Major Thai agencies predicting repeat of Bangkok's "2011 Great Flood" - city will disappear altogether by 2100 unless govt acts

[zzaa09]

Stop cementing over a broad natural flood plain.

Replace the hundreds of khlongs that have been filled during the "developed" era.

[Aussiepeter]

3 hours ago, proton said:

At least it will solve the soi dog problem ????

As I recall, the last time this happened in Bangkok, it created a "soi croc problem" and  from experience, I'd prefer a nasty soi dog to a hungry crocodile anytime (the crocodile farms were flooded and dozens of the 'inmates' escaped). Then again, crocs eat dogs, so .....

[ozimoron]

11 minutes ago, zzaa09 said:

Stop cementing over a broad natural flood plain.

Replace the hundreds of khlongs that have been filled during the "developed" era.

Ultimately it won't help much. Like Jakarta, the main culprit has been pumping ground water causing the city to actually sink.

[khaowong1]

6 hours ago, blazes said:

This little sentence stands all by itself in the middle of the story. Why? 

What poppycock.    When are the climate alarmists going to accept that climate has been "changing" for 4 billion years. 

It was once possible (10,000 years ago) to walk from the east coast of England to what is now Denmark....It was called Doggerland.

Exactly.  

[ozimoron]

4 minutes ago, khaowong1 said:

Exactly.  

Agreed. Here's a chart for just the past 150 years and some info.

 

http://www.climate.gov/media/12885

 

https://www.climate.gov/news-features/understanding-climate/climate-change-global-temperature

Edited August 31, 2022 by ozimoron

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

You have to consider numerous factors. Anthropogenic GGs, including CO₂ are a relatively new addition to the earth's atmosphere but the climate would be changing anyway without them, as it always has.

When you can define for me the laws of thermodynamics, and also the role of albedo and clathrates in the climate change dynamic, I might give your views some thought. I suspect, like many others, you just don't want to know.

It's not relevant to me, I'll be long dead before the worst effects arrive. Having said that, facts and evidence are casualties brought about by people who prefer to stick their heads in the sand, with the mantra it's just a natural cycle. It's not.

Edited August 31, 2022 by Lacessit

[realfunster]

2 hours ago, Surasak said:

Am I correct in my thinking, there were severe floods in Bangkok, maybe 1992?

Something like that, maybe more around mid-90s. When I bought my house in late 2000's the owner regaled me with tales of the epic flood (I think he mentioned '95) being around 1m deep in my soi in relatively central Bangkok.

[CLUBBER]

10 hours ago, Geoffggi said:

Very good statement .......????????

True statement and You can exchange Bangkok with any other city around the world and it would still be just as true !

[kickstart]

9 hours ago, Dmaxdan said:

So it will soon become Venice of the orient. The tuk tuk drivers will have to trade in their machines for gondolas.

Many years ago it was known as Venice of the Orient with the amount of canals round the city,then they filled them all in ,one reason for the floods of 2011 water had nowhere to go ,before the canals would have taken the water away.

I do not know when the op wrote this article ,but the Passak dam is not full ,it is very local to me ,they have opened all the gates on the dam and water is now flowing out ,wife's sister was fishing they on Sunday and said the water level had dropped ,the op wants to check his facts before writing.

The normal thing, bad news sells copy.

It was 3 years ago that they opened the dam gates in August after a lot of rain ,afraid of a lot of rain in September/October,filling the dam, and they will have to let water go so  flooding land down stream,then the rains stopped early ,come January/February not enough water in the dam for locale needs ,mainly irrigation,in April dam was  only 15% full,wife not happy ,nowhere to go fishing

Most locals around here say the rains come early this year they will finish early ,I think they are right going on past years leaving the dam short when water is needed again.

[realfunster]

13 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Having said that, facts and evidence are casualties brought about by people who prefer to stick their heads in the sand, with the mantra it's just a natural cycle. It's not.

Overall, I do believe the increase in human population and activity being a contributory factor to climate change but we have seen extreme climate variations multiple times in known history. Most recent being a significant ice-age which lasted for 2.5 million years and only ended 10,000 years ago, bang on time for Homo Sapiens to thrive. Such a climatic event is as equally destructive and life-threatening as the apparent modern climate warming but what caused the ice age to happen with relatively minimal inputs from the natural world and certainly no obvious negative inputs from any dominant/pervasive species ?

 

I repeat for emphasis, 2.5 million years of ice age.....just let that sink in....kind of makes the current trends feel insignificant right ?

 

The earth is a highly complex eco-system well beyond our current intellectual comprehension and therefore ability to understand and control. History shows that the human condition is to try to "understand" events via some structured system be this originally religion, early philosophy or in modern times, a more science/evidence based approach. Once this understanding is obtained via consensus, we then, rationally, try to exert some control and influence over it. However, we should not be shy to admit when we are beyond our level of understanding.  

[PETERTHEEATER]

3 hours ago, Swampy999 said:

Looks like those new submarines will come in handy after all although it will take a lot of new recruits to row them.

Work permits for Burmese galley slaves? No problem.

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, realfunster said:

Overall, I do believe the increase in human population and activity being a contributory factor to climate change but we have seen extreme climate variations multiple times in known history. Most recent being a significant ice-age which lasted for 2.5 million years and only ended 10,000 years ago, bang on time for Homo Sapiens to thrive. Such a climatic event is as equally destructive and life-threatening as the apparent modern climate warming but what caused the ice age to happen with relatively minimal inputs from the natural world and certainly no obvious negative inputs from any dominant/pervasive species ?

 

I repeat for emphasis, 2.5 million years of ice age.....just let that sink in....kind of makes the current trends feel insignificant right ?

 

The earth is a highly complex eco-system well beyond our current intellectual comprehension and therefore ability to understand and control. History shows that the human condition is to try to "understand" events via some structured system be this originally religion, early philosophy or in modern times, a more science/evidence based approach. Once this understanding is obtained via consensus, we then, rationally, try to exert some control and influence over it. However, we should not be shy to admit when we are beyond our level of understanding.  

The consensus among 95% of the world's scientists is the current climate change is caused by human activity. The 5% who don't agree are linked to the fossil fuel industry in one way or another.

 

Naturally, the fossil fuel industry is fighting a rearguard action to ensure their capital investment and profits are preserved. Think of what would happen to the Saudis if people stopped buying oil, they'd have to go back to bonking camels.

 

It is doubtful mankind can control what is happening, all we can do is mitigate the worst effects. It's not helped by politicians and uneducated laypeople who don't want to know.

 

Tell me, what do you think the odds are of effective government action to prevent Bangkok being underwater after 50 years, when they have already told the Dutch to go away?

 

Or consider this. There are EV's on every major carmaker's product line, they also have behemoth SUV's and pickups with gas-guzzling ICE's. Who do you think are the biggest sellers?

[Fairynuff]

7 hours ago, AnotherFarang8 said:

It didn’t go well for Sri Lanka where fertiliser production was cut after their government listened to climate change cultists, now food is scarce. It is not going well for energy prices after many countries stopped investments in fossil fuel production. Hopefully Thailand doesn’t give too much floor to these pseudo scientists to avoid getting srilanka’d.

Spoken like a true denier. I mean actually the water just falls off the flat end of Earth doesn’t it?

[johnmcc6]

more climate change scare mongering. According to A O C the planet will be snuffed out , not just Bangkok.

[charmonman]

9 hours ago, blazes said:

This little sentence stands all by itself in the middle of the story. Why? 

What poppycock.    When are the climate alarmists going to accept that climate has been "changing" for 4 billion years. 

It was once possible (10,000 years ago) to walk from the east coast of England to what is now Denmark....It was called Doggerland.

The “alarmists” as you call them are more concerned about the coming decades than 10000 or 4 billion years ago. What is your point?

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

When you can define for me the laws of thermodynamics, and also the role of albedo and clathrates in the climate change dynamic, I might give your views some thought. I suspect, like many others, you just don't want to know.

It's not relevant to me, I'll be long dead before the worst effects arrive. Having said that, facts and evidence are casualties brought about by people who prefer to stick their heads in the sand, with the mantra it's just a natural cycle. It's not.

Your condescending reply instantly makes me say: "Your right. I don't want or need to know anything from you".   

[Andycoops]

Looks like we'll be receiving the wife's relative's and their vehicles as refugees again then here in Isaan.

Their houses in Nonthaburi were under a metre of water last time.

[thaibeachlovers]

16 hours ago, huangnon said:

They won't be able to blame this one on Thaksin, or his sister then..

 

Bangkok has been known as the "Venice of the East" for how long now.?

Bkk was apparently full of canals till they filled them in for cars to use, so perhaps they could dig up the roads and return it to what it was.

 

Seriously, they've had 10 years to prepare, and what have they done?

If it all turns to <deleted> they only have themselves to blame.

[thaibeachlovers]

11 hours ago, George Aylesham said:

Indonesia has already decided to move its capital from Jakarta for this very reason. Saigon (HCMC), Manila and further afield, Shanghai, Tokyo, Taipei and Dhaka face similar fates in a foreseeable future. See the UN report 'Sinking Cities, Rising Seas' for more details.

I pretty much disregard anything that comes out of the UN. They haven't done much recently to give me confidence in them.

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, arithai12 said:

When "cities" were built, they didn't have paved roads and
trains and electricity and skyscrapers and they didn't need to commute

to work and didn't have global commerce.

A flood did not do as much damage as it does today.

and the population was a fraction of what it is now, which is IMO the biggest driver of building human habitations where they should not be built.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, Surasak said:

Am I correct in my thinking, there were severe floods in Bangkok, maybe 1992?

In the wet season the city flooded regularly back then as reported by Trink in his newspaper column.

[hotchilli]

17 hours ago, webfact said:

The water came not from overhead but gurgling up from the drains. Within hours and days it rose and rose until kayaks and boats were the only way to get around Don Muang, for example

So what will building flood walls achieve?

As well as keeping water out from the rivers it keeps water in on the inside of the city.

Bangkoks real issues are underground drainage and water table levels.

Until those are properly addressed there will be no change.

[hotchilli]

17 hours ago, webfact said:

He said that the government has failed to issue proper guidelines and is being slow to act. 

The governments [plural] have failed to solve the problem...

The public deserve solutions not guidelines.

Redirect the military budget, we don't need submarines of F-35's..

use that money for real infrastructures instead.

nuff said.

Edited August 31, 2022 by hotchilli

[thaibeachlovers]

15 minutes ago, hotchilli said:

So what will building flood walls achieve?

As well as keeping water out from the rivers it keeps water in on the inside of the city.

Bangkoks real issues are underground drainage and water table levels.

Until those are properly addressed there will be no change.

?????????????

They have big pumps already to remove water from the city into the river, which is why flooding ceased to be the problem it was in the 90s.

Just add more.

[brianlg]

12 hours ago, orchidfan said:

I remember the Great flood of 2011 NOT fondly. 

Downstairs of the house and garden under metres of filthy smelling water for months. 

Moved what we could upstairs but still a lot of damage to built in furniture, garden 90% dead.

Only transport in or out of the property by boat (until we finally abandoned and went to our condo).

I think we got B20,000 compensation for hundreds of thousands of baht in damages.

 

As I recall it was brought on by 3 consecutive tropical storms (which had been typhoons before making land fall) then the decision to open the flood gates upstream and let us in Pathum Thani cop it. 

 

Hopefully not again !

I believe it may have been 6 Typhoons over the China Sea in some 3-4 weeks in that year !

ALL the five main northern TH rivers [which merge at NAKHON SAWAN] were in full flood. I was there when the then earthen levee walls collapsed under the sheer weight of water AND Nakhon Sawan CBD was inundated with floodwaters more than chest deep [in central NS ... much deeper elsewhere]. I was assisting in the flood rescue near Big C up to my chest in floodwater ...

The new ALL CONCRETE levee walls built since that disaster should help prevent this from ever happening again in NS ... BUT who knows for sure ???

I believe the floodwaters covered some 70000 sq km AND sat there for 3 months !!! [Water as far as the eye could see] ...

[chrissables]

This article states in 2011 the worst flooding for 50 years, so 60 years ago flooding was worse.

[jacko45k]

19 hours ago, DaLa said:

Starting to move my furniture upstairs this afternoon.

Hurry up, you only have until 9pm. 

[ThailandRyan]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Bkk was apparently full of canals till they filled them in for cars to use, so perhaps they could dig up the roads and return it to what it was.

 

Seriously, they've had 10 years to prepare, and what have they done?

If it all turns to <deleted> they only have themselves to blame.

Didn't Prayut and his ilk say they would ensure Bangkok did not flood again? or was I blind back in 2016 when we had this OP

https://aseannow.com/topic/926649-pm-prayut-vows-to-overhaul-bangkoks-drainage-system/

[webfact]

Flooding in Thailand was three times worse in 2011 compared to this year, space agency data

 

Daily News Thai Caption:Three times the difference

 

Full story: https://aseannow.com/topic/1270610-flooding-in-thailand-was-three-times-worse-in-2011-compared-to-this-year-space-agency-data/

[ThailandRyan]

This morning TNN 16 just had a puff piece on the flooding in BKK and showed the new Governor inspecting locations.  One concern he had was on the elevated freeways, and another in the tunnels which become flooded out.  He also wanted to know why certain sections of the elevated highways had huge dips in them which fill up with water.  Well I have an answer for that, engineering failures.....nothing is straight in this country and roads have telephone poles, and power poles right at the edges.........

Edited September 1, 2022 by ThailandRyan