31% of Thais eye battery electric vehicles as next car choice

[alien365]

5 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Electric has gone up about 20%, if that, since I've been here/23 yrs.

Petrol has more than doubled, from ฿14 to ฿35 ... hmm

 

Has only gone up, with the increase of fossil fuels.

During covid when people stayed home the fuel prices were nearly half what they are now. If everyone goes electric I expect the same to happen with reduced demand. 

 

Regarding electric prices, my point was relating to further taxation. If the gvt loses tax income from petrol, where do you think they will make up the shortfall? 

[KhunLA]

7 minutes ago, alien365 said:

If the gvt loses tax income from petrol, where do you think they will make up the shortfall? 

Tourist 'exit tax' ... 20M tourist X 1000 baht

Cha Ching ????

[JonnyF]

10 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

What I find stranger is that people who don’t own an EV or hasn’t even driven one can assert authoritatively about the little (or nothing) they know about the driving and ownership experience of EVs.

I drove a friend's Audi E-Tron last summer. Very nice car, very quick. But for the 98,000 pounds it cost I would probably have preferred an ICE vehicle of the same price. They do lack a lot of character IMO, compared to something like a large V6 or V8, or even a smaller turbo charged engine.

 

10 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

 

A common example is how they always focus erroneously on the number of charging stations available. An EV owner knows that this is a non-issue. 

I wonder how that will change when these 31% of Thais actually buy one. They'll fill up the charging stations pretty quick. How will the electricity grid cope? Will the price of Petrol and Diesel fall due to the reduced demand? Will the price of electricity rise due to increased demand. All things to consider. 

 

I'm not against EV's (currently have a Hybrid), I just think 100% electric cars are best suited to people doing short trips in cities (or as a second car) rather than as your only mode of transport that you use for everything. I'll give it another few years and see where the land lies.

[edwinchester]

9 minutes ago, alien365 said:

During covid when people stayed home the fuel prices were nearly half what they are now. If everyone goes electric I expect the same to happen with reduced demand. 

 

Regarding electric prices, my point was relating to further taxation. If the gvt loses tax income from petrol, where do you think they will make up the shortfall? 

As electricity is vat rated Govt revenue will automatically go up with increased ev ownership as charging increases.

[h90]

4 minutes ago, edwinchester said:

As electricity is vat rated Govt revenue will automatically go up with increased ev ownership as charging increases.

yes 7% which is not that much

[Gweiloman]

5 hours ago, bluejets said:

And...just like in Aus, where or what are they going to use to charge the ruddy things?

Julian Islet showed last month how he visited over 70 recharge stations and ALL but one were not working........????

Cost is prohibitive for many Aussies , how the hell are Thai going to handle that?

 

Wow. You win the prize for the most misleading and inaccurate post of the year.

 

First off, the video is about a town in the UK, not Oz.

 

Secondly and more importantly, the charging stations were intentionally turned off. Your post implies that they were broken which they were not.

[h90]

22 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

Indoctrinated?

How about embracing of change and considerate to the environment and future generations even if it is at the cost of some temporary inconvenience as the technology matures.

 

Selfishness, on the other hand, best describes….

yes that is indoctrination......modern ic engines are very clean, there is oil for many years in the land. Of course we should save it as it is better used to produce plastics and medicine than burn it, but there is no rush to switch technology. Better to let the battery technology mature 10 more years.

[Will B Good]

As a second car for tootling about in BKK I might just consider one, assuming I lived in a house with a driveway and a charging point......otherwise no way Giuseppe.

[alien365]

8 minutes ago, edwinchester said:

As electricity is vat rated Govt revenue will automatically go up with increased ev ownership as charging increases.

Vat is still a lower percentage than the tax imposed on fuel. One thing is for sure, the taxman will never lose out. 

[Gweiloman]

13 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

I drove a friend's Audi E-Tron last summer. Very nice car, very quick. But for the 98,000 pounds it cost I would probably have preferred an ICE vehicle of the same price. They do lack a lot of character IMO, compared to something like a large V6 or V8, or even a smaller turbo charged engine.

 

I wonder how that will change when these 31% of Thais actually buy one. They'll fill up the charging stations pretty quick. How will the electricity grid cope? Will the price of Petrol and Diesel fall due to the reduced demand? Will the price of electricity rise due to increased demand. All things to consider. 

 

I'm not against EV's (currently have a Hybrid), I just think 100% electric cars are best suited to people doing short trips in cities (or as a second car) rather than as your only mode of transport that you use for everything. I'll give it another few years and see where the land lies.

Very well said.

 

I have no comment on your first point as the Audi E-Tron is not the first car that comes to mind for 99% of buyers when talking about EVs.

 

On the second point, I believe we have had a brief discussion recently that EVs are not suitable for some. Inability to charge at home and/or frequent long distance driving means that EVs are not a good choice . But for many people, this isn’t a problem. 

[ignis]

4 minutes ago, alien365 said:

During covid when people stayed home the fuel prices were nearly half what they are now. If everyone goes electric I expect the same to happen with reduced demand. 

 

Regarding electric prices, my point was relating to further taxation. If the gvt loses tax income from petrol, where do you think they will make up the shortfall? 

So say in UK the Government has lost so far £ 25 million from petrol/diesel tax + road tax on EVs

 

Quote

where do you think they will make up the shortfall,

UK so say coming soon will be pay per miles....  

 

Understand in UK they have been taking out the FREE charging units = must have the right type of EV to use + payment cards to use the newer charging points  [why different types and models use different EV chargers and connectors ? ]

 

Friend in UK, followed map to 3 different so say charging stations 2 not working the other a different type of  payment card =  not enough battery to try another station = breakdown service had to be called,  this is the 3rd time in a month !  he says it is the worst decision he every made to buy a EV car.. Maybe if he owned a house with off road parking and charging point would be a different matter.  

 

The + side is Sweden that are re-building the Motorways and some main road with automatic EV charging under the surface

 

Here is a question as price of electric has gone up so much it is no longer as cheap to charge any more,  did look into it for some time = will wait awhile longer, took delivery of the new Ranger last week.

[h90]

52 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Our EV battery is rated at IP69K  ... is that good enough for TH?

... that was rhetorical ... don't bother

 

"IP69K means a product is completely dustproof and can withstand washdown at pressures of 80 to 100 bar/1,160 to 1,450 PSI, in phases of 14 to 16 l/min, and at temperatures up to 176°F/80°C."

I would be happy enough with IP69....but would be still concerned how it looks after some years....in our Volvo..which is not the cheapest brand, all the electric connectors if you touch them they fall apart to dust. The plastic is broken.
So I would rather wait another 10 years....

[MrMojoRisin]

19 minutes ago, h90 said:

yes that is indoctrination......modern ic engines are very clean, there is oil for many years in the land. Of course we should save it as it is better used to produce plastics and medicine than burn it, but there is no rush to switch technology. Better to let the battery technology mature 10 more years.

Nope.

 

 

 

[KhunLA]

10 minutes ago, h90 said:

I would be happy enough with IP69....but would be still concerned how it looks after some years....in our Volvo..which is not the cheapest brand, all the electric connectors if you touch them they fall apart to dust. The plastic is broken.
So I would rather wait another 10 years....

That sucks.  Another reason to stay clear of Volvo.

[Jaysisaket]

I am genuinely interested in electric vehicles. So if someone asked me: - Are you considering buying an EV next? - I would say yes, maybe. Because it is in the range of possibilities. But it does not necessarily mean I would really buy one. So these polls are deceiving.
 

For me personally there are some issues that stop me from pulling the trigger. An ICE vehicle which was well maintained is an easy sell. I normally buy a new car every 5 years and sell the previous one. I usually clock around 100.000 km by then and the car usually sells for at least half the original purchase price. There is a huge market for second hand ICE vehicles. Especially for mid range cars.

 

How deep is the market for used electric vehicles? I am afraid that selling a used electric vehicle for any reasonable price would be a problem. First of all they will have a degraded battery after 100.000 km so their range will be lower and might be impractical for some owners. Secondly the majority of people live in apartments and do not have their own private charging points so they will have to go and charge the car somewhere for many hours instead of 10 mins at a gas station once in a while. Not everyone can afford spending that much time on a regular basis. Especially with a degraded battery which holds less charge they will have to make more frequent trips to the chargers. For me personally that would be an endless hassle and anxiety (need to go charge my car at some shopping mall but have no time because I am busy with some other stuff; or need to make a long trip urgently but the car is only halfway charged). The cost of replacing a battery is exuberant in most of the cases and makes non economic sense.

 

In my opinion electric cars have still a way to go before they are as carefree as ICE vehicles. The battery technology is still not there yet. Neither is the infrastructure. Without generous government subsidies EVs are a luxury toy for now for those of us with extra money they don’t know how to spend..

[KhunLA]

2 minutes ago, Jaysisaket said:

 I would really buy one. So these polls are deceiving.

Agree, and IMHO, all polls are deceiving, unless 'you' are asking the question.   You really don't know how the questions are presented, and will garner different results, asked different ways.

[MrMojoRisin]

13 minutes ago, Jaysisaket said:

I am genuinely interested in electric vehicles. So if someone asked me: - Are you considering buying an EV next? - I would say yes, maybe. Because it is in the range of possibilities. But it does not necessarily mean I would really buy one. So these polls are deceiving.
 

For me personally there are some issues that stop me from pulling the trigger. An ICE vehicle which was well maintained is an easy sell. I normally buy a new car every 5 years and sell the previous one. I usually clock around 100.000 km by then and the car usually sells for at least half the original purchase price. There is a huge market for second hand ICE vehicles. Especially for mid range cars.

 

How deep is the market for used electric vehicles? I am afraid that selling a used electric vehicle for any reasonable price would be a problem. First of all they will have a degraded battery after 100.000 km so their range will be lower and might be impractical for some owners. Secondly the majority of people live in apartments and do not have their own private charging points so they will have to go and charge the car somewhere for many hours instead of 10 mins at a gas station once in a while. Not everyone can afford spending that much time on a regular basis. Especially with a degraded battery which holds less charge they will have to make more frequent trips to the chargers. For me personally that would be an endless hassle and anxiety (need to go charge my car at some shopping mall but have no time because I am busy with some other stuff; or need to make a long trip urgently but the car is only halfway charged). The cost of replacing a battery is exuberant in most of the cases and makes non economic sense.

 

In my opinion electric cars have still a way to go before they are as carefree as ICE vehicles. The battery technology is still not there yet. Neither is the infrastructure. Without generous government subsidies EVs are a luxury toy for now for those of us with extra money they don’t know how to spend..

You’ll get there, eventually you’ll have no choice (much like those who swore by the horse and cart when cars first appeared).

[Gweiloman]

39 minutes ago, Jaysisaket said:

I am genuinely interested in electric vehicles. So if someone asked me: - Are you considering buying an EV next? - I would say yes, maybe. Because it is in the range of possibilities. But it does not necessarily mean I would really buy one. So these polls are deceiving.
 

For me personally there are some issues that stop me from pulling the trigger. An ICE vehicle which was well maintained is an easy sell. I normally buy a new car every 5 years and sell the previous one. I usually clock around 100.000 km by then and the car usually sells for at least half the original purchase price. There is a huge market for second hand ICE vehicles. Especially for mid range cars.

 

How deep is the market for used electric vehicles? I am afraid that selling a used electric vehicle for any reasonable price would be a problem. First of all they will have a degraded battery after 100.000 km so their range will be lower and might be impractical for some owners. Secondly the majority of people live in apartments and do not have their own private charging points so they will have to go and charge the car somewhere for many hours instead of 10 mins at a gas station once in a while. Not everyone can afford spending that much time on a regular basis. Especially with a degraded battery which holds less charge they will have to make more frequent trips to the chargers. For me personally that would be an endless hassle and anxiety (need to go charge my car at some shopping mall but have no time because I am busy with some other stuff; or need to make a long trip urgently but the car is only halfway charged). The cost of replacing a battery is exuberant in most of the cases and makes non economic sense.

 

In my opinion electric cars have still a way to go before they are as carefree as ICE vehicles. The battery technology is still not there yet. Neither is the infrastructure. Without generous government subsidies EVs are a luxury toy for now for those of us with extra money they don’t know how to spend..

Don’t know where you live (Sisaket?) but here in CM, I don’t believe that majority of people (who would be car owners) live in apartments. 
 

As has been mentioned numerous times on other threads, if you can’t charge at home, EVs are not for you. And if you are inclined to change your car frequently, then EVs could be a financial gamble.

[James105]

21 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

You’ll get there, eventually you’ll have no choice (much like those who swore by the horse and cart when cars first appeared).

I'll be in the 10% of laggards on this!   I think putting all the eggs in the EV basket is a bit of a mistake as battery technology is probably decades behind where it needs to be to make EVs a viable option for the majority.   It's a bit of a shame all this investment was not spent making what we currently use better and letting EVs naturally replace this as and when battery tech becomes genuinely viable.  

 

The car replaced the horse and cart as clearly it was better than what came before.   EVs will replace ICE when they become better than what was before in terms of distance between charges and convenience, such as being able to charge it in the equivalent time as filling a car with petrol.  Currently EVs are the equivalent of the horse and cart for most people as it is less convenient than a petrol car.  

[Gweiloman]

58 minutes ago, ignis said:

So say in UK the Government has lost so far £ 25 million from petrol/diesel tax + road tax on EVs

 

UK so say coming soon will be pay per miles....  

 

Understand in UK they have been taking out the FREE charging units = must have the right type of EV to use + payment cards to use the newer charging points  [why different types and models use different EV chargers and connectors ? ]

 

Friend in UK, followed map to 3 different so say charging stations 2 not working the other a different type of  payment card =  not enough battery to try another station = breakdown service had to be called,  this is the 3rd time in a month !  he says it is the worst decision he every made to buy a EV car.. Maybe if he owned a house with off road parking and charging point would be a different matter.  

 

The + side is Sweden that are re-building the Motorways and some main road with automatic EV charging under the surface

 

Here is a question as price of electric has gone up so much it is no longer as cheap to charge any more,  did look into it for some time = will wait awhile longer, took delivery of the new Ranger last week.

Sounds like your friend in the UK is a right plonker. Does he not know how to do research or possess any common sense?

[Will B Good]

1 minute ago, Gweiloman said:

Sounds like your friend in the UK is a right plonker. Does he not know how to do research or possess any common sense?

You're totally correct....total plonker......should be driving a proper car with an engine.

[Goat]

5 hours ago, jacko45k said:

They are popular perhaps as people are hearing of the high acceleration and torque they can produce,

which is why i will get one. Charge it from my roof top solar. 

Keep my other car for longer trips.

Cant wait.

[quake]

3 minutes ago, James105 said:

I'll be in the 10% of laggards on this!   I think putting all the eggs in the EV basket is a bit of a mistake as battery technology is probably decades behind where it needs to be to make EVs a viable option for the majority.   It's a bit of a shame all this investment was not spent making what we currently use better and letting EVs naturally replace this as and when battery tech becomes genuinely viable.  

 

The car replaced the horse and cart as clearly it was better than what came before.   EVs will replace ICE when they become better than what was before in terms of distance between charges and convenience, such as being able to charge it in the equivalent time as filling a car with petrol.  Currently EVs are the equivalent of the horse and cart for most people as it is less convenient than a petrol car.  

+1 

 

[Gweiloman]

2 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

You're totally correct....total plonker......should be driving a proper car with an engine.

Absolutely correct. Plonkers should drive ICEs. Let the smarter ones like us drive EVs and laugh all way to the bank and our destination. 1 baht per km, less if TOU, less is solar, free for me when I charge at my local free CS ????

[Will B Good]

3 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Absolutely correct. Plonkers should drive ICEs. Let the smarter ones like us drive EVs and laugh all way to the bank and our destination. 1 baht per km, less if TOU, less is solar, free for me when I charge at my local free CS ????

Serious question............ I drive from BKK to Loei once a month......what route planner for charging stations would you use?

[Gweiloman]

22 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Serious question............ I drive from BKK to Loei once a month......what route planner for charging stations would you use?

Take your pick of EV Station Pluz (PTT), PEA Volta (Bangchak) or Elexa (PT)

It’s only a relatively short trip, under 600 km. Realistically, only one charging stop is required. An hour or so.

Edited May 25, 2023 by Gweiloman

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, Will B Good said:

Serious question............ I drive from BKK to Loei once a month......what route planner for charging stations would you use?

Each CS vendor has their own app.

 

Charge Loma app:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.sukhom.charge_loma&hl=en

 

PlugShare site: https://www.plugshare.com/

 

If having MG, then their site:

https://www.mgcars.com/th/innovation/ev/charging-station?gclid=CjwKCAjw67ajBhAVEiwA2g_jEG0RkEMX7QdWpli8XL48iPW1m8FTnvzEdPUQxgiG2n9rt4fw2OLtJxoCsGoQAvD_BwE

 

Direct, T21/bkk to Loei, <550 kms, and may only need to top up once.  Though it is 8 hr drive, so 2 stops for comfort would be my choice, at least.

Edited May 25, 2023 by KhunLA

[vinny41]

2023 Global Automotive Consumer Study Southeast Asia ...

https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/Deloitte/sg/Documents/consumer-business/sea-cb-2023-global-automotive-consumer-study-southeast-asia-perspectives.pdf

Here is the full survey

[PETERTHEEATER]

20 hours ago, dinsdale said:

31% LOL. How about "Almost One Third". Doesn't matter though just more numbers and more predictions. Which reminds me the wet season has to start in the next 3 days.

Lets hope the rains don't short out any of the charging infrastructure on which electric cars are dependent...????

[vinny41]

Survey shows only 18% of Thai's survey are looking for 600km range + vehicles

So maybe Ford is getting it right 

We're not going to go to 600-mile range,” added Farley. “We're trying to make the smallest possible battery for competitive range.”

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1139741_ford-ceo-were-not-going-to-go-to-600-mile-range-on-

Cost of Batteries is between 70-75% of total vehicle cost