Elderly expats dazed and confused over insurance, ‘retirement visas’ and COVID

[Polaky]

8 minutes ago, Joules said:

Judging from the content in the six pages of content here, This article seems to have done nothing to settle the confusion.  I Always thought that with my O visa and marriage extension I could go out on a trip somewhere and come back without buying the insurance.  Now it does not look that way.  And at my age, a lot of insurers like Aetna just say no.

What we should be concentrating on is an affordable all age group Insurance policy regardless of where you originated from, that meets all requirements, and actually covers you for any event, then that insurance company would be rewarded with a flock of new policy enquiries, and enhance their business model, but does such insurance exist?, many scale their policies on age groups, which in my opinion is wrong, as many older people are fitter than the younger generation, and should not be penalised.

[Havenstreet1940]

16 minutes ago, Dante99 said:

Please tell us the name of the insurance company that provides the policy.

 

Thanks

WRLife.   Speak to aainsure in Pattaya. I have no connection to either.

 

Policy suits my objective to return to Thailand.   Maybe not to everyone's requirements.

[4MyEgo]

2 hours ago, John Drake said:

You take it wrong. I don't know why you tried to personalize your disagreement with me and inject some fantasy red herring. It's an abomination to force people to buy policies so riddled with exclusions as to make them useless. The older you get, the more that will happen. As for Thai insurance companies finding ways to not pay out, just read some of these comments where people have explained exactly that scenario. Your answer of having everybody "read the fine print" is something I expect from loan sharks, con men, and used car salesmen--and insurance salesmen, too, naturally.

Apologies if you took it personally, wasn't meant to be construed as an attack, merely a question.

 

I totally agree with you with regard to fine prints etc, etc, however I don't see it as anyone forcing you to buy a policy riddled with fine prints, the insurer has to protect themselves and add what they feel will expose them to greater risks, for example, a lot of people get caught out riding a motorbike larger than the insurer will insure, or ride without a drivers license or international license, or not wear a helmet, surly you wouldn't expect the insurer to cover that, besides I wouldn't deal with Thai insurers and never will as the laws here are very relaxed and money talks, that and I have heard too many stories where the police are involved and negotiations commence, and usually for a lower amount, (accident insurance), however I go through a broker for all of my insurances, the broker has a good reputation amongst expats here in Thailand and insurers don't want to not pay out if the client is within their rights as per the policy as the broker could and more than likely would give them the flick and advise all of his clients with that provider to change providers next time the policy is due, because the last thing the broker wants is expats not happy if they are within their rights and also giving the broker the flick or bad mouthing him/her, bad for business.

 

Remember, referrals are a good business source for brokers as well, happy customers, more business.

[4MyEgo]

2 hours ago, jerrymahoney said:

from https://thaiembdc.org/visas/

A lot to read and take in, but off the cuff and just so I get this right, if I leave the country, which I plan to in July for a 2 week trip, and being on a marriage extension and will be using a re-entry permit, I am required to get a Thailand Pass and provide the insurance letter ?

 

The wife and kids have dual passports, so will be entering on their Thai passports so I would assume that they don't need this ?

[jethro69]

This constantly 'confusion', to put it nicely, had actually quite the opposite effect for myself. I cancelled my insurance at all, as the policy went from year to year, over the fear it could not meet the requirements, which were changing from week to week, only hot air but anyways.

Just wonder if there are insurance packages in Thailand you can go just for the time you'll need them, and furthermost one policy which covers the surrounding countries, or ASEAN countries?

[antony77]

7 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Yes that is the CURRENT policy.

It has been like that for the last 20 years 

[Salerno]

4 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

I am required to get a Thailand Pass and provide the insurance letter ?

 

The wife and kids have dual passports, so will be entering on their Thai passports so I would assume that they don't need this ?

Correct (to be clear, family need the TP just not insurance).

 

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, antony77 said:

It has been like that for the last 20 years 

Irrelevant .

[4MyEgo]

8 minutes ago, Salerno said:

Correct (to be clear, family need the TP just not insurance).

 

Ok, so I need both, the wife and kids only the TP.

[Chris.B]

3 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Your blowing it totally out of proportion.

 

Insurance is required to minimise the risk, suffice to say, they want you to have the insurance to minimise the risk, what happens after that is up to you and your insurer.

 

I totally disagree with your comments, insurers don't back out, i.e. unless you have breached their terms and conditions within the policy, so if you haven't read, understood and complied with their terms and conditions of the policy, then that's on you.

 

I take it you got bitten once for not doing the above and hold a grudge ?

 

Personally, I have never had a problem with an insurer paying up, why, because I read the terms and conditions of their policies, and if it suites me, I proceed and pay, if it doesn't I decline the policy, that said, YOU have to know what your signing, problem is most people think insurance is insurance and you sign the dotted line, but it's not that easy, and yes there are exclusions, that is why you read the terms and conditions of the policy, i.e. one size doesn't fit everyone and if you do read and understand the terms and conditions of the policy, you will understand what is excluded and what how many confuse a visit to the hospital, depending on the policy, that you are not covered unless you are admitted under an emergency which is a 24 hour stay, that is when it kicks in, that or you have been in touch with the insurer and advised them of a procedure that has to be carrier out, the costs to do it etc etc and the insurer granting you permission to go ahead, in other words, you have to communicate with the insurer, same as being admitted in an emergency, you got to get in touch with them so they know what's going on, otherwise they can decline you, that said, there are limitations, e.g. you were unconscious for a period of time and couldn't contact them etc.

 

You can accept the above or not and can self insure, you just got to weigh up the risk of how much you will lose from your savings if you remain uninsured and end up in hospital, a bit like getting the Covid vaccine or not, I am for both, insurance and vaccinations.

You tell me then, how is it the questions Insurer's ask are often either vague or all encompassing?

 

[Salerno]

1 minute ago, 4MyEgo said:

Ok, so I need both, the wife and kids only the TP.

Everything the same other than insurance, so PCR tests, vaccine evidence, hotel booking etc. 

 

And the cherry on the cake, all done individually.

[4MyEgo]

Just now, Chris.B said:

You tell me then, how is it the questions Insurer's ask are often either vague or all encompassing?

 

Provide me the questions and I will do my best to answer them.

[4MyEgo]

1 minute ago, Salerno said:

Everything the same other than insurance, so PCR tests, vaccine evidence, hotel booking etc. 

 

And the cherry on the cake, all done individually.

Just to clarify, I will need to produce the insurance letter ?

 

All of us will require, PCR tests, vaccine evidence.

 

Hotel bookings for leaving the country ?

 

We live here and would be exiting for a holiday and therefore returning to our place.

[Chris.B]

6 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Provide me the questions and I will do my best to answer them.

It is a rhetorical question. ????

 

However I do remember reading about some guy who develop a medical condition and his insurer refused payment. Evidentially, unbeknown to him he had the condition from birth. The insurer pointed to their small print saying such conditions where not covered!

 

[Uroller]

8 hours ago, Live Long and Prosper said:

There country there laws, what does an alien have to have, to go and stay long term in the country of your passport? Should we start there saying how unfair it is?

In my two countries of citizenship aliens would be looked after as they are civilized countries. Probably not the answer you were hoping foot????

[4MyEgo]

7 minutes ago, Chris.B said:

It is a rhetorical question. ????

 

However I do remember reading about some guy who develop a medical condition and his insurer refused payment. Evidentially, unbeknown to him he had the condition from birth. The insurer pointed to their small print saying such conditions where not covered!

 

That's a bit of bad luck, but I would also suggest if the fine print was read, the insured would have know that they wouldn't be covered, that said, you can imagine how many people don't disclose certain existing conditions that they know about and then come undone later down the track and cry fowl play.

 

The above said, you would have to be pretty unlucky not to get paid if you have read all of the policy conditions, fine prints, call them what you like, I have a pre-existing condition and that was accepted and is spelt out in the policy that it is included in the policy.

 

 

[Blumpie]

IT's all quite simple, please relax and let me explain it.

And A-O visa will be an A-O visa in a third country unless one can explicitly state that the A-O visa is a community state and in that case there is no need for insurance.  Of course the quarantining may come into effect, but the A-O visa will care for that in that the O-A visa will supplement the A-O visa.  But be sure that the O-A visa isn't assigned in Slovenic countries or the assignment will be the same.  But if an O-A visa is issued from a branch of the Thai embassy then no insurance will be required unless you enter via the following airports, all in Thai, which I cannot translate.

 

Hope this helps, have a great day.  ????  (my post is satirical)

[Uroller]

It is my understanding that every tourist entering Thailand currently pays approx 750THB which is hidden in the ticket price, this was implemented a few years ago to cover Hospital costs but probably got diverted to something else, that amounts to billions of THB. Now once again another charge will be levied on tourists of 500 THB which was going towards “ helping tourists if they got sick” ( ????????????chuckle chuckle) The trouble with lying is that you forget what you said and clearly that initial 750 has just evaporated into thin air: 

 

Thin air = brown envelope

 

????

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, Blumpie said:

IT's all quite simple, please relax and let me explain it.

And A-O visa will be an A-O visa in a third country unless one can explicitly state that the A-O visa is a community state and in that case there is no need for insurance.  Of course the quarantining may come into effect, but the A-O visa will care for that in that the O-A visa will supplement the A-O visa.  But be sure that the O-A visa isn't assigned in Slovenic countries or the assignment will be the same.  But if an O-A visa is issued from a branch of the Thai embassy then no insurance will be required unless you enter via the following airports, all in Thai, which I cannot translate.

 

Hope this helps, have a great day.  ????  (my post is satirical)

That sounds like the best of all possible visas if you want to enter Cloud Cuckooland.

[Salerno]

28 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Just to clarify, I will need to produce the insurance letter ?

 

All of us will require, PCR tests, vaccine evidence.

 

Hotel bookings for leaving the country ?

 

We live here and would be exiting for a holiday and therefore returning to our place.

Yes.

Yes.

When you come back, you need 1 night quarantine (under current rules) to await the entry PCR test results, then you can go wherever you want. Going straight home from the airport isn't an option. (Things could change obviously).

 

Was looking for something else and noticed the following (no idea how old your kids are so might get away with fewer TP applications than thought):

 

For the Exemption from Quarantine scheme, everyone aged 12 or over must submit an individual registration through Thailand Pass. Children aged under 12 can be added into their parents’ registration under the section Personal Information. 

 

https://www.mfa.go.th/en/content/thailand-pass-faqs?cate=5f2916be298eeb02ac2eb389

 

 

[Bogbrush]

2 hours ago, Joules said:

"There is currently no requirement for anyone on a Non Immigrant O extension to have health insurance - apart from if they wish to re-enter Thailand, which is a requirement for all foreigners, regardless of their visa status. "

 

I would NEVER go anywhere as a tourist that required me to buy 3 million baht (more than $90,000US) in medical insurance as a condition of entering the country.  As it is, I live here with an O visa and marriage extension.  I supposed I am trapped. If I leave, they will nail me when I come back.  No travel for me.  And I seriously doubt I will get the foreign visitors I used to get pre-covid, with this insurance requirement.  What healthy person is going to pay that for the privilege of a visit?  Only the horney perverts.

 

If the Thai government would simply open up the government medical system to bona fide tourists (at no charge), they would make money, not lose it.  As it is, few people will want to come.  Nobody is going to come here to rip off the <deleted>ty (how about "crappy"?) government healthcare.  And let's be clear, what this is really about is the greed of the influential insurance cartel in this country.  It's just another attempted money-grab.  Not a friendly country anymore.

 

By the way, why doesn't somebody publish a schedule listing the approximate cost of this insurance per week (or month or year) for each age group?   I NEVER see that.  

I think you’re misreading this issue - the $100k insurance (you say $90) is for OA yearly extension and replaces the ‘throwaway’ local policy required before 1st October. The $50k cover is required by visitors. Funnily enough, a specific Covid requirement has fallen away…

[keithkarmann]

8 hours ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

Speak for yourself I work very hard for every Satang I have earned.

 

It's the other way round from what I have seen here. 

I thought that was sarcasm

[tandor]

9 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

Erm…isn’t that what the expats mentioned in the story are concerned about?

 

”The concerns raised by the expats who spoke to the Pattaya Mail are that if they were to leave Thailand and visit their home country, they would have difficulty meeting the insurance requirements needed for them to re-enter the country.”

..that would be an OA returning who did not have insurance before leaving, methinks!

[Thingamabob]

9 hours ago, Orinoco said:

They could do that. but won't ever do it.

But the truth is they don't want you anymore in there country

Deep down they despise you, and have a deep seated jealousy of the

money you have. ( as we never worked hard for it )

TIT.

 

 

 

 

 

Rubbish.

[Bluespunk]

24 minutes ago, tandor said:

..that would be an OA returning who did not have insurance before leaving, methinks!

Could very well be the case, but the article says everyone entering Thailand will need such insurance regardless.
 

Now that could well be a misinterpretation of the rules but it does bode well for the future that an article on the confusion around the rules is in itself rather opaque and contradictory. 
 

A good example being this genius of a paragraph 

 

“There is currently no requirement for anyone on a Non Immigrant O extension to have health insurance - apart from if they wish to re-enter Thailand, which is a requirement for all foreigners, regardless of their visa status. ”

[Chris.B]

1 hour ago, 4MyEgo said:

That's a bit of bad luck, but I would also suggest if the fine print was read, the insured would have know that they wouldn't be covered, that said,

 

 

but he didn't know he had the condition from birth so how could reading the fine print help him? 

[Scouse123]

Guys.

 

Currently in the UK.

I have completed my Thailand pass. I did it all on a mobile phone.

 

I didn't see anywhere it asking about visa pages or my retirement extension based on a Non O visa.

 

I filled two forms out online because I initially uploaded every document up on the first time it asked, which was the Passport page, instead of section by section.

 

I have NO ISSUES regards compliance, I am fully insured for 10 million and $100K Covid19 i have everything and uploaded all to the site.

 

Did I make an error and should I have uploaded retirement extension page,  Non O page and re entry page?

 

 

[Dante99]

2 hours ago, Havenstreet1940 said:

WRLife.   Speak to aainsure in Pattaya. I have no connection to either.

 

Policy suits my objective to return to Thailand.   Maybe not to everyone's requirements.

Many thanks.  From what I read on the WRLife website it looks quite good.  Great to find coverage for my old body.

[Rocking Robert]

Insurance is everything why would you not have it

[spidermike007]

Why the nonsense? The only explanation that makes sense, is they simply do not want us here. And that is part of the reason tens of thousands of expats have left, with their Thai partner or family. Expect this trend of diminishing expat population to continue for years to come. 

 

I think xenophobia is utterly rampant, in all segments of the government here, from the feds right on down to the local amphur. However, I do not think most Thai people are that way. I think most either like us, or are indifferent to us. Which I can handle. 

 

To the contrary, I think ex-pats should be treated with the kind of respect and acknowledgement we deserve. We have decided to change our policies, and we now realize how much you guys bring to the table. An immigration officer will now come to your home to renew your visa, to show our appreciation, of your continued support. You will only be required to sign one form, and we will give you a five year, multiple entry visa. Free of charge.