Pattaya’s biggest ever property scam: Ukrainian man on the run after 300 MILLION baht fraud

[Vigilante]

21 hours ago, sirocco said:

Hello, post 37, 

Not true, not all buyers are great naive and check point by point the content of their contract and follow the progress of construction.
But unfortunately, there is always the grain of sand.
This is what happened to HUA HIN where we counted, for this condonium, as buyers, lawyers, doctors, entrepreneurs, relatives of the late king.
The promoters disappeared in the wild, with the money of the future owners.
And the lawyers wandered the buyers.

'Pre-sales' are the most scam-prone affairs

The govt should ban them outright.

..and the people who buy into the scam should see a shrink.

[Gopro]

This guy once had my condo listed. Did the right thing by me at the time. Who would have thought. Anyway his wife must love him. Haha

 

https://youtu.be/XAk98AXRh4o

[sirocco]

POST 96, hello,

 

Very true for "pre-sales", but this also happens when construction is finished.
As for advising to go see a shrink, for those who have been scammed, is it before or after the purchase?
We don't overestimate you, it even happens to very intelligent people.
They found very clever, very perverse, very vicious, but not necessarily intelligent, people on their way.????

[scubascuba3]

9 minutes ago, sirocco said:

POST 96, hello,

 

Very true for "pre-sales", but this also happens when construction is finished.
As for advising to go see a shrink, for those who have been scammed, is it before or after the purchase?
We don't overestimate you, it even happens to very intelligent people.
They found very clever, very perverse, very vicious, but not necessarily intelligent, people on their way.????

If people paid for the property at the land office with a cheque vs Chanot then this wouldn't happen

[jacko45k]

13 hours ago, Ron jeremy said:

anyone who is stupid enough to buy or invest in Thailand deserves what they get.

So that would include Ford, Toyota, Tesco, KFC, McD etc etc?

[sirocco]

post 99, hello,

 

The scam has no smell, no places, no limits.
You have all the WE to think about this sentence

 

 

[newnative]

8 hours ago, Nip said:

The thing you are missing is (I suggest that ) you cannot trust Thai lawyers ... Sorry I would suggest that you cannot trust Thai lawyers.

    It wasn't a Thai lawyer who cheated people out of 300 million baht and then disappeared.  Nor Thai lawyers developing property projects that went belly up before completion.  However, when you use a lawyer, make sure he or she is, indeed, a registered lawyer. Use a lawyer licensed by the Lawyer's Council of Thailand and get a copy of their certificate with their lawyer's registration number.  A reputable lawyer will readily provide you with this--if not, look elsewhere.  If you then have had a problem with your lawyer, you can report the lawyer to the Lawyer's Council. There are some bad lawyers in every country in the World--but good ones, too.

[scubascuba3]

36 minutes ago, sirocco said:

post 99, hello,

 

The scam has no smell, no places, no limits.
You have all the WE to think about this sentence

 

 

Hey post 101, learn how to quote a post, it's a better way of replying. Anyone get scammed who paid by cheque at the land office vs chanote?

[scubascuba3]

1 minute ago, newnative said:

    It wasn't a Thai lawyer who cheated people out of 300 million baht and then disappeared.  Nor Thai lawyers developing property projects that went belly up before completion.  However, when you use a lawyer, make sure he or she is, indeed, a registered lawyer. Use a lawyer licensed by the Lawyer's Council of Thailand and get a copy of their certificate with their lawyer's registration number.  A reputable lawyer will readily provide you with this--if not, look elsewhere.  If you then have had a problem with your lawyer, you can report the lawyer to the Lawyer's Council. There are some bad lawyers in every country in the World--but good ones, too.

Escrow accounts aren't used which would safegaurd peoples money, without these I can't see how paying off plan is safe at all

[Henryford]

How did this go on for 10 years. I would have thought the first expat he scammed would have blown the whistle.

[newnative]

4 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Escrow accounts aren't used which would safegaurd peoples money, without these I can't see how paying off plan is safe at all

   As I have said before, I would ONLY buy off-plan from a large, well-funded, public development company with an excellent track record of completing projects. Nothing is certain in this World but I have bought 9 condos this way with no problems.  With all 9, the biggest payment of money was not made until the chanote was transferred to me at the Land Office. 

    If you like a project but it is being done by a builder other than the type above, I would suggest you wait for the project to be completed.  Don't be fooled by projects blaring they are Sold Out!  They aren't.  They might be fully booked but that's not the same as sold out.  A condo is only actually 'sold' when the chanote is transferred.  In almost all cases, when a project is finished there will be 'booked' units that come back up for sale.  Make a minimum down payment and don't pay any more money until the condo is transferred to you at the Land Office.  

[johng]

17 minutes ago, Henryford said:

How did this go on for 10 years. I would have thought the first expat he scammed would have blown the whistle.

Because of Thailand's antiquated draconian defamation laws..even if what you publish is true they can still sue for defamation !!!!

[newnative]

25 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Hey post 101, learn how to quote a post, it's a better way of replying. Anyone get scammed who paid by cheque at the land office vs chanote?

   I don't understand your post. A chanote is a title deed.  How can you pay by a title deed?  I assume that's what you mean by cheque vs chanote but maybe I am misunderstanding.  The Land Office accepts only cash for closing costs but a buyer can, and should, use a cashier's check made out in the seller's name only.  Said cashier's check, and usually a down payment cashier's check, as well, is given to the seller only when the chanote is transferred by the Land Office to the buyer's name.  Neither the down payment check nor the final payment check should be given to the buyer before the sale is completed.  

[newnative]

37 minutes ago, Henryford said:

How did this go on for 10 years. I would have thought the first expat he scammed would have blown the whistle.

My question, too.

[scubascuba3]

7 minutes ago, newnative said:

   I don't understand your post. A chanote is a title deed.  How can you pay by a title deed?  I assume that's what you mean by cheque vs chanote but maybe I am misunderstanding.  The Land Office accepts only cash for closing costs but a buyer can, and should, use a cashier's check made out in the seller's name only.  Said cashier's check, and usually a down payment cashier's check, as well, is given to the seller only when the chanote is transferred by the Land Office to the buyer's name.  Neither the down payment check nor the final payment check should be given to the buyer before the sale is completed.  

I'll rephrase slightly, pay with cashier cheque and receive chanote at land office

[mikebell]

22 hours ago, graexx said:

Mikebell, is there a safe way to buy a condo in thailand?

Well you can't buy one on the ground floor as that's sacred ground reserved for Thais.  You can't buy one unless there's 51% Thai ownership across the complete building.  It's not safe to buy one before they've finished construction in case they run out of money to pay the builders.  You can buy a 2nd hand one off the peg but if you have a Thai partner they might not stick around because of ghosts.

All-in-all, your best bet is a Ukrainian agent.... oh.

[scubascuba3]

8 minutes ago, mikebell said:

Well you can't buy one on the ground floor as that's sacred ground reserved for Thais.  You can't buy one unless there's 51% Thai ownership across the complete building.  It's not safe to buy one before they've finished construction in case they run out of money to pay the builders.  You can buy a 2nd hand one off the peg but if you have a Thai partner they might not stick around because of ghosts.

All-in-all, your best bet is a Ukrainian agent.... oh.

I don't think that's correct about ground floor condos.

 

As for 51% Thai ownership, foreigners can buy before it gets to 51%, remember the developer will hold unsold units, not sure how these are registered

[newnative]

16 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

I'll rephrase slightly, pay with cashier cheque and receive chanote at land office

Ok, right.  Yes, use a cashier's check in the seller's name. Hand it over when you get the chanote.

[newnative]

11 minutes ago, mikebell said:

Well you can't buy one on the ground floor as that's sacred ground reserved for Thais.  You can't buy one unless there's 51% Thai ownership across the complete building.  It's not safe to buy one before they've finished construction in case they run out of money to pay the builders.  You can buy a 2nd hand one off the peg but if you have a Thai partner they might not stick around because of ghosts.

All-in-all, your best bet is a Ukrainian agent.... oh.

This is all incorrect.

[BestB]

46 minutes ago, newnative said:

My question, too.

Who said it went on for 10 years? It says he was in business for 10 years , does not mean he was doing it for 10 years.

 

he had 3 partners, but they split up about 3 years ago. I am guessing once sales started to dry up and business got tough is when he decided to run the scams , most likely a year or less.

 

my ex worked in his office on 2nd road, but when partners split up she went with chinese partner 

[Reigntax]

Its not the biggest property scam if you compare it to Prayuth selling off the whole country to the Chinese for the last 6 years.

[gk10002000]

On 3/5/2020 at 7:03 PM, balo said:

Fixed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAk98AXRh4o&feature=youtu.be

[gk10002000]

I would call the big towering unfinished eyesore condo the biggest scam...

[BestB]

7 hours ago, gk10002000 said:

I would call the big towering unfinished eyesore condo the biggest scam...

They did not plan Or intended on unfinishing it 

[mikebell]

21 hours ago, newnative said:

This is all incorrect.

Care to elaborate?  

[mikebell]

21 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

I don't think that's correct about ground floor condos.

 

As for 51% Thai ownership, foreigners can buy before it gets to 51%, remember the developer will hold unsold units, not sure how these are registered

So in a 100 condo building, 49 can be bought by farangs whilst the other 51% remain empty till Thais buy.  Sounds a good deal to me.

I'd like the ground floor question clarified - an agent wouldn't even show me round one for this reason.

[jacko45k]

2 hours ago, BestB said:

They did not plan Or intended on unfinishing it 

End result is somewhat similar!

[BestB]

47 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

End result is somewhat similar!

 Not really, for something to be a scam, one must Have intent. In their case authorities pulled the plug more than half way through. Totally out of their hands. 

[jacko45k]

Just now, BestB said:

 Not really, for something to be a scam, one must Have intent. In their case authorities pulled the plug more than half way through. Totally out of their hands. 

Have all those who put down money had 100% refunds? 

[VocalNeal]

On 3/5/2020 at 3:47 PM, from the home of CC said:

expats burning expats,

I was told once by a expat Pattaya businessman that if I was going to get financially screwed in Pattaya it would more likely be an expat than a Thai.

Edited March 8, 2020 by VocalNeal