OTHERED: How racism, xenophobia and religious discrimination were woven into the fabric of the UK

[Mac Mickmanus]

8 minutes ago, kwilco said:

more sealioning!

Stop making false allegations .

I asked a person a question and he will not answer 

He cannot answer because its well known that Irish builders did like a drink 

[Mac Mickmanus]

22 minutes ago, kwilco said:

I guess they all looked the same to you?

  

 

 

That is true .

If I see a Black person, I cannot tell as to whether they come from the Caribbean of Africa , they do look the same to me 

[Mac Mickmanus]

22 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

I have.

 

You did not specify that Irish builders like a drink, though

that in itself is also a stereotype.

 

You said ''the Irish do like a drink''

 

As to what that can be called...I'll let you answer that.

 

 

 

Well, do you have an opinion on the question, simply replying and telling me to answer myself , well it is answering the post, but it isn't answering the question 

[proton]

On 10/14/2022 at 11:04 AM, Bluespunk said:

Nonetheless racism is a cancer that afflicts the country...

No it does not

[kwilco]

1 hour ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

people of African descent

See 29 - microaggressions

[kwilco]

7 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Stop making false allegations .

I asked a person a question and he will not answer 

He cannot answer because its well known that Irish builders did like a drink 

Sorry it IS sealioning the answer is tangential to the topic -  "its well known that Irish builders did like a drink " - you don't seem to recognise your own sweeping generalisations as pure prejudice and assumption...

but....

I think you should rethink your assumptions…. (L Greenslade 1, M Pearson, M Madden - 1995)

 

[There are] “long-standing stereotypes [that] portray Irish people as prone to use alcohol to excess.

The article traces the historical origins of those stereotypes, and examines evidence drawn from a range of sources in Ireland and Britain about alcohol consumption, attributed hospital admissions and mortality.”

 

It finds that rates of abstinence from alcohol are higher in Ireland than in Britain, and amongst migrants, the Irish are no more likely to consume alcohol than the indigenous population.

Data from the General Household Survey indicated that people of Irish birth or parentage are no more likely than the British born to use alcohol at all.

[proton]

14 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

If the UK is racist, it's certainly less so than any other country I've lived in.

So racist thousands flock to get in illegally and legally to be discriminated against with all the benefits living in the UK gives them ????

[Mac Mickmanus]

Just now, kwilco said:

See 29 - microaggressions

Are you saying that its derogatory to say people are of African descent ?

   That shows your racism by suggesting there is something wrong with being of African descent  .

  I am accusing you of being a racist for suggesting there's something wrong with being of African descent 

[Mac Mickmanus]

6 minutes ago, kwilco said:

Sorry it IS sealioning the answer is tangential to the topic -  "its well known that Irish builders did like a drink " - you don't seem to recognise your own sweeping generalisations as pure prejudice and assumption...

but....

I think you should rethink your assumptions…. (L Greenslade 1, M Pearson, M Madden - 1995)

 

[There are] “long-standing stereotypes [that] portray Irish people as prone to use alcohol to excess.

The article traces the historical origins of those stereotypes, and examines evidence drawn from a range of sources in Ireland and Britain about alcohol consumption, attributed hospital admissions and mortality.”

 

It finds that rates of abstinence from alcohol are higher in Ireland than in Britain, and amongst migrants, the Irish are no more likely to consume alcohol than the indigenous population.

Data from the General Household Survey indicated that people of Irish birth or parentage are no more likely than the British born to use alcohol at all.

Moving the goals posts somewhat .

I was speaking about Irish builders who came to work in the U.K in the 1950s , I also gave a reason as to why they wouldn't be suitable tenants was because building work is considered to be seasonal work and the work is irregular and so the tenants may only stay until their building has been built and they would move on somewhere else , and landlords would want long term tenants , 

[kwilco]

18 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Stop making false allegations .

I asked a person a question and he will not answer 

He cannot answer because its well known that Irish builders did like a drink 

your fallacy this time is  "Appeal to tradition" – an argument supported by the fact the it has long held to be true - and is in reality not true.

[kwilco]

3 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

13 minutes ago, kwilco said:

Sorry it IS sealioning the answer is tangential to the topic -  "its well known that Irish builders did like a drink " - you don't seem to recognise your own sweeping generalisations as pure prejudice and assumption...

but....

I think you should rethink your assumptions…. (L Greenslade 1, M Pearson, M Madden - 1995)

 

[There are] “long-standing stereotypes [that] portray Irish people as prone to use alcohol to excess.

The article traces the historical origins of those stereotypes, and examines evidence drawn from a range of sources in Ireland and Britain about alcohol consumption, attributed hospital admissions and mortality.”

 

It finds that rates of abstinence from alcohol are higher in Ireland than in Britain, and amongst migrants, the Irish are no more likely to consume alcohol than the indigenous population.

Data from the General Household Survey indicated that people of Irish birth or parentage are no more likely than the British born to use alcohol at all.

Expand  

Moving the goals posts somewhat

That is also a form of sealioning - they are referring to Irish immigration post war - you are moving the goalposts by adding extra qualifications after your argument has been shown to be flawed.

[Mac Mickmanus]

2 minutes ago, kwilco said:

That is also a form of sealioning - they are referring to Irish immigration post war - you are moving the goalposts by adding extra qualifications after your argument has been shown to be flawed.

Many of the Irish came to the UK to work in the construction industry in the 1950s

[Bluespunk]

40 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Well, do you have an opinion on the question, simply replying and telling me to answer myself , well it is answering the post, but it isn't answering the question 

No intention whatsoever of answering your deflection question, just happy pointing out the hypocrisy and irony of your posts where you accuse others of doing what you yourself do...

[Bluespunk]

21 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Many of the Irish came to the UK to work in the construction industry in the 1950s

My parents didn't...

[Mac Mickmanus]

Just now, Bluespunk said:

My parents didn't...

What jobs did your Parents do in the UK in the 1950's ?

[Bluespunk]

32 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Moving the goals posts somewhat .

I was speaking about Irish builders who came to work in the U.K in the 1950s , I also gave a reason as to why they wouldn't be suitable tenants was because building work is considered to be seasonal work and the work is irregular and so the tenants may only stay until their building has been built and they would move on somewhere else , and landlords would want long term tenants , 

You also made a sweeping generalisation that ''the Irish do like a drink''

[Bluespunk]

Just now, Mac Mickmanus said:

What jobs did your Parents do in the UK in the 1950's ?

None of your business

[Bluespunk]

44 minutes ago, proton said:

No it does not

Yes it does...and I have provided links earlier in this thread that shows the damaging effect racist attitudes and actions are having in the uk...

[Mac Mickmanus]

1 minute ago, Bluespunk said:

You also made a sweeping generalisation that ''the Irish do like a drink''

In relation to Irish  builders who came to work in the UK in the 1950's

[Bluespunk]

3 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

In relation to Irish  builders who came to work in the UK in the 1950's

It is not what you said.

 

Here is what you said

 

"Irish were coming to the U.K often to work in construction and Irish builders may not have been the type of tenant a landlord would want , work was seasonal and the Irish do like a drink ''

[Bluespunk]

53 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Stop making false allegations .

I asked a person a question and he will not answer 

He cannot answer because its well known that Irish builders did like a drink 

I answered it, as your generalisation was aimed at the Irish as a whole, not builders.

[proton]

1 minute ago, Bluespunk said:

Yes it does...and I have provided links earlier in this thread that shows the damaging effect racist attitudes and actions are having in the uk...

You, like a lot of liberals seem obsessed with racism, it's enormously exaggerated. 

[Lacessit]

Racism exists in every country on the planet, and is usually quite a good indicator of the education level.

I value or avoid people on the basis of their individual attributes, nationality or skin color is irrelevant to me.

Differences are a product of beneficial genetic adaptation, and the cultural environment the person was raised in.

Having said that, I do discriminate when it comes to religious adherents, because I regard them as mentally deranged. I make an exception for Buddhism, because IMO it is more a philosophy than a monotheistic belief.

[Bluespunk]

2 minutes ago, proton said:

You, like a lot of liberals seem obsessed with racism, it's enormously exaggerated. 

No it's not and despite how much you don't want to see it, racism is a cancer that eats away at a society.

 

Oh, and I am far more to the left than liberals...

[Mac Mickmanus]

3 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

I answered it, as your generalisation was aimed at the Irish as a whole, not builders.

You really need to read whole paragraphs and sentences separated by a comma and understand what point is being made  , rather than just picking out a few words from paragraphs and then taking the meaning out of context 

[Bluespunk]

18 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

You really need to read whole paragraphs and sentences separated by a comma and understand what point is being made  , rather than just picking out a few words from paragraphs and then taking the meaning out of context 

Your words, in total regarding your stereotype comments on the Irish.

 

"Irish were coming to the U.K often to work in construction and Irish builders may not have been the type of tenant a landlord would want , work was seasonal and the Irish do like a drink .''

 

The meaning is perfectly clear.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

You have fallen foul of rules...................

 

4.     Stereotyping of an entire nationality.

 

9.     Over-use of the 3rd person plural pronouns and adjectives, (e.g. - them, they, their)

 

 

10.  “They” come over here….

 

11.  Sweeping subjective generalisations about nationality, creed, colour

18.  “They come over here…”

 

If you can tick any one of these, you are probably racist.

Oh, so now you want to apply the list you yourself have been arguing against.

 

Try this for size (third time of asking):

 

22 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

OK let’s accept at face value your opinion is that particular list is nonsense.

 

Do you agree there are statements and ‘go to arguments’ that are characteristic of racists?

 

Or is it your contention that nobody can conclude another person is a racist on the basis of the statements and arguments they put forward?

 

 

 

[Mac Mickmanus]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Oh, so now you want to apply the list you yourself have been arguing against.

 

Try this for size (third time of asking):

 

 

Do you agree with the list or not , or does the list just apply to other people ?

   Yes, some racist people do make statements from the list , but also non racist people make statements from the list , meaning that the list doesn't prove a person is racist 

[pixelaoffy]

Picked out this CNN non story. What we know is multi culturalism has and is failing in UK and Oh Scott  long way to go before it gets in the Black whole that Republic in the North Atlantic is goingto.

[kwilco]

45 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Racism exists in every country on the planet, and is usually quite a good indicator of the education level.

I value or avoid people on the basis of their individual attributes, nationality or skin color is irrelevant to me.

Differences are a product of beneficial genetic adaptation, and the cultural environment the person was raised in.

Having said that, I do discriminate when it comes to religious adherents, because I regard them as mentally deranged. I make an exception for Buddhism, because IMO it is more a philosophy than a monotheistic belief.

12.     It’s a religion, so that’s not racist, is it?