Elderly expats dazed and confused over insurance, ‘retirement visas’ and COVID

[spidermike007]

Why the nonsense? The only explanation that makes sense, is they simply do not want us here. And that is part of the reason tens of thousands of expats have left, with their Thai partner or family. Expect this trend of diminishing expat population to continue for years to come. 

 

I think xenophobia is utterly rampant, in all segments of the government here, from the feds right on down to the local amphur. However, I do not think most Thai people are that way. I think most either like us, or are indifferent to us. Which I can handle. 

 

To the contrary, I think ex-pats should be treated with the kind of respect and acknowledgement we deserve. We have decided to change our policies, and we now realize how much you guys bring to the table. An immigration officer will now come to your home to renew your visa, to show our appreciation, of your continued support. You will only be required to sign one form, and we will give you a five year, multiple entry visa. Free of charge. 
 

[thaiowl]

Are returning Permanent Residents required to have this insurance?

[Enzian]

8 hours ago, Card said:

No. You need to buy covid insurance up to the date of your visa expiry or return ticket not your re entry permit.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a Non-O re-entry permit expires the same day as the visa; I was trying to keep details out.

[DrJack54]

15 minutes ago, Enzian said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a Non-O re-entry permit expires the same day as the visa; I was trying to keep details out.

Are you referring to reentry permit for an extension.

The reentry permit expiry date is same as current extension "admitted untill date"

If entering thailand with a reentry permit your insurance must cover up to expiry date.

Any exit flight is irrelevant to length of required insurance coverage.

[Havenstreet1940]

2 hours ago, Dante99 said:

Many thanks.  From what I read on the WRLife website it looks quite good.  Great to find coverage for my old body.

 

glad to have been able to help.   Hope all goes well for your trip.  Stay safe.

[kiwikeith]

6 hours ago, Havenstreet1940 said:

US$20,000 a year for over 75's?   I'm 83 and I have cover for US$ 80,000 a year for a fraction of that.  Admittedly it only covers me in Thailand, but hey, when I'm in UK I've got the use of the best health service in the world and it's free!

What is the name of that company please?

[Havenstreet1940]

Just now, kiwikeith said:

What is the name of that company please?

Company is WRLife.  Two agencies that I know of are info nrg-services.net  and aainsure in Pattaya.

Best of luck!

[sambum]

13 hours ago, John Drake said:

I thought they just added another 500 baht fee to air arrivals to take care of this "problem." But they want the scam insurance piled on top of it for Thailand Pass?  Worthless insurance with numerous exclusions and high premiums that will go to the ends of the earth to prevent paying out.

There are departments within Insurance Companies in the UK that are dedicated to finding ways to "wriggle  out" of paying any compensation on claims of any kind. I see no reason why Thailand Insurance Companies should be any different.

[ChaiyaTH]

13 hours ago, Chad3000 said:

Unpaid medical is a total red herring to be polite. We all know this. Most hospitals will literally escort you to ATM before discharge. No joke.

Hehe they even dared to ask me while I just rolled in from the ambulance being half in shock, half dead with 4 fractures including my nose. These people are worse than a mamasan is in the gogobar.

[Albert Zweistein]

14 hours ago, Chad3000 said:

Unpaid medical is a total red herring to be polite. We all know this. Most hospitals will literally escort you to ATM before discharge. No joke.

Visiting Bangkok hospital in Phuket last year first thing they asked me was pasport and credit card.

[James Roderick]

9 hours ago, SunsetT said:

3million thb cover is peanuts when most UK medical cover for travel is for £10million, some £5million, and Im sure US and EU cover is similar. Of course the age issue is a problem but those worried should, while it lasts, grab an Emirates return flight with inclusive medical cover up to $500,000 which accepted by the Thai authorities WITH NO AGE LIMIT: https://c.ekstatic.net/ecl/documents/before-you-fly/multi-risk-travel-insurance-faqs.pdf?h=_4vFoemLSIMxG_zq0fsk6g

 

"20. Does this policy include an age limit or age restriction?
There are no age restrictions for this policy"

Hi Sunset Can yu tell me more about the Emirates deal ??

 

[chilli42]

I am trying to understand how an older person would put themself in a situation where they would not have/want medical insurance.  I can understand it’s an unwelcome cost.  Can also understand that some may not be able to qualify due to age and/or prior illness.  However, having no medical insurance coverage seems somewhat high risk.  I am sure I am missing something so seeking to understand the situation

[chilli42]

6 hours ago, thaiowl said:

Are returning Permanent Residents required to have this insurance?

I bought 2 weeks of Covid insurance.  They were happy with that.

[Chad3000]

8 minutes ago, chilli42 said:

I am trying to understand how an older person would put themself in a situation where they would not have/want medical insurance.  I can understand it’s an unwelcome cost.  Can also understand that some may not be able to qualify due to age and/or prior illness.  However, having no medical insurance coverage seems somewhat high risk.  I am sure I am missing something so seeking to understand the situation

What you are missing in my case is that (60):

 

I have over 1m THB in the bank here in Thailand

 

I'm not that old

 

I'm healthy. Never sick or ill.

 

Do not own a motorbike or auto

 

Have government SSO insurance

 

Have Aetna plan from work, 500k

 

Have additional covid policy.

 

When I stop working in a year or two I'll buy more insurance. Trouble is the policies are frought with caveats, exclusions.

[Chaichara]

16 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

This thread is about retirees not tourists.

Yes, it is.

I renewed my retirement visa yesterday. There was no mention of insurance. I'm still curious to know what would happen if I left the country (for example for one day to Laos over the nearby friendship bridge) and return the same day. Fortunately I do have medical insurance (who would want to stay in a public Thai hospital?),  although it doesn't cover as much as  ฿3mio.  At my age it's already very expensive.

[Chad3000]

Despite my earlier comments this lot of older, broke Pattaya expats (that have used agents to remain) really should go home. If they have no money and or are uninsurable then they will be a burden on a private hospital's stakeholders.

[Enzian]

Some expats are high net worth enough that they can take the gamble (and avoid the paperwork) of not having health insurance, and therefore self-insure because the odds are very high they will never have a really high medical bill in country, and if they do, they know they have immediate access to very high amounts if they lose the gamble. And for Americans, if they can get on a plane and get back, they are covered by Medicare and their HMOs, some of which will cover certain kinds of emergencies in Thailand. 

[jerrymahoney]

47 minutes ago, Enzian said:

Some expats are high net worth enough that they can take the gamble (and avoid the paperwork) of not having health insurance, and therefore self-insure because the odds are very high they will never have a really high medical bill in country, and if they do, they know they have immediate access to very high amounts if they lose the gamble. And for Americans, if they can get on a plane and get back, they are covered by Medicare and their HMOs, some of which will cover certain kinds of emergencies in Thailand. 

.... and some expats are high worth enough that they can take the premiums for medical insurance in Thailand out of their petty-cash accounts.

 

To me the 3 big reasons for anyone of advanced age to have medical insurance in Thailand are: Heart attach, stroke, and brain aneurism.

 

None of those are hop-on-a-plane conditions,.

Edited November 5, 2021 by jerrymahoney

[starky]

Yes people should definitely be responsible for their own health insurance and if you are "living" or retired in a foreign country you should have far more than a basic travel insurance policy. Not even sure why a government would need to mandate this it should be common sense. And the government is completely correct in asking people staying here long term having some form of health cover.

[starky]

19 hours ago, tomacht8 said:

While the Thai authorities have previously revealed the issue that unpaid medical bills from uninsured foreign tourists have on the Thai health care system (and state coffers),

 

If I remember correctly, that was a ridiculous 300 million baht a year in unpaid hospital bills from foreigners.

 

Most of them were accidents on uninsured scooters. If Thailand were to ensure that all motorcycle rental companies take out reasonable accident insurance for their rental motorcycles, the problem would not even exist.

 

Almost all tourists have travel insurance, which is usually not expensive.

 

Furthermore, the pensioners have to keep 800,000 baht here for a long time, so that hospital bills can also be paid here.

 

And if the hospitals would not charge 2-3 times as much for sick foreigners, the problem of the unpaid bill would be nothing more than a fly poo.

 

It is obvious to me that the Thai hospitals are trying to rehabilitate themselves through sick foreigners.

You might want to read the fine print there is hardly any travel insurance that would cover you riding a motorcycle. Further to that I would posit that a lot (maybe most?)  people hiring bikes and scooters here probably don't even have a motorcycle license in their own country therefore there is no way any sort of insurance would cover them. Same happens in many countries where idiots want to hire bikes they don't know how to ride. And jet skis and other dangerous things people want to do on holidays but if they were barred from participating in those things they would whinge about that as well.

Edited November 5, 2021 by starky

[Eloquent pilgrim]

16 hours ago, Card said:

No. You need to buy covid insurance up to the date of your visa expiry or return ticket not your re entry permit.

I think you’ll find that insurance is required up to the expiry of your visa. Your return ticket is deemed irrelevant, because you could change or extend the date of your return flight; consequently the cover is require until the end of the permitted stay on your visa.

[jacko45k]

19 hours ago, silverhawk_usa said:

I have lived in Thailand 18 years and there seems to be constant confusion over Non-Imm A  and Non-Imm OA Visas. 

I think you mean Non-Imm-O and the subcategory O-A. 

[4MyEgo]

11 hours ago, Salerno said:

When you come back, you need 1 night quarantine (under current rules) to await the entry PCR test results, then you can go wherever you want. Going straight home from the airport isn't an option. (Things could change obviously).

Ah yes, forgot about that one didn't I.

 

Thx for your information, what a nightmare, that said, hope by the time we intend on travelling all of this BS is lifted because it might play a major part on our part not going, that and Australia lifting the one week home quarantine BS.

Edited November 6, 2021 by 4MyEgo

[Dante99]

3 hours ago, chilli42 said:

I am trying to understand how an older person would put themself in a situation where they would not have/want medical insurance.  I can understand it’s an unwelcome cost.  Can also understand that some may not be able to qualify due to age and/or prior illness.  However, having no medical insurance coverage seems somewhat high risk.  I am sure I am missing something so seeking to understand the situation

I looked far and wide and found few companies that would consider insuring me due to age.  Most of those were quoting 20,000 to 30,000 Baht per month or around 300,000 Baht per year.  That number should help you understand I would think.

 

Also some have sufficient assets to effectively "self insure" at the coverage level required.  Get that?

 

Others are so old they simply say let me go, do not pay much to keep me alive.  Many sign legal documents to that effect so they really do not need insurance because they choose to die.  

[Salerno]

2 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Thx for your information, what a nightmare, that said, hope by the time we intend on travelling all of this BS is lifted because it might play a major part on our part not going, that and Australia lifting the one week home quarantine BS.

For a single person, it's a pain but doable, for a family, personally, I don't think I'd even contemplate it unless really necessary.

[4MyEgo]

10 hours ago, Chris.B said:

but he didn't know he had the condition from birth so how could reading the fine print help him? 

Don't know what the condition was, so can't really comment, but I would say it would be rare that such a condition be included in a policy, that and it could be challenged, i.e. if he wanted to go that way, I mean, he disclosed to the best of his knowledge that he had no pre-existing condition/s, and I would have thought a pre-existing condition is a condition after the even, right. 

 

This to me sounds about right: 

A pre-existing condition is any health condition that a person has prior to enrolling in health coverage. A pre-existing condition could be known to the person – for example, if she knows she is pregnant already.

[4MyEgo]

6 minutes ago, Salerno said:

For a single person, it's a pain but doable, for a family, personally, I don't think I'd even contemplate it unless really necessary.

100% Amen to that.

 

[10baht]

14 hours ago, Chad3000 said:

15 hours ago, 10baht said:

O-A's are not tourists,

They really are.

 

Retired tourists.

BS, check the requirement, like money in the bank for one.

[elgenon]

21 hours ago, tomacht8 said:

While the Thai authorities have previously revealed the issue that unpaid medical bills from uninsured foreign tourists have on the Thai health care system (and state coffers),

 

If I remember correctly, that was a ridiculous 300 million baht a year in unpaid hospital bills from foreigners.

 

Most of them were accidents on uninsured scooters. If Thailand were to ensure that all motorcycle rental companies take out reasonable accident insurance for their rental motorcycles, the problem would not even exist.

 

Almost all tourists have travel insurance, which is usually not expensive.

 

Furthermore, the pensioners have to keep 800,000 baht here for a long time, so that hospital bills can also be paid here.

 

And if the hospitals would not charge 2-3 times as much for sick foreigners, the problem of the unpaid bill would be nothing more than a fly poo.

 

It is obvious to me that the Thai hospitals are trying to rehabilitate themselves through sick foreigners.

I'm confused. The Thai government is no longer requiring the Covid insurance be bought from a Thai company? So I can enter with a $50,000 travel insurance policy? If so, would it have to explicitly state that it covers Covid?

 

Thanks.

[jacko45k]

Just now, elgenon said:

I'm confused. The Thai government is no longer requiring the Covid insurance be bought from a Thai company? So I can enter with a $50,000 travel insurance policy? If so, would it have to explicitly state that it covers Covid?

 

Thanks.

Yes and yes.....