Voices: From hero to zero: How did faith in Boris Johnson’s premiership crumble in less than three years?

[Loiner]

5 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

So these EU workers were driving down wages while at the same time sponging of benefits?

 

Or is this just another example of the baseless and derogatory views that was behind Brexit?

Working for low wages and still claiming benefits are not mutually exclusive. Only 16 hours per week and claiming UC. Then there’s a whole black economy. 
Plus all the education and health sponging etc. 

[Loiner]

3 hours ago, RayC said:

Or maybe it was the likes of supermarkets squeezing suppliers that kept wage rates artificially low. 

 

Then how would you know anything about the practical difficulties of getting benefits abroad or did you find that simple to get benefits in the UK that you can't believe there is an easier system?

 

I can't provide details of any personal experience with applying for benefits overseas as I've never done so.

Various industries, not only ones related to supermarket products. 
 

I wouldn’t know about claiming benefits overseas and I’ve never been able to claim any in UK and certainly non overseas. 
 

Sorry I thought you were advising me through experience about the ease of claiming in France Belgium or Italy. Perhaps you could clarify with a Eastern European, cos they’re sure to know. 

[Chomper Higgot]

33 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Working for low wages and still claiming benefits are not mutually exclusive. Only 16 hours per week and claiming UC. Then there’s a whole black economy. 
Plus all the education and health sponging etc. 

you seem to know how that works.

[Chomper Higgot]

Back to Johnson.

 

He’s been rumbled.

 

 

[baboon]

6 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Back to Johnson.

 

He’s been rumbled.

 

 

Why, what's happened?

[candide]

38 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Working for low wages and still claiming benefits are not mutually exclusive. Only 16 hours per week and claiming UC. Then there’s a whole black economy. 
Plus all the education and health sponging etc. 

According to ONS statistics, EU citizen had a higher employment rate than other categories. It means that, in terms of taxes and various contributions, they were contributing more than the other categories. So they were actually subsidising benefits for the other categories, UK citizen included.

 

The category with the  lowest rate of employment (and hence the most subsidised) was that of non-EU foreigners, whose number is not affected by Brexit.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/employmentandemployeetypes/articles/ukandnonukpeopleinthelabourmarket/february2020

[RayC]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

 

Sorry I thought you were advising me through experience about the ease of claiming in France Belgium or Italy.

I don't know what lead you to that conclusion but apology accepted.

 

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

Perhaps you could clarify with a Eastern European, cos they’re sure to know. 

Wrong again, I'm afraid. I asked a Rumanian friend and he couldn't help as he'd never claimed benefits anywhere.

 

Maybe there are a few Brits who could advise about the relative ease of claiming benefits in the UK and the various EU states?

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

you seem to know how that works.

Yes, and that’s why I voted for Brexit. 

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, candide said:

According to ONS statistics…

Who was it said: 

 

Lies, damned lies and statistics. 

[Loiner]

6 minutes ago, RayC said:

I don't know what lead you to that conclusion but apology accepted.

 

Wrong again, I'm afraid. I asked a Rumanian friend and he couldn't help as he'd never claimed benefits anywhere.

 

Maybe there are a few Brits who could advise about the relative ease of claiming benefits in the UK and the various EU states?

Did you happen to have that Rumanian friend on speed dial?

 

The workshy lefty socialist ones might. 

[Mac Mickmanus]

7 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Frequently report during the run up to Brexit, British employers across any sector that required physical work (building/farming/fishing/forestry/infrastructure construction etc) all complained that British ‘kids’ were not applying for apprenticeships/jobs on offer.

 

British ‘Kids’ just won’t have it.

Could you provide a  link for that ?

[Mac Mickmanus]

20 hours ago, Loiner said:

6.2 million of them applied for UK settlement. Surely that must be enough to keep our cheap labour supporters happy?

Are they all still here, or just spending the last of their furlough cash at home before coming back to sign on for some benefits?

My Romanian neighbours are still here in the U.K , as are the Polish, Bulgarians and other Eastern Europeans  guys and guys working in my local Supermarket 

[Mac Mickmanus]

23 hours ago, Slip said:

So which minimum wage job will you be applying for?  You should be quick before the tories abolish minimum wage completely.

 

 

You make that suggestion about Tories cutting benefits on the very day that Tories announced that people can use benefits to buy a house

[placeholder]

21 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

You make that suggestion about Tories cutting benefits on the very day that Tories announced that people can use benefits to buy a house

The 2 are not mutually exclusive.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Could you provide a  link for that ?

https://www.economist.com/britain/2020/04/16/not-enough-britons-want-to-work-on-farms

[Chomper Higgot]

23 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

You make that suggestion about Tories cutting benefits on the very day that Tories announced that people can use benefits to buy a house

Not quite.

 

Johnson has suggested housing benefit be used to buy houses.

 

It’s another one of his ‘shiny things for the future’ it is not a policy that has been put in place.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

Who was it said: 

 

Lies, damned lies and statistics. 

Somebody who didn’t like what the data was demonstrating.

[Mac Mickmanus]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

https://www.economist.com/britain/2020/04/16/not-enough-britons-want-to-work-on-farms

That link shows that people didnt want to work on farms .

That doesnt back up your claim that British kids were "not applying for apprenticeships "

  Do you have a link to back up this claim you made ?

 

"Frequently report during the run up to Brexit, British employers across any sector that required physical work (building/farming/fishing/forestry/infrastructure construction etc) all complained that British ‘kids’ were not applying for apprenticeships/jobs on offer.

British ‘Kids’ just won’t have it."

 

[Loiner]

47 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

My Romanian neighbours are still here in the U.K , as are the Polish, Bulgarians and other Eastern Europeans  guys and guys working in my local Supermarket 

As if there are not enough of them already, the europhiles and big business want to import more. Keeps down the costs, locals on zero hours and the chattering classes domestic help available & cheap. 
 

[Chomper Higgot]

8 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

That link shows that people didnt want to work on farms .

That doesnt back up your claim that British kids were "not applying for apprenticeships "

  Do you have a link to back up this claim you made ?

 

"Frequently report during the run up to Brexit, British employers across any sector that required physical work (building/farming/fishing/forestry/infrastructure construction etc) all complained that British ‘kids’ were not applying for apprenticeships/jobs on offer.

British ‘Kids’ just won’t have it."

 

https://www.ukconstructionweek.com/news/why-dont-young-people-want-to-work-in-construction

https://constructionmanagement.co.uk/fear-manual-work-putting-young-people-construction/

https://priestleyconstruction.co.uk/news/getting-young-people-into-construction/

 

Nothing that surprises anyone that works in and has direct knowledge of the industry.

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, Loiner said:

As if there are not enough of them already, the europhiles and big business want to import more. Keeps down the costs, locals on zero hours and the chattering classes domestic help available & cheap. 
 

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2022/jun/10/rules-relaxed-foreign-teachers-work-schools-in-england

 

Guess who’s kids will wind up being taught by imported teachers who don’t meet the qualification requirements that the Tories plan to ‘relax’?

 

 

[placeholder]

19 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

That link shows that people didnt want to work on farms .

That doesnt back up your claim that British kids were "not applying for apprenticeships "

  Do you have a link to back up this claim you made ?

 

"Frequently report during the run up to Brexit, British employers across any sector that required physical work (building/farming/fishing/forestry/infrastructure construction etc) all complained that British ‘kids’ were not applying for apprenticeships/jobs on offer.

British ‘Kids’ just won’t have it."

 

Entry-level apprenticeship starts down by three-quarters in eight years, campaigners warn

https://www.peoplemanagement.co.uk/article/1751793/entry-level-apprenticeship-starts-down-three-quarters-eight-years-campaigners-warn

[Mac Mickmanus]

4 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

https://www.ukconstructionweek.com/news/why-dont-young-people-want-to-work-in-construction

https://constructionmanagement.co.uk/fear-manual-work-putting-young-people-construction/

https://priestleyconstruction.co.uk/news/getting-young-people-into-construction/

 

Nothing that surprises anyone that works in and has direct knowledge of the industry.

Those links say that there is a skill shortage in the building industry and the way to alleviate the skill shortage is to train more people how to build, like having more apprenticeships and training . 

   The reason as to why there is a lack of British builders is because there are a lack of apprenticeships and training (which is what I said) , you made the false claim that British kids don't want those (non existent) apprentiships .

   You made the stereotypical false claim that British kids are lazy and dont want to do building work .

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Those links say that there is a skill shortage in the building industry and the way to alleviate the skill shortage is to train more people how to build, like having more apprenticeships and training . 

   The reason as to why there is a lack of British builders is because there are a lack of apprenticeships and training (which is what I said) , you made the false claim that British kids don't want those (non existent) apprentiships .

   You made the stereotypical false claim that British kids are lazy and dont want to do building work .

I made no such stereotypical false claim, I never once used the word ‘lazy’.

 

I’ve backed up my statement with numerous links.

[Mac Mickmanus]

7 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Entry-level apprenticeship starts down by three-quarters in eight years, campaigners warn

https://www.peoplemanagement.co.uk/article/1751793/entry-level-apprenticeship-starts-down-three-quarters-eight-years-campaigners-warn

That link just shows that Companies now prefer to give apprenships to people aged over 25 years old and it also states that younger school leavers need to be given appentiships as well  , which is my point 

[Sparktrader]

On 6/7/2022 at 4:33 AM, Hummin said:

Hard to understand for one looking from outside how he managed to get in power in the first place! 

 

Unbelievable

The opposition are terrible. He beat a communist.

[Chomper Higgot]

Just now, Sparktrader said:

The opposition are terrible. He beat a communist.

Who is no longer the ‘opposition’

[Mac Mickmanus]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I made no such stereotypical false claim, I never once used the word ‘lazy’.

 

I’ve backed up my statement with numerous links.

You haven't .

You have shown that there are a lack of apprentiships available .

You didnt back up your claim that there are training and apprenticeship positions available and that British kids are not applying or taking up those (non existent ) apprenticeships .

   Can you back up your claim that there are Training and apprentships available, but British kids don't want to do them ?

[Chomper Higgot]

Just now, Mac Mickmanus said:

You haven't .

You have shown that there are a lack of apprentiships available .

You didnt back up your claim that there are training and apprenticeship positions available and that British kids are not applying or taking up those (non existent ) apprenticeships .

   Can you back up your claim that there are Training and apprentships available, but British kids don't want to do them ?

The links I have provided back up my statements.

 

[Mac Mickmanus]

6 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I made no such stereotypical false claim, I never once used the word ‘lazy’.

 

I

I must have misunderstood what you meant . 

What is the reason as to why British kids didn't want to do physical work ?