4 minutes ago, sead said:

You think the NATO are going successfully out of this war, well as it seems now it doesn't seem so

Nato's already won the moment Putin invaded and successfully increased the size of NATO with Norway and Sweden in the process of joining

5 minutes ago, sead said:

You think the NATO are going successfully out of this war, well as it seems now it doesn't seem so

Elaborate please…your intent seems a bit vague. Thanks.

2 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Nato's already won the moment Putin invaded and successfully increased the size of NATO with Norway and Sweden in the process of joining

Hope you are right in your assumption but there’s always concern when you push a bully into a corner.  Putin just may come out fighting…and unfairly too.  A weakened Russia is no match against a fully energized, reinvigorated NATO….but only for as long as any ensuing combat remains conventional.  Once Putin feels compelled to respond with nuclear options, things quickly will turn ugly and not just for European-based populations.  This man is not only a megalomaniac but very likely insane too.

1 hour ago, Fore Man said:

Once Putin feels compelled to respond with nuclear options, things quickly will turn ugly

and that's exactly why they should take him out ....   I'm sure the US could take him out if they really wanted to ....   

5 minutes ago, steven100 said:

and that's exactly why they should take him out ....   I'm sure the US could take him out if they really wanted to ....   

Maybe.  The real issue is not just finding him, but fixing him in place.  We know through various media sources that he has multiple rings of fanatically-dedicated personal security details protecting him. These PSDs are carefully vetted and their loyalty unquestioned.  I’ve no doubt that we (USA & its allies) certainly have amazing intelligence capabilities established and sometimes the issue isn’t taking out a FBG as much as making it appear to be a tragic accident and not an outright assassination.  But let’s keep our fingers crossed.  This thug posing as a sovereign ruler needs to be deposed, but there needs to be some assurance that his replacement isn’t seen as even more despotic.  From what I’ve gleaned, the expected understudy just might be even worse.

6 hours ago, Fore Man said:

Elaborate please…your intent seems a bit vague. Thanks.

 

The whole world is in a chaos and loosing 50x more than Russia. Just because USA and NATO are forcing Ukraine into it. They are now making countries such as India, China more aware of NATO strategies and will soon form a coalition to protect themselves. With own banktransfer systems that ain't controlled by USA or EU.

Meaning buying oil in close future will not be forced to be bought in USD and then converted again. Instead direct transfers between rubel-rupee will be made. India and China are the 2 biggest countries with cheap workers and big exports. Dear God what would happen if those start to apply duty taxes etc. Now without the fertilizers from Ukrain and Russia next year's crop will be EXPENSIVE and just wait for end of years gasprices. 

4 hours ago, sead said:

 

The whole world is in a chaos and loosing 50x more than Russia. Just because USA and NATO are forcing Ukraine into it. They are now making countries such as India, China more aware of NATO strategies and will soon form a coalition to protect themselves. With own banktransfer systems that ain't controlled by USA or EU.

Meaning buying oil in close future will not be forced to be bought in USD and then converted again. Instead direct transfers between rubel-rupee will be made. India and China are the 2 biggest countries with cheap workers and big exports. Dear God what would happen if those start to apply duty taxes etc. Now without the fertilizers from Ukrain and Russia next year's crop will be EXPENSIVE and just wait for end of years gasprices. 

And all this is the result of a non existent threat. You really believe NATO was about to invade Russia, or at any time in the near future? The demonising of NATO is laughable. Putin is solely to blame. You can see why he launched the invasion. NATO wasn't even on his doorstep back then. It's a land and resource grab. BRICS is the new power block, and you've got Iran and others hungry to join. Putin wants the old USSR back. That's the real threat.

On 7/18/2022 at 8:11 AM, KhunLA said:

Why, did he do something wrong.  Govts invade countries, not their citizens.

 

Did the world go after USA billionaire's assets when they invaded & occupied Nam, Iraq, Afghan.   I think not.  

Maybe not, but there were world wide protests against the Vietnam war. In the free world, that is. And major protest movements against the Iraq war. I don't see the same reaction to the Russian war. Where are the protests outside the Russian embassies? People don't react in the same way. And identifying and sanctioning American oligarchs back in 1968? You're drawing ridiculous parallels.

 

1. It was Russia who originally invaded Afghanistan. The US armed the Mujahedeen to throw them out. I don't think Zelensky is in any way like-minded. But no, it didn't end well.

2. When Russia invaded and brutally suppressed popular uprisings in Hungary in 1956 and Czechoslovakia in 1968, did the world react? No.

3. When Russia and Germany invaded Poland in September 1939 (yes, they were big buddies then, Hitler and Stalin), and proceeded to carve it up between themselves, did the world react? Yes. Britain and France declared war on Germany. Much later the US joined the war, but only after the Japanese destroyed their Pacific fleet at Pearl Harbour.

 

It seems to me there are many many people on this forum and around the world, who weren't around in the Soviet era (pre 1991). Now, we have a picture being pushed out of poor defenceless Russia trying to protect itself against brutal, aggressive, expansionist NATO. Zelensky's a Nazi, albeit of Jewish descent. The ethnic Russians in Donbas are being exterminated etc etc. What complete and utter drivel. What the Soviets did behind the Iron Curtain and indeed within Soviet Russia was just unbelievable. Trouble is, you can't teach it in schools for fear of accusations of brain washing. Putin is the true reincarnation of KGB/Soviet brutality. All the pictures we're getting of the smiling, friendly man in Tehran? Complete rubbish. He heads a brutal, repressive regime, make no mistake, and if you're a European, it's coming your way.

 

17 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Nato's already won the moment Putin invaded and successfully increased the size of NATO with Norway and Sweden in the process of joining

Naah. Turkey will never allow Sweden since Sweden wot give any insurgents over to Turkey 

6 hours ago, bradiston said:

And all this is the result of a non existent threat. You really believe NATO was about to invade Russia, or at any time in the near future? The demonising of NATO is laughable. Putin is solely to blame. You can see why he launched the invasion. NATO wasn't even on his doorstep back then. It's a land and resource grab. BRICS is the new power block, and you've got Iran and others hungry to join. Putin wants the old USSR back. That's the real threat.

NATO wasn't on his doorstep. Dear God. Russia and NATO has an agreement 40 years ago that if Russia allow east and west Germany to be one. Then USA and NATO wouldn't expand an inch towards RUSSIA. And as soon as Germany became one they invited Poland, Tjeckoslovakia etc etc to join NATO.

You have tens of videos showing both Ambassadors,Senators and Russian ministers warning about expanding NATO closer to Russia's borders. USA is pushing NATO to try and destroy Russia so that itself can be a stronger power. There's no need to further talk with you if you are not into politics. Russia only want a buffert zone which they now have. And don't give sh,,t about rest of UKRAINE

12 minutes ago, sead said:

Naah. Turkey will never allow Sweden since Sweden wot give any insurgents over to Turkey 

NATO officials on Tuesday celebrated Turkey’s lifting of its veto against Sweden and Finland joining the transatlantic alliance

15 minutes ago, sead said:

Naah. Turkey will never allow Sweden since Sweden wot give any insurgents over to Turkey 

Never say never

1 minute ago, Bkk Brian said:

NATO officials on Tuesday celebrated Turkey’s lifting of its veto against Sweden and Finland joining the transatlantic alliance

https://www.reuters.com/world/erdogan-says-turkey-will-freeze-finland-swedens-nato-bids-if-promises-not-kept-2022-07-18/

 

Sweden will never fulfill Turkeys demands

4 minutes ago, sead said:

https://www.reuters.com/world/erdogan-says-turkey-will-freeze-finland-swedens-nato-bids-if-promises-not-kept-2022-07-18/

 

Sweden will never fulfill Turkeys demands

That's right, if the promises are not kept, you are assuming Sweden will not fulfill them, why?

Just now, Bkk Brian said:

That's right, if the promises are not kept, you are assuming Sweden will not fulfill them, why?

Because Sweden is the world's biggest humanity country. You don't have to bet with me but I'll gladly give 1000thb if Sweden accepts those terms. Only if they change terms it's possible

7 minutes ago, sead said:

Because Sweden is the world's biggest humanity country. You don't have to bet with me but I'll gladly give 1000thb if Sweden accepts those terms. Only if they change terms it's possible

I wouldn't want to take your money correct. When a country such as Sweden makes a promise I tend to believe it rather than you.

15 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

That's right, if the promises are not kept, you are assuming Sweden will not fulfill them, why?

Because it's not illegal to be a member in the Gulen movement in Sweden. Sweden doesn't rate Kurds as terrorists. Hence Sweden will rather protect its rights than being a member of NATO.

it's just a scheme by USA AND NATO

5 minutes ago, sead said:

Because it's not illegal to be a member in the Gulen movement in Sweden. Sweden doesn't rate Kurds as terrorists. Hence Sweden will rather protect its rights than being a member of NATO.

it's just a scheme by USA AND NATO

The deal is on sorry to disappoint you, as much as you'd like to see it fail.

49 minutes ago, sead said:

https://www.reuters.com/world/erdogan-says-turkey-will-freeze-finland-swedens-nato-bids-if-promises-not-kept-2022-07-18/

 

Sweden will never fulfill Turkeys demands

Has it occurred to you that Turkiye's demands can be met in other ways? Ever heard of bargaining chips?

27 minutes ago, sead said:

Because it's not illegal to be a member in the Gulen movement in Sweden. Sweden doesn't rate Kurds as terrorists. Hence Sweden will rather protect its rights than being a member of NATO.

it's just a scheme by USA AND NATO

Scheme.

Schmeme.

 

Sometime should tell Sweden that they didn’t actually choose to seek NATO membership then.

On 7/18/2022 at 3:03 PM, ChaiyaTH said:

So we should confiscate everything any Americans owns from this point too? To punish them for multiple wars, illegal invasions and the deaths of millions?

What logic is that with people nowadays, to punish all citizens of a country just because the governments actions. If you ask me we should do a hunt on all people who think and speak like this, and get rid of them ASAP, they are the cause of so much unrest globally.

The oligarchs that surround Putin are part of his coterie of supporters. They are tied to him because he demanded 50% of their assets to stay oligarchs. Those who did not comply were jailed, became refugees, or disappeared. They have benefited just as much as Putin has from the corruption in Russia.

 

AFAIK American billionaires such as Bezos, Musk, Gates and Buffett never had any ties with politicians, which makes your post a false equivalence.

 

Sanctions are supposed to work by punishing all the citizens in a country, based on the proposition angry people can bring about regime change.

3 hours ago, sead said:

 Russia only want a buffert zone which they now have. And don't give sh,,t about rest of UKRAINE

I guess that's why Russia had a 50 km long column of tanks heading towards Kyiv. Until it got mauled rather badly.

5 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I guess that's why Russia had a 50 km long column of tanks heading towards Kyiv. Until it got mauled rather badly.

Think USA put more into Vietnam than Russia into Ukraine. Me not think USA won the war. Do you

On 7/18/2022 at 8:29 AM, SAFETY FIRST said:

Wow, 19 people with 6 cabins, I reckon there's some 3somes going on. ????

6 guest cabins, crew have cabins of their own.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/feb/28/nato-expansion-war-russia-ukraine

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/02/20/putin-ukraine-nato-2007-munich-conference/

 

https://theconversation.com/ukraine-war-follows-decades-of-warnings-that-nato-expansion-into-eastern-europe-could-provoke-russia-177999

 

There's hundreds of posts and videos dating 25 years back

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Has it occurred to you that Turkiye's demands can be met in other ways? Ever heard of bargaining chips?

Yes. And I said that in the post before. Only if the change the arrangement

10 minutes ago, sead said:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/feb/28/nato-expansion-war-russia-ukraine

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/02/20/putin-ukraine-nato-2007-munich-conference/

 

https://theconversation.com/ukraine-war-follows-decades-of-warnings-that-nato-expansion-into-eastern-europe-could-provoke-russia-177999

 

There's hundreds of posts and videos dating 25 years back

His invasion was not about NATO expansion, if you believe this you have no idea and carried out little research into why he attacked Ukraine

3 hours ago, sead said:

NATO wasn't on his doorstep. Dear God. Russia and NATO has an agreement 40 years ago that if Russia allow east and west Germany to be one. Then USA and NATO wouldn't expand an inch towards RUSSIA. And as soon as Germany became one they invited Poland, Tjeckoslovakia etc etc to join NATO.

Actually there is no such written and then signed agreement about NATO expansion.

 

Maybe (and maybe not) there was a handshake on this behind closed doors, but there is no such written signed agreement about NATO expansion.

 

If you know of such, please point out the signed agreement - and show the EXACT signed agreement and wording where I have my facts wrong.

 

I can thou, point to you a signed agreement, where (after fall of Soviet Union) that when Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons, that Russia (and USA) signed a document stating they would not invade Ukraine.

 

Sadly, Russia broke that agreement.

.

4 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

Actually there is no such written and then signed agreement about NATO expansion.

 

Maybe (and maybe not) there was a handshake on this behind closed doors, but there is no such written signed agreement about NATO expansion.

 

If you know of such, please point out the signed agreement - and show the EXACT signed agreement and wording where I have my facts wrong.

 

I can thou, point to you a signed agreement, where (after fall of Soviet Union) that when Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons, that Russia (and USA) signed a document stating they would not invade Ukraine.

 

Sadly, Russia broke that agreement.

.

Exactly. There's no written statement. Only words from those involved. Not everything was written down at those times. Now we know how important that is

4 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

Actually there is no such written and then signed agreement about NATO expansion.

 

Maybe (and maybe not) there was a handshake on this behind closed doors, but there is no such written signed agreement about NATO expansion.

 

If you know of such, please point out the signed agreement - and show the EXACT signed agreement and wording where I have my facts wrong.

 

I can thou, point to you a signed agreement, where (after fall of Soviet Union) that when Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons, that Russia (and USA) signed a document stating they would not invade Ukraine.

 

Sadly, Russia broke that agreement.

.

Yes, it was the Budapest Memorandum. A total stitch up.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum_on_Security_Assurances