Biggest U.K. train strike in 30 years inevitable as talks fail and too late to roster staff

[onthedarkside]

 

 

The biggest national rail shutdown for three decades is now inevitable as talks have failed and it is too late to roster crews to cover services.

...

Members of the RMT union working for the infrastructure provider Network Rail and 13 train operators voted 8:1 in favour of striking in a dispute over pay, jobs and working conditions. Around 40,000 workers are expected to walk out on 21, 23 and 25 June.

 

They will be joined on the first day of action by colleagues working for London Underground, effectively shutting down the Tube network in the capital.

...

Across Great Britain, all but 4,500 of the normal 20,000 daily trains have been axed. More than half of the route network is closed because Network Rail signallers are walking out.

 

(more)

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/trains-strike-tube-rmt-latest-b2104494.html

 

 

[RichardColeman]

About time striking that causes chaos was banned completely - either that or the unions have to pick up the bill for every penny of lost train revenue, additional public travel cost and company lost work hours. I doubt anybody would vote for a strike if they received a bill for 10,000  quid each per day for doing so

 

 

[Bangkok Barry]

1 hour ago, RichardColeman said:

About time striking that causes chaos was banned completely - either that or the unions have to pick up the bill for every penny of lost train revenue, additional public travel cost and company lost work hours. I doubt anybody would vote for a strike if they received a bill for 10,000  quid each per day for doing so

 

 

I'm not saying that I support the strike, but to say that unions wanting a decent standard of living for their members should suffer huge financial penalties is about as short-sighted a comment as I've read for a very long time.

[James105]

Of all the jobs out there this is the one that is the most easily automated as the trains (literally) run on tracks.    Some lines in London already run without drivers.   Strikes like this will hasten the demise of this job.    If I was a train driver with zero transferrable skills and someone was willing to pay me £60,000+ per year I'd probably try and keep a low profile rather than striking and drawing attention to how easy the job is compared to how much the salary is.  A bus driver has a significantly more challenging job, has transferrable skills and gets less than half the salary of a train driver.  

[baboon]

2 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

About time striking that causes chaos was banned completely - either that or the unions have to pick up the bill for every penny of lost train revenue, additional public travel cost and company lost work hours. I doubt anybody would vote for a strike if they received a bill for 10,000  quid each per day for doing so

 

 

What, so working people should not have the right to stick up for themselves in any meaningful way? There is a word for that: 'Serfdom'. 

Have a think about it.

[baboon]

3 minutes ago, James105 said:

Of all the jobs out there this is the one that is the most easily automated as the trains (literally) run on tracks.    Some lines in London already run without drivers.   Strikes like this will hasten the demise of this job.    If I was a train driver with zero transferrable skills and someone was willing to pay me £60,000+ per year I'd probably try and keep a low profile rather than striking and drawing attention to how easy the job is compared to how much the salary is.  A bus driver has a significantly more challenging job, has transferrable skills and gets less than half the salary of a train driver.  

Err, the RMT are striking, not ASLEF. ASLEF is the drivers' union.

[hotchilli]

3 hours ago, James105 said:

Of all the jobs out there this is the one that is the most easily automated as the trains (literally) run on tracks.    Some lines in London already run without drivers.   Strikes like this will hasten the demise of this job.    If I was a train driver with zero transferrable skills and someone was willing to pay me £60,000+ per year I'd probably try and keep a low profile rather than striking and drawing attention to how easy the job is compared to how much the salary is.  A bus driver has a significantly more challenging job, has transferrable skills and gets less than half the salary of a train driver.  

For every driver there are numerous support workers..

Trains drive on tracks but who maintains them, you seem to forget station workers, electricians, carriage workers etc etc.

 

[superal]

3 hours ago, baboon said:

Err, the RMT are striking, not ASLEF. ASLEF is the drivers' union.

and ASLEF have said they are joining in with the strikes and also have a total of 6 strikes planned as opposed to 3 by the RMT . There will be little public sympathy when the already "struggling to make ends meet public" cannot get to work etc . Drivers getting £60k + per annum , no wonder the rail fares are so expensive . Now seeking a pay rise over and above the inflation rate ?  If this strike goes ahead it will cause massive disruption and damage to the economy .  Government should bring in the army and teach the operation skills and follow up with new civy recruits for train workers jobs . Let the strikers know that their jobs will be lost if they go on strike

[Chomper Higgot]

2 hours ago, superal said:

and ASLEF have said they are joining in with the strikes and also have a total of 6 strikes planned as opposed to 3 by the RMT . There will be little public sympathy when the already "struggling to make ends meet public" cannot get to work etc . Drivers getting £60k + per annum , no wonder the rail fares are so expensive . Now seeking a pay rise over and above the inflation rate ?  If this strike goes ahead it will cause massive disruption and damage to the economy .  Government should bring in the army and teach the operation skills and follow up with new civy recruits for train workers jobs . Let the strikers know that their jobs will be lost if they go on strike

Union workers are ‘members of the public’.

 

The Government are failing here, refusing to join negotiations while pitching one set of working people against other working people.

 

It’s a perfect example of Tory divide and rule with the inevitable spite and envy thrown in ( look how much those people earn!).

 

Poverty and the cost of living crisis are getting worse, the way to fix that is improve incomes for working people.

 

Workers who unionize are able to negotiate better pay and conditions, and have every right to do so (or at least for the time being they do).

 

Here’s the laughable bit, Government and the right wing in faux outrage over the impacts on the poor.

 

When did a Tory Government or the rightwing ever care about the poor?

 

Edited June 20, 2022 by Chomper Higgot

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

 

 

It’s a perfect example of Tory divide and rule with the inevitable spite and envy thrown in ( look how much those people earn!).

 

 

When did a Tory Government or the rightwing ever care about the poor?

 

A perfect example of Labour opposition and the unions combining to attempt overthrow of an elected government. 
 

It’s a long time since Labour or the unions ever cared about the workers or the poor. 
 

We need a Maggie to crush the unions who abuse their membership as political pawns. 

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, Loiner said:

A perfect example of Labour opposition and the unions combining to attempt overthrow of an elected government. 
 

It’s a long time since Labour or the unions ever cared about the workers or the poor. 
 

We need a Maggie to crush the unions who abuse their membership as political pawns. 

Quit gaslighting Loiner, the strike is not an attempt to bring down the Government.

‘Political Pawns’ you say!

 

 

 

[James105]

5 hours ago, hotchilli said:

For every driver there are numerous support workers..

Trains drive on tracks but who maintains them, you seem to forget station workers, electricians, carriage workers etc etc.

 

Fine, whatever.   Perhaps if the unions in the UK hadn't all been screaming for harder and longer lockdowns so their members could sit at home watching Netflix at the expense of taxpayers then maybe, just maybe, there would be more money to go around.    Who would have thought that 2 years of doing nothing would have consequences.   

[Red Forever]

11 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

About time striking that causes chaos was banned completely - either that or the unions have to pick up the bill for every penny of lost train revenue, additional public travel cost and company lost work hours. I doubt anybody would vote for a strike if they received a bill for 10,000  quid each per day for doing so

 

 

How about shareholders in the privatised railway companies "pick up the bill" cos they are the only beneficiaries of this fragmented, complicated transport system.

£200 Euston to Manchester <deleted>!

 

[RayC]

32 minutes ago, Loiner said:

A perfect example of Labour opposition and the unions combining to attempt overthrow of an elected government. 
 

It’s a long time since Labour or the unions ever cared about the workers or the poor. 
 

We need a Maggie to crush the unions who abuse their membership as political pawns. 

71% of those balloted took part in the vote with 89% voting in favour of strike action and only 11% voting against. So 63% of the membership in favour of the strike.

 

Union had no choice but to implement the results of the ballot. After all, that's what democracy is all about, isn't it?

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Quit gaslighting Loiner, the strike is not an attempt to bring down the Government.

‘Political Pawns’ you say!

 

 

 

You cannot seriously believe that. Labour has no credible policies, so does nothing but try to bring down the government. 
All union members have been used as political pawns for years. It’s what the committed leftists embedded as their ‘leadership’ set out to do. 

[Excel]

2 minutes ago, Loiner said:

You cannot seriously believe that. Labour has no credible policies, so does nothing but try to bring down the government. 
All union members have been used as political pawns for years. It’s what the committed leftists embedded as their ‘leadership’ set out to do. 

Oh dear, they should never have made weed legal with posts like that 

[Bluespunk]

20 hours ago, onthedarkside said:

Members of the RMT union working for the infrastructure provider Network Rail and 13 train operators voted 8:1 in favour of striking in a dispute over pay, jobs and working conditions. Around 40,000 workers are expected to walk out on 21, 23 and 25 June.

Good to see united action in a common cause. Good luck and hope all goes your way. 

[baboon]

6 hours ago, superal said:

and ASLEF have said they are joining in with the strikes and also have a total of 6 strikes planned as opposed to 3 by the RMT . There will be little public sympathy when the already "struggling to make ends meet public" cannot get to work etc . Drivers getting £60k + per annum , no wonder the rail fares are so expensive . Now seeking a pay rise over and above the inflation rate ?  If this strike goes ahead it will cause massive disruption and damage to the economy .  Government should bring in the army and teach the operation skills and follow up with new civy recruits for train workers jobs . Let the strikers know that their jobs will be lost if they go on strike

How is it government business? The rail system is privatised.

[Chomper Higgot]

51 minutes ago, Loiner said:

You cannot seriously believe that. Labour has no credible policies, so does nothing but try to bring down the government. 
All union members have been used as political pawns for years. It’s what the committed leftists embedded as their ‘leadership’ set out to do. 

1. The thread is not about Labour or Labour’s policies.

 

2. Nobody is trying to bring the Government down, you made that bit up.

 

3. Your assertion that Union Members are used as ‘political pawns’ missiles the fact that it is Union Members who voted for this strike, the Union is found exactly what a clear majority of Union Members are telling it to do.

 

So, misdirection and whataboutary, followed by imagined fallacy and a display of a complete misunderstanding of how unions operate.

 

Keep it up, you are doing wonderfully.

[Loiner]

16 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

1. The thread is not about Labour or Labour’s policies.

 

2. Nobody is trying to bring the Government down, you made that bit up.

 

3. Your assertion that Union Members are used as ‘political pawns’ missiles the fact that it is Union Members who voted for this strike, the Union is found exactly what a clear majority of Union Members are telling it to do.

 

So, misdirection and whataboutary, followed by imagined fallacy and a display of a complete misunderstanding of how unions operate.

 

Keep it up, you are doing wonderfully.

You really don’t like the truth do you. 

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, Excel said:

Oh dear, they should never have made weed legal with posts like that 

Sure not exclusively, but weed does tend to be the drug of choice for the left. 

[baboon]

5 minutes ago, Loiner said:

You really don’t like the truth do you. 

We are yet to hear any from your good self...

[Chomper Higgot]

50 minutes ago, Loiner said:

You really don’t like the truth do you. 

Let me know when you find some.

[Chomper Higgot]

6 hours ago, Loiner said:

Sure not exclusively, but weed does tend to be the drug of choice for the left. 

Where as being nasty to those less fortunate is the drug of choice for the right.

[Loiner]

19 hours ago, RayC said:

71% of those balloted took part in the vote with 89% voting in favour of strike action and only 11% voting against. So 63% of the membership in favour of the strike.

 

Union had no choice but to implement the results of the ballot. After all, that's what democracy is all about, isn't it?

You have a twisted democracy if in yours it’s ok for a union which nobody for can overthrow a nationally elected government. 

The opposition party which failed to be elected will have MPs on the picket lines to help. Didn’t someone here try to deny that’s what this thread is about?

[RayC]

28 minutes ago, Loiner said:

You have a twisted democracy if in yours it’s ok for a union which nobody for can overthrow a nationally elected government. 

The opposition party which failed to be elected will have MPs on the picket lines to help. Didn’t someone here try to deny that’s what this thread is about?

I assume that you omitted the word 'voted' (3rd line)? In any event, whether the word is included or not, the statement is nonsense: The members of the Union vote in the leadership of their Union. How is that undemocratic?

 

It appears that you would deny individuals the right to withdraw their labour?

 

Not all the public are in favour of the strike, so it is a risky strategy if opposition MPs see it as courting favour with the electorate, hence the reason that Starmer has warned against them being seen on the picket line. Maybe those opposition MPs who defy Starmer on this matter are simply there because they believe in the RMT's case.

 

It appears that your version of democracy comprises a government - of which you approve - with no dissent permitted. Now that is a strange version of a free, democratic society.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

You have a twisted democracy if in yours it’s ok for a union which nobody for can overthrow a nationally elected government. 

The opposition party which failed to be elected will have MPs on the picket lines to help. Didn’t someone here try to deny that’s what this thread is about?

Again, gaslighting.

 

The rail strike is not an attempt to overthrow the Government.

 

You made that up, it’s not a thing.

[bannork]

21 hours ago, Loiner said:

A perfect example of Labour opposition and the unions combining to attempt overthrow of an elected government. 
 

It’s a long time since Labour or the unions ever cared about the workers or the poor. 
 

We need a Maggie to crush the unions who abuse their membership as political pawns. 

The government keep going on about turning the UK into a high wage economy, so put their money where their mouth is- give the rail workers the rise they're asking for 

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, bannork said:

The government keep going on about turning the UK into a high wage economy, so put their money where their mouth is- give the rail workers the rise they're asking for 

To quote a drama queen tennis player: “You cannot be serious?”