Mandatory health insurance due for long stay tourists

[unamazedloso]

They expect an increase in elderly here? Are they insane??

Im 41 been here for over half my life and no way in hell will i be here at 50. 

Took a bit of time to see with my own eyes how evil thai mentality is regardless of the stories but yep, they are all true and much worse. My 2 cents would be go else where to retire even if its not ideal. Better to get depressed and commit suicide of your own accord than have someone fake it on your behalf. Just saying.... 

[monkfish]

Ok I can understand the inpatient requirement but is the 40K outpatient really necessary it will double the cost of any premium.
Isn't the 800k we have in the bank account enough guarantee that we can cover any outpatient needs?
 

[Elzear]

So... what happens if you are over the Insurance age limit ? Cannot get insurance ? Cannot stay in Thailand ? As I said once, I feel Thailand wants the foreigners out, slowly squeezing them out with more and more requirement. 

 

But I'll sure be there for the Ganja festival.. insurance or no insurance

[jimn]

1 hour ago, glennb6 said:

Not a very clear explanation for an official announcement, but I'm now extending my O-A visa, not applying for a new one, so I passed on the details.

A pointless rant about nothing to do with the topic.

However I will address your one valid point above. What exactly are you extending? If you are on an extension of stay after originally having an OA visa, the insurance doesnt apply to you. Other than that you cant extend an OA visa. You can only be granted 12 months stay every time you enter Thailand up to the expiry date of the visa. After the visa expires you apply for a new visa you dont extend it. Just for clarification an OA visa can only be applied for in you own country not in Thailand.

[kevinmartyn]

WHat is so annoying about this Is that "Thai Nationals" should be included too!!! Not just foreigners! If Thai government are going to make rules they should be for all! Not just foreigners. Foreigners are treated like something you pick up on your shoe walking down a soi which has many street dogs!-Fact????????????

Edited October 11, 2019 by kevinmartyn
Spelling

[soisanuk]

1 hour ago, Momofarang said:

You are just utterly naive, "no more than a year" simply means "all Non-OA and yearly extensions of stay". Ministry of health speaking they don't know the proper wording for immigration (fecal, more and more) matters.

Unfortunately, you are correct re Ministry of Public Health (MofPH) spokespersons.  They do not know Immigration or even Visa issuance requirements. Thus I do not pay much attention to their announcements as they either are not clear or inaccurate causing much confusion.  It is official announcements of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs (MofFA) which dictates requirements to obtain Visas from Thai Embassies/Consulates and Thai Immigration Bureau (IB) which dictates requirements for the granting periods of stay based on the basis of entry into Thailand (Visa or Visa Exempt) and the granting of extensions to that stay.

 

I have not yet seen any official announcement from the MofFA requiring health insurance for obtaining the Non-Immigrant O-A Visa but based on all I have read, it will be implemented, BUT only for the O-A Visa joining the Non-Immigrant O-X Visa which already had the requirement.  Also, from what I have read, it appears that the MofFA rules will allow use of health insurance policies other than the Thai policies listed on the Thai General Insurance Association (TGIA) webpage when applying for the O-A Visa, but use of Thai policies is required for the O-X policy. The TGIA webpage now has two links for health insurance providers, one for the O-A (newly added) and one for the O-X - It also appears that the "Certificate" mentioned in other posting to this thread is intended for issuance by the Thai health insurance providers as it is on the TGIA website - see: http://longstay.tgia.org/home/.

 

I have seen the Official amendments to the IB's rules which show requirements and documentation needed for extensions of stay. It appears to be clear, IMO, that those that entered Thailand and granted a permission to stay of one year based on being the holder of a Non-Immigrant O-A Visa will be required to have proof of health insurance from a Thai company listed on the TGIA website - thus no other policies will qualify to get an extension. BUT, it is also clear, that as of the issuance of these new rules, there is NO health insurance requirement for granting long stay extensions for other Non-Immigrant Visa categories.  Since many Expats living here entered (or obtained from Thai Immigration) on a Non-Immigrant O Visa and apply for one year extensions on the basis of "retirement", the new rules will have not be applicable to them (will it be in the future - possibly, but at this time I don't think it beneficial to cry the "sky is falling").   To view the IB's newly issued amendments, which become effective at the end of this month - October 31 (please note the last page of the PDF file containing the amendments in both Thai and English appears to show that after an initial entry using an O-A Visa which most are Multiple entries, any second or subsequent entry during the O-A Visa's validity period requires proof to show that the holder will continue to have health insurance for the full one year from the entry date) -  https://www.immigration.go.th/read?content_id=5d9c3b074d8a8f318362a8aa&fbclid=IwAR39UI_zBxVLedZKgZeAeYnvb0yyyIsr6SHPhnq64ohzACO7VsLUU_LlGn0.

[Mitkof Island]

23 minutes ago, FredGallaher said:

Scaremongering is the standard MO of many disgruntled posters here. It makes for a lot of responses that increase revenue to the ThaiVisa business owners. Although partially factual headlines are tainted to get maximum responses. Whereas misleading readers is not a prime concern. 

Scaremongering is also the standard MO for a rare few of YouTube channels. Every time there is news like this they are just drooling to make the next video and claim how right they were about everything from those evil sex mongers , e-beggars and how much the Thais hate you. LISTEN TO ME THE MASTER OF TRUTH and SUBSCRIBE NOW!  I need more booze money. My bank account is going dry. Anyone who questions me is one of those HATERS !!!!!!

[brewsterbudgen]

WHat is so annoying about this Is that "Thai Nationals" should be included too!!! Not just foreigners! If Thai government are going to make rules they should be for all! Not just foreigners. Foreigners are treated like something you pick up on your shoe walking down a soi which has many street dogs!-Fact[emoji33][emoji33][emoji33]

Strange comment. Why would a Thai national need a OA visa?

Sent from my SM-A500F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[monkfish]

Quote

Satit said elderly foreigners can acquire insurance coverage from both domestic and international firms, or via www.longstay.tgia.org.

Would help if the link would work lol.

 

Quote

Satit said 14 private insurance companies in Thailand had joined the project. 

Will prices be controlled and excludes removed?

[brianbbb]

expect a big fall tourist looking stay long term in thailand 

[Jeffrey346]

2 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

Strange comment. Why would a Thai national need a OA visa?

Sent from my SM-A500F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

I think he wants all Thai Nationals to have to pay for health ins. He doesn't know that all Thai Nationals are covered by free Gov health ins.

[Max69xl]

43 minutes ago, Jeffrey346 said:

It has always been a tourist visa.

I don't agree. There are officially only 1 tourist visa available, the 60 days TR. A person on long stay is not a tourist. 

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, FinChin67 said:

English is not my first language but every time they come with something like this they can be so unclear what they really mean. It does not matter if it concerns visa or now insurance but its never written in a way that I could understand.. Luckily, I do not need to care as I decided to live now in Malaysia but it really does not help Thailand to come with new unclear demands all the time..

 

Yes, asking for tourists and residents to have a valid insurance is not a bad thing at all but should be clear about it. Not really that difficult..

They should have a link to the thai language source.

[monkfish]

Just checked Out Patient covering 40,000 THB per year by Thaihealth is 10,740 THB per year extra for 51-55 year that's just a completely ludicrous!

[Neeranam]

1 minute ago, Max69xl said:

I don't agree. There are officially only 1 tourist visa available, the 60 days TR. A person on long stay is not a tourist. 

Yes they are, they are certainly not a resident.

[Thaivisa Health Protect]

1 hour ago, glennb6 said:

So now, a few days back I read that health insurance was to be manditory for new O-A visa applicants over 50 yrs of age. Not a very clear explanation for an official announcement, but I'm now extending my O-A visa, not applying for a new one, so I passed on the details.

 

Today I read that the plans are "updated" to include ALL over 50 O-A visas, new and extensions, and again with less than clear guidelines. I will only speak for myself because that's the only person I am an expert in knowing.

 

Seems I am considered first, a long stay TOURIST. I thought I was a long term Non-immigrant? Something about being deemed a temporary tourist bothers me both from the perspective of being considered temporary by the authorities, and from the point of security of lifestyle. The later in that I am retired here, intend to live here until I die, and if that makes me a "non-immigrant" fine, but a temporary tourist?? Maybe tourists will be limited to X number of months one of these days at the whims of, well...

 

I am very INSULTED to be called "high risk" because I am over 50 yrs old. Hey, we all die some day but some people are healthier than others regardless of age. Some people live a healthier life style than others, regardless of age. I do know age discrimination when it's typed in print in my face by the host government!

 

Me, knock on my wooden head, I am healthy, never needed a hospital or a doctor in countless years. I'm not fat/overweight. I eat healthy, I exercise regularly and am in better shape than most 30-40 yr olds. I don't smoke, I rarely drink alcohol, I am in a monogamous relationship with my GF, and my stress levels are near zero. Sound pretty good and low risk to me.

 

I rarely ride public transportation, which seem to overturn, have brake failures, and driver brain failures resulting in crashes thus ranking Thailand rather high on road fatalities and injuries. I drive an older Toyota pickup and a whimpy Honda Wave motorcycle. I have Thai driver licenses and extra insurance on the pickup truck. I drive safely, sober, and on the lookout. Anyone who has ever been here and especially who live here knows how bad the driving is.

 

Tourists who rent larger motorcycles and blast around drunk. Locals who believe Buddha will protect them and don't bother looking who they drive in front of or on which side of the road they drive. Half the population who rides motorcycles sans helmets, and frequently three plus people on two seat motorcycles...yea. Many locals don't have driver licenses, carry insufficient insurance if any, and apparently frequently run from the scene of accidents (according to the daily news reports)...yea, who is it that is 'high risk'???

 

Police? Apparently they are there at the occasional roadblock to check helmets, license, and other minor stuff. Many people remember the recent news report with pictures of three young boys stopped at a roadblock, one wearing a metal pot on his head, and the police standing around chuckling how funny that was. Too young for licenses, no helmets, insurance? Driving skills?  Say no more.

 

I stress the road safety issues because driving is high risk here, but hey, because I'm an over 50 non-Thai, I am considered high risk. Essh.

 

So, I checked the premium rates for the stated minimum required insurance of 400k in patient and 40k outpatient coverage and surprise surprise surprise... 81,746 baht per year for 61-67yr olds. Seems a bit high for very minimal coverage, especially when the government has recently and officially condoned public hospitals to charge "whatever they feel like" for foreigners.

 

My current coverage with same company is 780k inpatient, zero outpatient. If I am injured and require outpatient care I will pay out of pocket. As my visa requirement is that I must have 800k in Thai banks, I think I can cover the 40k baht minimum.

 

My current coverage including discounts for no outpatient coverage, a deductible, and not having used the insurance (now in 2.5yrs since I started) is 19,238 baht per year.

 

So for lesser coverage the government is expecting me to pay an additional 62,508 baht every year!?? Expecting me to be OK with insurance that provides me with lesser coverage but costs 425% more than what I voluntarily buy now!??!!

 

At the very best and kindest, this is full on incompetence and disregard, and at worst it smells like government corruption, collusion with the insurance business, graft, and theft from a small segment of the non-resident population that is expected to say nothing as they are not Thai and just pay, just pay.

 

I don't like (but knew and agreed to before retiring here) having to keep 800k baht in Thai banks on a permanent bases. Didn't really care for the 2 months prior and 3 months after extension requirements because it sounds like the government assumes I'm trying to cheat the system with an agent (I am not). I don't travel in country much at all so the TM30 tracking doesn't affect me, but it seems childish and ineffectual if really intended to track criminals. I grin and report myself in to immigration every 90 days even though it makes me feel like a parolee, but at least the process is quick.

 

Now, the government says I will be required to pay an additional $2050 USD for their approved insurance scheme. I am not a big spender like the 2 week millionaire tourists or rich Thais, but my spending is a 100% positive income for the country, not to mention the 800k baht stuck in the bank. It costs Thailand ZERO, NOTHING to have me here, and I expected to live this way for another 20 to 30 years.

 

This mandatory insurance scam is insulting, way over the top costly, and provides significant mistrust in what the government may come up with next for me trying to live here.  Of all the policies and rules, this is one that may well push me to look elsewhere to live in retirement.

 

This rant is mostly "preaching to the choir" but maybe it will be read by some Thais, may some Thail government officials.

Hi Glen, 

 

I presume you have a Pacific Cross policy.  Actually you can keep your existing policy and add a 40k OPD limit into the plan to meet the OPD visa requirements.  This is true for any plan that exceeds the requirement by an approved company  You are not bound to take the particular Long Stay visa plan which was the case back in May.  That was the exact problem the plans represented bad value versus historic products.  Now any plan that meets or exceeds the 400k/40k minumum can obtain the visa.

 

 

Edited October 11, 2019 by Thaivisa Health Protect

[Neeranam]

28 minutes ago, lupin said:

Both the elite visa and the non o-x visas are still only 1 year permitted to stay renewable 1 year extensions for the validity of the visa.

So a 5 year elite visa is  5 x 1 year renewable extensions.

a 20 year elite visa is  4 x 5 year visa with each of those visas 5 x 1 year renewable extensions.

Non O-X is 2 x 5 year visas... each of those visas 5 x 1 year renewable extensions.

 

ALL of those visas still only get a 1 year permitted to stay stamp before you either have to leave the country and re-enter before permitted to stay date...or visit immigration to renew the next 1 year extension

Why would anyone rich enough to grt an elite visa not get insurance.

Why would anyone not get insurance?

 

[TeaMonkey]

9 minutes ago, monkfish said:

Would help if the link would work lol.

 

Will prices be controlled and excludes removed?

 

It's longstay.tgia.org

They haven't setup the domain routing properly so if you put www. at the beginning it can't find it. It also does not automatically redirect to the secure HTTPS so you will likely get an unsafe warning unless you specifically go to https://longstay.tgia.org

I was clicking on some of the company's on there and quite a few don't even have anything prepared. It just goes to their home page in the Thai language. 

[Jeffrey346]

1 minute ago, Max69xl said:

I don't agree. There are officially only 1 tourist visa available, the 60 days TR. A person on long stay is not a tourist. 

Really.. When you go for your 90 day report, it asks type of visa. what box do you check? Could that be tourist?

[Bogbrush]

Here is a quote from a company listed on the site for the 400000/40000 baht policy required for 65/70 age group.

[lupin]

6 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

I don't agree. There are officially only 1 tourist visa available, the 60 days TR. A person on long stay is not a tourist. 

Rubbish... the PE (thailand elite) visas also fall under the classification of a tourist visa. States as much on their website too..

[digger70]

26 minutes ago, monkfish said:

Ok I can understand the inpatient requirement but is the 40K outpatient really necessary it will double the cost of any premium.
Isn't the 800k we have in the bank account enough guarantee that we can cover any outpatient needs?
 

Yea that should be . But one can't use that cause if one uses some of that one can't get the next extension 

If they would allow one to use some of that and one could top it up again before applying for the next extension  one wouldn't need all this bullcrap.

[BritManToo]

2 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Why would anyone rich enough to grt an elite visa not get insurance.

Why would anyone not get insurance?

 

Because insurance doesn't cover existing health problems.

The UK insists long term stays buy into the health system, covers everything so worthwhile.

Seems that Thailand should allow long term stays to buy into their health system.

Else they will still have the problem of old guys not covered for the hospital visits they need.

 

If I have a bad heart, what is the point of getting me to buy health insurance?

 

[Max69xl]

23 minutes ago, kevinmartyn said:

WHat is so annoying about this Is that "Thai Nationals" should be included too!!! Not just foreigners! If Thai government are going to make rules they should be for all! Not just foreigners. Foreigners are treated like something you pick up on your shoe walking down a soi which has many street dogs!-Fact????????????

Don't you think every western country charges non-citizens extra if having no travel insurance or other insurance? You don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Health care is free in almost every country in Europe for citizens living there full time. Non-citizens can be charged not only double prize,but 100 times the normal prize for example surgery. Dual pricing is common everywhere in the world.

[Thaidream]

36 minutes ago, rwill said:

So the non-immigrant O-A visa is now a tourist visa?

It is NOT a tourist visa.  It is a special Non O- dubbed as Non O-A for the purpose of retirement.

 

The news release associated wit this thread is nonsense- full of hald truths and improper terminology.  Per the actual release of the Police Order - the requirement for insurance applies as follows

 

1.  Any Non O A Visa issued after 31 October 2019 will have the new requirement- Only this type of Visa. Any extensions on this Visa  will also have the new requirement for insurance.  In other words if your original O-A ihas an issue date of 1 Nov 2019 and after- the holder has the insurance requirement.   

 

All others who are in Thailand or entering on a Non O-A with a date of issuance prior to 31 October 2019 are NOT subject to the requirement.  In other words if some entered originally on a Non O-A dated 31 October 2010 and has several extensions- they are not subject to the requirement.

 

2. The wording of the police order spells out that anyone  holding the Non O-A peioe to the effective date of the new requirement is 'grandfathered' or not applicable.  At the same time if  a person let's his Non O-A expire or goes back to their home country and applies for a NEW O-A Visa after 31 October 2019- the new requirements DO apply.

 

According to the revised police order- it applies only (and the order uses this exact word) to only the Non O A which  means a regular Non O; Non B; Non O for marriage; Non O for Education; the elite; the METV; Tourist Visa and Visa Exempt are NOT affected.

[Neeranam]

1 hour ago, glennb6 said:

So now, a few days back I read that health insurance was to be manditory for new O-A visa applicants over 50 yrs of age. Not a very clear explanation for an official announcement, but I'm now extending my O-A visa, not applying for a new one, so I passed on the details.

 

Today I read that the plans are "updated" to include ALL over 50 O-A visas, new and extensions, and again with less than clear guidelines. I will only speak for myself because that's the only person I am an expert in knowing.

 

Seems I am considered first, a long stay TOURIST. I thought I was a long term Non-immigrant? Something about being deemed a temporary tourist bothers me both from the perspective of being considered temporary by the authorities, and from the point of security of lifestyle. The later in that I am retired here, intend to live here until I die, and if that makes me a "non-immigrant" fine, but a temporary tourist?? Maybe tourists will be limited to X number of months one of these days at the whims of, well...

 

I am very INSULTED to be called "high risk" because I am over 50 yrs old. Hey, we all die some day but some people are healthier than others regardless of age. Some people live a healthier life style than others, regardless of age. I do know age discrimination when it's typed in print in my face by the host government!

 

Me, knock on my wooden head, I am healthy, never needed a hospital or a doctor in countless years. I'm not fat/overweight. I eat healthy, I exercise regularly and am in better shape than most 30-40 yr olds. I don't smoke, I rarely drink alcohol, I am in a monogamous relationship with my GF, and my stress levels are near zero. Sound pretty good and low risk to me.

 

I rarely ride public transportation, which seem to overturn, have brake failures, and driver brain failures resulting in crashes thus ranking Thailand rather high on road fatalities and injuries. I drive an older Toyota pickup and a whimpy Honda Wave motorcycle. I have Thai driver licenses and extra insurance on the pickup truck. I drive safely, sober, and on the lookout. Anyone who has ever been here and especially who live here knows how bad the driving is.

 

Tourists who rent larger motorcycles and blast around drunk. Locals who believe Buddha will protect them and don't bother looking who they drive in front of or on which side of the road they drive. Half the population who rides motorcycles sans helmets, and frequently three plus people on two seat motorcycles...yea. Many locals don't have driver licenses, carry insufficient insurance if any, and apparently frequently run from the scene of accidents (according to the daily news reports)...yea, who is it that is 'high risk'???

 

Police? Apparently they are there at the occasional roadblock to check helmets, license, and other minor stuff. Many people remember the recent news report with pictures of three young boys stopped at a roadblock, one wearing a metal pot on his head, and the police standing around chuckling how funny that was. Too young for licenses, no helmets, insurance? Driving skills?  Say no more.

 

I stress the road safety issues because driving is high risk here, but hey, because I'm an over 50 non-Thai, I am considered high risk. Essh.

 

So, I checked the premium rates for the stated minimum required insurance of 400k in patient and 40k outpatient coverage and surprise surprise surprise... 81,746 baht per year for 61-67yr olds. Seems a bit high for very minimal coverage, especially when the government has recently and officially condoned public hospitals to charge "whatever they feel like" for foreigners.

 

My current coverage with same company is 780k inpatient, zero outpatient. If I am injured and require outpatient care I will pay out of pocket. As my visa requirement is that I must have 800k in Thai banks, I think I can cover the 40k baht minimum.

 

My current coverage including discounts for no outpatient coverage, a deductible, and not having used the insurance (now in 2.5yrs since I started) is 19,238 baht per year.

 

So for lesser coverage the government is expecting me to pay an additional 62,508 baht every year!?? Expecting me to be OK with insurance that provides me with lesser coverage but costs 425% more than what I voluntarily buy now!??!!

 

At the very best and kindest, this is full on incompetence and disregard, and at worst it smells like government corruption, collusion with the insurance business, graft, and theft from a small segment of the non-resident population that is expected to say nothing as they are not Thai and just pay, just pay.

 

I don't like (but knew and agreed to before retiring here) having to keep 800k baht in Thai banks on a permanent bases. Didn't really care for the 2 months prior and 3 months after extension requirements because it sounds like the government assumes I'm trying to cheat the system with an agent (I am not). I don't travel in country much at all so the TM30 tracking doesn't affect me, but it seems childish and ineffectual if really intended to track criminals. I grin and report myself in to immigration every 90 days even though it makes me feel like a parolee, but at least the process is quick.

 

Now, the government says I will be required to pay an additional $2050 USD for their approved insurance scheme. I am not a big spender like the 2 week millionaire tourists or rich Thais, but my spending is a 100% positive income for the country, not to mention the 800k baht stuck in the bank. It costs Thailand ZERO, NOTHING to have me here, and I expected to live this way for another 20 to 30 years.

 

This mandatory insurance scam is insulting, way over the top costly, and provides significant mistrust in what the government may come up with next for me trying to live here.  Of all the policies and rules, this is one that may well push me to look elsewhere to live in retirement.

 

This rant is mostly "preaching to the choir" but maybe it will be read by some Thais, may some Thail government officials.

Its people like you who are abusing the cheap Thai government hispitals. I know many who come here just for the cheap medical treatment.

 

Have you any idea how much a Thai neess to tetire to the US, 18 million baht or so and has to pay a lot more for medical insurance. 

Its about time we had reciprical agreements to allow the country we love(or abuse) to become a first world country.

[Max69xl]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

Because insurance doesn't cover existing health problems.

The UK insists long term stays buy into the health system, covers everything so worthwhile.

Seems that Thailand should allow long term stays to buy into their health system.

Else they will still have the problem of old guys not covered for the hospital visits they need.

 

If I have a bad heart, what is the point of getting me to buy health insurance?

 

Is your current visa the O-A? 

[BritManToo]

5 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

Is your current visa the O-A? 

I get non-Os, 90 days, just came in on my 10th back to back.

I don't know anyone that ever got an O-A, too many rules and restrictions.

 

Use the Thai government hospital all the time, usually costs me under 300bht every 3 months for my hospital visits & regular meds.

Edited October 11, 2019 by BritManToo

[Mitkof Island]

8 minutes ago, Bogbrush said:

Here is a quote from a company listed on the site for the 400000/40000 baht policy required for 65/70 age group.

About $3,000 a year !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I guess they consider that cheap for garbage coverage. Better spent elsewhere NO THANKS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Jeffrey346]

3 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I get non-Os, 90 days, just came in on my 10th back to back.

I don't know anyone that ever got an O-A, too many rules and restrictions.

 

Use the government hospitals all the time, usually costs me under 300bht every 3 months for my hospital visits & regular meds.

It costs me B280 for any hospital visit as I am married to a Gov employee. My meds which cost B25,000 are covered by the same B280 fee.

Are you married to a Gov employee as well?