Is the closure of your favorite bar or restaurant imminent?

[scubascuba3]

6 minutes ago, MarcelV said:

The curtain is gonna fall for MANY bars very soon. It's unavoidable.

Well, Brian Flowers and Mister Egg from le Pub have started a hunger strike, it's beyond desperate

Edited November 7, 2021 by scubascuba3

[hotandsticky]

On 10/30/2021 at 3:48 PM, Leaver said:

 

Good question, kinyara.  

 

It's not that I am not seeing it, it's just whether or not such investment will be successful, or not, in the future.  Only time will tell.

 

I have often said that tin roof beer bars day's are numbered here.  Main reason is, they are ground floor.  The land owner is wasting the strata. (the air above the tin roof)

 

What's the point of having 50 beer bars under a tin roof, when you can build a condo block or hotel that has 30 floors with 10 condo's / hotel rooms per floor, so 300 rentals or sales? 

 

Another reason was, who is going to pay 90 baht to sit in the heat, dust, traffic noise, mosquitos, beggars, and hawkers, whilst listening to loud <deleted> music by a young Thai DJ, and paying to take a leak in filthy toilets, when for the same price, or cheaper, you can go to a nice gentleman's club, for example?  

 

The use of the land changes.  They can now build and sell condo's with water views to wealthy Bangkokians, for example.  

 

However, on the point of investment, let's just imagine a big Chinese company bought the land where Soi Made in Thailand sits.  The land would be in a Thai company's name, but controlled through the usual methods. 

 

Imagine they built something like The Base, or a large hotel.  Say they do a deal with all the Chinese tour companies for their customers to stay there, or rent the condo's to Chinese holiday makers on the equivalent of the AirBnB platform in China, like what happens at The Base and elsewhere.

 

The Thai land owner gets their money for the sale of the parcel of land, obviously.  

 

A Chinese architect will probably be used to design the building.

 

A Thai construction company will probably be used, but many of them use Burmese laborers.  

 

A lot of the construction materials will be made in Thailand, but a lot also made in China.  For all we know, for such a project, tiles, taps etc may be shipped from China by the company, similar to the way they did in Sihanoukville in Cambodia for the casinos.  

 

Once completed, there's some work for some 300 baht a day Thai's, but many of the cleaners may be Burmese as well.

 

The rental transactions are all done in China.  That money never even hits Thailand.  

 

So, what really has been "invested" in Pattaya / Thailand in this case?  

 

Whilst the above is a hypothetical for Soi Made in Thailand, we have already seen it with the tourism industry in Thailand.  Chinese owned hotels, boats, buses, restaurants etc.  They even built a fake Thai Temple for Chinese tourists.  Remember that one?

 

Getting back to general "investment" in Pattaya.  In years gone by we have seen many starry eyed newbies open a bar, only to go broke 12 to 18 months later.  In many cases, these guys have over capitalized, building it bigger, newer, shinier etc, only to see the market was not prepared to pay 100 baht a beer, for example.  

 

So, there's sound investment, then there is a waste of time and money.  

 

Time will tell for many new businesses and refurbs around Soi LK Metro, Pothole, Baukhao and Tree Town, and whilst this area may do well in the future, it comes at the expense of bars and nightclubs going broke in other areas. 

 

In my opinion, Walking Street will not be able to compete.  Their rents are too high, which is reflected in their pricing, with most of the market is no longer prepared to pay, or can afford to pay, with a viable alternative a short distance away.  

 

So, whilst there may be investment in one area, what about the lost investment in another area, or do you think there are enough tourists, particularly western tourists,  to keep building endless bars, hotels, shopping malls, restaurants, gogo's, gentleman's clubs etc?  

 

 

 

 

You cannot argue with that summary. I don't see the MIT site being anything other than another Base.

 

If you could turn the clock back 50 years your blueprint would not include beer bars and entertainment venues within 500 metres of Beach Road. That is prime residential and tourist accommodation with high end retail.

 

The beer bars, Go-Go's etc would start around Buakhao/Third Road.................................evolution was not built overnight. 

[Leaver]

3 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Well, Brian Flowers and Mister Egg from le Pub have started a hunger strike, it's beyond desperate

 

Interesting.

 

I would think such actions, if picked up by Thai media, would be sailing very close to making those in power here lose face, and we all know there can be nasty consequences for that.  

[jacko45k]

11 hours ago, MarcelV said:

The curtain is gonna fall for MANY bars very soon. It's unavoidable.

Already seeing reports of high rents in Treetown and rent increases in LK Metro, in anticipation of a Dec 1st opening. That does not bode well because the customer base will be 'shallow' for a spell yet. 

[fredscats]

11 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Well, Brian Flowers and Mister Egg from le Pub have started a hunger strike, it's beyond desperate

They are all going to close,  jumping through hoops just to get here,   expensive must have medical insurance,(of course not if young),but then not much money there, then the property market     deader than the Dodo,demolish it

 Thailand as major retirement destination is finished,but then so is Thailand et al

[kinyara]

10 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

Interesting.

 

I would think such actions, if picked up by Thai media, would be sailing very close to making those in power here lose face, and we all know there can be nasty consequences for that.  

In terms of influence and media gravitas I think of the open letter written to the Thai government by the billionaire, ( Forbes info ), foreign CEO of Minor Group International, owner/operator of several hotel chains and countless food & beverage outlets which employ thousands in the industry. Somewhat less so the private actions of a couple of shophouse bar renters at the seedier end of the Pattaya sex industry, nothing against them personally.

[kinyara]

Went past Witherspoon's Beach Road today and it looks like it has bitten the dust.

[Olmate]

16 minutes ago, kinyara said:

Went past Witherspoon's Beach Road today and it looks like it has bitten the dust.

Hasn.t been open for ages.Have they departed? 

[kinyara]

16 minutes ago, Olmate said:

Hasn.t been open for ages.Have they departed? 

Looked like the interior has been gutted of all fixtures and fittings. 

[Olmate]

31 minutes ago, kinyara said:

Looked like the interior has been gutted of all fixtures and fittings. 

Hardly a sole in the other either..? 

[jacko45k]

15 hours ago, kinyara said:

Looked like the interior has been gutted of all fixtures and fittings. 

Yeah I passed a place on Buakhao the other day and all the contents were being moved out onto a truck. I think this was an Indian restaurant and the tables and seats were going elsewhere. A lot of those opened before Covid.... dreams shattered. 

[jwdub12]

18 hours ago, kinyara said:

Went past Witherspoon's Beach Road today and it looks like it has bitten the dust.

I could be mistaken but didn't they open the BR location during the pandemic? If so I'd be curious about the thinking behind that decision.

Edited November 10, 2021 by jwdub12

[kinyara]

28 minutes ago, jwdub12 said:

I could be mistaken but didn't they open the BR location during the pandemic? If so I'd be curious about the thinking behind that decision.

No you're correct, it stuck out at the time as one of the few openings. Presumably thought they got a decent deal for the location but gambling on an early return to normal. I hardly ever saw a customer in there in there when they were allowed to open. The Pig and Whistle was another that sticks out as getting their timing completely wrong.

[jacko45k]

5 minutes ago, kinyara said:

The Pig and Whistle was another that sticks out as getting their timing completely wrong

Not the 'Big and Whistle'? There and a hundred or more Indian restaurants.....

[kinyara]

5 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Not the 'Big and Whistle'? There and a hundred or more Indian restaurants.....

Lol, forget about the big re-branding exercise :))

[Mr Meeseeks]

6 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Yeah I passed a place on Buakhao the other day and all the contents were being moved out onto a truck. I think this was an Indian restaurant and the tables and seats were going elsewhere. A lot of those opened before Covid.... dreams shattered. 

[champers]

23 hours ago, kinyara said:

Looked like the interior has been gutted of all fixtures and fittings. 

Am I right in saying that Witherspoons on Soi Buakhao; at the R-Con bend; is currently in the process of being extended?

There are now no bars on Klang between Beach Road and 2nd Road. Pre-Covid I would say there was at least 6

 

[treetops]

27 minutes ago, champers said:

Am I right in saying that Witherspoons on Soi Buakhao; at the R-Con bend; is currently in the process of being extended?

They have taken over the original R-Con Corner Bar, which is linked at the back to the R-Con bar they recently took over.  Signs up for a German and Mexican restaurant there and I also saw a dartboard installed and the bar re-positioned.

[Leaver]

On 11/8/2021 at 10:29 AM, kinyara said:

In terms of influence and media gravitas I think of the open letter written to the Thai government by the billionaire, ( Forbes info ), foreign CEO of Minor Group International, owner/operator of several hotel chains and countless food & beverage outlets which employ thousands in the industry. Somewhat less so the private actions of a couple of shophouse bar renters at the seedier end of the Pattaya sex industry, nothing against them personally.

 

I never suggested his actions would influence and decisions made by authorities, but the headline "Farang business owner on hunger strike" written in Thai's, for Thai media, may get some interest, with their attitude being, how dare any farang protest in such a way, hence, a loss of face.    

 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Leaver

[Leaver]

On 11/10/2021 at 2:24 PM, treetops said:

They have taken over the original R-Con Corner Bar, which is linked at the back to the R-Con bar they recently took over.  Signs up for a German and Mexican restaurant there and I also saw a dartboard installed and the bar re-positioned.

 

Isn't it Retox Bar reincarnated at R-Con Bar?  

[treetops]

9 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Isn't it Retox Bar reincarnated at R-Con Bar?  

No (not my pic).

 

[Leaver]

42 minutes ago, treetops said:

No (not my pic).

 

 

I'm aware of the branding, but the furniture is ex-Retox, and so is the manager, and I dare say, so are the TV's.  

[treetops]

17 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I'm aware of the branding, but the furniture is ex-Retox, and so is the manager, and I dare say, so are the TV's.  

He manages the one round the corner fom the pic.  Everything in this one so far looks brand new.

Edited November 11, 2021 by treetops

[Leaver]

6 minutes ago, treetops said:

He manages the one round the corner fom the pic.  Everything in this one so far looks brand new.

 

Thanks for the clarification.  I thought it was all the same business.  

[treetops]

2 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Thanks for the clarification.  I thought it was all the same business.  

It is, but the owner of both (and I think the hotel too now) is the Witherspoon's guy.

 

It wouldn't surprise me if he "moved" Retox Game On into the first bit he took over as the German and Mexican parts of this latest one seem to be other existing businesses transplanted in.  I can't remember the names but the signage now gives that impression.

[moontang]

4 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

I'm aware of the branding, but the furniture is ex-Retox, and so is the manager, and I dare say, so are the TV's.  

The Tellies or the "girls"?

[Leaver]

17 hours ago, treetops said:

It is, but the owner of both (and I think the hotel too now) is the Witherspoon's guy.

 

It wouldn't surprise me if he "moved" Retox Game On into the first bit he took over as the German and Mexican parts of this latest one seem to be other existing businesses transplanted in.  I can't remember the names but the signage now gives that impression.

 

Has he bought the hotel and moved everything to that site?

[topt]

On 11/11/2021 at 1:10 PM, Leaver said:

 

Isn't it Retox Bar reincarnated at R-Con Bar?  

I will echo @TaaSaparot unless you are suggesting the style is similar 

On 11/11/2021 at 2:16 PM, Leaver said:

 

I'm aware of the branding, but the furniture is ex-Retox, and so is the manager, and I dare say, so are the TV's.  

Not from the Honey Retox - all that stuff including TVs was still there long after Witherspoons opened - I migrated the golf stuff so I do actually know........

The owner is absolutely nothing to do with the ex Retox - you obviously haven't spoken to him have you........

On 11/11/2021 at 2:48 PM, treetops said:

It is, but the owner of both (and I think the hotel too now) is the Witherspoon's guy.

My understanding is not the hotel but I could be behind the times.......

And I repeat other than employing Dean as the manager nothing to do with Retox. He originally leased/bought the original Witherspoons on the corner of Soi Lengkee.

[rott]

On 11/10/2021 at 8:32 AM, kinyara said:

. The Pig and Whistle was another that sticks out as getting their timing completely wrong.

Yes very unlucky timing, I think he took it on just before Covid.

[redwood1]

On 11/10/2021 at 5:46 AM, jacko45k said:

Yeah I passed a place on Buakhao the other day and all the contents were being moved out onto a truck. I think this was an Indian restaurant and the tables and seats were going elsewhere. A lot of those opened before Covid.... dreams shattered. 

Trust me there are still plenty of Indian restaurants still open who I doubt have had more than a tiny few customers in the last 2 years.........