Thailand shakes up golden visa scheme, hikes prices by up to 500 per cent

[adrin]

22 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Credit should never be given for the sponsorship of inflation, xenophobic policy and a lack of vision. That is the very definition of irrational.

 

Credit should be given for common sense, intelligence, and forward thinking policy. Which is not the case here. 

coomon sense is that thailand is developing quickly, most urban people enjoying better life than in the west already. immigrants flocking to thailand, so they increase fees in order to stop the worst coming in or at least pay more.

 

dont know where the majority of the people on this board is living? esan? pattaya? yeah, maybe there the economy and everything is still 30 years behind of places like bkk and phuket

[sidneybear]

On 9/2/2023 at 2:39 PM, aldriglikvid said:

I'm always surprised when boomers enters the thread

Many of your posts have a point, but then you spoil them with infantile gerontophobia. The boomer generation has as much right to post here as you do, and your use of ageist slurs is unnecessary, irrelevant and quite unpleasant. And I'm saying this as a Gen-Xer before you start.

 

Edited September 3, 2023 by sidneybear

[BusyB]

23 hours ago, aldriglikvid said:

 

This is another highly interesting take, besides the "Thai Economics"-zingers: "the numbers aren't impressive". 

 

According to what? Do you guys understand that Thai Elite doesn't scale as a Spotify or HBO Max subscription? Every new member with a PE-visa requires a shuttle on Suvarnabhumi, Phuket and Chang Mai. Every new PE-visa requires bypass att checkin, security and a special line at Immigration. The idea that TPC are seeking VOLUME, as you guys claim, is nauseating clueless. They try to find a traditional Supply and Demand BALANCE of what deep-pocket tourists are willing to pay. When users are growing +100% YoY, for 3 years in a row, clearly they are underpricing themselves. Not to mention all the staff (costs) they need to hire to meet and greet all these new clients on the airports. 

 

To the "not impressive" numbers: it was 6000 active PE-visa holders in 2019 and there were forty thousand (40 000) in July before they announced their new pricing. Considering everyone had approx. 40 days to subscribe to the old pricing before the new price is fixed, I'm confident that number is not less than 50 000 next month. That's almost 10x in 5 years. Yeah, hardly impressive. 

 

Personal take? I don't think they actually want anymore than 20 000 active users. Perhaps not even that. Why would they? It's better to increase price until you reach that point of users. The exact same revenue to a lower fixed and operational cost i.e. higher profits. 

 

 

"Thai Economics"

I was just interested that's all. Thanks for the numbers. I had no idea previously.

[fusion58]

On 9/2/2023 at 10:07 AM, webfact said:

The former Thai Elite visa, priced at one million baht (US$28,587) and available to all, has given way to an exclusive Reserve Card, which is by invitation only and limited to just 100 new members annually. This costs five million baht. Holders of the Reserve Card can keep the good times rolling with five-year extensions, each at a mere 10 per cent of the Reserve card’s current value when they decide to extend.

And you'll still be required to report your whereabouts every 90 days like a crook on parole. Nothing "elite" or "privileged" about that.

[Srikcir]

On 9/2/2023 at 11:50 AM, bob smith said:

could you explain to me why anyone would pay 5 million baht for a visa that you can get legally for 1,900 baht at immigration? 

Or a 10-year Long Term Resident visa for 50,000 baht?

[sidneybear]

Pheu Thai (as its TRT prior iteration) always was (financially) hard on foreigners holding long term visas, and it's a bit of an irony why so many people here support them. The Thaksin government, by way of example, jacked up prices for PR from the 25k that I paid (in 1997) to 200 odd k (or whatever it is) now, plus various other substantial increases in visa fees.

 

Those old generals might not have been so bad. Just sayin that we might expect more of this. ..

 

Edited September 3, 2023 by sidneybear

[Bday Prang]

On 9/2/2023 at 7:09 AM, JayClay said:

I also don't have a child

Could adopt one "in theory"

[sidneybear]

Elite, or Priveleged, or whatever their marketing team comes up with is, as it's name implies, for the more minted among us. Someone might want to do the maths on the new fees, taking inflation into account since the scheme first started. 

 

Either way, Thaksin's lot has a long history of multiplying visa fees for long termers. It's ironic why so many people here adore the man.

[sidneybear]

Thai Elite was Thaksin's brainchild. Then Thaksin was kicked out. Then the fees stayed the same for years on end.

 

Then Thaksin's lot gets back in. Coincidentally, and suddenly, the fees go up by leaps and bounds.

 

Could there be a business relationship here, the more cynical minds among us may wonder? Or is this mere coincidence?

[redwood1]

30 minutes ago, sidneybear said:

Thai Elite was Thaksin's brainchild. Then Thaksin was kicked out. Then the fees stayed the same for years on end.

 

Then Thaksin's lot gets back in. Coincidentally, and suddenly, the fees go up by leaps and bounds.

 

Could there be a business relationship here, the more cynical minds among us may wonder? Or is this mere coincidence?

You could be on to something.......Thaksin hardly needs more money....But there must be many mouths to feed below him.....But they are very mistaken if they think 1 or 2 or 5 million is not a very large amout of money to most people in this world....

 

This kind of money could buy a condo someone could live in for the rest of their life...

Edited September 3, 2023 by redwood1

[Gknrd]

Personally I cannot stand people , countries, companies that are constantly trying to find ways to rip people off. 

I agree with the poster above. Mostly for the rich Chinese trying to get out of China, or criminals. If there is a way to rip you off Thailand will figure out a way. Just another reason not to spend a dime more than you have to in Thailand if you want to go. 

Edited September 3, 2023 by Gknrd

[Celsius]

3 hours ago, sidneybear said:

Many of your posts have a point, but then you spoil them with infantile gerontophobia. The boomer generation has as much right to post here as you do, and your use of ageist slurs is unnecessary, irrelevant and quite unpleasant. And I'm saying this as a Gen-Xer before you start.

 

 

I told him the same thing in another thread....as a gen xer too.

 

Seems to be bitter about something. 

 

And there is absolutelly nothing intelligent about his posts. His main point that Elite visa is a niche market and they don't want a lot of subscribers. 

 

Pure comedy gold nonsense.

[K2938]

5 hours ago, Photoguy21 said:

What happens if there is a change of mind and the "visa" is cancelled y the government or changed in such a way that many of the subscribers cannot accommodate the change? will they get part of their money back? Very doubtful I would think.

Even says in the contract that they can basically do whatever they want.  The pretty much only exception would be if the company were shut down by government order, but the Thai authorities could do a lot of negative things without fulfilling exactly this condition.  So you buy at your own risk.  No compensation.  The likelihood of you being totally ripped off is however low since there are also reputational factors.

[BarstoolChang]

On 9/2/2023 at 6:22 PM, aldriglikvid said:

1m thb for a 20 year hassle free visa equals 50k thb per year i.e. $1.4k per...year! Not even mentioning priority check-in, priority security and the same immigration queue pilots and flight-crew using. 

 

If $1.4k per year is "expensive" and "money in the water" I just can't help you. It's an incredible value proposition, IMHO. 

 

Finally, who cares if applications go to zero after the price increase? (Which, of course, it won't). 

 

Being a LTD they use IFRS accounting and thus the 35k applications paid and accepted the last 3 years, will contribute to revenue and profits for years to come. The cash is already in their coffers and thus can earn money "again", similar to an insurance company. 

 

Enough of clueless Euro-poors today. I'm out! 

 

 

This dude bought the elite visa when it was cheap and now spends all day defending the price increases and calling people europoors.

 

<deleted>.

[BE88]

2 minutes ago, BarstoolChang said:

This dude bought the elite visa when it was cheap and now spends all day defending the price increases and calling people europoors.

 

<deleted>.

Or maybe he works for Elite Visa? ????

[sidneybear]

1 hour ago, Celsius said:

 

I told him the same thing in another thread....as a gen xer too.

 

Seems to be bitter about something. 

 

And there is absolutelly nothing intelligent about his posts. His main point that Elite visa is a niche market and they don't want a lot of subscribers. 

 

Pure comedy gold nonsense.

He's maybe upset and envious that he can't afford a house yet, or that he otherwise thinks he should have more than he does, and blames the older generations for that, who have worked all their lives. Bigotry against those who are older and wiser is a common phenomenon. 

 

It's a pity, because he tries to make valid points, then spoils them by having a chip on his shoulder about the entire boomer generation, who have just as much right to air their views as he does. 

 

Edited September 3, 2023 by sidneybear

[steve187]

On 9/2/2023 at 1:20 PM, JayClay said:

Yes I know that.

 

But I shall continue to ask the question every time somebody writes something as stupid as "this visa is worthless because you can get the same for 1,900bt/year".

 

I will be sure to include the fact that I have no children next to to prevent you having to waste your data...

stuck record comes to mind

[freedomnow]

9 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

More b0llocks.

I was pretty sure that no one would have anything and I was right.  Again.

Yes, you are always right.

[KUGS]

On 9/2/2023 at 6:42 AM, aldriglikvid said:

Demand is through the roof, and that's why they're raising prices. That's not "Thai Economics" but traditional Austrian Economics. 

Where it hurts, I believe, is that you Euro-poors aren't in the crosshair of TPC. The 70's are no more, unfortunately, and your EU-pension can't compete with the Koreans, Japanese or the Chinese. 

So previous articles about Thailand aiming to ramp up annual revenues for the Thai Elite Programs are not true then?

[aldriglikvid]

52 minutes ago, KUGS said:

So previous articles about Thailand aiming to ramp up annual revenues for the Thai Elite Programs are not true then?

 I'm sorry? 
 

As shown, membership are through the roof (almost 10x in 4 years) and I would argue that they are rising prices because they can. As there is a high variable cost with a TE membership, it makes economic sense to raise prices instead of raise volume. 

My comment was towards people saying that the price increases are because of falling membership numbers i.e. "Thai Economics".  Elderly, often bitter and with low levels of testosterone, expats claim there's a specific Thai phenomena where Thai goes against common logic and increase prices when demand falls. Myself, I haven't seen this phenomena called Thai Economics. Actually, I can't think of another society that is so fixed on "discounts", "promotions", "buy 1-get-1" i.e. traditional economics. 

????

Edited September 3, 2023 by aldriglikvid

[JemJem]

On 9/2/2023 at 9:00 AM, ChaiyaTH said:

Damn, they really really not even get the slightest idea. This is just so stupid, that it becomes sad. Like you would wish nobody such low IQ. I was expecting a lowering of prices.
 

For example a 5 year elite visa for 250,000 baht, still expensive, but much better.

 

Why on earth would you pay near 200,000 a year upfront for 5 years. You can setup a business for 1/3rd of the cost and still get a business visa, or any other type of visa in 10 directions (with agents).

 

It is that much money you could even establish a company overseas, to then make a business here to have a representative office company and then get a non-b too.

 

I would even keep messing around tourist visa's more likely, as it gives a very big travel budget to make it fun and worth it. Could visit multiple countries far away and many times within SE asia.

The tourist visa method for staying long term is not a good idea anymore, I am afraid. As far as I know, many posters in this forum have written that not only the requirements for getting a tourist visa in the neighboring countries are not that easy anymore, but also, and more importantly, I think it gets riskier to get it after 2 or 3 back to back tourist visas (plus extensions of one month each). Probably even riskier if you use the visa exempt method (back to back for several times).

 

As for the Elite Card fees, yep, I agree with you. Now, they have become really way too high. 

[Liverpool Lou]

15 hours ago, freedomnow said:

On 9/3/2023 at 10:12 AM, Liverpool Lou said:

More b0llocks.

I was pretty sure that no one would have anything and I was right.  Again.

Yes, you are always right.

Most of the time, not always.

[Misty]

19 hours ago, Srikcir said:

Or a 10-year Long Term Resident visa for 50,000 baht?

Okay, but that one is easy.  My 10 yr LTR comes with a 5 year digital work permit, no thai employees needed. Hands down better than any of the other options open to me. Can't work on elite card.  Better than either PR status or NonB where at best only a 1 year work permit + 4 Thai employees required. No 90 day reporting.  Deal with the pleasant BoI staff, not the CW folk.

[varun]

So what was originally 1 million for 20 years, has now ballooned to 3.4 million.

 

Typical Somchai logic:

No hab Customer? Let's raise the prices!

[Datsun 1200]

On 9/2/2023 at 11:41 AM, Ralf001 said:

Each yearly extension costs Bt.500,000 ?

Untrue

 

IH

[newringo]

On 9/2/2023 at 11:39 AM, aldriglikvid said:

 

I'm always surprised when boomers enters the thread and calls Thai Elite a failed programme. And, most often, ends with the comment "Thai economics, heu heu heu" - and the other Pattaya-boomers sends likes and emoji's. 

The fact (if that interests you) is that active users of the TE scheme is up +400% since 2019 and grew triple digits alone in 2023. They declare revenue and profits annually, and we just learned it's both record revenue and record profits. Demand isn't "low", to the contrary, it's through the roof; and that's why they're increasing prices. 



 

Thai Elite visas issued as of this year: 2398.  Portuguese Golden visas: 12497 Small (roof?) you have.

[Ralf001]

2 hours ago, Datsun 1200 said:

Untrue

 

IH

How much is the reserve card ?

"Holders of the Reserve Card can keep the good times rolling with five-year extensions, each at a mere 10 per cent of the Reserve card’s current value when they decide to extend."

Edited September 4, 2023 by Ralf001

[wordchild]

37 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

How much is the reserve card ?

"Holders of the Reserve Card can keep the good times rolling with five-year extensions, each at a mere 10 per cent of the Reserve card’s current value when they decide to extend."

As i understand it the 500000 bt  fee, for the 5 year extension,  is applied AFTER the member's initial 20 YEAR period has reached its end. ie it allows the member to extend the visa for a total of 25 years and beyond that in blocs of 5 years. 

 

Its not a great deal but it may be attractive to some, eg especially to existing 20 year members (of the current scheme)  who are likely to be offered a (possibly significant) discount to switch to the new category.

 

I think the big issue with the new Thailand Privilege scheme is  (as referenced above by Misty)  that the economics do not stack up well against the "rival"  LTR+ wk Permit Scheme. 

Edited September 4, 2023 by wordchild

[aldriglikvid]

1 hour ago, newringo said:

Thai Elite visas issued as of this year: 2398.  Portuguese Golden visas: 12497 Small (roof?) you have.

Not sure were you got that data from. TPC said on their annual meeting that they had over 10k applications Jan-July. 

[Srikcir]

On 9/4/2023 at 10:52 AM, Misty said:

Okay, but that one is easy.  My 10 yr LTR comes with a 5 year digital work permit, no thai employees needed. Hands down better than any of the other options open to me. Can't work on elite card.  Better than either PR status or NonB where at best only a 1 year work permit + 4 Thai employees required. No 90 day reporting.  Deal with the pleasant BoI staff, not the CW folk.

Immigration/BOI is very accommodating with the LTR.

I got my LTR visa (Pensioner) on Nov. 8, 2022 with first report date of Nov. 7, 2023. Subsequently, I left Thailand for the month of May, 2023.

On Aug. 24, 2023 I went to same place BOI One-Stop Service Center in Chamchuri Square, Bangkok at the LTR visa window to get the annual report date adjusted to Dec. 7, 2023 because of my foreign trip.  Instead they just posted my 1st report date completed as of Aug. 24, 2023 and issued me a new report date of May 28, 2024.