After reading the thread about the new rules for keeping 800,000 baht in the bank for a 'retirement' visa etc, I'm sure many foreigners living in Thailand are thinking about alternative destinations for their retirement.

 

This could be a case of jumping out of the frying pan and into the fire!  For example, neighbouring countries in Asia hardly offer the security of knowing that you can peacefully spend your retirement without the surprise of new visa rules.

 

What would help to calm the mind would be a country where the financial requirements to get a long-term visa are modest, a country which has a decent healthcare system, pretty women, acceptable food, acceptable cost of living etc etc.

 

Most importantly, (IMHO), a country which provides permanent residence after a few years...

 

I don't think such a country exists in Asia?  Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

 

Are all the countries that offer PR only in Latin America?  (I could go and live in southern EU, but I think the cost of living, city taxes, state intrusion etc are not acceptable for me).

 

 

Off the top of head (confirm yourself of course) these ones --

 

Panama

Colombia (after 5 years retirement status)

Peru

Mexico

Ecuador

Add 

 

Permanent residency is only available to foreignersthat have an immediate family relationship with a Costa Rica citizen or foreigners that have held a temporary residency status for at least 3 years.

Belize if you are a Brit.

Philippines has an attractive offer, a special retirement resident visa (SRRV). Check here: https://pra.gov.ph/

The SRRV is a lifetime visa and its holders are exempt from Bureau of Immigration requirements. SRRV-holders are also eligible to work, study or invest in the Philippines.

 

There are several versions of the SRRV each with different requirements.

 

If you're retired in Thailand, best to get the "classic" version. For those 50 years of age and above with a pension of at least USD$800 per month if single and/or a pension of at least $1,000 per month if married, the time deposit amount is USD$10,000, with an additional deposit of USD$15,000 for each dependent. If no pension, deposit USD$20,000.

 

The deposits can be converted to investments in the Philippines, such as buying a condominium or for long- term house and lot leasing. A foreigner cannot buy or own land in the Philippines, however, they can buy a condo, provided 60% of the other unit owners are Philippine citizens.

 

Pitcairn's ? they seem to be dying off and need fresh stock with a blind eye to age.

How about Thailand?

You just need to "work" for a while. Even if you setup a business just for the purpose of getting permanent residency later this is actually not too expensive.

In case you have a friend who is running a business already and who can employ you it's actually quite cheap, and facturing in that you get "free" healthcare while employed you might even safe money by doing this compared to a retirement extension

Why is permanent residency so important to you?

Why is permanent residency so important to you?

 

Because PR in most countries (including Thailand), usually gives you security of tenure - you cannot be forced to leave the country due to some unforeseen change in visa rules.

 

I have lived in Thailand since 2002 (and also worked in Burma and Laos).

 

Where was I provided with a business visa, work permit etc from the word go?  In Burma and Laos

 

Where was a work permit refused because I refused to pay a bribe?  In Thailand......

 

I never managed to tick all the required boxes to apply for PR in Thailand due to the corruption that meant that I wasn't able to show 3 years of legal employment.  (Of course, because the WP was refused, I never worked.....)

 

 

The Philippines seems to be the best option in Asia. However, I'm told the food is crap compared to Thailand, and crime is worse. Against that, English is spoken more widely. I'll stick with Thailand until they make it unviable.

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

The Philippines seems to be the best option in Asia. However, I'm told the food is crap compared to Thailand, and crime is worse. Against that, English is spoken more widely. I'll stick with Thailand until they make it unviable.

The local food isn't much good, but there are foreign restaurants everywhere with good food.

Never encountered any crime while I was there, everyone was very polite, even when walking through poor areas at night.

 

A couple of my pals tired of the Philippines and recently moved to Cambodia.

(They're both drunks, and Cambodia is much cheaper for booze, beer 50c/pint)

Most of Latin America offers a permanent residency at some point in time.  The purpose of a temporary residency visa is to make ejecting you easier if you are unsavory (happy drunks are generally tolerated, but belligerent drunks might not have their visas renewed, for example.)

 

Some nations offer citizenship after a significant investment/donation/bribe to the local Treasury.

 

Keep in mind that both 'permanent' residency and citizenship can be revoked at the stroke of a pen anywhere in the world.

15 hours ago, Lacessit said:

The Philippines seems to be the best option in Asia. However, I'm told the food is crap compared to Thailand, and crime is worse. Against that, English is spoken more widely. I'll stick with Thailand until they make it unviable.

 The food is indeed crap and the country more dangerous by far than LOS. 

All things considered, Thailand is the best option for retirement in SE Asia. 

Europe;

 

In Cyprus, you can purchase citizenships.

 

Most find Sweden quite liberal and flexible when it comes to PR and Swedish (EU) passport.

Most everywhere gives permanent residency to people who put on the requisite amount of time and/or money, usually 2-7 years. HK and Singapore are nearby obvious examples but also Malaysia and Philippines and probably most others. And of course in the caribbean and Central America many also do. And most permanent residents can also vote and hold office too. Imagine thailand allowing that? LOL they can’t even figure out how to get their own people how to vote. But wouldn’t it be interesting if the governor or mayors of pattaya and Phuket and Samui were farangs? Now that would be funny, but very common in other places.

Belize is a nice country as long as you stay out of Belize City it self way Life English spoken and easy to get PR I lived there 4 years and easy excess to Mexico 

17 hours ago, Lacessit said:

The Philippines seems to be the best option in Asia. However, I'm told the food is crap compared to Thailand, and crime is worse. Against that, English is spoken more widely. I'll stick with Thailand until they make it unviable.

I have had a look in to Panama and it looks quite attractive with discounts for the retired community on a variety of things.   They also appear to have quite a good medical system and year round warm weather.  You can read up on this on their website.

1 hour ago, jasonsamui55 said:

Most everywhere gives permanent residency to people who put on the requisite amount of time and/or money, usually 2-7 years

Agreed.. Most developed countries give PR and citizenship fairly routinely for people who immigrate legally and properly.. My Thai sister in law is now a UK national.. I could go to anywhere european, or the developed former colonies (oz nz canada etc etc) easily.. Add in central and south America.. 

The xenophobic attitudes of denying naturalization is really a minority position.. 

18 hours ago, jackdd said:

How about Thailand?

You just need to "work" for a while. Even if you setup a business just for the purpose of getting permanent residency later this is actually not too expensive.

In case you have a friend who is running a business already and who can employ you it's actually quite cheap, and facturing in that you get "free" healthcare while employed you might even safe money by doing this compared to a retirement extension

you have never had a business in Thailand have you?

I lived in Thailand for 10 years but moved back to NZ and will be here till the kids are through school. I am off to Bali in a few months to see if it is a good alternative to Thailand for after the kids finish school.

18 hours ago, Banana7 said:

Philippines has an attractive offer, a special retirement resident visa (SRRV). Check here: https://pra.gov.ph/

The SRRV is a lifetime visa and its holders are exempt from Bureau of Immigration requirements. SRRV-holders are also eligible to work, study or invest in the Philippines.

 

There are several versions of the SRRV each with different requirements.

 

If you're retired in Thailand, best to get the "classic" version. For those 50 years of age and above with a pension of at least USD$800 per month if single and/or a pension of at least $1,000 per month if married, the time deposit amount is USD$10,000, with an additional deposit of USD$15,000 for each dependent. If no pension, deposit USD$20,000.

 

The deposits can be converted to investments in the Philippines, such as buying a condominium or for long- term house and lot leasing. A foreigner cannot buy or own land in the Philippines, however, they can buy a condo, provided 60% of the other unit owners are Philippine citizens.

 

The ph is on track for better growth than thailand and you would be far better investing in property there than here.  Personally I will consider Japan as well as nearby countries.

North Korea, all's you have to do is make sure they see your bible … no 90 day check-ins … would be great for a few of the posters here. On the serious side, a few countries in South America if you don't mind living in an ex-pat walled compound community, and always being in a group with armed guards when outside the walls. Good news is it pretty cheap to live there.

7 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

Agreed.. Most developed countries give PR and citizenship fairly routinely for people who immigrate legally and properly.. My Thai sister in law is now a UK national.. I could go to anywhere european, or the developed former colonies (oz nz canada etc etc) easily.. Add in central and south America.. 

The xenophobic attitudes of denying naturalization is really a minority position.. 

Los Angeles alone has nearly 100,000 thais living there who are welcomed with citizenship.  And like I said earlier you can't even mail a letter here without a passport. 

After 35 years living in Thailand, except for a spell of 6 years spent in Taiwan from '86 to '93, Thailand is still fine as far as I am concerned. Taiwan would also be fine if I was looking for an alternative. Both places operate a reasonable non-immigrant status system, with no need to opt for residency unless you have a particular reason for so doing.

40 minutes ago, crees said:

North Korea, all's you have to do is make sure they see your bible … no 90 day check-ins … would be great for a few of the posters here. On the serious side, a few countries in South America if you don't mind living in an ex-pat walled compound community, and always being in a group with armed guards when outside the walls. Good news is it pretty cheap to live there.

That characterization of expat life in many places in Latin America is simply not true. It's a very large area. Just do research and find the safer places which are generally considerably safer than most U.S. cities. 

50 minutes ago, robertson468 said:

I have had a look in to Panama and it looks quite attractive with discounts for the retired community on a variety of things.   They also appear to have quite a good medical system and year round warm weather.  You can read up on this on their website.

Yeah it has it's advantages and has a fantastic visa program with very low financial requiements. But it's generally very hot and humid and the cost of housing in Panama City and nearby beach cities is quite high. So expats are often attracted to Boquette which has pleasant weather but is isolated. I haven't been there but I have been to nearby Costa Rica. 

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Yeah it has it's advantages and has a fantastic visa program with very low financial requiements. But it's generally very hot and humid and the cost of housing in Panama City and nearby beach cities is quite high. So expats are often attracted to Boquette which has pleasant weather but is isolated. I haven't been there but I have been to nearby Costa Rica. 

Can't imagine it being hotter than Thailand.  Bangkok was ranked hottest city in the world by the world meteorologist society based on temp, humidity, dewpoint and not even considering smog lol.

Try Kushner, he is selling USA permits for investment +fees

20 minutes ago, tlandtday said:

Can't imagine it being hotter than Thailand.  Bangkok was ranked hottest city in the world by the world meteorologist society based on temp, humidity, dewpoint and not even considering smog lol.

It's the humidity that makes the Panama City area extremely unpleasant. But there are other areas besides Boquette that would be more pleasant, some internal highlands areas that are popular with expats as well. A cheaper provincial very very hot city is David (which is I think an hour's bus ride to more pleasant Boquette). 

1 hour ago, tlandtday said:

Los Angeles alone has nearly 100,000 thais living there who are welcomed with citizenship.  And like I said earlier you can't even mail a letter here without a passport. 

I'll have to disagree with that. I lived in LA for the better part of 30 years. I know quite a few Thai people and they are a big part of the reason I moved to Thailand for retirement.

 

It is true the Thai population is sizable in LA. What is failed to document is how many are actually there legally or illegally. From the Thai people I ask a sizeable portion of those are illegal. The USA has not been handing out citizenship to Thais. Most have had to marry in with a US citizen. Sometimes paying big money.

 

Also, something that doesn't hit the news much is the USA is now deporting people from SE asian countries if they have any sort of criminal records. Some SE Asian people who were refugees as a result of the Vietnam War are being deported after living in the USA legally for 30+ years.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/12/world/asia/trump-deport-cambodians.html