke out against the racism of this guy's other post and to those who seconded their comments.

 

Not that further evidence of racism is required but this to me is too apropos to pass...

 

A Buddhist symbol which generally faces one way while a similar Nazi symbol always faces the opposite direction does not make the Buddhist symbol backwards, genius.

 

But thinking the Buddhists' a backwards image of a Nazi symbol might show you're thinking Thai Buddhists inferior to Nazis, which is sort of exactly a definition of racism.

 

So your learned racism doesn't just reveal itself in your sentences as you say them, doesn't just show up though your conversation might try to cloak it as political opinion, rather the stench of it reeks though your very thought processes even as you attempt to so-called correct the thinking of another poster. Oh well, at least you're consistent.

 

Physician, smatter thyself.

[HalfLight]

1 hour ago, DM07 said:

To the westerners who want to simply bash Thailand and any comment whatsoever regarding this article about the Eduction system not being to blame

This is such BS, In the estimation of people like you, the best way to feel good discarding what is obviously the case but which you don't think *should* be the case, is to accuse people who know better than you of 'Thai-bashing'. It's simplistic, naive, yuppie politically correct and plain wrong.

 

In my opinion you badly need to get a life, preferably an educated life. Get out and smell the roses. The Thai roses.

 

 

[Bendi]

It is a nation who dont care. Dont care abaout the people in the nation. Dont care a bout people outside the nation. Totaly neglect.

Me, me, me.

Thats thai.

Been here 10 years. Nothing amazes me anymore.

The selfishnes, layzines..i dont care thing that thai people have.

Have to stay some more years. My bed. I lie in it. But later il be gone. Not staing here for my golden years.

[HalfLight]

12 minutes ago, thaicurious said:

Thank you to the good posters who spoke out against the racism of this guy's other post and to those who seconded their comments.

 

Not that further evidence of racism is required but this to me is too apropos to pass...

 

A Buddhist symbol which generally faces one way while a similar Nazi symbol always faces the opposite direction does not make the Buddhist symbol backwards, genius.

 

But thinking the Buddhists' a backwards image of a Nazi symbol might show you're thinking Thai Buddhists inferior to Nazis, which is sort of exactly a definition of racism.

 

So your learned racism doesn't just reveal itself in your sentences as you say them, doesn't just show up though your conversation might try to cloak it as political opinion, rather the stench of it reeks though your very thought processes even as you attempt to so-called correct the thinking of another poster. Oh well, at least you're consistent.

 

Physician, smatter thyself.

If you want to show that this guy is uneducated, ask him to explain the symbolisim of the clockwise-rotatint swastika. If he cannot, then he should be ignored.

[sanemax]

18 minutes ago, thaicurious said:

 

But thinking the Buddhists' a backwards image of a Nazi symbol might show you're thinking Thai Buddhists inferior to Nazis, which is sort of exactly a definition of racism.

 

 

TBF , when he said "backwards" , he probably  didnt mean mentally backwards , he likely just meant *in the opposite direction*

[thaicurious]

2 minutes ago, HalfLight said:

If you want to show that this guy is uneducated, ask him to explain the symbolism of the clockwise-rotating swastika. If he cannot, then he should be ignored.

I tend to think people show themselves for who they are or at least eventually. Alone citing facts does not determine thoughtfulness particularly not now that so much can be googled, a great resource but the processing of information is internal and, to my mind, mostly self taught, influenced variously but inevitably self directed.

 

I mentioned only because the other comments in response to his focused on just one isolated aspect of his racism while this shows it not specific but systemic.

[thaicurious]

9 minutes ago, sanemax said:

TBF , when he said "backwards" , he probably  didnt mean mentally backwards , he likely just meant *in the opposite direction*

But to be even fairer, more weight could have gone to your argument hadn't he revealed himself racist in another post. But even then it would still possibly indicate as I noted though you'd be more correct in leaving room for doubt that perhaps it was just disconnected phraseology. However, his already vocalized racist commentary gives that weight to my argument that his word usage was less random and more telling.

[DM07]

37 minutes ago, HalfLight said:

This is such BS, In the estimation of people like you, the best way to feel good discarding what is obviously the case but which you don't think *should* be the case, is to accuse people who know better than you of 'Thai-bashing'. It's simplistic, naive, yuppie politically correct and plain wrong.

 

In my opinion you badly need to get a life, preferably an educated life. Get out and smell the roses. The Thai roses.

 

 

I agree, but please make clear, that you are NOT quoting me here!