Electric Vehicles in Thailand

[JBChiangRai]

I used to have a Mercedes PHEV, real world battery driving was only about 19km, it had a 3.6Kw on board charger that took a couple of hours to charge it up, there was no DC charge ability, I think the Haval is unique in having that.

 

You could switch the car to "Charge" mode  on the Mercedes when the battery was exhausted, but there's no point doing that, using petrol to charge the battery is the worst of both worlds and very inefficient.

 

The Haval having a large battery and fast DC Charging makes it by far the most advanced on the market.

 

Personally, I favour a large battery and very small petrol engine in a PHEV that would allow you to limp along to the end of your journey, nobody is doing that.

[Gweiloman]

3 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

I used to have a Mercedes PHEV, real world battery driving was only about 19km, it had a 3.6Kw on board charger that took a couple of hours to charge it up, there was no DC charge ability, I think the Haval is unique in having that.

 

You could switch the car to "Charge" mode  on the Mercedes when the battery was exhausted, but there's no point doing that, using petrol to charge the battery is the worst of both worlds and very inefficient.

 

The Haval having a large battery and fast DC Charging makes it by far the most advanced on the market.

 

Personally, I favour a large battery and very small petrol engine in a PHEV that would allow you to limp along to the end of your journey, nobody is doing that.

I think the Haval has hit the sweet spot. A 34 kWh battery with a real world range of 150 - 170 km means an actual driving time of 2+ hrs which is a good break time. DC charging gives a charging time from 10%-80% in around 40 minutes which is good for a toilet break and coffee stop. As we have dogs, we would normally stop for no less than 30 mins anyway.

 

A bigger battery would add more weight which means higher fuel consumption when the battery is run down.

[Gweiloman]

3 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

On the MG HS PHEV there is a dedicated EV only button and three driving modes: Eco; Normal and Sport and a Super Sport button on the steering wheel

 

 

 

The Haval also has a EV only driving mode as well as a hybrid mode. However, I don’t quite understand why.

 

When hybrid mode is selected, the car still drives on EV mode. It’s only when you accelerate hard that the ICE kicks in.

 

On EV driving mode, the car is capable of speeds up to 140 kmh on pure EV. And when the battery is low, the ICE will automatically kick in so I’m puzzled why there are the two modes.

 

 I doubt any GWM salesperson can answer that question as it seems like I knew more of the car than they did at the time I picked up the car from the dealership.

[Bandersnatch]

2 hours ago, Gweiloman said:

The Haval also has a EV only driving mode as well as a hybrid mode. However, I don’t quite understand why.

 

When hybrid mode is selected, the car still drives on EV mode. It’s only when you accelerate hard that the ICE kicks in.

 

On EV driving mode, the car is capable of speeds up to 140 kmh on pure EV. And when the battery is low, the ICE will automatically kick in so I’m puzzled why there are the two modes.

 

 I doubt any GWM salesperson can answer that question as it seems like I knew more of the car than they did at the time I picked up the car from the dealership.

On the MG PHEV when you switch off EV mode the car will choose the efficient driving mode. At low speeds the car will drive in EV only 

 

Different driving modes as shown on instrument cluster

 

 

 

[Gweiloman]

51 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

On the MG PHEV when you switch off EV mode the car will choose the efficient driving mode. At low speeds the car will drive in EV only 

 

Different driving modes as shown on instrument cluster

 

 

 

When you switch off EV mode, at what speed will the ICE kick in? I have gone as high as 120 kph in hybrid mode without the ICE kicking in. (In EV only mode, the ICE kicks in at 140 kph)

[Bandersnatch]

1 hour ago, Gweiloman said:

When you switch off EV mode, at what speed will the ICE kick in? I have gone as high as 120 kph in hybrid mode without the ICE kicking in. (In EV only mode, the ICE kicks in at 140 kph)

a lot lower speed than that in the MG PHEV  - something like 50k

[TronxII]

Thanks guys for the interesting details. I think here in the forum you can get more information than on all EV marketing sites combined.

That's also the issue for the car sales people. Mostly they do not have real world experience with their products.

A 34 kWh battery sounds very good for a plugin hybrid. This 150km would cover 95% trips of electric driving for my personal needs.

[Bandersnatch]

On 12/31/2022 at 11:25 AM, Gweiloman said:

I just completed a 1,000 km journey from CM to Isaan so I guess I’m qualified to comment on this route to some extent. A mixed bag of good and bad. This is my first extended journey. I had previously just charged at home.

 

Left the house just before 10 am with a full charge (approx range of 170 km. I have the Haval H6 PHEV). First stop, PEA Volta at Bangchak station Lampang. 2 outlets, both being used when I arrived. Fortunately, one guy was just finishing up so I waited just a few minutes. Car charged like a dream, I hardly had time for the dogs to do their stuff and for me to finish brunch. While I was charging, a MG EP turned up but he was able to slow charge on AC while waiting for a free outlet.

 

Next stop, Uttaradit. PEA app shows a PTT EV station. However the PTT app does not show this station. I chanced it but the station is not yet operational. Worse, the station was on the opposite side of the road and U-turning was a challenge to say the least (with the traffic coming from the South). Also, quite a few U-turns were closed off to alleviate through traffic so every detour was much longer. Along the way there, I turned into a couple of PTT stations that had an EV Station sign but they were also not yet operational. The gas stations however were an absolute nightmare. Nowhere to park, could hardly turn in and out of the stations. Note to self: avoid future travel during holiday season.

 

As I had petrol as a backup mode of propulsion, I continued onto Phisanulok and PEA station. Once again, both outlets occupied. I waited about 30 minutes for my turn. However, this outlet, even though rated at 50kW, was only able to push 11 kW to my vehicle whereas the previous station pushed out 47 kW. Same story at another PEA in Khon Kaen (11 kW). Prior to that, I went to the actual PEA office in Lomsak. Both outlets utilised. One car was at 34%, the other at 70+ but they were going charge to 90%. Charging etiquette not up to par, just like with normal driving.

 

At PTT Khon Kaen, only one outlet but was booked for the full 50 minutes. This booking policy is a debate for another day.

 

By now, I thought my car had developed a problem as the last 2 charging sessions were at 11 kW. Even though it was midnight by now, my partner kindly suggested trying at a PTT instead of PEA. So onwards to PTT Maha Sarakham and hallelujah. After fiddling with the senseless PTT app which requires your car number plate and doesn’t tell you to click the default button, I started charging again at 47 kW. Knowing that my car wasn’t broken made my day in spite of the ups and downs.

 

My takeaways. Avoid travelling on festive public holidays. If you must, take your fossil vehicle or a PHEV. A full EV will be quite the challenge. For petrol powered vehicles, fill up at any station other than PTT. Where possible, turn off the hwy and fill up at smaller stations. This will save you time and stress. 
 

Sorry for the long post (it could have been longer) and thanks for reading. I now have to plan my return trip properly.

Thanks @Gweiloman for the report. You have made me think about Thailand's unique situation for EVs for holidays and particularly at New Year.

 

I live in Surin Province out in the countryside but just 1 km from a 4 lane city ring road. 10km later I can be at Robinson shopping center.  On a typical journey to Robinson I will see a dozen or so cars, but at new year there can be a 4km tailback on the same road. 

 

Bangkok is where the money is and so where the EVs are. You just need to look at a charging station map of Thailand to see that. 

 

Currently there are enough charging stations for the EVs in Thailand as most people like me charge at home, but at new year it is clearly not the case. I have listed my home charger on Plug Share for anyone with an emergency. If more EV owners did the same we would have less EV range anxiety.

 

 

 

 

[Longwood50]

On 1/1/2023 at 12:52 AM, Gweiloman said:

I decided that a PHEV is the best option for me and thus f, after a month of own, I’m still happy with my choice.

Well perhaps but I am skeptical.  Common sense tells me, I pay for more the electric car to begin with and as it ages its batteries become exhausted and my range decreases.  As it approaches the age to replace the battery its resale value plummets so whatever "savings" I got from driving an electric vechicle are lost when I factor in the depreciation.  Though you may be happy at this time and perhaps always will, 1 in 5 drivers in Californa said, they will not purchase an EV the second time.  That is a lot 

https://www.businessinsider.in/1-in-5-electric-vehicle-owners-in-California-switched-back-to-gas-because-charging-their-cars-is-a-hassle-new-research-shows/articleshow/82332806.cms

[KhunLA]

6 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

I have listed my home charger on Plug Share for anyone with an emergency. If more EV owners did the same we would have less EV range anxiety.

That's cool ... I'd do the same, but don't think anyone would bother for a slow charge.

 

Have 2 MG CSs, within 5 kms of house, along with

1 CS < 40 kms N of us, and

1 CS < 30 kms south of us.

[JBChiangRai]

3 hours ago, Longwood50 said:

Well perhaps but I am skeptical.  Common sense tells me, I pay for more the electric car to begin with and as it ages its batteries become exhausted and my range decreases.  As it approaches the age to replace the battery its resale value plummets so whatever "savings" I got from driving an electric vechicle are lost when I factor in the depreciation.  Though you may be happy at this time and perhaps always will, 1 in 5 drivers in Californa said, they will not purchase an EV the second time.  That is a lot 

https://www.businessinsider.in/1-in-5-electric-vehicle-owners-in-California-switched-back-to-gas-because-charging-their-cars-is-a-hassle-new-research-shows/articleshow/82332806.cms

 

The article cites dissatisfaction with Level 1 charging which is non-existent here, Thailand is only Level 2 (4 times faster) or Superfast DC.

 

I expect at least 20 years out of my battery if it's properly looked after.  With a starting range of 510km, it should still have over 400km range at 20 years.  I will probably be dead by then.

[Bandersnatch]

2 hours ago, KhunLA said:

That's cool ... I'd do the same, but don't think anyone would bother for a slow charge.

 

Have 2 MG CSs, within 5 kms of house, along with

1 CS < 40 kms N of us, and

1 CS < 30 kms south of us.

The same here, but if all the chargers are full at New Year it might be appreciated.

 

 

 

 

[Longwood50]

1 minute ago, JBChiangRai said:

I expect at least 20 years out of my battery if it's properly looked after.  With a starting range of 510km, it should still have over 400km range at 20 years.  I will probably be dead by then

Again perhaps, but as I drive around Thailand I see precious few charging stations. As to your claim of getting 510 KM perhaps you should advise Mercedes that unlike published reports your car outstrips theirs. 



As to a range of 400KM at 20 years I find that pretty difficult to believe..  This report says at 8 years the battery would be at 70%.  

Now this is not an issue in Thailand but both battery charging time, range, and life of battery are considerably less in cold weather.  Ford recently advised owners of its new EV truck to avoid using the heater during cold weather and to rely on heated seats and steering wheel to save the battery.  The same applies to using the AC during the summer. 



It would seem to me, the only people who will greatly benefit from and EV would be those that travel a lot such as taxi drivers in major cities.  If you drive very little you won't save enough in reduced energy costs to recoup the additional expense of purchasing an EV.  The unknown question is if the owner decides to change vehicles at the end of 5 to 8 years what the resale value will be.  I "suspect" buyers will know the battery is towards the end of its normal life, will have reduced range, and might need to be replaced.  Given that I would conjecture the resale value will plummet.  

Also unknown, all of the studies are based on todays cost of electricity.  As more electric cars are on the roads it is almost a certainty that government will tax the EV's either directly or through higher electric costs to offset the loss of fuel tax.  Though it wont impact immediately existing owners. The price of lithium has skyrocketed and that is with only a small fraction of the cars being Electric.  That alone could significantly increase the cost of a new EV and destroy any resale value entirely on the used one if it required now a much more expensive battery replacement. 



 

[KhunLA]

37 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

The same here, but if all the chargers are full at New Year it might be appreciated...

That was easy enough.  Contact my attorney about copyright infringement ????

Edited January 4, 2023 by KhunLA

[TronxII]

36 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

As to your claim of getting 510 KM perhaps you should advise Mercedes that unlike published reports your car outstrips theirs. 

Miles vs km in your picture. Any further questions? Does it compute?

[TronxII]

55 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

The same here, but if all the chargers are full at New Year it might be appreciated.

Thats nice community spirit to make your chargers available for emergency.

How does this work, I see a checkin button. So could someone reserve a time slot?

How do other charging stations handle this? Can you reserve a spot, or is it first come first serve?

[Bandersnatch]

7 minutes ago, TronxII said:

Thats nice community spirit to make your chargers available for emergency.

How does this work, I see a checkin button. So could someone reserve a time slot?

How do other charging stations handle this? Can you reserve a spot, or is it first come first serve?

Plugshare lists EV chargers for many different companies. You can plan a trip and if you add your EV type to your profile it will know your range and suggest charging stations. You can filter your search by plug type. When you visit a charger you can "Check in" and leave a review for others to read maybe that it's not working. 

 

To actually use a charger like PTT, PEA etc you will have to use their app to pay for and in some cases you can reserve a spot.

[JBChiangRai]

1 hour ago, Longwood50 said:

Again perhaps, but as I drive around Thailand I see precious few charging stations. As to your claim of getting 510 KM perhaps you should advise Mercedes that unlike published reports your car outstrips theirs. 
 

I don't drive a Mercedes, I drive a Porsche Taycan and Porsche are known for understating their performance figures.

[KhunLA]

53 minutes ago, TronxII said:

How do other charging stations handle this? Can you reserve a spot, or is it first come first serve?

I'm only familiar with MG's charger, and yes, you can reserve up to 15 mins prior I believe.   If someone pulls up in that time, they won't be able to plug in, or simply wait, maybe, for end of that reserve time, and it will open.

 

Haven't read the fine print yet.  Everyone we've used has been empty, so we haven't bothered trying.  If someone there, there's another usually just down the road.

[KhunLA]

16 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

I don't drive a Mercedes, I drive a Porsche Taycan and Porsche are known for understating their performance figures.

I also consistently exceed MG's range rating of 320 kms (WLTP), cruising at 60 & 90 kph, instead of WLTP's average test speed of 47 kph.  Even exceed, occasionally, NEDC's rating of 403, by just a few.

 

[motdaeng]

video about charging system in thailand ...

 

i have the impression that the whole thing hasn't been thought through (yet) ... ????

 

 

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, motdaeng said:

video about charging system in thailand ...

 

i have the impression that the whole thing hasn't been thought through (yet) ... ????

 

 

With a 10 minute window, that seems about fair.   Just plan to be there early or on time.

 

A work in progress.  Planning is everything.  Would think people against it would be those folks that don't plan, or don't follow through with their plans, or on 'Thai Time'.

 

Ignorant & arrogant folks will always complicate things ... sadly.

[macahoom]

2 hours ago, motdaeng said:

video about charging system in thailand ...

 

i have the impression that the whole thing hasn't been thought through (yet) ... ????

 

 

 

This is his report on EV Station PluZ.

 

We've used these stations several times. Admittedly, the first time we used one, it was a little confusing. But now we understand it and have the hang of it, it's quite simple and works well.

Edited January 5, 2023 by macahoom

[JBChiangRai]

2 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

With a 10 minute window, that seems about fair.   Just plan to be there early or on time.

I think 10 minutes is perfect, I guess they are aiming for people to book their place in the queue as they arrive which makes perfect sense.

[motdaeng]

normally i only need to use the charging station for a road trips.
e.g. to book the day before makes little sense to me, since it will be difficult

to arrive at the charging station at the full hour (+ 10 min) on a 200 km journey ...

 

maybe booking max 30 minutes in advance would work better ?
we'll see, the system can (imho) be improved ...

 

another point, if the slot is booked and nobody shows up, the charging station is

locked and can not be uesed by others for 15 minutes (?) ... that sounds not like a good idea ...

Edited January 5, 2023 by motdaeng

[macahoom]

2 minutes ago, motdaeng said:

another point, if the slot is booked and nobody shows up, the charging station is

locked and can not be uesed by others for 15 minutes (?)

10 minutes.

[Sophon]

1 minute ago, macahoom said:

10 minutes.

Plus the five minutes before the booking slot.

[macahoom]

9 minutes ago, Sophon said:

Plus the five minutes before the booking slot.

You're almost right!

 

It's actually 10 minutes before the booking slot. I know Bjørn says 5 minutes in the video, but I'm pretty sure he's wrong.

Edited January 5, 2023 by macahoom

[Sophon]

14 minutes ago, macahoom said:

You're almost right!

 

It's actually 10 minutes before the booking slot. I know Bjørn says 5 minutes in the video, but I'm pretty sure he's wrong.

It might be different for different charging networks, but I did see one of his earlier road trip videos where the charger stopped charging five minutes before the hour.

[macahoom]

1 minute ago, Sophon said:

It might be different for different charging networks, but I did see one of his earlier road trip videos where the charger stopped charging five minutes before the hour.

 

2 minutes ago, Sophon said:

It might be different for different charging networks, but I did see one of his earlier road trip videos where the charger stopped charging five minutes before the hour.

Sorry for any confusion, but we've been discussing EV Station PluZ which is the station featured in Bjørn's video a few posts earlier. It stops charging 10 minutes before the hour.