U.S. Housing Prices Explosion Making Repatriation a Less Realistic Option for Many?

[Yellowtail]

3 hours ago, impulse said:

2 comments... 

 

1) If that house happened to be in Flint or Detroit MI, it would be worth about what they paid for it.  (That's an exaggeration, of course.  But you get the point)  Luck of the draw in terms of what sector your parents found employment in.  If it was at Pontiac or Chrysler, too bad...

Had that house been in Flint or Detroit it wouldn't have lasted one winter. In any event, if it had survived the winter we would have moved when the city managements spirals out of control. 

 

Anyone buying a home in 1954 likely would have done fine working for Pontiac or Chrysler, and they would have retired with fat pensions they would still be enjoying (probably in Florida)  assuming they were sill alive. 

 

 

3 hours ago, impulse said:

2) Your ROI comparison assumes constant costs.  You left out insurance, taxes and maintenance which have been skyrocketing along with the values.  Here where I live, taxes alone would be about $15,000 a year and flood insurance would be about the same (we get socked here at the beach).  Add those numbers into the comparison, and putting that money into some other investment vehicle looks pretty good. 

Yes, but I also left having to take rent out of the S & P investment,  yes? Just paying rent in a 1 bedroom apartment in the same area would have eaten up every bit the the S & P investment. 

 

A guy that grows up farming that works as a mechanic in WW2, then becomes an engineer and has two sons and two daughters by a wife that ran a turret-lathe during WW2 does not spend much on maintenance. 

 

I can't speak to insurance, but taxes would have been frozen in the '70s with Prop 13, yes? 

 

But getting back on topic, if a landlord is paying $15K a year in taxes on a single family dwelling, that's $1,250 a month going from the tenant to the government, yes?

 

I have never owned real-estate, and virtually all of what little money I have in other investment vehicles. How are your other vehicles doing so far this year? Mine not so good....

[Yellowtail]

1 hour ago, cmarshall said:

It's always impressive to me to hear the conservatives decry government programs at the same time that they extol home ownership.

Why does that impress you? 

 

1 hour ago, cmarshall said:

Well, here's some news for you: the US has a socialized system of home ownership from which your family has benefitted. 

This is not news to me,  why would you assume it is? I'm guessing it's because like a lot of people, you down on everyone you disagree with and think they're stupid. 

 

1 hour ago, cmarshall said:

The banks make the mortgages, but then upstream the loans to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac while the FHA standardized loan terms.  The 30-year mortgage was created during WWII and is pretty much an American phenomenon along with the absence of prepayment penalties, which is unknown outside the US.  Your childhood home benefitted from the GI bill with its federal mortgage guarantee even if your father was not himself a veteran since it assisted in creating the buildout of the postwar suburbs.  

Again, none of this is news to me. I have benefitted from any number of things I do not think are for the greater good. I do not think the government should be guaranteeing home loans anymore than I think they should be bailing out banks, financial institutions, private corporations, homeowners etc. That I do or do not benefit from the bailouts is irreverent. 

 

I benefited from the student loan program, but I do not support it, and do not think it benefits working American. 

 

1 hour ago, cmarshall said:

So, let's keep the government's hands off our Medicare, eh?

Are you Canadian eh? How about let's keep the government's hands off our healthcare altogether?  

[cmarshall]

24 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Why does that impress you? 

 

This is not news to me,  why would you assume it is? I'm guessing it's because like a lot of people, you down on everyone you disagree with and think they're stupid. 

 

Again, none of this is news to me. I have benefitted from any number of things I do not think are for the greater good. I do not think the government should be guaranteeing home loans anymore than I think they should be bailing out banks, financial institutions, private corporations, homeowners etc. That I do or do not benefit from the bailouts is irreverent. 

 

I benefited from the student loan program, but I do not support it, and do not think it benefits working American. 

 

Are you Canadian eh? How about let's keep the government's hands off our healthcare altogether?  

Makes you the poster boy for cognitive dissonance.  

[Jingthing]

Massive rent increases = Massive increases in the "unsheltered"

 

 

[Yellowtail]

3 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Massive rent increases = Massive increases in the "unsheltered"

 

 

When people are unable to continue to pay the rent, and large number of units go unrented, will the price not come down? 

[Yellowtail]

13 hours ago, cmarshall said:

Makes you the poster boy for cognitive dissonance.  

How?

[GinBoy2]

I must be living in the US, in a parallel universe, to the universe that folks not living in the US are reading about.

 

There has always been homelessness and skidrow.

 

When I lived in San Diego a lot of the homeless were ex military, combination of drugs, PTSD which given the VA benefits shouldn't have resulted in homelessness.

 

We now live in the frozen North yet I don't see the hoards of the reported  homeless freezing to death on the sidewalk

[meechai]

5 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

I must be living in the US, in a parallel universe, to the universe that folks not living in the US are reading about.

You have to understand these are folks that have not (because they cant) been back to the USA in decades.

So since they cant they want to be the chicken little running amok crying the sky is falling in a place they never been...in decades

 

These dogs won't hunt & never would......It in reality is they who live in a parallel favela ????

[Yellowtail]

7 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

I must be living in the US, in a parallel universe, to the universe that folks not living in the US are reading about.

 

There has always been homelessness and skidrow.

 

When I lived in San Diego a lot of the homeless were ex military, combination of drugs, PTSD which given the VA benefits shouldn't have resulted in homelessness.

 

We now live in the frozen North yet I don't see the hoards of the reported  homeless freezing to death on the sidewalk

Do we think a housing crisis being ginned-up in the press that blames greedy landlords coming up on a mid-term election is a coincidence? 

 

Why no discussion on how a moratorium on evictions has to driven rents?

 

Why no discussion about the cost of construction which has almost doubled in the last year? Does that not impact housing costs? 

 

No, the problem has to be greedy landlords. Someone must try to save the poor from the greedy, money-grubbing landlords, and someone must be blamed for the poor NOT being saved, and this all needs to happen before November. 

 

[Yellowtail]

2 hours ago, meechai said:

You have to understand these are folks that have not (because they cant) been back to the USA in decades.

So since they cant they want to be the chicken little running amok crying the sky is falling in a place they never been...in decades

 

These dogs won't hunt & never would......It in reality is they who live in a parallel favela ????

In all fairness, a lot of people still thing the media they favor is providing unbiased reporting. 

[meechai]

57 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

In all fairness, a lot of people still thing the media they favor is providing unbiased reporting. 

True...mainly the folks that don't live in the spots msm is reporting on.

They still cannot understand it is sensationalism that sells/gets the clicks...well that & supporting the usual political BS ????

[Jingthing]

9 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

I must be living in the US, in a parallel universe, to the universe that folks not living in the US are reading about.

 

There has always been homelessness and skidrow.

 

When I lived in San Diego a lot of the homeless were ex military, combination of drugs, PTSD which given the VA benefits shouldn't have resulted in homelessness.

 

We now live in the frozen North yet I don't see the hoards of the reported  homeless freezing to death on the sidewalk

What is the population of your town or city?

Homeless people are concentrated in URBAN areas.

Of course there is also the trend of nomadic vehicle dwellers, mostly seniors chasing low paying very seasonal jobs often in less urban areas.

Whether homeless people seek better climates or not appears to be a point of controversy.

[Jingthing]

16 minutes ago, meechai said:

True...mainly the folks that don't live in the spots msm is reporting on.

They still cannot understand it is sensationalism that sells/gets the clicks...well that & supporting the usual political BS ????

So you actually don't believe that rapidly rising rents and a critical shortage of affordable housing doesn't directly result in increases of people living in vehicles and full homelessness?

How could it not?

You seem to be saying homelessness is some kind of media conspiracy theory.

Sir, that is bonkers.

While I can understand many people not caring about those suffering with too high housing costs or homelessness but I draw the line at efforts to play act that the problem doesn't exist. That is intolerable! That is a lie!

[EVENKEEL]

6 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

So you actually don't believe that rapidly rising rents and a critical shortage of affordable housing doesn't directly result in increases of people living in vehicles and full homelessness?

How could it not?

You seem to be saying homelessness is some kind of media conspiracy theory.

Sir, that is bonkers.

While I can understand many people not caring about those suffering with too high housing costs or homelessness but I draw the line at efforts to play act that the problem doesn't exist. That is intolerable! That is a lie!

Your enthusiasm for trying to keep this subject alive is commendable. Early on suggestions were given on how to live cheaper and in each case you had multiple reasons why it just wouldn't work for you. Let me refresh the memory.

1. Buy an old travel trailer and rent a space, they can be had in the $300/mo range.

2. Rent a room in a house with kitchen privileges, which would require the least out of pocket expenses.

3. Here's a good one. become a merchant seaman and get free housing.

4. Alot of dairies and farms have free housing for the workers.

  

[Yellowtail]

9 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

So you actually don't believe that rapidly rising rents and a critical shortage of affordable housing doesn't directly result in increases of people living in vehicles and full homelessness?

How could it not?

You are absolutely correct, it must result in an increase in people living in vehicles and full homelessness.

 

Now do you not agree that a moratorium on evictions has to drive up the cost of rent and that the escalating cost of construction as well as construction related goods and services also has to drive up housing costs? 

 

But to be clear, people need to eat and they need energy, so the increasing prices of food and energy also contributes an increase in  people living in vehicles and full homelessness.

 

Why the focus on greedy landlords? 

[BritManToo]

16 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

3. Here's a good one. become a merchant seaman and get free housing.

4. Alot of dairies and farms have free housing for the workers.

Not much call for OAPs in either of those jobs.

[meechai]

43 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

You seem to be saying homelessness is some kind of media conspiracy theory.

Your words not mine....There are homeless as always & many in fact by choice

It is you that uses sensationalized media to explain your sky is falling in the USA chants

 

But you & your constant complaining about a place you have not been for decades gets old & is in fact the dishonest one

 

Folks who actually move back seem to do fine & do find affordable places & I am saying that while living in one of the most expensive States

 

Perhaps you should tune out of msm & concentrate on finding your place in the sun...if it exists ????

 

[Jingthing]

8 minutes ago, meechai said:

Your words not mine....There are homeless as always & many in fact by choice

It is you that uses sensationalized media to explain your sky is falling in the USA chants

 

But you & your constant complaining about a place you have not been for decades gets old & is in fact the dishonest one

 

Folks who actually move back seem to do fine & do find affordable places & I am saying that while living in one of the most expensive States

 

Perhaps you should tune out of msm & concentrate on finding your place in the sun...if it exists ????

 

You're a broken record with your obsession on personally attacking me based on travel activities.

You are not posting in good faith.

You're in severe denial about a very serious national problem

We can easily guess at your motivations but at the end of the day -- not interesting.

I will pass at engaging with you any further on this issue as there is clearly no value in it.

Cheerio dude

Edited March 9, 2022 by Jingthing

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, meechai said:

Folks who actually move back seem to do fine & do find affordable places & I am saying that while living in one of the most expensive States

I doubt I'd do fine if forced to return to the UK, housing prices are extreme everywhere.

I could probably afford a rural farmhouse in France though ...... if only we hadn't left the EU!

[Yellowtail]

48 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Not much call for OAPs in either of those jobs.

But there is plenty of work available

[Longwood50]

On 3/7/2022 at 10:39 PM, Jingthing said:

A somewhat rich country like the US shouldn't have even one homeless person unless they're camping. 

Jinthing, 

The 20% poorest people in the USA are better off than the "average" in most European countries.  And yet like all liberals, that is "just not enough"   The USA has spent over the last 58 years 22 Trillion dollars in welfare related programs.  The entire net worth of the entire world is estimated to be $510 trillion dollars, so the USA with only 4.25% of the world population has spent 4.3% of the entire worth of the world giving it to the poorest, and that is "not enough"


https://fee.org/articles/the-poorest-20-of-americans-are-richer-than-most-nations-of-europe/


The average person in this world struggles with enough to eat, shelter over their heads, adequate medical care, sufficient clothing, yet you somehow believe that the USA should automatically provide those not in modest amounts but unlimited. 
Then why work at all?  You automatically get what most in the world struggle for minimal amounts each and every day. 

I don't know how you can miss the point that when you "subsidize" anything you don't get rid of it, you encourage more of it.  If the government was providing locations advertising unlimited amounts of "free food" even more necessary than housing for survival that they would not have massive hoards of people clammering for their free food. 

You want "free" housing for everyone and don't believe that is a magnet to attract even more indigents from third world countries seeking to suck the benefits of the USA dry. 

You seem to be totally absent of any recognition of cost.  The USA is already 

Here is the debt clock of just the USA federal government.  It does not include debt by states, or local governments.  Take note the USA is already in debt to the tune of $91,073 for each citizen and $241,611 for each taxpayer.  And yet you believe that is "rich" Oh I know, you are in the Bernie Sandes camp.  Just tax the rich more.  If you conficated the entire net worth of the Forbes 400 richest billionaires in the USA and you can only do that once, it amounts to $4.5 Trillion.  Only 15% of what the total debt currently is. 







https://usdebtclock.org/index.html?taxpayer=

This is the Bill of Rights.  Please show me where it says each person whether a citizen or not is entitled to housing.  You are entitled only to "life liberty and the pursuit of happiness"

The First Amendment provides that Congress make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting its free exercise. It protects freedom of speech, the press, assembly, and the right to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

 

The Second Amendment gives citizens the right to bear arms.

 

The Third Amendment prohibits the government from quartering troops in private homes, a major grievance during the American Revolution.

 

The Fourth Amendment protects citizens from unreasonable search and seizure. The government may not conduct any searches without a warrant, and such warrants must be issued by a judge and based on probable cause.

 

The Fifth Amendment provides that citizens not be subject to criminal prosecution and punishment without due process. Citizens may not be tried on the same set of facts twice and are protected from self-incrimination (the right to remain silent). The amendment also establishes the power of eminent domain, ensuring that private property is not seized for public use without just compensation.

 

The Sixth Amendment assures the right to a speedy trial by a jury of one’s peers, to be informed of the crimes with which one is charged, and to confront the witnesses brought forward by the government. The amendment also provides the accused the right to compel testimony from witnesses, as well as the right to legal representation.

 

The Seventh Amendment provides that civil cases preserve the right to trial by jury.

 

The Eighth Amendment prohibits excessive bail, excessive fines, and cruel and unusual punishments.

 

The Ninth Amendment states that the list of rights enumerated in the Constitution is not exhaustive, and that the people retain all rights not enumerated.

 

The Tenth Amendment assigns all powers not delegated to the United States, or prohibited to the States, to either the States or to the people.

 

Edited March 9, 2022 by Longwood50

[EVENKEEL]

2 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Not much call for OAPs in either of those jobs.

We had a good number of seaman in their 70's still sailing. Sailing is one of those occupations that's age blind, if you have the credentials and can pass an easy exam you're working.

[Jingthing]

2 hours ago, Longwood50 said:

Jinthing, 
...

The average person in this world struggles with enough to eat, shelter over their heads, adequate medical care, sufficient clothing, yet you somehow believe that the USA should automatically provide those not in modest amounts but unlimited. 

...

...
 

 

Dude!

 

I get that you're only here to mostly copy paste your far right wing Ayn.Rand flavored distorted propaganda, but so sorry you don't get to paint me personally as a communist boogeyman based on stuff I don't think and never said.

 

Do.you really think that's OK? To.my POV that's very sleazy posting behavior.

 

As this topic is only about the critical lack of affordable housing it should be limited to that. So I actually do have some ideas on how the housing crisis could be addressed but we have been instructed to not debate politics here so I won't offer them here. Also I'm realistic enough to realize they would never be enacted anyway. There are too many vested interests among moneyed Americans left and right to actually legislate widespread solutions.

 

Anyway kindly desist painting me as your token communist whipping boy. That's not me. That's your fantasy villain. I'm not playing that game for you. 

Edited March 9, 2022 by Jingthing

[Longwood50]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Anyway kindly desist painting me as your token communist whipping boy. Thst's not me. That's your fantasy villain.

I know, it is difficult to argue when someone presents you with facts instead of your inborne biases. 

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

I know, it is difficult to argue when someone presents you with facts instead of your inborne biases. 

You don't seem to know really. 

Edited March 9, 2022 by Jingthing

[Longwood50]

17 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

You don't seem to know really. 

Well perhaps you can engligten me.  Your posts are all opinions and never include any hard facts. 
,
Despite your assertion that the USA does nothing, the homeless population in the USA has decreased from 2007 at  647,000 to 580,000 despite a population increase from 301.2 million in 2007 to now 330 million people 


Now here are two of the cheapest homes in California the state with the largest number of homeless people. 

Please englighten everyone on how with the 580,000 thousand homeless you provide a home costing 189,900 each.  That would amount to 110,142,000,000.  While you are at it, these home will also require property taxes, insurance, utilities, and repair.  Will that come from the same pot of money?

I would also like you to give me an answer to give to the family who both are working, scrimpting to purchase their own home of $200,000 why they should have to work to get their home when the government as you say is providing it for free. 

As the original post said, that housing prices in the USA have skyrocketed.  That is supply and demand.  Perhaps those that are homeless might "bear some responsibility" in rectifying their own situation rather than thinking The World Owes Me Living from the children's fairy tale the Ant and the Grasshopper. 








https://www.statista.com/statistics/555795/estimated-number-of-homeless-people-in-the-us/

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

Well perhaps you can engligten me.  Your posts are all opinions and never include any hard facts. 
,
Despite your assertion that the USA does nothing, the homeless population in the USA has decreased from 2007 at  647,000 to 580,000 despite a population increase from 301.2 million in 2007 to now 330 million people 


Now here are two of the cheapest homes in California the state with the largest number of homeless people. 

Please englighten everyone on how with the 580,000 thousand homeless you provide a home costing 189,900 each.  That would amount to 110,142,000,000.  While you are at it, these home will also require property taxes, insurance, utilities, and repair.  Will that come from the same pot of money?

I would also like you to give me an answer to give to the family who both are working, scrimpting to purchase their own home of $200,000 why they should have to work to get their home when the government as you say is providing it for free. 

As the original post said, that housing prices in the USA have skyrocketed.  That is supply and demand.  Perhaps those that are homeless might "bear some responsibility" in rectifying their own situation rather than thinking The World Owes Me Living from the children's fairy tale the Ant and the Grasshopper. 








https://www.statista.com/statistics/555795/estimated-number-of-homeless-people-in-the-us/

You did it again.

Put words in my mouth that I never thought or said.

 

SO SLEAZY!

 

Go ahead and keep posting all you like with your distorted propaganda.

 

But don't bother BAITING me again.

 

Don't bother putting words in my mouth again.

 

There will not be any response 

 

If I ever want to engage with an Ayn Rand bot I'll go elsewhere.

 

Cheerio dude 

[Jingthing]

Adding insult to injury.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/forbeseq/2022/01/01/how-the-us-criminalizes-homelessness/?sh=24be4894869a

 

How The U.S. Criminalizes Homelessness

 

Read the article for a discussion about the link between the lack of affordable housing and homelessness.

[Yellowtail]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Adding insult to injury.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/forbeseq/2022/01/01/how-the-us-criminalizes-homelessness/?sh=24be4894869a

 

How The U.S. Criminalizes Homelessness

 

Read the article for a discussion about the link between the lack of affordable housing and homelessness.

Did you not read it? Why not just tell us what the link is? 

[Yellowtail]

17 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Adding insult to injury.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/forbeseq/2022/01/01/how-the-us-criminalizes-homelessness/?sh=24be4894869a

 

How The U.S. Criminalizes Homelessness

 

Read the article for a discussion about the link between the lack of affordable housing and homelessness.

Well, I read it, and I'm ready for the discussion, but to be clear, while the article said there was a link, it did not show what that link was. 

 

The article, as well as the "Vera Institute of Justice's" website seemed long on rhetoric, and projections, but short on facts.