Foreigner Kills Two Teenage Girls In Songkhla Crash

[EricTh]

1 hour ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

On the topic of who was at fault for the accident , the wearing of crash helmets is irrelevant 

At least wearing crash helmets would have saved their lives.

 

A hard knock of the head on the road is deadly.

 

 

[EricTh]

7 hours ago, grain said:

Just watched that vid that was on Thai TV, pretty conclusive I'd say, the SUV pulled out in front of oncoming traffic. Clearly in the wrong in any country. Sorry for the Aussie as he's in deep deep sh*t and it's going to take a serious pile of dosh to buy back his liberty. RIP to the girls on the mc. 

I doubt any amount of money can save the situation because two young lives were lost due to his carelessness.

 

Most probably he will be banned from coming to Thailand for xx years.

 

 

[Eloquent pilgrim]

9 minutes ago, EricTh said:

The girls had the right of way as they were going straight on the main road.

 

It's obvious that the foreigner was wrong, turning right without seeing incoming cars is wrong. I hope that Thai immigration ban this guy from coming to Thailand.

 

 

Well I would hope he receives something rather more appropriate than a simple ban from traveling to Thailand 

[Deli]

Cannot call it a strike.

[Rayfromwangchompoo]

1 hour ago, EricTh said:

At least wearing crash helmets would have saved their lives.

 

A hard knock of the head on the road is deadly.

 

 

I was in THAILAND in the

In the U.S Army 1964-1965  and again from 1968-1970. In the 64-65 tour we drove our Army

Vehicle.

During that time, there was a terrible farang/Thai accident where several were killed.

The following week the Thailand and American government worked out a plan to have the Thai citizens drive all of us.

During the ensuing months, both governments worked out a "status of forces" agreement.

[Lopchan]

So many sad, sad low life's here blaming the deceased (Thai), implying they were at fault. Yet if the deceased were an expat, you same people would be blaming the (Thai driver) without evidence. What a sad pathetic bunch of racists / elitists you are

 

[Mac Mickmanus]

12 minutes ago, Lopchan said:

So many sad, sad low life's here blaming the deceased (Thai), implying they were at fault. Yet if the deceased were an expat, you same people would be blaming the (Thai driver) without evidence. What a sad pathetic bunch of racists / elitists you are

 

I havent noticed anyone blaming the girls .

Which posts are you referring too ?

[d4dang]

15 hours ago, redwood1 said:

It does not really matter who was at fault.....But I do know this guy will be in jail for a very long time unless he pays out some big big big money.....

and a lot less than Hi Sco drivers.

[richard_smith237]

6 hours ago, Thunglom said:

Almost everything you assume about road safety is wrong.

As said it is the arrogance (and ignorance) of foreign drivers that contributes so much to the dangers on our roads.

The arrogance and ignorance indeed....  the arrogance of the comments alone....

 

And, no... foreign (Western trained) drivers do not contribute 'so much' to the dangers on the roads here... not as you seem to be implying; that foreigners driving in Thailand present some disproportionately elevated risk compared to Thai’s driving in Thailand. 

 

I can’t prove this which is where your accusation of arrogance and ignorance will come into this, but neither can you prove otherwise.

 

If stats were available and we took 100,000 foreign (Western trained) drivers and 100,000 Thai drivers who covered a similar mileage I believe there would a higher accident rate amongst the Thai drivers...   you will want to call that arrogance and ignorance, I would call it 25 years experience of driving here with an awful lot of Thai friends....   it always astonishes me the frequency of accidents people have here...  It really astonishes me how many of them are drunk-driving related. 

 

Anecdotally, I just see a lot more silly and reckless driving and riding  on the roads here than I do in the UK (I drive for about 6 weeks a year in the UK - not a lot, but its certainly enough to spot the difference). 

 

You won’t like that, you will want to throw accusations of racism, you will want to debate the specifics of road safety, road layout etc..  but without sufficient education of its drivers and effective enforcement of the road laws here there proportionately more accidents here involving Thai drivers than foreign (western).

 

------

 

That said: I do also believe there is an element of ’they’re wrong, this is the right way to drive’ employed by some foreign (western trained) drivers which can lead to accidents... but to suggest that contributes to the dangers on the roads here is a major projection.

 

Most foreign drivers here simply adapt and drive as ‘most’ Thai’s do... and most Thai’s drive well. 

It is a minority who are reckless and cause mayhem and that small minority are in greater numbers here in Thailand than in the West because more can get away with it. 

 

-------

 

This of course is all somewhat off topic: The video shows the white SUV pulling out from the beach-car park opposite the shooting range. The SUV driver clearly not seeing the girls approaching on the motorcycle with tragic consequences. 

 

I wonder if helmets would have made any difference, I suspect not given the apparent speed of the impact, the girls riding along a long straight of road, maybe going 60kmh etc and hitting stationary object.

 

The SUV driver clearly at at fault, no doubt about that whatsoever. 

No mitigating circumstances - just a terrible mistake, an absence of concentration. 

No criminal behaviour either, not drunk etc, no speeding etc...  a terrible terrible accident. 

 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

33 minutes ago, Lopchan said:

So many sad, sad low life's here blaming the deceased (Thai), implying they were at fault. Yet if the deceased were an expat, you same people would be blaming the (Thai driver) without evidence. What a sad pathetic bunch of racists / elitists you are

 

Careful.... it gets slippery up on that virtue signaling soap box !!!

[tgw]

15 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

Hopefully if its his fault he'll do 20 years plus stay behind bars until he pays millions to the parents.

 

Certainly his life is over big time.

what you describe wouldn't be justice for an accident.

[richard_smith237]

8 hours ago, Lemsta69 said:

just watched the vid. looks like he did the typical Aussie driver manoeuvre and gunned it out of the driveway instead of inching out slowly like most Thais do. I suspected this as soon as I read that the driver was an Aussie. is why I don't trust farang in vehicle over here.

IF you’re on a motorcycle and see a car about to pull out, its any driver you shouldn’t trust !!...

 

As soon as you read the headline you suspect the driver was an Aussie, thats just laughable.. 

 

But, to ‘not trust any farang driver’ highlights a certain misguided ‘gone native’ prejudice which is utterly ridiculous....  the nation is full of poor drivers and many many more considerate and careful drivers...  unfortunately the poorer drivers exist in greater numbers than should be acceptable. 

 

 

----------

 

I recall working for an International company here:

I’d been in Thailand fr 15 years, driving for that time.

Once the country manager found out I was driving here he wanted to insist that foreigners do not drive here... But, I'd had a Thai Driving Licence for years, I’d been driving my Adult life in Thailand. 

 

They were insistent that I use a ’Thai Driver’ - I argued how could someone who is uneducated, with less driver training and with half of my in country driving experience possibly be a safer option...   

 

I get it for people who been brought in from overseas and in other countries considered ‘high risk’ we cannot drive and I don’t want to... but in Thailand, I much prefer to drive myself or my Wife drive... why? because I know our standards. 

 

 

 

 

 

[dj230]

the driver looked fairly old, so what happens now? does he go to jail/prison? would be a death sentence 

[NanLaew]

12 hours ago, CygnusX1 said:

Not saying this was the cause of this accident, but all car drivers have to be aware that the thick A pillars in modern cars create a blind spot. While riding my bicycle I was once hit by a car turning across my path, and on another occasion almost hit. Both drivers apologised profusely, saying that I was in their blind spot. Case of passive safety (strong A pillar protecting occupants in a rollover) compromising active safety (being able to see everything in front of you). 

 

As both a cyclist and car driver, I appreciate both sides.

Not saying this contributed to the accident either but when I bought a pickup about 12 years ago, the dealership fitted those standard, dark-tinted plastic wind/rain deflectors around the door frames. I found the driver-side deflector easily doubled the A pillar blind spot by  completely blocking the gap between it and the wing mirror. The effect on the passenger side A pillar blind spot was even worse. I removed all of them after that and have always refused to have them when offered as a freebie by a dealership.

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

I havent noticed anyone blaming the girls .

Which posts are you referring too ?

Maybe not overtly blaming the victims here but the first page and a half are thick with general opinions on motorbike accidents, speeding, lack of helmets, three-on-a-bike, irresponsible parents with hardly a word spoken about the behavior of the SUV driver.

[Butterflyman]

18 hours ago, ChrisY1 said:

Never hit a motorcycle.....you'll always be at fault!

Unless a Thai car driver hit a faring on a motorbike 

[geisha]

Looks obvious to me. The car driver was looking left to pull out and didn’t see the bike coming from right. Looks like the bike was going quite fast . Awful. 

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, Butterflyman said:

19 hours ago, ChrisY1 said:

Never hit a motorcycle.....you'll always be at fault!

Unless a Thai car driver hit a faring on a motorbike 

The guy who told you the ‘farang is always at fault’ probably wasn’t really ex-special forces...  

... its probably best to get out of the bars and get some real life experience here ! 

[hioctane]

If it is a straight road, how can you not see a motobike coming? Even if a mototbike was speeding, it would be in your field of vision. Besides, who in their right mind would make a U turn on a road with fast traffic? Something doesn’t add up.

[Lemsta69]

9 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

IF you’re on a motorcycle and see a car about to pull out, its any driver you shouldn’t trust !!...

 

As soon as you read the headline you suspect the driver was an Aussie, thats just laughable.. 

 

But, to ‘not trust any farang driver’ highlights a certain misguided ‘gone native’ prejudice which is utterly ridiculous....  the nation is full of poor drivers and many many more considerate and careful drivers...  unfortunately the poorer drivers exist in greater numbers than should be acceptable. 

 

 

----------

 

I recall working for an International company here:

I’d been in Thailand fr 15 years, driving for that time.

Once the country manager found out I was driving here he wanted to insist that foreigners do not drive here... But, I'd had a Thai Driving Licence for years, I’d been driving my Adult life in Thailand. 

 

They were insistent that I use a ’Thai Driver’ - I argued how could someone who is uneducated, with less driver training and with half of my in country driving experience possibly be a safer option...   

 

I get it for people who been brought in from overseas and in other countries considered ‘high risk’ we cannot drive and I don’t want to... but in Thailand, I much prefer to drive myself or my Wife drive... why? because I know our standards. 

 

 

 

 

 

nope, your read it wrong. as soon as I read that the driver was Aussie I said I reckon he's gunned it when he saw the gap. and lo and behold, what do I see when I watch the vid? 

 

my distrust of foreign drivers comes from personal experience not because I've gone troppo.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

22 minutes ago, Lemsta69 said:

my distrust of foreign drivers comes from personal experience not because I've gone troppo.

Are you a foreign driver yourself here ?

[brewsterbudgen]

10 hours ago, dj230 said:

the driver looked fairly old, so what happens now? does he go to jail/prison? would be a death sentence 

Why? It was a horrible accident.

[richard_smith237]

3 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

13 hours ago, dj230 said:

the driver looked fairly old, so what happens now? does he go to jail/prison? would be a death sentence 

Why? It was a horrible accident.

Even as a horrible accident severe punishment is not an impossibility. 

 

Even in the UK there is a possible jail term for those driving without due care and attention casing death for which there is a maximum penalty of 5 years. 

 

After watching the video we can all see how this was a horrible accident through a moment of inattention which led to tragic consequences....      But, there are laws which are in place to ensure people ‘double check - triple check’ etc and ensure they don’t allow complacency to creep into their habits. 

 

This accident is a lesson and reminder to us all to take extra extra care out there. 

[richard_smith237]

4 hours ago, Lemsta69 said:

nope, your read it wrong. as soon as I read that the driver was Aussie I said I reckon he's gunned it when he saw the gap. and lo and behold, what do I see when I watch the vid? 

 

my distrust of foreign drivers comes from personal experience not because I've gone troppo.

So you distrust foreign drivers in a country with 25,000 road fatalities per year because you think all Aussies drive the same and ‘gun it’ for a gap ????....

 

On this basis should I believe that all foreigners jump to ridiculous conclusions ?

 

 

[richard_smith237]

4 hours ago, hioctane said:

If it is a straight road, how can you not see a motobike coming? Even if a mototbike was speeding, it would be in your field of vision. Besides, who in their right mind would make a U turn on a road with fast traffic? Something doesn’t add up.

He wasn’t making a U-Turn... he was pulling out of a car park turning right. 

(Or he went into the car-park itself so that he could make the U-Turn, which ironically should have been more safe than doing a U-Turn in the road itself). 

 

Given the lay out of the car-park it would appear that the angle of SUV was pointing more left than straight, perhaps it was more difficult for the foreigner to check over his shoulder to see if vehicles were approaching, or his B-Pillar partially blocked his view when he looked back and he just didn’t check properly. 

 

 

 

 

[Lemsta69]

4 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Are you a foreign driver yourself here ?

nope.

[Lemsta69]

21 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

So you distrust foreign drivers in a country with 25,000 road fatalities per year because you think all Aussies drive the same and ‘gun it’ for a gap ????....

 

On this basis should I believe that all foreigners jump to ridiculous conclusions ?

 

 

you can believe what you want to believe mate. but like I said, based on my observations of foreign drivers here you're all guilty until proven innocent. especially older dudes in big ol' trucks. 

 

you can write another 10,000 word essay if you what but it'll just go straight to tl;dr

[fredwiggy]

and auto drivers do the same, hanging on the center line, driving under the speed limit, while others are trying to pass, which is a lack of consideration, or, not being a safe driver and checking mirrors while you drive?

5 hours ago, Lemsta69 said:

nope, your read it wrong. as soon as I read that the driver was Aussie I said I reckon he's gunned it when he saw the gap. and lo and behold, what do I see when I watch the vid? 

 

my distrust of foreign drivers comes from personal experience not because I've gone troppo.

What would be the main reason you don't trust foreign (every other country?) drivers? If you are Thai, surely, if you just watch the daily news, where you see mainly, snakes in houses, gold theft, Covid updates, monks going haywire, and, the daily road carnage, where ,mostly Thais, are getting killed at the rate of 65 a day, not including those that go to the hospital and die, that the roads here are very unsafe. In fact, Thailand is always in the top 5 of daily fatal accidents worldwide. Every driver on earth makes these kinds of mistakes sometimes, from either inexperience or frustration, rushing to go somewhere. How many foreign drivers have hit or almost hit you, especially seeing that scooter drivers here cut off and weave around traffic, and play with fire? And auto drivers do the same, hanging on the center line, driving under the speed limit, while others are trying to pass, which is a lack of consideration, or, not being a safe driver and checking mirrors while you drive?

[Eloquent pilgrim]

8 minutes ago, Lemsta69 said:

nope.

So are you are an Aussie, but not here at the present time; just trying to understand your comment .... thanks 

[richard_smith237]

3 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

What would be the main reason you don't trust foreign (every other country?) drivers?

Lack of critical thought. 

 

3 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

If you are Thai, surely, if you just watch the daily news, where you see mainly, snakes in houses, gold theft, Covid updates, monks going haywire, and, the daily road carnage, where ,mostly Thais, are getting killed at the rate of 65 a day, not including those that go to the hospital and die, that the roads here are very unsafe.

Doesn't matter... he wants to blame the foreigner.. any accident involving a foreigner will add to his conformation bias while ignoring all else. 

 

3 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

In fact, Thailand is always in the top 5 of daily fatal accidents worldwide. Every driver on earth makes these kinds of mistakes sometimes, from either inexperience or frustration, rushing to go somewhere.

Nope... only Aussie drivers... or is it only foreigners, he doesn’t trust any of us. 

 

3 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

How many foreign drivers have hit or almost hit you, especially seeing that scooter drivers here cut off and weave around traffic, and play with fire?

All of us.... Whenever there is any incident, near-miss or something silly occurs its totally ignored, unless of-course its a foreigner...  then that gets added to the conformation bias because foreign drivers cannot be trusted.