O/A visa and insurance experience today

[flexomike]

4 hours ago, lkv said:

Important Updates

 

Suvarnabhumi is now stamping people for 30 days.

 

They really like to take the p#ss, one day one way, another day another way.....????

 

https://m.facebook.com/groups/1395920320731833?view=permalink&id=2577658015891385

 

 

 

 

 

no reenty permit?

[flexomike]

Just now, flexomike said:

no reenty permit?

sorry did't see OA issue date

[ubonjoe]

7 hours ago, lkv said:

Suvarnabhumi is now stamping people for 30 days.

They really like to take the p#ss, one day one way, another day another way.....????

 

I wonder if he noticed the 30 day stamp before leaving the airport. If he did he should of questioned somebody about it and it probably would of been corrected.

[jacko45k]

18 hours ago, kingofthemountain said:

there is 

few who hardly seems to know where is the door entrance

I shall try to learn the Thai script for 'push' and 'pull' so that you no longer find me senile!

[OJAS]

21 hours ago, Max69xl said:

So why don't you start with telling us which immigration office you belong to?

Might not a clue lie in the last 6 letters of his username?

[Max69xl]

5 hours ago, flexomike said:

no reenty permit?

He used the multi entry which is incl. the first year.

[Max69xl]

3 hours ago, jacko45k said:

I shall try to learn the Thai script for 'push' and 'pull' so that you no longer find me senile!

There are doors at several malls with a Push-sign, but they go both ways. ????

[Max69xl]

20 hours ago, KeeTua said:

What immigration office do you belong to?

How many offices have a dedicated 90 day report desk? I've never seen to one.

Desk 4 (actually 2 desks) at Jomtien Immigration. How many offices have you visited in Thailand? FYI: Jomtien Immigration has 10 desks for different purposes. 

Edited November 25, 2019 by Max69xl

[Sheryl]

21 hours ago, moontang said:

Thanks for the heads up..that kills my plan B.2, which was to go to Malaysia.  Waiting to hear about the the letter of retirement for those with 800k in the bank..at that point, I will probably try the high deductible with Pacific Cross and make it my last year, here.  I thought Falcon would be ok, but on my second review of it I see it is 800k coverage, but only 80k per incident..you can get 200k coverage from BBL for a song..I am mid 50s..so I will care better than most..but this is about the worst pile of <deleted> since moving here full time 6 years ago.

Falcon also does not guarantee coverage, even year by year , and will not cover past age 65 in any case, so not a viable choice for a retiree looking to settle here even just in terms of meeting immigration requirements.

 

In your  mid 50's, you can get a policy with AETNA or Thai Vivat that guarantees lifetime renewal, and people anywhere up to age 75 can get policies or with Pacific Cross or Viriyah that guarantees renewal to ages 99/100. These are the options that would provide some assurance of meeting Immigration requirements as currently written, meeting need to be protected for health costs is a somewhat other matter.

 

Premium affordability is certainly an issue; Thai insurance policies cost more for less compared to international expat policies and matters are much worsened by the requirement to include OPD cover.

 

A high deductible PC policy will indeed likely be the least expensive option but unless you have other (non Immigration approved) insurance cover or ready access to  savings to cover health expenses, need to consider how you will finance hospital care if needed.

 

 

[Max69xl]

20 hours ago, gk10002000 said:

I don't see why an expat foreign insurer would not sign the certificate.  Let's suppose they understood the on the surface wording of the Thai insurance needs.  Now let's assume they don't understand the Thai policy needs, so what?  If the insurer signs the certificate, and you the customer are happy with it, then there should be no problem using it.  And if for some reason the policy later turns out to be not acceptable to the Thais, well, wouldn't that put the risk soley on you?  I doubt the Thai hospital would refuse treatment.  The policy is what it is.  It may not meet the Thai immigration needs, but that would be a moot point at that time?  And there would be nothing that could come back and harm the insurance company?  yes no?

"I doubt the Thai hospital would refuse treatment."

They can refuse treatment unless you show them a credit card/debit card, especially at a private hospital.

[Sheryl]

3 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

I wonder if he noticed the 30 day stamp before leaving the airport. If he did he should of questioned somebody about it and it probably would of been corrected.

There is a notation below the 30 day stamp that appears to state that it was issued because of lack of insurance so d presumably some sort of discussion took place in which he was asked to show insurance.

[BritManToo]

6 hours ago, flexomike said:

no reenty permit?

It says 'waiver 30 days' as no health insurance for the O-A VISA.

(mai mee pra gan suk ka pap)

Edited November 25, 2019 by BritManToo

[Max69xl]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

It says 'waiver 30 days' as no insurance for the O-A VISA.

Because he entered using the ME-permit. 

[Martyp]

20 hours ago, gk10002000 said:

I don't see why an expat foreign insurer would not sign the certificate.  Let's suppose they understood the on the surface wording of the Thai insurance needs.  Now let's assume they don't understand the Thai policy needs, so what?  If the insurer signs the certificate, and you the customer are happy with it, then there should be no problem using it.  And if for some reason the policy later turns out to be not acceptable to the Thais, well, wouldn't that put the risk soley on you?  I doubt the Thai hospital would refuse treatment.  The policy is what it is.  It may not meet the Thai immigration needs, but that would be a moot point at that time?  And there would be nothing that could come back and harm the insurance company?  yes no?

I wonder if a foreign insurance company could issue a letter or certificate of their own specifying what they cover for clients living in Thailand. If their own letter says they pay out equal to or more than the 40,000/400,000 baht requirement would a Consulate consider honoring that? It avoids signing a certificate from a foreign country but specifies that they meet the coverage needs. 

[gk10002000]

2 minutes ago, Martyp said:

I wonder if a foreign insurance company could issue a letter or certificate of their own specifying what they cover for clients living in Thailand. If their own letter says they pay out equal to or more than the 40,000/400,000 baht requirement would a Consulate consider honoring that? It avoids signing a certificate from a foreign country but specifies that they meet the coverage needs. 

If they do that, then why not just sign the certificate?  It is not clear and has been discussed who can sign the certificate.  Some think it must be some Thai director.  Others think a Thai sign is not required, just a somewhat high director of the insurance company?

[moontang]

40 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Falcon also does not guarantee coverage, even year by year , and will not cover past age 65 in any case, so not a viable choice for a retiree looking to settle here even just in terms of meeting immigration requirements.

 

In your  mid 50's, you can get a policy with AETNA or Thai Vivat that guarantees lifetime renewal, and people anywhere up to age 75 can get policies or with Pacific Cross or Viriyah that guarantees renewal to ages 99/100. These are the options that would provide some assurance of meeting Immigration requirements as currently written, meeting need to be protected for health costs is a somewhat other matter.

 

Premium affordability is certainly an issue; Thai insurance policies cost more for less compared to international expat policies and matters are much worsened by the requirement to include OPD cover.

 

A high deductible PC policy will indeed likely be the least expensive option but unless you have other (non Immigration approved) insurance cover or ready access to  savings to cover health expenses, need to consider how you will finance hospital care if needed.

 

 

What good is lifetime renewal if they can charge whatever they want to?  Aetna?  Anything to do with Blue Cross is the last people I want to deal with.  But it does vary by State in the US, but they are horrible in Arizona.

Edited November 25, 2019 by moontang

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

18 hours ago, Max69xl said:

So why not go to Savannakhet,Laos? They still issue Non-Immigrant O based on retirement. 

 

It may come to that. My preference, however, was to go to a fun city (SGN) that I know and that I can get to by flying. Also it appears the Thai embassy in Ottawa lists an O for over-50s. Anyway, I have till next spring to decide. 

 

Though my doubts about my future in Thailand grow by the day as the cluster**** continues (see 30-day stamp above on O-A re-entry).

 

 

[Max69xl]

38 minutes ago, Martyp said:

I wonder if a foreign insurance company could issue a letter or certificate of their own specifying what they cover for clients living in Thailand. If their own letter says they pay out equal to or more than the 40,000/400,000 baht requirement would a Consulate consider honoring that? It avoids signing a certificate from a foreign country but specifies that they meet the coverage needs. 

Every foreign insurance covers way more than 40k/400k, and usually never mentions OPD. 

[Tracyb]

OK.  So after considering all the issues at hand regarding insurance for O-A Visa holders, I decided to go ahead and buy the coverage I need for MY O-A predicament.

 

I have to say that buying insurance coverage here in Thailand wasn't an easy decision to take, but..... I did finally decide to obtain coverage from Pacific Cross.

 

I thought about going out of the country and getting an "O" visa and then considered that I could possibly be back in the same predicament later if IM decides to include "O" visas in the requirement for insurance.  In the course of my deliberations I vacillated between

1). buying Insurance and keeping my O-A alive,  or

2). continue to self insure and go for an "O" visa in Laos.

3)  Cashing in and moving to another country

4). Cashing in and going back to the USA to find housing and a return to my life there. 

 

I ended up determining that for all the hassles IM puts in my way, I'm still better off here than going back to California... or any other state in the USA for that matter.  All of the European countries where I have an interest in living require insurance before issuing a visa for long term stay ( beyond three months).  So here I am. 

 

I'm 68 years old and I have two pre-existing conditions, both of which are not life threatening and have been excluded from my coverage.  My only other insurance is Medicare in the USA which offers no coverage here in Thailand.

 

I decided to buy a plan that provides 3,000,000 Baht inpatient and 3000 Baht per outpatient visit with unlimited visits allowed each year. Coverage is good at every hospital in Thailand.  I chose an annual 40,000 baht deductible to reduce the premiums by 25%....  .  So, I'm self insured to the extent that I have to cover 40,000 baht before they pay for treatments of any kind...inpatient or outpatient.  I got a physical, the insurance company reimbursed me for the cost once I was approved for coverage.  My policy coverage starts today.

 

I have to say that my decision finally came down to the fact that I was gambling that I won't get inured in an accident or experience a major medical problem and that if I did I would just have to suck it up and pay the bill.  It became a matter of economics for me.  Yes, I can afford the premiums and I appreciate that many others in my situation may not be able to.  I also understand that many folks will choose to go the "O" visa route and convert from an O-A and continue to self insure. One will do what one feels best for oneself and I respect that.

 

Now that I have the insurance coverage I have some peace of mind knowing that I won't have to transfer large sums at crappy exchange rates to cover medical expenses that I might incur.

 

I'm sleeping easier now and that's worth the price.... for me!

 

Special thanks to Sheryl, too, for all the help she provides....

 

[Max69xl]

7 minutes ago, Kaoboi Bebobp said:

 

It may come to that. My preference, however, was to go to a fun city (SGN) that I know and that I can get to by flying. Also it appears the Thai embassy in Ottawa lists an O for over-50s. Anyway, I have till next spring to decide. 

 

Though my doubts about my future in Thailand grow by the day as the cluster**** continues (see 30-day stamp above on O-A re-entry).

 

 

If staying close to BKK it's possible to do a Fly'n'ride to Savannakhet and back. You need 1 night in Savannakhet,though. Maybe it's possible to fly to Mukdahan from other airports.

[moontang]

11 minutes ago, Kaoboi Bebobp said:

 

It may come to that. My preference, however, was to go to a fun city (SGN) that I know and that I can get to by flying. Also it appears the Thai embassy in Ottawa lists an O for over-50s. Anyway, I have till next spring to decide. 

 

Though my doubts about my future in Thailand grow by the day as the cluster**** continues (see 30-day stamp above on O-A re-entry).

 

 

I am thinking Penang...cheap flight, no Visa..new facility that they got the links out of..or scared the visa runners and teachers away...trying to get clarification on requirement of statement of retirement in Savanaket.

[Max69xl]

9 minutes ago, Tracyb said:

OK.  So after considering all the issues at hand regarding insurance for O-A Visa holders, I decided to go ahead and buy the coverage I need for MY O-A predicament.

 

I have to say that buying insurance coverage here in Thailand wasn't an easy decision to take, but..... I did finally decide to obtain coverage from Pacific Cross.

 

I thought about going out of the country and getting an "O" visa and then considered that I could possibly be back in the same predicament later if IM decides to include "O" visas in the requirement for insurance.  In the course of my deliberations I vacillated between

1). buying Insurance and keeping my O-A alive,  or

2). continue to self insure and go for an "O" visa in Laos.

3)  Cashing in and moving to another country

4). Cashing in and going back to the USA to find housing and a return to my life there. 

 

I ended up determining that for all the hassles IM puts in my way, I'm still better off here than going back to California... or any other state in the USA for that matter.  All of the European countries where I have an interest in living require insurance before issuing a visa for long term stay ( beyond three months).  So here I am. 

 

I'm 68 years old and I have two pre-existing conditions, both of which are not life threatening and have been excluded from my coverage.  My only other insurance is Medicare in the USA which offers no coverage here in Thailand.

 

I decided to buy a plan that provides 3,000,000 Baht inpatient and 3000 Baht per outpatient visit with unlimited visits allowed each year. Coverage is good at every hospital in Thailand.  I chose an annual 40,000 baht deductible to reduce the premiums by 25%....  .  So, I'm self insured to the extent that I have to cover 40,000 baht before they pay for treatments of any kind...inpatient or outpatient.  I got a physical, the insurance company reimbursed me for the cost once I was approved for coverage.  My policy coverage starts today.

 

I have to say that my decision finally came down to the fact that I was gambling that I won't get inured in an accident or experience a major medical problem and that if I did I would just have to suck it up and pay the bill.  It became a matter of economics for me.  Yes, I can afford the premiums and I appreciate that many others in my situation may not be able to.  I also understand that many folks will choose to go the "O" visa route and convert from an O-A and continue to self insure. One will do what one feels best for oneself and I respect that.

 

Now that I have the insurance coverage I have some peace of mind knowing that I won't have to transfer large sums at crappy exchange rates to cover medical expenses that I might incur.

 

I'm sleeping easier now and that's worth the price.... for me!

 

Special thanks to Sheryl, too, for all the help she provides....

 

Even if you changed to an O Visa, you could have bought an insurance from Pacific Cross. 

[Tracyb]

But why bother?  The decision came down to not wanting to self insure to the extent I had been.

[Sheryl]

18 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

Every foreign insurance covers way more than 40k/400k, and usually never mentions OPD. 

 

Actually all I have seen include an option for OPD but of course not limited to 40K and greatly increasing premiums, so  in a place like Thailand not worth it.

 

However even without the optional OPD cover, most foreign policies  include OPD  for selected things like cancer treatment (chemo, radiation) and hemodialysis, and day surgeries. They do this because people would otherwise be admitted to hospital which would cost them even more. Some also include OPD visits directly treated to a hospitalization.

 

My foreign policy, in-patient only, includes full treatment costs for outpatient cancer treatment,and dialysis (up to the policy limit of US 1 million). It also covers day surgeries , outpatient care that precedes a hospitalization for the same condition, and outpatient care in the first 30 days after hospital discharge (for the same condition/event). I was reimbursed about 45,000 baht worth of OPD visits this year under this last category.

 

Back when we all still expected the new insurance requirement to allow foreign policies (and a self insurance option for the uninsurable...those were the days!), I was thinking that  a policy likem ine  should be acceptable on the grounds that these provisions easily included  well over 40K in OPD cover even though restricted to certain high cost OPD visits -- which is of course far more significant in terms of actual protection that the Immigration approved OPD covers of maximum 1500 - 2000 baht per visit.

 

 

[Sheryl]

52 minutes ago, moontang said:

What good is lifetime renewal if they can charge whatever they want to?  Aetna?  Anything to do with Blue Cross is the last people I want to deal with.  But it does vary by State in the US, but they are horrible in Arizona.

 

They can't quite "charge whatever they want". But they CAN raise premiums on an individual basis (on top of age band increases) if you have a large claim. Not to an unlimited degree,  there is a cap on it but I think up to as much as 25%. There are also provisions to subsequently reduce the rate if no further large claims after X years.

 

All Thai policies have this as it is allowed under Thai regulations. Very bad, I agree, and this is why I have an international policy. But I don't think it varies much if at all between Thai companies. They are all following OIC guidelines.

 

AETNA Thailand is its own company. Experiences in all respects (positive and negative) will not be the same as with AETNA US or elsewhere.

[moontang]

4 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

They can't quite "charge whatever they want". But they CAN raise premiums on an individual basis (on top of age band increases) if you have a large claim. Not to an unlimited degree,  there is a cap on it but I think up to as much as 25%. There are also provisions to subsequently reduce the rate if no further large claims after X years.

 

All Thai policies have this as it is allowed under Thai regulations. Very bad, I agree, and this is why I have an international policy. But I don't think it varies much if at all between Thai companies. They are all following OIC guidelines.

 

AETNA Thailand is its own company. Experiences in all respects (positive and negative) will not be the same as with AETNA US or elsewhere.

It is still their culture....same as Toyota, Philip Morris, Heineken or any other multinational that has a Thai subsidiary.

 

It is a shame they wouldn't just adopt the same requirements as the EU.  About the same money for much higher coverage, and you can print out a letter showing your coverage.

[Max69xl]

13 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

Actually all I have seen include an option for OPD but of course not limited to 40K and greatly increasing premiums, so  in a place like Thailand not worth it.

 

However even without the optional OPD cover, most foreign policies  include OPD  for selected things like cancer treatment (chemo, radiation) and hemodialysis, and day surgeries. They do this because people would otherwise be admitted to hospital which would cost them even more. Some also include OPD visits directly treated to a hospitalization.

 

My foreign policy, in-patient only, includes full treatment costs for outpatient cancer treatment,and dialysis (up to the policy limit of US 1 million). It also covers day surgeries , outpatient care that precedes a hospitalization for the same condition, and outpatient care in the first 30 days after hospital discharge (for the same condition/event). I was reimbursed about 45,000 baht worth of OPD visits this year under this last category.

 

Back when we all still expected the new insurance requirement to allow foreign policies (and a self insurance option for the uninsurable...those were the days!), I was thinking that  a policy likem ine  should be acceptable on the grounds that these provisions easily included  well over 40K in OPD cover even though restricted to certain high cost OPD visits -- which is of course far more significant in terms of actual protection that the Immigration approved OPD covers of maximum 1500 - 2000 baht per visit.

 

 

I have had many many health/travel insurances in my life, and none have even mentioned OPD. Only the total coverage incl. everything. When we're talking about an insurance covering 5 to 15 million baht (when converted), do you think 40k for OPD makes a difference? 

[kingofthemountain]

1 hour ago, Tracyb said:

OK.  So after considering all the issues at hand regarding insurance for O-A Visa holders, I decided to go ahead and buy the coverage I need for MY O-A predicament.

 

I have to say that buying insurance coverage here in Thailand wasn't an easy decision to take, but..... I did finally decide to obtain coverage from Pacific Cross.

 

I thought about going out of the country and getting an "O" visa and then considered that I could possibly be back in the same predicament later if IM decides to include "O" visas in the requirement for insurance.  In the course of my deliberations I vacillated between

1). buying Insurance and keeping my O-A alive,  or

2). continue to self insure and go for an "O" visa in Laos.

3)  Cashing in and moving to another country

4). Cashing in and going back to the USA to find housing and a return to my life there. 

 

I ended up determining that for all the hassles IM puts in my way, I'm still better off here than going back to California... or any other state in the USA for that matter.  All of the European countries where I have an interest in living require insurance before issuing a visa for long term stay ( beyond three months).  So here I am. 

 

I'm 68 years old and I have two pre-existing conditions, both of which are not life threatening and have been excluded from my coverage.  My only other insurance is Medicare in the USA which offers no coverage here in Thailand.

 

I decided to buy a plan that provides 3,000,000 Baht inpatient and 3000 Baht per outpatient visit with unlimited visits allowed each year. Coverage is good at every hospital in Thailand.  I chose an annual 40,000 baht deductible to reduce the premiums by 25%....  .  So, I'm self insured to the extent that I have to cover 40,000 baht before they pay for treatments of any kind...inpatient or outpatient.  I got a physical, the insurance company reimbursed me for the cost once I was approved for coverage.  My policy coverage starts today.

 

I have to say that my decision finally came down to the fact that I was gambling that I won't get inured in an accident or experience a major medical problem and that if I did I would just have to suck it up and pay the bill.  It became a matter of economics for me.  Yes, I can afford the premiums and I appreciate that many others in my situation may not be able to.  I also understand that many folks will choose to go the "O" visa route and convert from an O-A and continue to self insure. One will do what one feels best for oneself and I respect that.

 

Now that I have the insurance coverage I have some peace of mind knowing that I won't have to transfer large sums at crappy exchange rates to cover medical expenses that I might incur.

 

I'm sleeping easier now and that's worth the price.... for me!

 

Special thanks to Sheryl, too, for all the help she provides....

 

So what is the price\year? 

[moontang]

Just thought I would share this...these are the types of policies I have been using for six years..paid for a broken tooth, once..I am tempted to show to the IO, it is a ton more coverage than required, with a very highly rated company, that does direct payment to Bumrungrad, Bangkok Hospital, and 20 others in BKK alone.  Meets all the Schengen requirements and even specifies LOS in the Letter.  I guess it is going to be the Thaiway or the Highway...#$@##@s.

 

Edited November 25, 2019 by moontang

[moontang]

20 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said:

So what is the price\year? 

Yeah, and did you have to pay all at once..and do they take credit cards?