British press support UK pensioners losing out in Thailand

[PremiumLane]

7 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

You've taken the labour bait put out there easily

Come again?

[Kwasaki]

6 minutes ago, steve187 said:

that's the max new state pension, the old system prior to 6th April 2016 was not fixed and depended on for your personal contributions, serps (State Earnings Related Pension Scheme) and or S2P (State Second Pension) i don't know what the maximum amount achievable was.

The maximum as you say was due to the amount you paid in N. I.  payments the more you earned the more you N. I. you paid. 

 

The serps thing I was in for a time and then got out and there was S2P and a full pension of all three was calculated when your pension was due.

The full pension was given if you had paid full N. I. for 30 years in my case even though I had paid in for 42 years. 

So I ended up with 3 amounts that added up to my total weekly pension. 

[chilly07]

10 hours ago, soi3eddie said:

Nothing will change. How dare we leave the UK for a happier life in Thailand (or elsewhere). We only exist in the eyes of the UK government if they can still tax us. Nobody stuck in the UK would support an increase for those living overseas. 

 

They still levy full tax on pensions originating in the UK despite freezing the state pension! As well as restricting access to the NHS!

[Eff1n2ret]

1 hour ago, vinci said:

are Uk pensions like American Social Security?

It depends what pensions you are talking about. What is under discussion is the State Retirement Pension, entitlement to which depends on contributions made through "National Insurance" paid during one's working life. In effect it's a giant Ponzi scheme, because "National Insurance" supposedly covers not only pensions but healthcare and other benefits, but individual contributions come nowhere near to paying for all that - so people in work today are paying for us wrinklies, as we did for our forebears.

Pensions paid to retired Government workers or private pension schemes are not part of this topic. 

[chilly07]

23 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

You've taken the labour bait put out there easily

Ashamed to say that labour governments are equally guilty on frozen pensions in that they also declined to unfreeze them

[Chivas]

Yet again myself (and many others here) would offer that same message.....why on earth completely burn your bridges with the UK

 

 

 

[Will B Good]

3 minutes ago, Chivas said:

Yet again myself (and many others here) would offer that same message.....why on earth completely burn your bridges with the UK

 

 

 

Could you add some flesh to the bones?.......do you mean lie and pretend you are not abroad or legally maintain your residency rights somehow or is there a third way?

 

Genuine questions.

Edited May 2, 2022 by Will B Good

[Chivas]

5 hours ago, hotchilli said:

Out of sight out of mind, as the old saying goes.

We paid in our contributions just the same as everyone else, but when it comes to paying out the goalposts move.

Incorrect

Who choose to drop anchor in another country ??   You or the Treasury ??

Or are you claiming you didn't know in the first place ??

 

Nothing to do with moving the goalposts......vast majority in my opinion didn't actually sadly realise is the actual correct answer

[Kwasaki]

47 minutes ago, PremiumLane said:

This is what you get when you have a Tory government - they only care about their rich mates and their own business interests 

Well I would argue on that one because Maggie gave me options and I ended up with more UK gov pension than the basic at the time my was due. 

[oobar]

2 hours ago, PaDavid said:

The point you may have missed is that we’ve paid for our pensions our entire working lives through something called National Insurance. So, in effect, it’s a contributory pension scheme in the same way as if we had paid into a private plan

Same way with Social Security in America.  We pay during our working life and get a pension but without  an expat penalty. 

[potless]

28 minutes ago, nahkit said:

I was always under the impression that National Insurance was a means to fund a future pension rather than a coffer for government services.

Unfortunately not. All tax revenue from whatever source goes into one large pot and then gets reallocated to whatever. E. g. vehicle license tax revenue doesnt get to be spent on roads.

[Will B Good]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Well I would argue on that one because Maggie gave me options and I ended up with more UK gov pension than the basic at the time my was due. 

She was clever in that respect......mortgaging the future to save the present (and her skin).

 

Police, armed forces, fire services......all received amazing deals whilst she sold off the family silver to pay for it all (at least in the short term).

[Chivas]

12 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Could you add some flesh to the bones?.......do you mean lie and pretend you are not a abroad or legally maintain your residency rights somehow or is there a third way?

 

Genuine questions.

I'm not advocating anything illegal

I'm just saying with more emphasis perhaps that anyone who "completely" burns their bridges with their home country frankly needs their head examining

 

I will give one incredibly easy example of retaining your/our "status" within the UK......It is incredibly easy to remain on your GP's patient list (one of the be all and end all of proof for the DWP) by interacting online with GP

 

I'm not resident in Thailand and never would do (happy 6 months a year fine by me) but I havent seen my own GP here in UK for 11 years even though I've had hospital treatment for some fairly serious stuff.....I interact "deliberately" with them once a year basically to ensure I remain on the patient lists in the first place (no agenda simply dont want to be removed by inaction).......point being you can do that from anywhere in the world

 

Moving on as I mentioned it few weeks ago expats use "boatmail" or similar services for physical letter communications

 

To me burning our bridges is just insane...

Edited May 2, 2022 by Chivas

[Will B Good]

1 minute ago, potless said:

Unfortunately not. All tax revenue from whatever source goes into one large pot and then gets reallocated to whatever. E. g. vehicle license tax revenue doesnt get to be spent on roads.

NIC are ring fenced to an extent....the government can borrow from the pot, on the promise to pay it back.

[Will B Good]

3 minutes ago, Chivas said:

I'm not advocating anything illegal

I'm just saying with more emphasis perhaps that anyone who "completely" burns their bridges with their home country frankly needs their head examining

 

I will give one incredibly easy example of retaining your/our "status" within the UK......It is incredibly easy to remain on your GP's patient list (one of the be all and end all of proof for the DWP) by interacting online with GP

 

I'm not resident in Thailand and never would do (happy 6 months a year fine by me) but I havent seen my own GP here in UK for 11 years.....I interact "deliberately" with them once a year basically to ensure I remain on the patient lists in the first place (no agenda simply dont want to be removed by inaction).......point being you can do that from anywhere in the world

 

Moving on as I mentioned it few weeks ago expats use "boatmail" or similar services for physical letter communications

 

To me burning our bridges is just insane...

Couldn't argue with that........... burning your bridges is 'insane'......I have always taught my kids the number one rule in life is keep your options open.....never close one down until you are forced to.

 

I do the same as you re: GP and keep property in the UK and visit the UK for 30 plus days each tax year

Edited May 2, 2022 by Will B Good

[Kwasaki]

4 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

She was clever in that respect......mortgaging the future to save the present (and her skin).

 

Police, armed forces, fire services......all received amazing deals whilst she sold off the family silver to pay for it all (at least in the short term).

Well all I can say is I benefited from the years Maggie was in power, it went down hill from then but fortunately I was by then financially stable to withstand the Labour onslaught. 

[scubascuba3]

22 minutes ago, chilly07 said:

Ashamed to say that labour governments are equally guilty on frozen pensions in that they also declined to unfreeze them

Yep about 20 years apparently

[Will B Good]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Well all I can say is I benefited from the years Maggie was in power, it went down hill from then but fortunately I was by then financially stable to withstand the Labour onslaught. 

My brother was in the Army and remember him telling me in the mid-eighties he didn't know what to do with all his money....(slight exaggeration I am sure).......but taking the Armed Forces as an example......

 

................the cost of pensions (paid for from general taxation....there are no pension payments made by soldiers).......are astronomical.....and we are paying for it now.

[Thujone]

7 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

"For example, a single pensioner who retired in late 1982 after having made the full contributions would be getting £32.85 a week, or £1,708 a year, if their pension were frozen then. If they had stayed in Britain, they would now be getting £141.85 a week, or £7,376 a year"

 

Slight extreme example, that would make them about 105, many in Thailand that age?

You've obviously never been to Soi Buakhao, Pattaya.

[potless]

7 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

NIC are ring fenced to an extent

But to what extent? Not 100% for sure. 

[billd766]

54 minutes ago, PremiumLane said:

This is what you get when you have a Tory government - they only care about their rich mates and their own business interests 

You are obviously the kind of person who skims a headline and does no research on the subject at all. If you had done any research and found this page (it took me a couple of minutes to find and a bit longer to read).

 

The truth is nothing at all like the post you posted, but anything will do to bash the conservatives, and the truth doesn't matter

 

When a previous attempt reached as far as the ECHR, the UK PM went to the courts and spoke against equalisation.

 

What was his name now?

 

Ah, now it comes to me.

 

His name was Tony Blair and he was the PM and the leader of the Labour party.

 

Do you believe that if Labour get back into power, that they will parity to frozen pensions?

 

BTW the frozen pensions have been around longer than me and I am 77.

 

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01457/

 

The UK State Pension is payable worldwide to those who meet the qualifying conditions. It is up-rated where there is a legal requirement to do so, for example, where recipients are living in countries where there is a reciprocal agreement that provides for up-rating. The Government has no plans to change the policy on up-rating UK State Pensions overseas; the policy is longstanding and has been supported by successive Governments for over 70 years. The Government understands that people move abroad for many reasons and that this can have an impact on their finances. However, the decision to move abroad remains a personal choice. Advice that the UK State Pension is not up-rated overseas except where there is a legal requirement has been provided to the public for many years. Information is provided in leaflets and on gov.uk (PQ HL 11595 5 January 2021)."

 

There is a lot more that you can read and download via the link.

[Surasak]

2 hours ago, Cake Monster said:

As with many of these kind of sensationalist reports, the OP does not state the reason why exactly there are 100 Countries Worldwide, where a pensioner cannot get the full entitlement.

if it is indeed correct that some Older Citizens that retired some time ago are still receiving the pension they first received upon their retirement Day, the british Government should be ashamed of themselves.

These are good hard working Folk that have paid their dues all their working lives, and are entitled to more respect than this from their own Government.

Even the wetbacks get more respect and State Aid than a Pensioner

The number of countries where UK pensioners do not get increases is over 150. As the UK government being ashamed of themselves, they now no shame ans possibly never will. This situation has gone on for the past 70 years or more and successive governments have done nothing. It was taken to the european court of justice some years ago and even they threw it out. What chance now?

[sawadee1947]

11 hours ago, webfact said:

Some of the oldest “frozen pensioners” are receiving payments of only £30 to £40 a week, which never go up.

.....and how they survived then? Definetely there are other sources of income.

So complaining on High Level????

[Will B Good]

4 minutes ago, potless said:

But to what extent? Not 100% for sure. 

It is notional in the respect they can borrow from it......just as companies are still allowed to borrow from their own pension funds (absolutely immoral) just as Robert Maxwell did with the Mirror's pension fund......criminal.

[Kwasaki]

5 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

My brother was in the Army and remember him telling me in the mid-eighties he didn't know what to do with all his money....(slight exaggeration I am sure).......but taking the Armed Forces as an example......

 

................the cost of pensions (paid for from general taxation....there are no pension payments made by soldiers).......are astronomical.....and we are paying for it now.

Yeah well I have said many times to plan you retirement is important and more so if you go and live in a country with no % annual increases.

Over there 10 years I have been getting my pensions here the cost of living is still much the same where I live. 

[Will B Good]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Yeah well I have said many times to plan you retirement is important and more so if you go and live in a country with no % annual increases.

Over there 10 years I have been getting my pensions here the cost of living is still much the same where I live. 

Agree 100%......I have four pension streams......three are UK CPI index linked.

[potless]

4 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Robert Maxwell

Also affectionately known as "the bouncing Czech. " 

[Purdey]

1 hour ago, Thailand said:

And your point is?

Would they be complaining if they had other money in the bank?

[billd766]

29 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

She was clever in that respect......mortgaging the future to save the present (and her skin).

 

Police, armed forces, fire services......all received amazing deals whilst she sold off the family silver to pay for it all (at least in the short term).

Meanwhile Gordon Brown literally sold off the complete UK gold reserves at a bad price, just to pay the bills.

 

The only PM I would really have trusted would have been Winston Churchill and he was out of power long before I got the vote. 

[Hanuman2547]

I feel sad for all of my Brit friends that are not getting this rise in their pension.  It's a d@mn shame that you are not getting the benefit that you worked for.