Mountain B fire: Full extent of tragedy hits home in horrific story of Vietnamese lady "Nong Kim"

[ukrules]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

Tears rolled down the victim's face as she tried to raise her hand in recognition. She appeared to be trying to say something. 

 

Indeed, perhaps she was wondering why she wasn't in a medically induced coma, you know - like how they look after burn victims in hospitals throughout the world....

 

[aussienam]

"There she had to put a 50,000 baht deposit down before they would accept her friend for treatment. "

 

This is a critical life threatening emergency. And this very very wealthy hospital is squabbling over 50,000 Baht.  So, you need to go doctor shopping from hospital to hospital if you are poor.  And if no money - the hospitals turn their backs to you and you DIE.

 

Developed nations in a democracy have a overriding duty of care to first and foremost save life.  Worry about the costs later.  

 

This poor Vietnamese lady could easily have died from delays. She also could already suffered irreversible damage and disfigurement to her from the delays in treatment. Burns don't stop once the fire is put out. Tissue damage continues for some time after.  One of the most urgent situations to start immediate treatment.  

Truly a horrific outcome.

[Ralf001]

28 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

 

In Australia most people visiting the country (most types of visas) have access/cover from the Australian social health care plan 'MEDICARE'. 

 

 

 

 

Medicare in Australia only covers people from countries that they have an RHCA with.

 

https://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/servicesandsupport/overseas-visitors-and-healthcare

https://www.smartraveller.gov.au/before-you-go/health/reciprocal-health

Edited August 12, 2022 by Ralf001

[Disillusioned farang]

Has anybody noticed what disgusting human beings they are at the bangkok Pattaya hospital, not only what the hell can legitimately  cost that much money in such a short space of time, they should be helping in a humane way at a cut price for such a tragedy! 
Just a heartless moneymaking machine , I hope they suffer the same as this poor girl in another life!

[Burma Bill]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

There she had to put a 50,000 baht deposit down before they would accept her friend for treatment. 

If this was the case (and I personally believe so) then an utter disgrace Bangkok Hospital. In the first instance you should be providing sympathy, care and treatment to victims of this very tragic disaster. Medical expenses can be finalized much later. I shall never recommend Bangkok Hospital to anyone, and the fees - rip offs!!! If you want to sue me for defamation, for reference I do not live in Thailand, so stuff your Thai Law.

Edited August 12, 2022 by Burma Bill
additional information

[Ralf001]

15 minutes ago, Disillusioned farang said:

Has anybody noticed what disgusting human beings they are at the bangkok Pattaya hospital, not only what the hell can legitimately  cost that much money in such a short space of time, they should be helping in a humane way at a cut price for such a tragedy! 
Just a heartless moneymaking machine , I hope they suffer the same as this poor girl in another life!

Yeah, utterly disgusting for a business to want to make money.

 

I assume the owners of Mountain B were also in the game to make money.

 

Now that I think about my employer also likes to make money.

 

Making money = disgusting..... what a world we live in !!

Edited August 12, 2022 by Ralf001

[The Fugitive]

To be fair, it's possible that the person in charge of admissions lacked judgement, authority and/or the courage to make a decision. They heard 'foreigner' and their instructions just kicked in. If the patient was a big fat falang with a heart attack they would have been correct. Even so, I believe there are regulations relating to providing initial life saving treatment (with a time limit) which must be provided. In this case it was obvious that prolonged treatment would be necessary.

[starky]

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

As we all know the local attitudes to medical cover is widely different per country.

 

In Australia most people visiting the country (most types of visas) have access/cover from the Australian social health care plan 'MEDICARE'. 

 

I was back in Australia for a couple of years. My Thai granddaughter (16, speaks very advanced English) was initially accepted to receive a 6 months scholarship to study in a normal Oz local high school and take part in their swimming coaching activity. 

 

I called MEDICARE, gave them the details and asked 'would she be covered fully under Oz  MEDICARE benefits, same as a local resident OZ citizen?

 

Quick answer 'Yes, fully covered, but make sure she is registered very quickly on arrival at a local Centrelink/Medicare office, or you can probably complete this by phone, just depends on whether they want to see her to prove her identity (prove she exists).

 

(Ultimately if was all canclled. Her Thai Matayom school wasn't happy and made noises about reducing her overall grades. Her father immediately withdrew her application for the Oz opportunity.)

Wrong! A grandaughter is completely different mate thats why you registered her. And unlike many countries Australia will offer emergency care i.e they wont let you die. Unfortunately for a foreign resident, and this is straight of the gov.au website

When in Australia and health care assistance is required, and a person is not covered by an appropriate level of private health insurance cover, as a non-resident and non-citizen of Australia, a person will be considered a private patient and will be required to pay any costs themselves at the time of treatment.Feb 7, 2565 BE

Edited August 12, 2022 by starky

[Mac Mickmanus]

10 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

Yeah, utterly disgusting for a business to want to make money.

 

I assume the owners of Mountain B were also in the game to make money.

 

Now that I think about my employer also likes to make money.

 

Making money = disgusting..... what a world we live in !!

The issue isnt about making money . 

There is a time and place for making money .

We kind of expect the medical profession to be more concerned about peoples welfare and saving lives, rather than making money .

   I do realise that hospitals aren't a charity and they also need to make money , but you would expect them to be more concerned about patients welfare than their bank balance 

[starky]

2 hours ago, Archie Baker said:

Rexiprocol agreements buddy.  That's what governments do you know, look after their citizens when overseas.  Any nationality in UK is given A&E free of any charges.  Thailand wants it all and more.  Bangkok hospital should be ashamed of their action.  There's making money and ripping you off. 

Yeah buddy what they will do is keep you alive buddy thats it. And she us from Vietnam buddy what recipropical agreements do they have with Thailand buddy? If the Vietnamese government want to look after her great people are blaming Thais and the Thai government. You understand what reciprocal means buddy?

Edited August 12, 2022 by starky

[Ralf001]

3 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

The issue isnt about making money . 

There is a time and place for making money .

We kind of expect the medical profession to be more concerned about peoples welfare and saving lives, rather than making money .

   I do realise that hospitals aren't a charity and they also need to make money , but you would expect them to be more concerned about patients welfare than their bank balance 

Private hospitals care about their bottom line...... End off.

 

[starky]

2 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

Private hospitals care about their bottom line...... End off.

 

Yep. Worldwide.

[starky]

1 hour ago, aussienam said:

"There she had to put a 50,000 baht deposit down before they would accept her friend for treatment. "

 

This is a critical life threatening emergency. And this very very wealthy hospital is squabbling over 50,000 Baht.  So, you need to go doctor shopping from hospital to hospital if you are poor.  And if no money - the hospitals turn their backs to you and you DIE.

 

Developed nations in a democracy have a overriding duty of care to first and foremost save life.  Worry about the costs later.  

 

This poor Vietnamese lady could easily have died from delays. She also could already suffered irreversible damage and disfigurement to her from the delays in treatment. Burns don't stop once the fire is put out. Tissue damage continues for some time after.  One of the most urgent situations to start immediate treatment.  

Truly a horrific outcome.

No she could have taken her chances in a non private hospital.  Or like every other foreigner who gets blasted on here when they set up a gofund me page she SHOULD have had private health insurance. 

Edited August 12, 2022 by starky

[Mac Mickmanus]

16 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

Private hospitals care about their bottom line...... End off.

 

I do realise that . 

I was laying on a private hospital bed with an internal infection and I was pleading with them to give me some anti biotics to take the pain away .

   They wouldn't give me any treatment or anti biotics until I paid them a few thousand Baht . 

   I had to painfully  make my way down from the 13 th floor and find an ATM and make a withdrawal , and then go back to the hospital and pay before I got anti-biotics . 

[The Fugitive]

2 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

I do realise that . 

I was laying on a private hospital bed with an internal infection and I was pleading with them to give me some anti biotics to take the pain away .

   They wouldn't give me any treatment or anti biotics until I paid them a few thousand Baht . 

   I had to painfully  make my way down from the 13 th floor and find an ATM and make a withdrawal , and then go back to the hospital and pay before I got anti-biotics . 

That's so bad! Would this have been before the days of wireless remote card readers? Or did they insist upon actual cash?

[malthebluff]

This story should go International to all news media in every country  only then will Thailand do anything, with Thailand getting a bad name it will give them a chance to save face maybe only short lived but this poor girl needs help now no matter how little 

[GinBoy2]

2 hours ago, BusyB said:

No insurance would accept liability for that - not one health and safety check or fire procedure in place.

 

And it's not only Thailand. In the UK there was Grenfell ... with dozens of high rises there still using the same cladding that caused that tragedy even now.

 

And in the US something similar happened in California a few years ago I think, where a warehouse or art gallery or something had been converted into a raver club - also a massive death toll.

 

Thailand has many faults but this kind of thing is not specifically Thai.

I remember the Oakland CA fire. It was in an old warehouse that had been converted as some artisan work space.

 

There was an illegal rave organized by two guys. 30 odd people died.

 

Difference between that and this case is that the two guys did some significant time in jail, and it cost the City of Oakland $30M in damages to the victims for failing to enforce building codes.

 

We wait to see if lot's of wai's equal $30M!

[Confuscious]

5 hours ago, smedly said:

tragic

 

there has been a lot of talk about building control and standards in Thailand after this negligent mess (it cannot be labelled an accident) - it is pure negligence both from the owner but more so the authorities who are ulitimately responsible for letting this business operate without proper safety assessment 

 

Also in developed countries businesses like this must have insurance but of course they will not get insurance unless the building has all the safety certificates that allow it to operate, IMO the local authorities and ultimately the Thai government share most of the blame - the owners bypassed the system because they could

 

IMO all businesses like this must have liability insurance and to get that they must pass all building control requirements and safety 

 

The lady in the OP should not be paying a penny, it is the responsibilty of Government and local authorities to ensure the safety of everyone and when they fail they should pay 

I remember the words of a puppet-general who staged a coup and HE WOULD ERIDICATE Thailand from corruption such as this and thers we can see every day.
But we see corruption getting at an incredible level after all this years.

Thailand is still the laughing stock of the world.
 

[Bangkok Barry]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

Apinya noted that her friend is a foreign national so does not have the same rights to care as Thais.

Says it all, doesn't it. She's not a human being, she's a foreigner.

[starky]

This forum is so predictable. They roll out a picture of a pretty girl all the white knights are up in arms blowing up at a hospital. NOT THE HOSPITALS FAULT. Not one mention of the multiple dead or any concern about how all the others with the horrible burns are doing.

  If the person in the bed was Barry from essex no one would give a rats and more than likely would be roasting him for not having the right insurance.

[Bangkok Barry]

2 hours ago, starky said:

If she was in the US the treatment would have been the same. Show proof of insurance or pay an upfront deposit.

Not a good comparison to quote. The USA is famous for having outrageous prices for medical care.

[Mac Mickmanus]

12 minutes ago, The Fugitive said:

That's so bad! Would this have been before the days of wireless remote card readers? Or did they insist upon actual cash?

There seemed to be a bit of a mix-up .

A civilian woman walked into the cubicle and asked me for 2000 Baht for the treatment .

  I was like "Who are you and what do you want money for "

I had no idea who she was .

  She again asked for 2000 Baht .

And I just said "I dont have any money " *

And she walked out and left me in agony in the cubicle .

"No money , no treatment "

(* What I meant was that I didn't have any money/cash on me and I'd pay with a card/cash after visiting an ATM when presented with the bill)

  She just thought that I couldn't pay the bill and all the treatment stopped and I was left in the cubicle for an hour .

[Bangkok Barry]

What is interesting about this case is that it is claimed that many - 10 -  government hospitals refused to treat her as they considered themselves incapable of doing so. Transferring her to another hospital by ambulance - you pay - wasn't even an option, it seems. which is what happened with me when I had a heart scare a few years ago. There was nowhere available where she could be treated, in an area where there are countless factories and other businesses that could be prone to massive accidents, explosions and such, at any moment. That's pretty frightening.

[Bangkok Barry]

2 hours ago, BusyB said:

Thailand has many faults but this kind of thing is not specifically Thai.

No-one has written that it is. Sadly, it isn't.

Edited August 12, 2022 by Bangkok Barry

[starky]

3 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

What is interesting about this case is that it is claimed that many - 10 -  government hospitals refused to treat her as they considered themselves incapable of doing so. Transferring her to another hospital by ambulance - you pay - wasn't even an option, it seems. which is what happened with me when I had a heart scare a few years ago. There was nowhere available where she could be treated, in an area where there are countless factories and other businesses that could be prone to massive accidents, explosions and such, at any moment. That's pretty frightening.

Uhm you realise your living in a developing nation? Are you not already aware of this?

[shackleton]

I would have thought most expats are aware of having medical insurance or the problems if you don't  in Thailand 

Tourists should have travel insurance cover  if on holiday 

No excuses if you caught out out having none 

Last resort there is always Gofundme 

Seems to work for some 

[Bangkok Barry]

51 minutes ago, starky said:

No she could have taken her chances in a non private hospital. 

Read the article again. It is claimed that 10 state hospitals refused her as they weren't able to treat her.

[Mac Mickmanus]

2 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

There seemed to be a bit of a mix-up .

A civilian woman walked into the cubicle and asked me for 2000 Baht for the treatment .

  I was like "Who are you and what do you want money for "

I had no idea who she was .

  She again asked for 2000 Baht .

And I just said "I dont have any money " *

And she walked out and left me in agony in the cubicle .

"No money , no treatment "

(* What I meant was that I didn't have any money/cash on me and I'd pay with a card/cash after visiting an ATM when presented with the bill)

  She just thought that I couldn't pay the bill and all the treatment stopped and I was left in the cubicle for an hour .

It was actually a groin infection (nothing to do with sex) , a small skin abrasion caused by walking and chaffing had become infected and I thought it was just a groin strain and so I waiting about a week for it to naturally get better .

   One of my <deleted> had swelled up to twice the normal size and the doctor had said that if the infection spreads , they will have to amputate the infected bits if the anti biotics didn't clear up the infection and I needed to take extremely strong anti biotics as soon as possible and hope it all clears up

   That is when the civilian walked in and asked for money .

I was lying there with a potentially life threatening infection or one that needed an amputation unless I had anti biotics immediately  and their only concern seemed to be a few thousand baht 

[Ralf001]

42 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

I do realise that . 

I was laying on a private hospital bed with an internal infection and I was pleading with them to give me some anti biotics to take the pain away .

   They wouldn't give me any treatment or anti biotics until I paid them a few thousand Baht . 

   I had to painfully  make my way down from the 13 th floor and find an ATM and make a withdrawal , and then go back to the hospital and pay before I got anti-biotics . 

Had a stroke, wife drove me to a private hospital. spent 5 hours laying on a bed with zero medical attention until my health insurance guaranteed payment... then spent 6 days in ICU and a further 2 weeks in a private room.... at a cost of 2 million baht to my insurance company.

 

Had I gone to the government hospital I am registered at (I have social security card) the cost would have been significantly less but would have had to come from my pocket and assume the care to reflect cost.

[Bangkok Barry]

1 hour ago, Ralf001 said:

Yeah, utterly disgusting for a business to want to make money.

 

I assume the owners of Mountain B were also in the game to make money.

 

Now that I think about my employer also likes to make money.

 

Making money = disgusting..... what a world we live in !!

The number one purpose of a hospital is to treat people who need medical help. That really shouldn't be too difficult to understand. Your employer is in a different business, I assume, so your point is irrelevant. And MountainB made their money by not giving a rat's fart about the people they made it from and broke the law. Neither case has any relevance to a hospital not wanting to carry out their prime duty.