3 hours ago, Leaver said:

You are only in Pattaya for 4 days a month.  In any case, did you actually go to The Sportsman this past high season, pre virus?  I frequent The Sportsman, and noticed a big drop in clientele, and this was in high season.  This was confirmed by staff and management.  I hope they remain in business, even when things get back to normal.

 

The Sportsman is a good example because of its consistency. It consistently has good food and beverage, and service and facilities.  The same management, and their high standards, have been in place for years.  It's not like The Sportsman "went down hill."  The problem for The Sportsman is, Pattaya / Thailand has changed around it. 

 

What has changed has been well debated on TV, such things like strong baht, higher cost of living, rising competition from neighboring countries, changing tourist demographic, aging expat population etc etc  All of these things, and more, are outside of The Sportsman's control.  They were along for the ride pre virus.      

 

Sports bars like Retox are big operations.  They are not a hobby for a retired expat.  They do not operate like a charity for expats.  If profits aren't coming in, they wind up.  Retox is currently for sale.  What does that tell you?

 

Elderly expat clientele is not enough for these sports bars to continue operating.  There is no money in putting a football match on, and having your bar full of spectators watching the match over a cup of tea, or a glass of coke, or one beer, and then leaving.  They need the tourists to come in, preferable with their two week Thai girlfriend, and for them to watch the match, get drunk, buy a meal, and hang around after the match, before heading out somewhere for the night.  This wasn't happening pre virus, and doesn't look to like happening for the foreseeable future.   

Your last paragraph confirms you have absolutely no idea.

 

The Sportsman is in a <deleted> location, not been for many many years ( used to do my visa run from there ).

 

You keep mention Retox - why? it was a flash in the pan.

3 hours ago, luckyluke said:

According to a notice from the french speaking community in Pattaya ( Ensemble ) to their members, restaurants will only be able to sell alcohol from 11 am till 02 pm, and from 05 till 11 pm.

This to avoid they take over the role of a pub/bar.

Restaurants have been denied to sale alcool since weeks

and still without the tourism from abroad they have a tiny portion

of their usual clientele.

 

Most of them have been closed during the last 2 months or

have tried to survive with only the take out service

 

The authorities could at least let's them now try to make some decent money

in these hard times, and not come again with more silly restrictions.

 

The same thing is imo for the beach vendors, i don't get the logic to not

allow the beach chair renters to work everyday of the week.

2 hours ago, treetops said:

Kilkenny on LK Metro seem to agree.

 

I am in Bangkok, still can get beers now at The Ekkamai Beer House. 

6 hours ago, kinyara said:

I agree with a lot of what you say. You mention competition from neighbouring countries but you don't explicitly mention increased local competition, which I think is as relevant if not more relevant than anything else.

 

The sports bar concept has proliferated perhaps more than any other over the years especially within the resident expat and western tourist enclave across 2nd road from The Sportsman in LK Metro & Buakhow. They were also a successful early adopter of home delivery with Door to Door and look at the competition in that market now. The number of venues has grown significantly from the Sportsman's early days not because of a contraction in Western tourist numbers but an expansion. Custom has been spread too thin to enjoy the same profits for long standing businesses by sheer business numbers, the question we should see answered is how much business culling takes place and who the prime beneficiaries are. 

 

 

I have often said the slices of the tourism pie here are getting cut thinner and thinner.   As you allude to, the virus may provide a reset for this.  

 

Only the businesses themselves know their own bottom line.  It would be a calculation of how much money they are willing to spend to either hang in the game for tourists to come back, which can also mean they remain closed in order to minimize loses, to when is their lease due, to speculating on tourists returning, to any rent discount given by the Thai landlord. 

 

As we have seen in some threads recently, some business owners have decided it's financially beneficial to walk away.      

 

As I said, sports bars can be busy with expats watching sport, but that doesn't mean the bar is making a profit.  In many cases, expats watching a sport match are similar to balloon chasers here, except the sport is on offer, not a meal. 

 

I actually think the biggest beneficiaries will be the retired expat that has a small bar as a hobby.  He's never needed or turned a profit before, so will still be here, and will probably pick up a few extra customers after the demise of the larger establishments that have huge overheads.

 

3 hours ago, HashBrownHarry said:

Your last paragraph confirms you have absolutely no idea.

 

The Sportsman is in a <deleted> location, not been for many many years ( used to do my visa run from there ).

 

You keep mention Retox - why? it was a flash in the pan.

It's you who has no idea.  You are only here for 6 weeks of the year.

 

The Sportsman used to very busy, and regularly.  Yes, it's only a small bar, but even last high season, there were empty tables, regularly.  It's location is very central for expats, and tourists.  

 

I am talking about Retox on Soi Honey.  Have you ever been there.  It's probably Pattaya's busiest sports bar, and is for sale. 

1 minute ago, Leaver said:

It's you who has no idea.  You are only here for 6 weeks of the year.

 

The Sportsman used to very busy, and regularly.  Yes, it's only a small bar, but even last high season, there were empty tables, regularly.  It's location is very central for expats, and tourists.  

 

I am talking about Retox on Soi Honey.  Have you ever been there.  It's probably Pattaya's busiest sports bar, and is for sale. 

I lived there for 8 years ( mentioned many times before that you seem to ignore ) until i got fed up with the place.

 

The Sportsman was never 'very busy'. Infact i beleive the owner got into trouble for trying to sell class A's from there?

 

I know where Retox is thank you, i have been there. How long has it been on the go, i don't think too long, right?

10 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

I lived there for 8 years ( mentioned many times before that you seem to ignore ) until i got fed up with the place.

 

The Sportsman was never 'very busy'. Infact i beleive the owner got into trouble for trying to sell class A's from there?

 

I know where Retox is thank you, i have been there. How long has it been on the go, i don't think too long, right?

I seem to remember you saying you moved away from Pattaya, but come back to Pattaya for around 4 days every month, because you have a condo here.  Is this the case?

 

On years gone by, The Sportsman has been busy.  Yes, it's only a small bar, so when even full, we are not talking about the numbers the bigger places get, but then again, I am sure they pay less rent and have less over heads, so profit margins would have been ok back then. 

 

As for Retox, it been there a while.  I would hardly call it a flash in the pan.

3 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I seem to remember you saying you moved away from Pattaya, but come back to Pattaya for around 4 days every month, because you have a condo here.  Is this the case?

 

On years gone by, The Sportsman has been busy.  Yes, it's only a small bar, so when even full, we are not talking about the numbers the bigger places get, but then again, I am sure they pay less rent and have less over heads, so profit margins would have been ok back then. 

 

As for Retox, it been there a while.  I would hardly call it a flash in the pan.

Sometimes longer, sometimes less.....up to me.

 

Don't agree, the busiest time was for the sunday carvery as i recall, never liked the place, too dark.

 

Define ' a while '

11 hours ago, Leaver said:

You are only in Pattaya for 4 days a month.  In any case, did you actually go to The Sportsman this past high season, pre virus?  I frequent The Sportsman, and noticed a big drop in clientele, and this was in high season.  This was confirmed by staff and management.  I hope they remain in business, even when things get back to normal.

 

The Sportsman is a good example because of its consistency. It consistently has good food and beverage, and service and facilities.  The same management, and their high standards, have been in place for years.  It's not like The Sportsman "went down hill."  The problem for The Sportsman is, Pattaya / Thailand has changed around it. 

 

What has changed has been well debated on TV, such things like strong baht, higher cost of living, rising competition from neighboring countries, changing tourist demographic, aging expat population etc etc  All of these things, and more, are outside of The Sportsman's control.  They were along for the ride pre virus.      

 

Sports bars like Retox are big operations.  They are not a hobby for a retired expat.  They do not operate like a charity for expats.  If profits aren't coming in, they wind up.  Retox is currently for sale.  What does that tell you?

 

Elderly expat clientele is not enough for these sports bars to continue operating.  There is no money in putting a football match on, and having your bar full of spectators watching the match over a cup of tea, or a glass of coke, or one beer, and then leaving.  They need the tourists to come in, preferable with their two week Thai girlfriend, and for them to watch the match, get drunk, buy a meal, and hang around after the match, before heading out somewhere for the night.  This wasn't happening pre virus, and doesn't look to like happening for the foreseeable future.   

Well done Leaver, a detailed post talking about a place you actually go to.

I agree with your post in its entirety.

This forum is full of people who appauld the actions of the Thai government in keeping farang's out of Thailand but wouldn't spend a dime helping the businesses left.

Those that will not close permanently, will soon realise that penny pinching expats ain't going to keep the lights on.

 

An on the ground inspection of the "restaurant" situation in my area this afternoon led me to believe that my watch was either 2 hours too fast, half an hour too slow or correct and some people have an Olympic ability to nurse a beer. 

I went to a hotel bar on Buakhao yesterday and good to see it picked up where it left off, a steady stream of punters all day, so they'll be fine

16 hours ago, luckyluke said:

I am in Bangkok, still can get beers now at The Ekkamai Beer House. 

This is about Pattaya.

4 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

This is about Pattaya.

My first post was about Pattaya, mentionning there may be special drink hours in effect. 

Being in Bangkok actually, I mentioned that where I was, there were no special drink hours. 

So I believe there is a fair correlation. 

Of course you are entitled to believe there isn't. 

 

tonguing for a beer and a bit of a fiddle down the 6, did it re-open yesterday ?

I had a slap up meal all washed down with alcoholic beverages in Hemmingways.

Decent crowd & great service

1 hour ago, Don Mega said:

tonguing for a beer and a bit of a fiddle down the 6, did it re-open yesterday ?

No

1 hour ago, seeyoujimmy said:

No

Ohh well, will continue with beers and Thaifreindly at home then !!

10 hours ago, kinyara said:

An on the ground inspection of the "restaurant" situation in my area this afternoon led me to believe that my watch was either 2 hours too fast, half an hour too slow or correct and some people have an Olympic ability to nurse a beer. 

It is another one of their stupid rules which is so easy to get around. I go to Retox to watch the football. I buy a beer bucket with ice and 3 bottles. There will be a rush on beer buckets at 1.50 pm and everyone can sit and drink in peace. If the hotel wants to really cheat they can just ring through the drinks before 2pm, sell later and give people an old receipt. Is a bit like the 7/11 situation where you just go to a mum and dad shop.

20 hours ago, Leaver said:

I have often said the slices of the tourism pie here are getting cut thinner and thinner.   As you allude to, the virus may provide a reset for this.  

 

Only the businesses themselves know their own bottom line.  It would be a calculation of how much money they are willing to spend to either hang in the game for tourists to come back, which can also mean they remain closed in order to minimize loses, to when is their lease due, to speculating on tourists returning, to any rent discount given by the Thai landlord. 

 

As we have seen in some threads recently, some business owners have decided it's financially beneficial to walk away.      

 

As I said, sports bars can be busy with expats watching sport, but that doesn't mean the bar is making a profit.  In many cases, expats watching a sport match are similar to balloon chasers here, except the sport is on offer, not a meal. 

 

I actually think the biggest beneficiaries will be the retired expat that has a small bar as a hobby.  He's never needed or turned a profit before, so will still be here, and will probably pick up a few extra customers after the demise of the larger establishments that have huge overheads.

 

I can see a lot of beer bars in the Soi Buakhao/LK Metro area opening, and maybe some gogos that had deep pockets, but the high overhead bars on Walking Street won't open until a lot of international tourists return, and only if they've struck up a good deal (concessions) from their landlords. Their wasn't great business before covid struck, so the going will be tough.

 

If Pattaya City Hall wants to retain Walking Street as a tourist attraction, they should be injecting a lot of cash to help the struggling businesses.

On 6/15/2020 at 12:44 AM, HashBrownHarry said:

Your last paragraph confirms you have absolutely no idea.

 

The Sportsman is in a <deleted> location, not been for many many years ( used to do my visa run from there ).

 

You keep mention Retox - why? it was a flash in the pan.

Retox has been around for awhile. They were iRovers on LK Metro before setting up on Langkee.

2 hours ago, Wongkitlo said:

It is another one of their stupid rules which is so easy to get around. I go to Retox to watch the football. I buy a beer bucket with ice and 3 bottles. There will be a rush on beer buckets at 1.50 pm and everyone can sit and drink in peace. If the hotel wants to really cheat they can just ring through the drinks before 2pm, sell later and give people an old receipt. Is a bit like the 7/11 situation where you just go to a mum and dad shop.

You fella will be the reason that bar and clubs wont be open for the forseeable just pushing the boundaries.

Look at the cretins on the Treetown Youtube video now going viral. No social distancing and boozing

 

Absolutely brain dead the lot of em period

48 minutes ago, Chivas said:

You fella will be the reason that bar and clubs wont be open for the forseeable just pushing the boundaries.

Look at the cretins on the Treetown Youtube video now going viral. No social distancing and boozing

 

Absolutely brain dead the lot of em period

This Tree Town area at Soi Buakhao has been very busy for weeks (not only yesterday) with little or no care about any restrictions. It seems to be a very special zone here in Pattaya in the middle of Central Pattaya - so not at a remote location. 

Off topic post and reply removed, this is Pattaya Forum.

27 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Are you talking of Bangkok, or Rayong or somewhere as I don't know these soi 33/1 places in Pattaya.....

 

It's Bangkok. It was in reply to CrunchWrapSupreme who seemed to be asking about the openings yesterday in Bangkok where he lives.  

 

Me, I'll be heading to Pattaya soon.

On 6/15/2020 at 9:10 AM, Leaver said:

You are only in Pattaya for 4 days a month.  In any case, did you actually go to The Sportsman this past high season, pre virus?  I frequent The Sportsman, and noticed a big drop in clientele, and this was in high season.  This was confirmed by staff and management.  I hope they remain in business, even when things get back to normal.

 

The Sportsman is a good example because of its consistency. It consistently has good food and beverage, and service and facilities.  The same management, and their high standards, have been in place for years.  It's not like The Sportsman "went down hill."  The problem for The Sportsman is, Pattaya / Thailand has changed around it. 

 

What has changed has been well debated on TV, such things like strong baht, higher cost of living, rising competition from neighboring countries, changing tourist demographic, aging expat population etc etc  All of these things, and more, are outside of The Sportsman's control.  They were along for the ride pre virus.      

 

Sports bars like Retox are big operations.  They are not a hobby for a retired expat.  They do not operate like a charity for expats.  If profits aren't coming in, they wind up.  Retox is currently for sale.  What does that tell you?

 

Elderly expat clientele is not enough for these sports bars to continue operating.  There is no money in putting a football match on, and having your bar full of spectators watching the match over a cup of tea, or a glass of coke, or one beer, and then leaving.  They need the tourists to come in, preferable with their two week Thai girlfriend, and for them to watch the match, get drunk, buy a meal, and hang around after the match, before heading out somewhere for the night.  This wasn't happening pre virus, and doesn't look to like happening for the foreseeable future.   

Great post, totally agree about the "Elderly expats" they just don't spend.

13 minutes ago, hackjam said:

Great post, totally agree about the "Elderly expats" they just don't spend.

Many may just live here on a State and Company pension, but it beats the lifestyle at home. The whole industry is based on the 30 million plus tourists per year not the  retired expats who, let us face it, are mostly incapable of walking around Nong Nooch in the heat, drinking 15 bottles of beer a day, having a lunchtime massage and a night time barfine.

Covid has kicked the industry into the gutter where it appeared to be heading... but it still appeals to me here to be a retirement option....

2 hours ago, hackjam said:

Great post, totally agree about the "Elderly expats" they just don't spend.

Similar to retired people back home. The problem is bars and restaurants open, winging it really without an honest business plan, when they lose money they start blaming the customers, i used to see it in golf bars, blaming customers for not spending enough when it's their turd business model

On 6/14/2020 at 10:41 PM, Leaver said:

Like I have said in the past, it's a race to the bottom here.

 

I believe they advertised for sale just as news of the virus was breaking, or very soon after, but would say the decision to sell was made well before full information and impact was know about the virus.  Retox also saw low numbers this past high season. 

 

I have came to Pattaya and elsewhere in Thailand during Christmas and New Year peak travel season year after year.   While I arrived at Pattaya on January 2, 2020,  it was very obvious New Year 2020 was a bad high season in Pattaya.   The number of tourists in Jan 2020 have dropped a lot in comparison to peak season in the past years.  Virus concern had not even entered the picture at that time.  

 

Having stayed in hotels on Soi 13 several times and dined for breakfast and dinner in the Sportmans Pub in close neighborhood few times,   I agreed with your assessment.     

Do not know about this Rotex Bar myself.   

 

 

21 hours ago, Chivas said:

You fella will be the reason that bar and clubs wont be open for the forseeable just pushing the boundaries.

Look at the cretins on the Treetown Youtube video now going viral. No social distancing and boozing

 

Absolutely brain dead the lot of em period

So you think Thai Police and Politicians sitting in their offices reading TVF will know what a beer bucket is?

From my point of view, the whole social distancing thing is nonsensical, when you have no new cases, and Covid appears to be completely gone from the land. Distancing from what exactly? The ghost of Covid? The imaginary Zombies?