Renewing one of your two UK passsports.

[Saltire]

Theres a long running thread about passport renewals at the moment, here is a summary of my journey which ended yesterday.

 

The Passport Saga

 

I have 2 valid UK passports, both issued in 2010. My original one expires August 2021, this is the active one with all my stamps etc. I needed a new one so that when I renew my extension of stay in November I get a full 12 months and not just up to the passport expiry date of August 2021.

 

So when VFS Global in Bangkok re-opened in June I took along all the relevant documents. The second passport expires in December 2020 so I figured i'd just let it expire. This was my first mistake.

 

After a week I got an email from VFS requesting 'additional documents', a letter from my employer to confirm I still require a second passport. I retired 8 years ago so have no employer to provide these documents, nor do i now need a second passport.

 

I started by trying to talk to someone using the HMPO support number and then by email but this proved almost impossible. I suggested in an email that when they send my new one I would surrender both my passports which could be voided before they handed over the new one. I also offered to send it to Liverpool or VFS by DHL, but this request was never answered.

 

The eventual response to all this was an email asking if I had been back to VFS to hand in my second passport. I got so frustrated I took the second passport to VFS despite the fact that it is a 5/6 hour drive each way from home to Soi 13 and so this was a real inconvenience. Yes I know I could nominate someone but I am not a fan of agents nor do I have anyone who could help with this and go for me.

 

VFS had no idea why I was requesting an original passport be sent to Liverpool as they only ever send a full photocopy. I had to politely insist they send it using DHL it with my cover letter. All I had from Liverpool we the request for an employers letter to justify keeping a second passport. I showed them this and immediately regretted it as they now wanted the requested documents. After an hour they agreed to DHL my passport to Liverpool at a cost of 1115 Baht. It got there in the usual 2 days

 

When it arrived I emailed to confirm they now have the second passport and can they get a move on with my renewal. The response to this one beggars belief.

 

They asked me to DHL BOTH my passports to Liverpool. A polite but direct reply insisted there was no way I would send them my active passport while living in Thailand. They obviously had not read my email to tell them they had the other one already, and that while it had arrived, they had not seen it even 3 days after it was signed for.

 

This time the reply was very apologetic explaining it can take a long time for internal mail to come to the recipients desk. I was notified the completion now would take 7 to 10 days.

 

Next on the 23rd July I got an SMS from DHL saying my passport was on the way and scheduled to arrive at VFS on the 29th (the 27th and 28th being holidays. I emailed them on the 28th asking for a collection appointment on the morning of the 3rd of August.

 

The response to this appointment request came when DHL showed me that VFS had signed for it.

 

Unbelievably they told me your passport is not the jumbo one you ordered, they have issued you a 32 page, not a 50 page. They asked me to check the payment and if it was for the jumbo to send them proof of the transaction and they would return the passport to the UK and have them send a new one! I replied DO NOT send it back I can live with the smaller one this time around, and my appointment for Monday was confirmed. What a shambles.  

 

I went on Monday 3rd, no mention of a refund or apology for the wrong size (but not their fault anyway) so I just checked it, signed it and headed home.

 

This took a day shy of 6 weeks, the standard time having been quoted as 3 to 6 weeks, but I had to go 3 times and not 2. 

 

So for anyone who has 2 UK Passports, you want one renewed and no longer need the second one, you need to return it to HMPO for cancellation BEFORE you try to renew your working one. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[dabhand]

I may have missed it, but what happened to the second passport after it reached HMPO? Is this being kept by HMPO or expected to be sent back to you, for your records, after being cancelled?

 

Excellent summary of  'events' and, as previously noted, very useful for my similar circumstances with an upcoming renewal of one of my two UK passports.  

 

 

[sidgy]

1 hour ago, Saltire said:

So for anyone who has 2 UK Passports, you want one renewed and no longer need the second one, you need to return it to HMPO for cancellation BEFORE you try to renew your working one. 

Do you go through VFS to send back for cancellation? And if so , do you think i can do it on the same time i apply to renew my 2nd passport?

was going to renew my passport with only about five pages left whilst i cannot travel. my first passport is full already. Due to not working at the moment due to C19, i have no employer to give me a letter to explain why i need second passport so looks like i will have to go back to one 

[CorpusChristie]

Why do you need two UK passports ?

[sidgy]

15 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

Why do you need two UK passports ?

working offshore around the world. sometimes need to send passport away to get visa but also have to have passport with you in Thailand. Holding two passports allows this

[Saltire]

18 hours ago, dabhand said:

I may have missed it, but what happened to the second passport after it reached HMPO? Is this being kept by HMPO or expected to be sent back to you, for your records, after being cancelled?

 

Excellent summary of  'events' and, as previously noted, very useful for my similar circumstances with an upcoming renewal of one of my two UK passports.  

 

 

I have no idea what happens to it, I assume they cut it up. I have a scan of it for posterity,

[Saltire]

18 hours ago, sidgy said:

Do you go through VFS to send back for cancellation? And if so , do you think i can do it on the same time i apply to renew my 2nd passport?

was going to renew my passport with only about five pages left whilst i cannot travel. my first passport is full already. Due to not working at the moment due to C19, i have no employer to give me a letter to explain why i need second passport so looks like i will have to go back to one 

HMPO does not seem to have a standard procedure for renewing 2 passports, but the appllication form says you should submit a complete copy of all passports you wish to renew.

 

Am pretty sure you are right about no letter, no second passport unfortunately.

Edited August 5, 2020 by Saltire

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, Saltire said:

HMPO does not seem to have a standard procedure for renewing 2 passports, but the appllication form says you should submit a complete copy of all passports you wish to renew.

 

Am pretty sure you are right about no letter, no second passport unfortunately.

Just over 5 years ago and just after VFS took over the UK passport renewal procedure, I had to renew both my UK passports as they were both down to a few pages. The downloaded guidance specifically stated that If I had a second valid UK passport, copies of all the pages in that 2nd passport had to be submitted with the renewal of the 1st passport in addition to copies of the 1st actually being renewed. I also had to supply a company letter with each renewal stating my continued need for two passports. That was two separate letters detailing all old and all new passport numbers.

 

I did the first passport renewal using this procedure and it was issued in January and upon receipt of the new passport, repeated the same procedure for the 2nd passport that was issued in February. Both renewals took between 13 to 17 days between submitting their applications at VFS and collecting them up at VFS.

[NanLaew]

20 hours ago, sidgy said:

working offshore around the world. sometimes need to send passport away to get visa but also have to have passport with you in Thailand. Holding two passports allows this

Also the need to have a 'clean' passport.

 

Some countries don't like other countries and can deny entry if a visitors passport has evidence they have previously visited a country they don't like. I worked in Cuba and they put all entry and exit stamps on a piece of paper stapled inside my UK passport. I simply removed the Cuban paper while in transit through Mexico before flying into the US where I was living at the time. Iran, Saudi and others have issues with Israel entry/exit stamps but Israel didn't mind how many Iraq or Pakistan immigration stamps I had.

[Saltire]

1 hour ago, NanLaew said:

Just over 5 years ago and just after VFS took over the UK passport renewal procedure, I had to renew both my UK passports as they were both down to a few pages. The downloaded guidance specifically stated that If I had a second valid UK passport, copies of all the pages in that 2nd passport had to be submitted with the renewal of the 1st passport in addition to copies of the 1st actually being renewed. I also had to supply a company letter with each renewal stating my continued need for two passports. That was two separate letters detailing all old and all new passport numbers.

 

I did the first passport renewal using this procedure and it was issued in January and upon receipt of the new passport, repeated the same procedure for the 2nd passport that was issued in February. Both renewals took between 13 to 17 days between submitting their applications at VFS and collecting them up at VFS.

Thanks, it sounds like HMPO had people who knew what they were doing 5 years ago. No one I spoke to really had a clue.

[NanLaew]

45 minutes ago, Saltire said:

Thanks, it sounds like HMPO had people who knew what they were doing 5 years ago. No one I spoke to really had a clue.

I didn't have to speak with anyone at HMPO or VFS. I recall that a comment about the need to identify 'all other passports' and include copies of that was in the downloaded instruction. Arguably, this was my fourth or fifth sequential dual passport renewal while out of the UK so the support letters weren't an unknown requirement. VFS didn't bat an eyelid when they checked the submission and all those 'extra' passport copies either.

 

As for the current HMPO people being a bit lost, maybe they don't have full access to all facilities while working from home during the pandemic?

Edited August 5, 2020 by NanLaew

[OJAS]

53 minutes ago, Saltire said:

Thanks, it sounds like HMPO had people who knew what they were doing 5 years ago. No one I spoke to really had a clue.

Not to mention that IMHO HMPO should, generally speaking, really be making a much better fist of explaining the passport renewal process for those with 2 valid passports on the GOV.UK website (just as you have taken the trouble to do in your OP), rather than having them rely on ignorant morons for relevant info info upon request. After all, we're not exactly talking about a "once-in-a-blue-moon" event in this particular instance, are we?!

 

EDIT: Same, of course, could arguably be said about the dreaded With-It Tower Passport Renewal Experience in general. HMPO could IMHO do little worse than explain the procedures involved in the same clear way as the American Embassy has done for the benefit of our American cousins, for instance:-

 

https://th.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/passports/adult-passport-renew/

 

 

Edited August 5, 2020 by OJAS

[NanLaew]

2 minutes ago, OJAS said:

Not to mention that IMHO HMPO should, generally speaking, really be making a much better fist of explaining the passport renewal process for those with 2 valid passports on the GOV.UK website (just as you have taken the trouble to do in your OP), rather than having them rely on ignorant morons for relevant info info upon request. After all, we're not exactly talking about a "once-in-a-blue-moon" event in this particular instance, are we?!

The OP assumed that he would just let the second, still valid passport expire and admits that it was his mistake to have made that decision. HMPO's records showed he has two passports but maybe the OP didn't reference it in his application to renew his other passport?

 

I agree that it did open a can of worms for the OP at a most inopportune time and the drop outs in his communications with HMPO didn't make it any easier but AFAIK, the need to include details of the other passport in the application and the need for copies of that passport may still be part of their downloadable instructions? Generally, be it passport renewal or hanging new wallpaper, when one doesn't follow instructions, it usually doesn't end properly.

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, OJAS said:

Not to mention that IMHO HMPO should, generally speaking, really be making a much better fist of explaining the passport renewal process for those with 2 valid passports on the GOV.UK website (just as you have taken the trouble to do in your OP), rather than having them rely on ignorant morons for relevant info info upon request. After all, we're not exactly talking about a "once-in-a-blue-moon" event in this particular instance, are we?!

 

EDIT: Same, of course, could arguably be said about the dreaded With-It Tower Passport Renewal Experience in general. HMPO could IMHO do little worse than explain the procedures involved in the same clear way as the American Embassy has done for the benefit of our American cousins, for instance:-

 

https://th.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/passports/adult-passport-renew/

 

 

Where does it explain in the "same clear way" how an American can renew two valid passports?

[Saltire]

3 hours ago, NanLaew said:

The OP assumed that he would just let the second, still valid passport expire and admits that it was his mistake to have made that decision. HMPO's records showed he has two passports but maybe the OP didn't reference it in his application to renew his other passport?

 

I agree that it did open a can of worms for the OP at a most inopportune time and the drop outs in his communications with HMPO didn't make it any easier but AFAIK, the need to include details of the other passport in the application and the need for copies of that passport may still be part of their downloadable instructions? Generally, be it passport renewal or hanging new wallpaper, when one doesn't follow instructions, it usually doesn't end properly.

Correct, never assume anything. It does have a space on the form to tick 1 2 or 3 passports and you need to send a full copy of every page for all passports. I missed this, but not wishing to renew the second one I would probably have interpreted it a not applicable unless I wanted and was eligible for 2 renewals. It could definitely be clearer.

 

I can relax for 10 years now as I am unlikely to fill this new one up anytime soon with all the travel issues even though they gave me the wrong size.

 

Incidentally when I was collecting it a customer was lodging a renewal for his son who had a UK and Thai passport. They needed a copy of every page for both, even though only 1 was a UK passport.

 

[Saltire]

Just when you think the process is over, got my new passport on the 3rd August and registered it with immigration same day, yesterday I get an SMS from DHL saying a passport is on the way to VFS??

 

This will be interesting.

 

Are they sending me a second passport even though I no longer qualify for one and no longer need one? Or are they sending me a 50 page one as paid for even though I accepted the 32 page one? Have they cancelled the one I now have? The incompetence never stops.

 

Whatever they are sending one thing is for sure; I will not be going to Bangkok again to collect it.

 

 

[Saltire]

I am hoping this is the final post on this thread!

 

When I returned the second passport via VFS (an additional trip) they subsequently issued my new one which is now registered with Immigration.

 

They voided the old passport I sent them and returned it with DHL to VFS who asked me to come and collect it. Now, having had 3 trips to VFS I had no intention of a 4th one to collect a dead passport.

 

I asked them to either a) post it to my home using regular mail, or b) destroy it on my behalf.

 

They wrote back to say they would destroy it as they were not allowed to mail it to me.

 

AND EVERYONE LIVED HAPPILY EVER AFTER.

 

THE END.