11 minutes ago, Somchai Jackson said:

Hopefully he's in an orange jumpsuit at the end of the month.  Seditious has its price.

It will take longer than that, and most likely will be for state crimes. Patience . . . patience.

42 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

you can't pin the actions of a third party as evidence of guilt

Of course you can. many crimes when prefixed with conspiracy to........ are just that.

1 hour ago, GrandPapillon said:

even a blind man could see that he can't be convicted with "second hand" evidence

 

only a true Trump hater could be convinced of otherwise ????

Not the first time I've explained this to you - the man is not hated, his CRIMES are hated. And if you had been paying attention, it's no longer second hand. Now that he's been muzzled, defanged, and people aren't afraid for their careers, they're coming forward, willing and eager to testify about his election meddling.

 

Don't let your misguided love for the traitor dissuade you from seeing the facts.

 

Trump entertained plan to install an attorney general who would help him pursue baseless election fraud claims

 

Just now, polpott said:

44 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

you can't pin the actions of a third party as evidence of guilt

Of course you can. many crimes when prefixed with conspiracy to........ are just that.

No longer third party. 45 is guilty as sin, and first hand witnesses are coming forth, corroborating the evidence of his crimes.

 

And I really wish a 45 supporter could explain the undying love for the traitor. Is it a 401k thing? Not the first time I've asked. Not sarcasm, I really want to know. Details, please.

If you lost a loved family member due to avoidable incompetence, wouldn't you be out of sorts? If you lost your home and your savings, tossed out on the streets, while billionaires were buying their sixth yacht, wouldn't that rub you the wrong way?

1 hour ago, phil2407 said:

I'm not American but as I understand the US law you can't impeach an Ex president as it's unconstitutional (might be wrong) even done when the president  in office - if so why wasn't Clinton not treated the same when he denied no sexual activity took place with his intern Monica whoever? 

 

Yes, the Senate Can Try Trump

Impeachment for former officials was the norm at the time of the founding.

For the Founders, it would have been obvious that the “power to impeach” included the ability to hold former officials to account. The impeachment power was imported to America from England, where Parliament impeached only two men during the 18th century, both former officers. 

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/yes-the-senate-can-try-trump-11611356881

 

A little bit about the author of this article:

Keith E. Whittington is William Nelson Cromwell Professor of Politics in the Department of Politics at Princeton University. He is the author of Repugnant Laws: Judicial Review of Acts of Congress from the Founding to the Present (which won the Thomas M. Cooley Book Prize) and Speak Freely: Why Universities Must Defend Free Speech (which won the PROSE Award for best book in education and the Heterodox Academy Award for Exceptional Scholarship))...

 

1 hour ago, GrandPapillon said:

even a blind man could see that he can't be convicted with "second hand" evidence

 

only a true Trump hater could be convinced of otherwise ????

What is second hand about the evidence?  Trump's speech revved up the crowd with statements like "you have to fight much harder", "When you catch somebody in a fraud ( reference to his false claims of a stolen election), you are allowed to go by very different rules", "we will not take it anymore, and that is what this is all about", "You have to show strength", etc., then pointed them to the Capitol building.  All this is on record; it's not second hand.

 

If he had not intended to have them storm the building he would have immediately taken action after the police were overwhelmed.  Instead he watched TV and ignored staff telling him he had to authorize the use of the National Guard.

 

I think there is a good chance that some of the Republicans forced to run and hide from an angry mob baying for blood will consider these things strong evidence of guilt.

 

Of course it's worth noting that you have tried to minimize the gravity of the sedition, made light of the security measures that prevented another violent protest, and consider Russia a friend of the US.  Everything you post must be taken with a large grain of salt.

 

 

44 minutes ago, J Town said:

No longer third party. 45 is guilty as sin, and first hand witnesses are coming forth, corroborating the evidence of his crimes.

 

And I really wish a 45 supporter could explain the undying love for the traitor. Is it a 401k thing? Not the first time I've asked. Not sarcasm, I really want to know. Details, please.

If it's a 401k thing these people aren't paying attention.  The S&P 500 is up about 20% since Trump lost the election.  https://www.marketwatch.com/investing/index/spx

2 hours ago, GrandPapillon said:

he has been charged, not convicted

 

anyway, there is no enough evidence to convict him in the Senate, no matter how political it is

 

you can't pin the actions of a third party as evidence of guilt

 

he will walk away from conviction, and be back in 4 years, so you guys will have something again to talk about ????

People get convicted for inciting others to commit crimes all the time. 

 

We’ll have plenty to talk about as Trump goes through his impeachment trial, Federal trials, State trials and Civil trials..... Oh and of course, his bankruptcy.

1 hour ago, polpott said:

Of course you can. many crimes when prefixed with conspiracy to........ are just that.

And as a general rule ‘conspiracy’ to commit a crime carries twice the penalty of actually committing the crime.

 

Lock him up!

3 hours ago, Somchai Jackson said:

Hopefully he's in an orange jumpsuit at the end of the month.  Seditious has its price.

 

What does your gut feeling tell you?

Do you think enough Republicans will go against him? 

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

And as a general rule ‘conspiracy’ to commit a crime carries twice the penalty of actually committing the crime.

I would think that conspiracy to invade the Capitol would possibly attract a sentence of life imprisonment, Lucky it happened in DC or Trump might be facing the long walk.

2 minutes ago, Virt said:

 

What does your gut feeling tell you?

Do you think enough Republicans will go against him? 

For their own sakes, they should.

3 hours ago, J Town said:

Heavy sigh . . . He's been impeached by Congress. Remember the last time? Yeah, he wasn't convicted the last time, might not this time, but bottom line:

 

He's been impeached twice.

in this environment, this could be considered a badge of honor,

 

wasn't Clinton impeached as well, and yet came across as one of the best US president ever? ????

15 hours ago, vandeventer said:

This are joke right! Trump left office you can't impeach him as he is already gone! Your just s--- scared he will be back in 4 years, as Biden continues to screw up the country in only 2 days in office. Open borders will be one of his biggest downfalls plus all the other stupid things he is doing. Real Americans won't put up with S---.

"Real Americans" know the law and the fact that Trump was already impeached while he was still in office (for a second time by the way.....a record....so much for making American great again) and now they are going to trial in the Senate to decide if he should be convicted...I love how some people think they speak for "Real Americans"...

15 minutes ago, Tie Dye Samurai said:

"Real Americans" know the law and the fact that Trump was already impeached while he was still in office (for a second time by the way.....a record....so much for making American great again) and now they are going to trial in the Senate to decide if he should be convicted...I love how some people think they speak for "Real Americans"...

" Real americans" is a dog whistle for you know what. The truth of the matter is that there is a president for for impeachment after office. If it was the case that a president could not be impeached and tried after he left office,  a president would be free to do whatever he wanted in the last couple of weeks in office.

34 minutes ago, Tie Dye Samurai said:

"Real Americans" know the law and the fact that Trump was already impeached while he was still in office (for a second time by the way.....a record....so much for making American great again) and now they are going to trial in the Senate to decide if he should be convicted...I love how some people think they speak for "Real Americans"...

Yes, it's code for far right wing white nationalism. 

7 hours ago, Somchai Jackson said:

Hopefully he's in an orange jumpsuit at the end of the month.  Seditious has its price.

He'll be legally exposed for the rest of his life unless he manages to get reelected president (which at this point even without a senate conviction seems unlikely). 

7 hours ago, J Town said:

Heavy sigh . . . He's been impeached by Congress. Remember the last time? Yeah, he wasn't convicted the last time, might not this time, but bottom line:

 

He's been impeached twice.

Yes. Impeachment and Mr. trump will be forever linked. Try googling impeachment and then do image search. There he is! American children in perpetuity (if the democracy survives) will be learning what a president should NOT be by the example of Mr. trump. In that he trumped Nixon!

This is great news, because it's always good to let politicians decide who we're not allowed to vote for.

3 minutes ago, impulse said:

This is great news, because it's always good to let politicians decide who we're not allowed to vote for.

Not politicians, The Constitution .

 

8 hours ago, phil2407 said:

I'm not American but as I understand the US law you can't impeach an Ex president as it's unconstitutional (might be wrong) even done when the president  in office - if so why wasn't Clinton not treated the same when he denied no sexual activity took place with his intern Monica whoever? 

Mr. trump was impeached while he was in office. The trial in the senate to convict him or not will occur after. It's Kosher, dude. 

I have no idea what you're trying to say about Bill Clinton.

Yes he was impeached and not convicted (all while he was still in office).

To add there has never been even one conviction of an impeached president in American history. So it's very hard to do. If Mr. trump isn't convicted in the senate for inciting an insurrection against the U.S. government then it might be fair to say that it's basically IMPOSSIBLE. 

9 hours ago, J Town said:

I can only hope people will take off the 45 tainted glasses. Even Qanon is calling 45 a phony now.

 

DT's last lie (no, not the last lie he'll ever tell, but the lie that broke the camel's back (mixed metaphor alert, or if that's too imaginative just toss it off as fake news, as no camels were involved)):

Quote

Now, it is up to Congress to confront this egregious assault on our democracy. And after this, we’re going to walk down, and I’ll be there with you, we’re going to walk down, we’re going to walk down.

Anyone you want, but I think right here, we’re going to walk down to the Capitol, and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we’re probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them.

https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2021-01-13/transcript-of-trumps-speech-at-rally-before-us-capitol-riot

 

Even the dumbest of his supporters can see he did not accompany them.  I was curious how the Secret Service detail would deal with him leading the rabble.  Probably thought it was a good time to inspect the bunker again (fascist leaders love bunkers, have you noticed?).  No pardons for his ardent fans.  I've wondered what this moment would look like, when these sorry supporters realize they were had, especially the sorry sacks of [bleep] who sent the rich guy money.  I could see them now looking at him doing his "YMCA" dance at rallies and realize he was mocking them, getting their blood boiling.

I think his best move would be to go into exile, not just to escape US law enforcement but the wrath of betrayed former fans.  He can play golf with Thaksin, see which one can out-cheat the other.  My money's on real the real entrepreneur.

 

 

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

1 hour ago, impulse said:

This is great news, because it's always good to let politicians decide who we're not allowed to vote for.

Not politicians, The Constitution .

 

So what you're telling me is that the Constitution is currently going around making back room deals to decide how to vote?

 

2 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

So what you're telling me is that the Constitution is currently going around making back room deals to decide how to vote?

 

No the constitution decides who you are not allowed to vote for,

You said "This is great news, because it's always good to let politicians decide who we're not allowed to vote for. " 

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

" Real americans" is a dog whistle for you know what. The truth of the matter is that there is a president for for impeachment after office. If it was the case that a president could not be impeached and tried after he left office,  a president would be free to do whatever he wanted in the last couple of weeks in office.

 

Not really.  He could be prosecuted as any normal citizen for any legal misdeeds.  True, he's free to take as many politically unpopular actions as he wants- as long as they're legal.  But he still can't break the law.  And Congress and the Supreme court are free to overturn any unconstitutional actions.

 

 

8 hours ago, J Town said:

No longer third party. 45 is guilty as sin, and first hand witnesses are coming forth, corroborating the evidence of his crimes.

 

And I really wish a 45 supporter could explain the undying love for the traitor. Is it a 401k thing? Not the first time I've asked. Not sarcasm, I really want to know. Details, please.

Good point, it would be interesting to know the specifics of why he has these followers.

1 minute ago, impulse said:

 

Not really.  He could be prosecuted as any normal citizen for any legal misdeeds.  True, he's free to take as many politically unpopular actions as he wants- as long as they're legal.  But he still can't break the law.  And Congress and the Supreme court are free to overturn any unconstitutional actions.

 

 

Not really? who are real Americans then and who are fake Americans?

 

4 minutes ago, sirineou said:

No the constitution decides who you are not allowed to vote for,

You said "This is great news, because it's always good to let politicians decide who we're not allowed to vote for. " 

 

Show me in the Constitution where it says we can't vote for Trump in 2024.  I looked.  Don't see it...

You guys hate Trump so much you're willing to let them erode our voting rights just to keep him from running in 2024.

 

Just now, sirineou said:

Not really? who are real Americans then and who are fake Americans?

 

You're saying he'd be free to do whatever he wants in his last few weeks, free of the threat of impeachment.  That's not true.