18 minutes ago, sandyf said:

People welcomed into the UK and lived there for over 30 years not allowed to vote.

A hypocritical referendum.

Thousands of UK citizens not allowed to vote due to shortcomings in government systems.

An incompetent referendum

A life changing decision based on one vote out of 10s of millions.

An ill-conceived referendum.

Proven illegal activity by the leave campaign.

A fraudulent referendum.

 

"Democratic" - probably the most inappropriate adjective that could be used.

Thanks for your rant Sandy.

 

People welcomed into the UK and lived there for over 30 years not allowed to vote. How many exactly? Also many who have been there a few years and were allowed to vote.

 

A hypocritical referendum. Can you show us your evidence for this?

 

Thousands of UK citizens not allowed to vote due to shortcomings in government systems. I would say many thousands so that would have made the vote leave with an even bigger majority, is that what your saying?

 

An incompetent referendum. Can you show us your evidence for this and not delivering the result the referendum itself?

 

A life changing decision based on one vote out of 10s of millions. How many shall we have the best of 5. Wasn't there only one vote going into the ECE?

 

An ill-conceived referendum. Your evidence for this?

 

Proven illegal activity by the leave campaign.

A fraudulent referendum. Go on then tell us how and why?

 

"Democratic" - probably the most inappropriate adjective that could be used. What is your version of democracy. 2 votes if you have a degree? Please enlighten us?

 

 

Brexiteers wont believe this...... I d like to hear why...

 

 

1 hour ago, wilcopops said:

Brexiteers wont believe this...... I d like to hear why...

 

 

So what happened with the polls for the 2016 referendum result? Your Polls lied to you then. Was that a one of fluke. It would seem not.

1 hour ago, wilcopops said:

Brexiteers wont believe this...... I d like to hear why...

 

 

Because it's the typically manipulated 'truth' - which has become all to common nowadays....

 

A shame, as I'd previously liked stephen fry.  I've no doubt that he knows very well that this video manipulates the 'facts'*, but he posted it anyway ☹️.

 

* e.g. Implying that the majority now want to remain according to opinion polls - which is why the first part of this video was supportive of opinion polls and desperately trying to explain why they previously were wrong.....  Not to mention, a fair number of opinion polls indicate that leave would win if there was another referendum at the moment - which is one of the reasons why MPs aren't keen on the idea....

On 4/7/2019 at 12:34 PM, malagateddy said:

Brits do not do that..only surrendering nations

 

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I don’t need to May is doing it already. What a disgrace we should have left on the 29th no point in kicking the van down the road we need our freedom NOW

Bt99..shall I ask darksidedog if he would consider holding our financial stake once we properly word our bet?

Right..lets put down the exact wording re the bet.
Single bet only as thai politics should in all honestly be avoided by expats imo.
Once we have phrased the wording of the wager..perhaps the Moderator DARKSIDEDOG could pm you and I his thai bank details then both of us lodge 1,000 baht into his account. ?????
What do you say???


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2 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

Because it's the typically manipulated 'truth' - which has become all to common nowadays....

 

A shame, as I'd previously liked stephen fry.  I've no doubt that he knows very well that this video manipulates the 'facts'*, but he posted it anyway ☹️.

 

* e.g. Implying that the majority now want to remain according to opinion polls - which is why the first part of this video was supportive of opinion polls and desperately trying to explain why they previously were wrong.....  Not to mention, a fair number of opinion polls indicate that leave would win if there was another referendum at the moment - which is one of the reasons why MPs aren't keen on the idea....

QED

It seems nOw Brexiteers are blaming the Queen.

Yet further evidence that they understand neither the constitution nor democracy.

7 minutes ago, wilcopops said:

It seems nOw Brexiteers are blaming the Queen.

Yet further evidence that they understand neither the constitution nor democracy.

 

 

Foolish comment!

13 minutes ago, wilcopops said:

It seems nOw Brexiteers are blaming the Queen.

Yet further evidence that they understand neither the constitution nor democracy.

Do you ever think before you post....?

2 minutes ago, transam said:

Do you ever think before you post....?

 

 

That would be one of those rhetorical questions then........................????

2 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

That would be one of those rhetorical questions then........................????

Well I always sing before posting....????

Just shows what these self serving MP's say and what they do and change their mind. If you haven't got a VPN my apologies.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6904667/In-words-read-MPs-House-Hypocrites-swore-honour-Brexit-U-turned.html

7 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Thanks for your rant Sandy.

 

People welcomed into the UK and lived there for over 30 years not allowed to vote. How many exactly? Also many who have been there a few years and were allowed to vote.

 

A hypocritical referendum. Can you show us your evidence for this?

 

Thousands of UK citizens not allowed to vote due to shortcomings in government systems. I would say many thousands so that would have made the vote leave with an even bigger majority, is that what your saying?

 

An incompetent referendum. Can you show us your evidence for this and not delivering the result the referendum itself?

 

A life changing decision based on one vote out of 10s of millions. How many shall we have the best of 5. Wasn't there only one vote going into the ECE?

 

An ill-conceived referendum. Your evidence for this?

 

Proven illegal activity by the leave campaign.

A fraudulent referendum. Go on then tell us how and why?

 

"Democratic" - probably the most inappropriate adjective that could be used. What is your version of democracy. 2 votes if you have a degree? Please enlighten us?

 

 

Shouting the odds doesn't make things right.

There has only ever been 3 national referendums and they have all been fundamentally flawed. It was by good luck rather than judgement that the other two did not have a contentious result. The politicians screwed up and now they are suffering the consequences of their actions, and it is not over by a long way.

Political reform could well be the brexit bonus.

3 hours ago, wilcopops said:

It seems nOw Brexiteers are blaming the Queen.

Yet further evidence that they understand neither the constitution nor democracy.

God forbid where's the lese-majeste law when you need it! It is alleged that the venerable Archbishop of Canterbury persuaded May to talk with Corbyn. She being a church-going daughter of a vicar.  If God is on our side who can be against us?

 

3 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Just shows what these self serving MP's say and what they do and change their mind. If you haven't got a VPN my apologies.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6904667/In-words-read-MPs-House-Hypocrites-swore-honour-Brexit-U-turned.html

Peter Oborne. 

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

A hypocritical referendum. Can you show us your evidence for this?

The cliche'd response of those with no argument?

"burden of proof fallacy"

 when someone claims that others don’t have a burden of proof with regards to their own arguments, or when someone attempts to shift their own burden of proof to someone else.

More religious sh&t..if you honestly believe that..well..as religion or rather lack of common manners and decency to other people has been responsible for more deaths than anything else..what can I say.
Just hope that your god be it he/she is oh so happy with all deaths caused by religious beliefs. Will he/she also be happy that his/her top kiddies live in the lap of luxury whilst many struggle to put food on the table?????
Just saying

God forbid where's the lese-majeste law when you need it! It is alleged that the venerable Archbishop of Canterbury persuaded May to talk with Corbyn. She being a church-going daughter of a vicar.  If God is on our side who can be against us?
 

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Another prominent leaver has gone the full Oborne.....

 

Without question, the most concerning part of Brexit discourse over the past few years has been how the most stubborn of Leave campaigners have doubled down on erroneous positions, adopting ever more extreme views as the jaws of reality bite down on our attempts to leave the EU.

Faced with genuine complexity and immovable obstacles, those who maintained that Brexit would be easy are becoming increasingly desperate and erratic in their prescriptions for how things might be saved. Problems that were once dismissed as trivialities or as Project Fear are now rapping sharply at the door. First among these is probably the prospect of a no-deal Brexit.

 

The Brexit ideologues would sooner barbecue their grandmothers than acknowledge any misjudgment of the biggest issue in post-war British politics. Admittedly, changing one’s mind can be difficult – especially for public figures. But the constant mining for excuses, however irrational and absurd, is intellectually unhealthy. The fact that is has become so normal, is a worrying sign for British democracy.  

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-no-deal-queen-monarchy-ukip-andrew-lilico-republican-a8862931.html

10 hours ago, wilcopops said:

The cliche'd response of those with no argument?

"burden of proof fallacy"

 when someone claims that others don’t have a burden of proof with regards to their own arguments, or when someone attempts to shift their own burden of proof to someone else.

So I will take that as a no then.

22 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

So I will take that as a no then.

Again another response that only reinforces the perception of paucity of intellect in the Brexit camp.

Brexit is nearly dead in the water. A campaign which stated with no defined parameters nor common aim is doomed to eat itself, and it appears to be true to form.

How can Brexit actually happen with such a fractious group of squabbling disciples and factions?

The country is not divided 50/50 leave remain, it is 50% Remain and the rest is just raggle-taggle disparate groups of Xenophobes racists, the gullible and those obsessed with some idyllic view of "the past". There is no common Brexit plan, no unified movement

There is no leave majority at all; just that half of the country want 17 million different things, many of which aren't even Brexit...if they bothered to think about it

So now we are faced with another 6 months of watching the UK sink slowly into economic, political and diplomatic oblivion as parliament (our sovereign authority) gradually wrenches back control like a parent trying to get petulant toddler to let go of a dangerous toy.

 

 

 

 

55 minutes ago, wilcopops said:

Again another response that only reinforces the perception of paucity of intellect in the Brexit camp.

Brexit is nearly dead in the water. A campaign which stated with no defined parameters nor common aim is doomed to eat itself, and it appears to be true to form.

How can Brexit actually happen with such a fractious group of squabbling disciples and factions?

The country is not divided 50/50 leave remain, it is 50% Remain and the rest is just raggle-taggle disparate groups of Xenophobes racists, the gullible and those obsessed with some idyllic view of "the past". There is no common Brexit plan, no unified movement

There is no leave majority at all; just that half of the country want 17 million different things, many of which aren't even Brexit...if they bothered to think about it

So now we are faced with another 6 months of watching the UK sink slowly into economic, political and diplomatic oblivion as parliament (our sovereign authority) gradually wrenches back control like a parent trying to get petulant toddler to let go of a dangerous toy.

 

 

 

 

If you make a bold claim it more than justifiable to provide some sort of evidence to support your claim. I was not asking for a list of journals just some evidence. If it was a believe or opinion then the poster (sandy) just had to say.

 

So all the nonsense you have written to try and justify nothing is irrelevant to what i was asking.

 

So another 6 months as you put it the UK sink slowly into economic, political and diplomatic oblivion as parliament (our sovereign authority) gradually wrenches back control like a parent trying to get petulant toddler to let go of a dangerous toy.

 

You do like to make some sweeping statements. Oblivion great adjective. So does that mean we wont have a parliament? So the economy would be what exactly. We have been hearing that for 3 years and nothing. It would with your definition or are you been melodramatic with your words... again

Probably would be..but then both backstabbing parties would then have to go cap in hand to..the ..BREXIT PARTY..DUP AND UKIP AND BEG FOR ASSISTANCE TO FORM A GOVT.???????[emoji6]

What if you end up with a hung parliament? according to some political observers that is a possibility.

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3 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

If you make a bold claim it more than justifiable to provide some sort of evidence to support your claim. I was not asking for a list of journals just some evidence. If it was a believe or opinion then the poster (sandy) just had to say.

 

So all the nonsense you have written to try and justify nothing is irrelevant to what i was asking.

 

So another 6 months as you put it the UK sink slowly into economic, political and diplomatic oblivion as parliament (our sovereign authority) gradually wrenches back control like a parent trying to get petulant toddler to let go of a dangerous toy.

 

You do like to make some sweeping statements. Oblivion great adjective. So does that mean we wont have a parliament? So the economy would be what exactly. We have been hearing that for 3 years and nothing. It would with your definition or are you been melodramatic with your words... again

Your lack of comprehension is breathtaking

So did Kenny Dalgleish..many times[emoji6]

The only one with any power left Arlene Foster says no, yes, maybe [emoji848]

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1 minute ago, wilcopops said:

Your lack of comprehension is breathtaking

Is that a remainers way of saying I don't agree with you or you don't agree with me!

51 minutes ago, wilcopops said:

Your lack of comprehension is breathtaking

Well stay seated then...????

6 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

If you make a bold claim it more than justifiable to provide some sort of evidence to support your claim. I was not asking for a list of journals just some evidence. If it was a believe or opinion then the poster (sandy) just had to say.

 

So all the nonsense you have written to try and justify nothing is irrelevant to what i was asking.

 

So another 6 months as you put it the UK sink slowly into economic, political and diplomatic oblivion as parliament (our sovereign authority) gradually wrenches back control like a parent trying to get petulant toddler to let go of a dangerous toy.

 

You do like to make some sweeping statements. Oblivion great adjective. So does that mean we wont have a parliament? So the economy would be what exactly. We have been hearing that for 3 years and nothing. It would with your definition or are you been melodramatic with your words... again

 

Correct! The burden of proof lies with someone making a claim not on anyone else to disprove. 

If you claim a teapot is orbiting the Sun between the Earth and Mars you need to provide evidence. Not to do so questions the veracity of the claim and the age of the claimant.

 

In light of general dissatisfaction with current UK political parties can I recommend a party that has more sensible policies than any of the current major parties. They have sensible policies and my vote.

 

https://www.loonyparty.com/proposals/policies-a-z/

 

 

15 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

If you make a bold claim it more than justifiable to provide some sort of evidence to support your claim. I was not asking for a list of journals just some evidence. If it was a believe or opinion then the poster (sandy) just had to say.

Evidence, as far as the brexiteer is concerned, is nothing more than fake news. They firmly believe that everybody that should have had the right to vote had the right to vote, and that Vote Leave have done nothing wrong.

 

Whatever happened to 'beyond reasonable doubt'?, politicians that supported the referendum breached their own guidelines on human justice.