Why the Chinese are infinitely more important than Western tourists to Thailand

[Rimmer]

A flame has been removed

[ThomasThBKK]

Out of curiosity, do they smuggle their wares through the Chinese customs, or do they just add markup to the price they get back in China? Like the good old days in CCCP when you could buy half of Moscow with a pair of Levi's.

Smuggle mostly.

Another reason they often buy luxury watches and co is to get money out of china.

Credit card transactions aren't limited yet, so you can buy a 100k usd item, return it to the dealer and ask for cash back or just resell it with a loss.

Let's see how much they spend when all these loopholes will be closed [emoji120]



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[tifino]

well, after reading more replies, it does seem more likely that they are simply well funded plunderers...

[DrTuner]

2 minutes ago, tifino said:

well, after reading more replies, it does seem more likely that they are simply well funded plunderers...

China has been weaponizing tourism for a while now, they are the pioneer troups of the looming invasion. Nothing benign about anything pooh bear does.

[Thungrat]

From where they know how much a tourist spends???

[brianbbb]

Don't see much for there money reaching the villages unlike westerns support 

[chilli42]

As population of potential tourists of course the Chinese are more important - a much overdue discovery.  There are more of them, they reside much closer and their income levels are expanding rapidly each year (been to London, Paris or Rome lately?).  The “West” is the exact opposite, there are fewer, the income levels particularly among the middle class are being crushed, and it’s a long unpleasant flight.  There was never a day in Thailand when penniless retirees and back packers were considered valued tourists (or valued anything).  At best these groups were tolerated.  I don’t think anyone cares where a tourist comes from.  Tourism at the ground level is a business of individuals.  All that the hotel, bar, restaurant etc care about is the size of the individual tourists wallet.  They aren’t dealing with whole populations.  Sure there will be Mandarin speaking Thai’s in hotels and high end shops etc ... what does that matter?  Don’t worry, English will remain a major tourist language the Indians have that covered for you.

[tifino]

6 minutes ago, brianbbb said:

Don't see much for there money reaching the villages unlike westerns support 

there you go!  the Chinese remain as the anonymous rabble - the tourist

 

The westerner, by becoming personal, and helping the locals -   have gotten under the Thai skin, and the tourist tag has become Secondary

[MickeyDelux]

lol... this must be appalling to those farangs who want to feel important.

 

The premise of the article is absurd. When as a westerner I was important to Thailand, whenever that was, did I get some special privilege? My coffee was still the same price as everyone elses.  I guess I missed that farang VIP treatment. 

 

fwiw- Whenever I go out in Chiangmai or even to HongKong and some mainland Chinese guy spits in the street or on the floor of the mall or a Chinese family begins screaming the locals don't react as if they are important but rather as if they are rude.

Edited April 25, 2019 by MickeyDelux

[mindfulness]

19 hours ago, Benroon said:

I'm struggling to understand the significance of that ? Whether they stay here a month or a day, whether they tour extensively or stay in their room, they are outspending westerners on a presumably pro rata basis ?

 

It's just confirmation that western sex pests with less money than the wealthier and less sex pesty Chinese are going to be asked to jump through a few more hoops or go home.

They have already started to infiltrate the GoGo bars, and seem to be in ‘playboy’ mode throwing it around like a oil sheik.  

 

I can see the headlines now in 5 to 10 years time, ‘Chinese man barricades himself inside condo’, Chinese man gets shot for dating cops girlfriend etc, etc, and the list goes on. 

[MickeyDelux]

now there is one thing that does make the Chinese important in a sense...

 

 

[Hardie]

20 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

Probably not as English is an important language in China.  English speakers in China is over 200 million and rising, with 50 million secondary school children now studying the language

Regardless of what you read, almost no one speaks English in China, even in hotels. Once you leave the airport, you're largely on your own. Maybe that's why there are few independent travelers there...

[ramrod711]

20 hours ago, Wilsonandson said:

Will this lead to Manadrin becoming the prefered 2nd language in Thailand?

Sent from my SM-A700FD using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

The daughter of my "across the street" neighbor has been in China for three years now learning the language. When she comes back she usually works as a tour guide in Chiang Mai.

[Mark mark]

21 hours ago, otherstuff1957 said:

I've done some work for companies that cooperate with TAT and saw and interesting TAT report a couple of years ago. 

 

The Chinese do spend, on average, about 20% or more than Europeans/Americans/Aussies.  However, a breakdown of where they spend their money was very interesting.  It is traditional for Chinese tourists to return to China with expensive gifts for their friends and relatives.  This is a 'face' thing so they are often willing to spend a big chunk of their total expenditures on these gifts. 

 

So, what do they buy?  They go to the high-end stores on Suk and buy brand-name stuff.

 

Unlike Western tourists, they don't usually patronize small, local shops, smaller guesthouses or local restaurants.  Consequently, even though they spend more money, much, if not most of their money goes to foreign companies and their wealthy Thai partners.  A relatively small portion of their spending goes directly to local merchants and local SME businesses. 

 

The tourists that benefit Thai SMEs the most are actually the much-maligned backpackers!

Right ON !!!

[Sticky Wicket]

4 hours ago, 0815 said:

Go to one of the big shopping malls (like Central Festival in Chiang Mai) and you will see where their money goes...

Yeh, into Rich Thai and Chinese pockets

[Mark mark]

21 hours ago, otherstuff1957 said:

I've done some work for companies that cooperate with TAT and saw and interesting TAT report a couple of years ago. 

 

The Chinese do spend, on average, about 20% or more than Europeans/Americans/Aussies.  However, a breakdown of where they spend their money was very interesting.  It is traditional for Chinese tourists to return to China with expensive gifts for their friends and relatives.  This is a 'face' thing so they are often willing to spend a big chunk of their total expenditures on these gifts. 

 

So, what do they buy?  They go to the high-end stores on Suk and buy brand-name stuff.

 

Unlike Western tourists, they don't usually patronize small, local shops, smaller guesthouses or local restaurants.  Consequently, even though they spend more money, much, if not most of their money goes to foreign companies and their wealthy Thai partners.  A relatively small portion of their spending goes directly to local merchants and local SME businesses. 

 

The tourists that benefit Thai SMEs the most are actually the much-maligned backpackers!

That is why we Westerners ARE still liked, ... or even Loved !!!  .... And also for our liberal values, Fredoms, and Education, just to start off with, ... huge numbers of Chinese are sending their children to get Educated abroad, Right .... To Western Countries, Right. 

 

... And the trouble with the Immigration Department, They want us Westerners, to Obey the rules also !!! "God Dam them" !!! Har Har only kidding, .... (Gross sarcasm here) .... The Immigration Department, ...  are just being ... ... .... The Immigration Department ! ... And that is what they DO !!! ....  So the Free ride is over Boys ? ... well time to join the other 4 billion in the real world. ... Sorry.

 

... I wonder how much a Year it would cost the Thais to stay in the UK, or Australia in "Costs" ... a LOT more then it costs us to stay here I bet !!! ...

[justin case]

zero dollar chinese tourists + how many are ATM for the whole family, sick buffalo included?

[justin case]

9 minutes ago, Mark mark said:

That is why we Westerners ARE still liked, ... or even Loved !!!  .... And also for our liberal values, Fredoms, and Education, just to start off with, ... huge numbers of Chinese are sending their children to get Educated abroad, Right .... To Western Countries, Right. 

 

... And the trouble with the Immigration Department, They want us Westerners, to Obey the rules also !!! "God Dam them" !!! Har Har only kidding, .... (Gross sarcasm here) .... The Immigration Department, ...  are just being ... ... .... The Immigration Department ! ... And that is what they DO !!! ....  So the Free ride is over Boys ? ... well time to join the other 4 billion in the real world. ... Sorry.

 

... I wonder how much a Year it would cost the Thais to stay in the UK, or Australia in "Costs" ... a LOT more then it costs us to stay here I bet !!! ...

oh no, a farang that is a farang basher

 

thais can buy house & land in western countries

western countries do not think they will put the land in their suitcase and run with it

 

thais can stay FOREVER if married to a farang , starting with 5 YEARS (in my country) than the get , hold on, not only permanent stay, but CITIZENSHIP

 

thais can start a business, no need for 4 locals to be hired

 

thais don't need 10x more money in savings than average farang in his country

 

etc etc

[Mark mark]

6 hours ago, helloagain said:

Shall we all just **** off and leave these racist thais to their own devices. We already know they want our money and not us. Chinese arnt much better than animals. Ive seen at breakfast raising a leg and fart. They stand next to each other and shout. When there is a buffet like at fantasy show its gone in seconds and they leave their table strewn with their rubbish. Eat like pigs. Yeh real quatity tourists NOT. They thais make it easy fir them to be here like they did for the russians. Another breed of quality tourists not. 

And they have made it easy for YOU also.

[Ctkong]

21 hours ago, otherstuff1957 said:

I've done some work for companies that cooperate with TAT and saw and interesting TAT report a couple of years ago. 

 

The Chinese do spend, on average, about 20% or more than Europeans/Americans/Aussies.  However, a breakdown of where they spend their money was very interesting.  It is traditional for Chinese tourists to return to China with expensive gifts for their friends and relatives.  This is a 'face' thing so they are often willing to spend a big chunk of their total expenditures on these gifts. 

 

So, what do they buy?  They go to the high-end stores on Suk and buy brand-name stuff.

 

Unlike Western tourists, they don't usually patronize small, local shops, smaller guesthouses or local restaurants.  Consequently, even though they spend more money, much, if not most of their money goes to foreign companies and their wealthy Thai partners.  A relatively small portion of their spending goes directly to local merchants and local SME businesses. 

 

The tourists that benefit Thai SMEs the most are actually the much-maligned backpackers!

So the Chinese are putting money into the coffers of the well connected Thai elites. I think the current policy is doing just that. Big corporations making money out of the Chinese. The ruling elites  couldn’t care less about the well being of the small people. They don’t even pay much taxes too. 

[Mark mark]

1 minute ago, justin case said:

oh no, a farang that is a farang basher

 

thais can buy house & land in western countries

western countries do not think they will put the land in their suitcase and run with it

 

thais can stay FOREVER if married to a farang , starting with 5 YEARS (in my country) than the get , hold on, not only permanent stay, but CITIZENSHIP

 

thais can start a business, no need for 4 locals to be hired

 

thais don't need 10x more money in savings than average farang in his country

 

etc etc

Yes because Thais do not want to, or can not afford to go to Foreign Countries, or get the Visa, ... How hard is it for them to get a Visa to go there in the first Place !!! A lot harder than it is for me to get one to stay here I think ? New Immigration rules or not ! .... and there is not the obvious arrival pressure there in Foreign Countries, ... like there it here .... any way all of what you say should change any way, ... it should be MUCH MUCH harder for them to stay in our countries, ... it is the "We are a Multi Cultural" Country bullshit, ... which is just fielded by our useless Politicians, to fake the GDP numbers, and keep them selves in power, .... and the Greedy Developers. ... Lucky the Thais are not so stupid I think my self ... "Get money from Tourism", .... celebrate their own Culture ... and then they all can just Go Home !!! ... Right ... I am not a foreigner Bassher, ... I just want them to reason, ..the Obvious ! ... That socially and Politically, ... WE are STILL, very much on top !!! ... And if you can not see that, ... well you are doing something wrong, I think.

[ThomasThBKK]

So the Chinese are putting money into the coffers of the well connected Thai elites. I think the current policy is doing just that. Big corporations making money out of the Chinese. The ruling elites  couldn’t care less about the well being of the small people. They don’t even pay much taxes too. 

We would buy this brand name stuff too if they didn't have luxury bs tax on it.

I can literally take a flight to germany, buy a watch way cheaper than here, get VAT back at the airport, take a flight back and it was still cheaper [emoji23][emoji848]

For the saved money i could prolly stay 2 weeks in italy at the garda sea and have a holiday...

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[Ctkong]

21 hours ago, madmitch said:

These articles always fail to mention that the average stay of a Chinese visitor is significantly shorter tha the average stay of Western tourists and, in particular, Russians, who generally tend to stay in one place for their entire two to three week stay.

The itinerary for a typical Chinese tour is shorter but more packed with activities. The Chinese always try to get the most bang for their bucks. This was told to me by my many tourist guides. Chinese spent their holiday differently from the westerners. While westerners tend to just coop up in one place relaxing by the beach or pool ,taking leisure massages, hours of dining for the duration of their stay, the Chinese will just try to squeeze all sightseeing and shopping into as little time as possible. Ever saw any Chinese ( from china) lazing about the hotel pool wasting important time doing nothing? That would be a sacrilege to the chinese .  remembered once vacationing at Novotel rayong beach resort. Many Europeans there spending their time each day in a standard routine. After morning breakfast, lounge by the beach chair or the pool until time for lunch with a massage or yoga session in between. Dinner also at the resort. I didn’t see them leaving on the bus to venture outside at all . Scandinavian tourists I presumed .i asked one of them how long they spent at the resort. He mentioned to me that they ,as a group, came directly to rayong Novotel  ( klaeng area) resort from the airport. Also going back straight to airport from there. Not stopping by Bangkok either. 11 days all in. One hotel resort and all leisure. He asked me how long I was staying and I replied. Two days. And that include going sightseeing to Chanthaburi town more than an hour drive away.

Edited April 25, 2019 by Ctkong

[Berkshire]

5 hours ago, Jim Brantley said:

Every tourist likes to know their visit is important and they are as much appreciated as they appreciate the  country they are exploring.  This article would seem to suggest that the Chinese visitors are more important than Western travelers.  I think there are many more countries that would like my presence more than Thailand; so, I guess I will spend my money elsewhere.  No one likes to be thought of, or treated, as a second class tourist.

The article was written by a westerner.  It was his perspective, not the Thais.  Which is why I don't understand why some of you are taking this so personal.  The guy is just pointing out the demographics.  It doesn't mean Thailand wants more Chinese than westerners, but it does suggest that Thailand will get more Chinese than westerners.  In no way does it remotely say Thailand doesn't want westerners.  But hey, spend your money elsewhere if you please.  Just don't blame the Thais for your misinterpretation of the facts. 

Edited April 25, 2019 by Berkshire

[Ctkong]

9 minutes ago, ThomasThBKK said:

We would buy this brand name stuff too if they didn't have luxury bs tax on it.

I can literally take a flight to germany, buy a watch way cheaper than here, get VAT back at the airport, take a flight back and it was still cheaper

For the saved money i could prolly stay 2 weeks in italy at the garda sea and have a holiday...

Sent from my LYA-L29 using Tapatalk
 

Chinese buy luxury goods overseas mainly to fly under the radar of their authorities. They don’t want their names to be flagged out in the purchases. 

[Ctkong]

1 hour ago, mindfulness said:

They have already started to infiltrate the GoGo bars, and seem to be in ‘playboy’ mode throwing it around like a oil sheik.  

 

I can see the headlines now in 5 to 10 years time, ‘Chinese man barricades himself inside condo’, Chinese man gets shot for dating cops girlfriend etc, etc, and the list goes on. 

The mainland Chinese are racists to the core. I don’t think they find the brown bodies in the go go’s much attractive. As a novelty ,yes. But girlfriend material ? ????

[Mark mark]

8 minutes ago, Ctkong said:

So the Chinese are putting money into the coffers of the well connected Thai elites. I think the current policy is doing just that. Big corporations making money out of the Chinese. The ruling elites  couldn’t care less about the well being of the small people. They don’t even pay much taxes too. 

This is what the (Corrupt ?) Political, and Business Elite are doing in just about EVERY COUNTRY !!!

 

It just seems like Human nature Unfortunately, the excesses of Greed, the more you have the more you want !!! Sad Really, but it is not only Thailand, it is every where !!! ... Just look around your self, ... The Yellow shirts in France, the Climate Change group in London, the Loonie Vegans in Melbourne ... etc, Etc, Etc ... all People fairly, Justifiably I think ? (Except for the vegans ?) ... complaining about the Elite that really, ... Just do not consider ANY of us !!! ...

 

Just take a look around your selves Brothers, ... ... IF you are NOT just one of them I guess ? ... The Greedy Ones ? ...

[Lashay]

4 hours ago, Duck J Butters said:

Exactly, there is massive money to be made off the Chinese here as a foreigner with a business.

 

I can personally attest to witnessing this change as I and my wife have several stem cell and anti-aging clinics throughout Thailand. Europeans come to Thailand still looking for Dollar Store prices and 50 cent beers like Thailand is still some third world dump that they heard about after watching the movie The Beach with Leonardo Di Caprio.

 

While the Chinese come to Thailand and are dropping $50k USD on stem cell treatment like it’s water to waste and another $50k on fun after the stem cell because they are now feeling superhuman.

 

The idea of a Westerner dropping $50k USD on anti-aging is laughable at best. I’d be hard pressed to get any American or European friends ( rich by Western standards ) to spend $3k USD which is my wife’s absolute minimum discounted price for stem cell treatment.

 

Bottom line is we just aren’t rich enough anymore ( well, I am, all thanks to Chinese tourists )  to compete with the Chinese tourist and we look poor and stingy in comparison. So the Thais have lost interest in us.

 

But if you have business in Thailand, you learn to love the Chinese tourist. China is building hi-speed rails that will connect China and Thailand and well, Thailand’s projection of 100 million tourists by 2030 is probably an underestimate. I would expect closer to 300 million tourists / year. 

 

The world is getting smaller and smaller thanks to technology ( singularity by 20240 ) and we are just at the very beginning of the gold rush that is Southeast Asia. Getting set up in Southeast Asia right now is like setting up shop during the California Gold Rush. You’re gonna get stupid rich no matter what business you’re in: We haven’t  seen anything yet my friend. There is stupid money to be made in Thailand and Asia in general. Stupid money. Like one of my wife’s Chinese patients just donated his yacht in Phuket to her clinic. Why? Because he doesn’t use it and was thankful that she made him feel younger and better. The yacht is worth well over 30 million baht but that was nothing for this guy. Chump change.

These are chinese high end 1-10%ers type, there are not 80 million of them. The 80 million are mainly factory, shop, manual labour workers so forth. The 1-10% from most developed country's will easily drop from 50k on same type of treatment, just they do it in other country's with better medical reputations.

 

Now you could argue, due to basic population the chinese 1-10% are a huge number, and you would be right. And if thailand could tap that market well it would be a modern day gold rush.

 

But here is important factor, how many 1-10% ers do you know who want to go to same place as their "unwashed masses"? Think of all the nearby mass market tourist destinations your country goes to, then ask yourself, do the rich go there as well? Or do they avoid it like the plague? The company CEO does not want to rub shoulders with his factory workers while on holiday. Europe and the US are getting the real big spending chinese, thailand is mainly the bottom of the market

 

Thailand has been going on for years, and still does, about "quality tourists", well package tourists, no matter the country they come from, are numerous but never, ever "quality" and more non "quality" tourists you have harder it will be to attract the quality.

 

 

[Ctkong]

2 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

Chinese tourists are the biggest spenders in the world. Last year, their tourism receipts totalled US$258 billion, almost twice that of runner-up USA.

 

There is an economic boom of Chinese travellers globally. Because Chinese goods generally cost 21% more than the global average in 2017, international mobility allows Chinese travellers to make their purchases abroad.

According to a study by Bain, the Chinese account for 32% of all spending on personal luxury goods. However, for many years, they have done most of their buying outside of China.

http://www.chatchat.com/the-rise-of-chinese-millennial-shoppers/

 

Chinese buy overseas because they are leery of imitations or counterfeits in their home country. Overseas enforcement are more stringent than theirs. 

[Lashay]

3 hours ago, howbri said:

Chinese start their children on English lessons as early as 2 or 3. I taught in Shanghai for 4 years and everyone wanted to be my friend to improve their English.

Yet none of the chinese coming here seem to have more than a word or two of english. That should tell you a lot about them