Pita and his “devil may care” attitude

[marquess]

Let him fail in his task, if he were really concerned about improving this country rather than following a woke globalist agenda; he would stick to amending the general libel laws. Too many citizens of this country are stiffled from speaking out when they see  corruption and genearl malpractise.

This change coupled with a reform of the judiciary and the police would result in an organic change in this country that would prove to be unstoppable. Going about like a bull in China shop will rightly exclude him from the P.M position. 

[BenStark]

29 minutes ago, phetphet said:

Will they now ban him long enough that he cannot even lead MF at the next election?

Isn't there a second case considered which could see the party disbanded?

[keithkarmann]

Seems like a good plan to me. Urge some popular person to put himself forward. Get most of the votes knowing that he can be brought down easily with his share ownership. Then ease someone less popular into the top job.

[Bangkok Barry]

2 hours ago, Purdey said:

But rural old people are very conservative and still support the status quo

That is your personal opinion, I'm guessing, as I've seen no poll. My wife and her family and friends out here in the sticks would not agree with you. They detest every part of the current setup. Every part. I'll leave it there.

Edited July 19, 2023 by Bangkok Barry

[RichardColeman]

6 hours ago, mfd101 said:

A little too much confidence & too little experience.

Guess that statement does not apply to anyone prefixed General

[Gandtee]

4 hours ago, Robin said:

An experienced politician would have known that his policy on sect 112 was going to cause trouble with the  Senate, and kept quiet on that until he was installed in power,

Inexperience and overconfidence are not good qualities for  new PM.

But isn't his policy on sec. 112 what the people voted for? Obviously the majority of the voting public want it changed.

[LukKrueng]

6 hours ago, JayClay said:

Maybe. Maybe not.

 

He's clearly got the public on his side. How the public react if/when he doesn't get his way will determine his destiny.

 

Compromising on this issue and losing the support of the public would most likely weaken him to the point that he would be a lame duck prime minister. It would empower the senetors to vote against every peice of legislation proposed potentially paralysing the government. 

Politics is a game of compromise wherever there's more than 1 party. If any party could win enough seats to have a majority in parliament there would be no need for a coalition. But if you need other parties in a coalition, you have to accept their stance on all issues as well.

So if he wants to be PM and that issue as he (and his voters) wants it stands in the way, he should find a compromise that will be a step in his direction and others can live with it as well.

[LukKrueng]

12 minutes ago, Gandtee said:

But isn't his policy on sec. 112 what the people voted for? Obviously the majority of the voting public want it changed.

Not really the majority of the voters. They might be the biggest group but far from majority.

[Arthur Mullard]

5 hours ago, damian said:

If one thing he has at least exposed the whole system for what it is (an absolute fraud) and stoked the fire for change. I am sad he will not get the opportunity this time but absolutely loving the fact he is making them squirm and bristle. I think dropping the various bills for reform and the 272 senate was a master stroke to further stoke the fires. 

I think a lot of posters until now inc myself have maybe naively assumed Pita et al didn't see any of this coming....................

[kennw]

5 hours ago, khunPer said:

Worth to remember that MFP and Pita got around 30% of the votes, the majority of seats in the House of Representatives is made up by a coalition that don't agree in all MFP's politics.

But enough were prepare to join and make a coalition.  And, as leader of the party that won the most votes he is entitled to vie for the PM position if the coalition could make the required number of seats. The ITV and second court cases are an attempt to displace him, before the senators have to declare them selves. If they, as non-elected members prevent the people's choice, they will be condemned. But there are powerful forces involved.  

[AloisAmrein]

12 hours ago, Taboo2 said:

He is an immature kid with no experience and definitely no street smarts.  He has not clue about the "Game".  

 

Hoped he learnt his lesson!

He has the the confidence of millions of voters, the big majority. And you call him an immature kid. Shame on you!

[Flory]

It's almost like he knew this day would come the moment he signed up for the job of leading FF's successor. It's almost like there's finally a critical mass of Thais that understand compromising on true systemic reform results in a short-lived civilian administration followed by another coup and X number of years of the military running the show again.

[bristolgeoff]

Spoke to some thais tonight not my business to get involved.But what thais have said they are not very happy and that could be in many parts of thailand

[herfiehandbag]

19 hours ago, mfd101 said:

I'm entirely unclear what happens when the current Senate comes to an unlamented end next May. Is a new Senate then appointed? If so, by whom? Or does the Thai Parliament become unicameral (ie Lower House only)?

That is why the present government intends to remain in place. They have to construct the replacement.

[JayClay]

13 hours ago, LukKrueng said:

Politics is a game of compromise wherever there's more than 1 party. If any party could win enough seats to have a majority in parliament there would be no need for a coalition. But if you need other parties in a coalition, you have to accept their stance on all issues as well.

So if he wants to be PM and that issue as he (and his voters) wants it stands in the way, he should find a compromise that will be a step in his direction and others can live with it as well.

But there is no compromise position here. It's not like he was standing on a position of abolishing the monarchy, which could then be watered down to "okay let's talk about the lesse majest rules".

 

The reforms he campaigned on are so minor that there's nowhere to go with regards to negotiating. 

 

If it was a party in a stronger position, with a healthy backing of the senetors, then sure... compromise away.

 

But for somebody in Pita's position, losing the support of his only ally (in the form of the voting public) is an unwise strategy that would give him the position of PM in name only. And his party would be destroyed in the next election, if not sooner.

[jacko45k]

5 hours ago, AloisAmrein said:

He has the the confidence of millions of voters, the big majority. And you call him an immature kid. Shame on you!

Well he got caught with 40,000 shares in his pocket he should not have had......could he have done something about that before the elections?

[zzaa09]

3 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Well he got caught with 40,000 shares in his pocket he should not have had......could he have done something about that before the elections?

More than likely. 

To be sure, Pita and MF should've found it necessary to procure most anything that could've been use against them - in any manner. Almost naive not to comprehend who they were competing with. 

[Bday Prang]

18 hours ago, damian said:

On the contrary. I think he knows the game very, very well. It's just difficult to play when know one else follows the rules including his own team (as in coalition) members. 

"the game" as you put it is all; about not following the stated rules, always has been.  he is either stupid or naive, either way he is unfit for the job

[bamnutsak]

52 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Well he got caught with 40,000 shares in his pocket he should not have had......could he have done something about that before the elections?

 

43 minutes ago, zzaa09 said:

More than likely. 

To be sure, Pita and MF should've found it necessary to procure most anything that could've been use against them - in any manner. Almost naive not to comprehend who they were competing with. 

 

The Old Guard would have come up at least four or five other spurious "charges" which the pliant Election Commission would have forwarded to the Administrative Court or the Constitutional Court. Ruangkrai has filed additional charges, and has threatened to file more. 

 

I think that Pita, and his legal team, thought that they had the iTV shares issue covered and were (and still are) well positioned to defend it. They assumed they could defend it in front of the EC first.

 

Thai "law" is very flexible, it can be used for or against anyone by those above in the Thai Social Pyramid. It's baked into the Thai Social Contract.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 20, 2023 by bamnutsak

[jacko45k]

4 minutes ago, bamnutsak said:

The Old Guard would have come up at least four or five other spurious "charges" which the pliant Election Commission would have forwarded to the Administrative Court or the Constitutional Court.

I have little doubt... but it appears they made it rather easy for them!

[Bday Prang]

16 hours ago, marquess said:

Let him fail in his task, if he were really concerned about improving this country rather than following a woke globalist agenda; he would stick to amending the general libel laws. Too many citizens of this country are stiffled from speaking out when they see  corruption and genearl malpractise.

This change coupled with a reform of the judiciary and the police would result in an organic change in this country that would prove to be unstoppable. Going about like a bull in China shop will rightly exclude him from the P.M position. 

I am inclined to agree, he would soon be cozying up to Klaus Schwab and the rest of them , The only foreigners voicing support for him are woke lefties and those who for some reason would like to change Thailand into copy of their own miserable countries.

The ruling elite , or dinosaurs, as the lefties like to call them have for decades, presided over this country and created a place where all of us have chosen to stay. What makes them think that this woke pretty boy will make things any better for us? To be honest I don't think they do, they despise the fact that Thailand has , as yet , chosen not to follow the currently fashionable woke globalist agenda. Long may the status quo prevail. as always , better the devil you know, in my not so humble opinion

[HaoleBoy]

21 hours ago, mfd101 said:

I'm entirely unclear what happens when the current Senate comes to an unlamented end next May. Is a new Senate then appointed? If so, by whom? Or does the Thai Parliament become unicameral (ie Lower House only)?

I asked this on twitter to a couple of Thai political people.
What still isn't clear is does the next PM have sway over who gets nominated or not.

 

[mfd101]

1 minute ago, HaoleBoy said:

I asked this on twitter to a couple of Thai political people.
What still isn't clear is does the next PM have sway over who gets nominated or not.

 

Clear as mud!

[HaoleBoy]

19 hours ago, khunPer said:

Worth to remember that MFP and Pita got around 30% of the votes, the majority of seats in the House of Representatives is made up by a coalition that don't agree in all MFP's politics.

MFP / Pitha got 38% and then formed a coalition.  The coalition wrote a MoU with NO lese-majeste in it.  Lese-majeste changes are MFP only.  The junta Senators used the "lese-majeste" law amendment as a smoke screen to cover the real reasons.
The coalition support, of 68% (of voting Thais), was for the MoU they wrote which stated:

- remove alcohol duopoly held by the rich families

- eliminate the military from ever being in politics again

- reduce the military size (# of generals)

- stop conscription

- reduce / remove the military perks (golf courses and such)

[BritManToo]

3 minutes ago, HaoleBoy said:

The coalition support, of 68% (of voting Thais)

The coalition has no support from Thais, it was formed after the voting ended.

You would need another vote to see who, if anyone, supports the coalition.

Edited July 20, 2023 by BritManToo

[wealthychef]

On 7/19/2023 at 9:37 AM, webfact said:

it was obvious from the very beginning that Move Forward leader Pita Limjaroenrat was not willing to modify his party’s stand on modifying the lèse majesté law, despite heavy lobbying by its political partners.

How is this "devil may care?"  it sounds to me like someone standing by a principle.  To be fair, he is a politician, so the idea that he is acting on principle is probably wrong, but... it does look like it at first glance.  

[Thingamabob]

On 7/19/2023 at 9:43 AM, Andrew Dwyer said:

While the amount of support/votes he got from the Thai people shows they are ready for change he will always have a hard time changing the lèse majesté law especially as the Senators were put in place to protect laws such as this.

 

Power to the people, not to the dinosaurs with their greed and aversion to any change.

The objections by the coup- appointed 'senators' to any change in the lese majeste law are entirely false and hypocritical. They make a lot of money with the way things are, that is why they want no change.

[NanLaew]

22 hours ago, Robin said:

An experienced politician would have known that his policy on sect 112 was going to cause trouble with the  Senate, and kept quiet on that until he was installed in power,

Inexperience and overconfidence are not good qualities for  new PM.

Inexperience and overconfidence didn't do Tony Blair any harm did it?

[BangkokReady]

I think it's obvious he wanted to make a point. To not back down on anything, knowing it would likely cost him the job.

 

Did he successfully make his point? I think so. Could he have accomplished something more meaningful if he compromised on some points? Quite possible also.

 

I guess time will tell as to what impact his actions have had.

 

Sure, you can get a lot of votes by campaigning to lessen the power of those in control. But are the people in power going to allow that to happen? Is there any democracy in the world where the common man can (or will) vote to take power away from the ruling Elite?

[NanLaew]

59 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

The coalition has no support from Thais, it was formed after the voting ended.

You would need another vote to see who, if anyone, supports the coalition.

Each citizen who voted for a candidate from each one of the coalition parties voted for the same thing: change from the loyalist, royalist, military hegemony. The post-election coalition, by the definition of it's own mandate, is still a collective call for that change. No need to go back to the polls. None whatsoever.