More details on Thai taxation of overseas income

[Neeranam]

4 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

If there's a dual taxation agreement between Thailand and the country in question, and you have registered your tax domicile with one or the other, tax will only be deducted at one location, not both.

 

As for claiming tax residence in the country that attracts the lowest income tax, that's for you to decide and resolve.

I will get a British state pension in 10 years. 

If I am still working, could I pay tax on the pension in the UK, and tax on my work (online) in Thailand?

 

[Celsius]

10 minutes ago, freeworld said:

Withholding tax on transfers...LOL

 

On international transfers. Why not?

 

Do you also lol when you pay 200 baht using a foreign ATM card?

[WhatsNext]

I read many remarks that you pay tax in country A and then have to pay the difference if country B, which is Thailand in this case, has a higher tax rate than A.

 

This is not the case, the income is either taxed in A or B, depending on the source and there is no paying of any difference. 

 

Long story short, if you pension is already taxed in A, then no tax in B and the other way round.

[Sydebolle]

7 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

Well that law already exists - you don't pay Thai tax on money earned in the previous tax year.  I have no idea but I'd guess they can request proof of when the money was earned. For those with substantial savings/wealth abroad - that should be fairly easy to do but for those living month to month...............somewhat more difficult.

 

Don't forget, there are a subsantial amount of people that do live from month to month - many move abroad on retirement because their pensions go further.

 

Don't panic though - just sit back and see what happens in the next few months.

Absolutely correct is the statement "just sit back and see what happens in the next few months." And for all those pensioners, the relevant paragraph reads "on money earned in the previous tax year". All pensions received now have been earned 20, 30 or 40 years ago and safe kept to be paid out much later than a year after having "earned" it. Law fodder, I know, but - as said - wait and see! 

[freeworld]

12 minutes ago, Celsius said:

 

On international transfers. Why not?

 

Do you also lol when you pay 200 baht using a foreign ATM card?

That 200 Baht is a service fee, not a tax.

 

Tax transfers...Why? The receiving banks do not know the origin and history of the money. The tax authorities already have their laws, revenue codes and orders and what not to control taxation.

[Hamma]

I think it is rather fair to pay tax in the country you live in, and I have no respect for people avoiding paying taxes. But I would prefer paying tax of my pension here rather than in Danmark like it is now because of the double tax agreement between the two countries. I know that many countries don’t tax pensions, but DK does (37 %). 

[hughrection]

I have an inheritance coming soon - hopefully settled before the new year. There will be no inheritance tax taken in the UK as it is below the threshold - about 40k GBP.

The inheritance tax for Thailand is only liable if receiving over 100 million baht.

 

Will I have to pay tax on this?  Many thanks for any answers.

[JackGats]

If the income has been received in another country and later within the same tax year is being transferred to the taxpayer’s account in Thailand it must be taxed in Thailand.

 

This describes the state of things up to now, not the new situation created by the RD paper.

[hondoelsinore]

4 minutes ago, Hamma said:

I think it is rather fair to pay tax in the country you live in, and I have no respect for people avoiding paying taxes. But I would prefer paying tax of my pension here rather than in Danmark like it is now because of the double tax agreement between the two countries. I know that many countries don’t tax pensions, but DK does (37 %). 

Easy to play the fair game with the typical liberal mindset of civic responsibility when the tax rate of your residency is lower than your mother country, it's just not necessary to virtue signal to strangers on the Internet. 

[Taboo2]

Good, so for a retiree like me on Social Security and 401K, which is already taxed by the bastards Biden and IRS, there is nothing to worry about.

 

I am not working or generating income from YouTube or any other means, so this is a non-issue for me.

[TroubleandGrumpy]

34 minutes ago, WhatsNext said:

I read many remarks that you pay tax in country A and then have to pay the difference if country B, which is Thailand in this case, has a higher tax rate than A.

This is not the case, the income is either taxed in A or B, depending on the source and there is no paying of any difference. 

Long story short, if you pension is already taxed in A, then no tax in B and the other way round.

Not so as far as I know. The DTAs work on a 'tax credit' basis. The tax applied in A is 'credited' against the tax applicable in B. In general the various tax depts in B agree not to apply taxation on certain income from A (pensions etc.). However, as Thailand has never gone down this path before (personal income tax DTAs), and this is going to take a lot of working out.  What is needed is for the Thai RD to advise exactly what processes are in place to lodge individual tax returns where DTAs come into account, what documents/proof of tax applied in A is required, and what if those payments in A were 'tax exempt' (like Pensions), and many other 'complications'.

 

Mid-Late 2024 before any/most of that is provided by Thai RD - maybe. 

[James105]

10 minutes ago, Hamma said:

I think it is rather fair to pay tax in the country you live in, and I have no respect for people avoiding paying taxes. But I would prefer paying tax of my pension here rather than in Danmark like it is now because of the double tax agreement between the two countries. I know that many countries don’t tax pensions, but DK does (37 %). 

This is a personal opinion, but I do feel that if a country wants me to pay tax like a local then a minimum requirement for me would be to allow me to "officially" work in that country and buy land in that country to live on, and not make me pay for a very expensive "tourist" visa that does not allow me to do either of those things.   

 

I'm not after a vote or anything, but if someone wants to take away some of my hard earned cash that was earned way before I moved over here without anything in return is not okay with me.  

[Neeranam]

17 minutes ago, hughrection said:

I have an inheritance coming soon - hopefully settled before the new year. There will be no inheritance tax taken in the UK as it is below the threshold - about 40k GBP.

The inheritance tax for Thailand is only liable if receiving over 100 million baht.

 

Will I have to pay tax on this?  Many thanks for any answers.

How would they know?

[maddox41]

7 hours ago, NanLaew said:

That is NOT the way a "double tax agreement" works.

 

If tax has already been paid in the country where the money comes from, it does not need to be deducted again on receipt in Thailand.

 

I am sure that in their mangling of their language means to say that the amount of tax paid in the source country can be deducted from the amount of any tax owed in Thailand.

Correct but more money out of our pocket to go to a  accountant and  translate it into thai they always, win ???? 

 

[kimamey]

5 hours ago, quake said:

All sorted then.

Glad we don't have to think anymore about this.

Thank you the tax department, your so cool. 

 

 

 

Don't say that. You'll only encourage them.

[Neeranam]

11 minutes ago, Taboo2 said:

I am not working or generating income from YouTube or any other means, so this is a non-issue for me.

Reminded me, I earn passive income from watching YouTube videos. Better get that sorted. 

[JimTripper]

imagine getting audited and trying to explain your tax return to people with limited english ????.

 

even pointing to a menu at a restaurant has problems.

 

i guess hiring a lawyer or agent would be recommended for that just like going to immigration is now.

Edited October 4, 2023 by JimTripper

[freeworld]

21 minutes ago, hughrection said:

I have an inheritance coming soon - hopefully settled before the new year. There will be no inheritance tax taken in the UK as it is below the threshold - about 40k GBP.

The inheritance tax for Thailand is only liable if receiving over 100 million baht.

 

Will I have to pay tax on this?  Many thanks for any answers.

In Thailand there is no tax to pay. Just keep all records of the origin, reason and transfer of the money should anyone query it later.

You may also consider  to get a Foreign transaction certificate from the bank should you want to repatriate it later.

Edited October 4, 2023 by freeworld

[TroubleandGrumpy]

12 minutes ago, Taboo2 said:

Good, so for a retiree like me on Social Security and 401K, which is already taxed by the bastards Biden and IRS, there is nothing to worry about.

I am not working or generating income from YouTube or any other means, so this is a non-issue for me.

Maybe.  Maybe not.

[TroubleandGrumpy]

8 minutes ago, James105 said:

This is a personal opinion, but I do feel that if a country wants me to pay tax like a local then a minimum requirement for me would be to allow me to "officially" work in that country and buy land in that country to live on, and not make me pay for a very expensive "tourist" visa that does not allow me to do either of those things.   

 

I'm not after a vote or anything, but if someone wants to take away some of my hard earned cash that was earned way before I moved over here without anything in return is not okay with me.  

We all agree. Make me pay income taxes (which most Thais do not) but give me no rights, no services, no status, and require 90 days, TMN30s, annual g=beggings, permnission to leave/re-enter.  Well you can kiss my fu.............

[beammeup]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

They're are many ways to avoid paying tax on this. 

How about sending smaller payments to different bank accounts via apps like Wise? 

How about buying USDT and using P2P on exchanges like Binance? This way, you have Thai baht going to your accounts from random Thai accounts. 

 

 

Might work for a while. But they might also suspect money laundering and go after you.

[TroubleandGrumpy]

2 minutes ago, freeworld said:

In Thailand there is no tax to pay. Just keep all records of the origin, reason and transfer of the money should anyone query it later.

I agree. I was thinking of doing a return in 2025 just to see what would happen, but then I realised I was being an idiot. The only and always best strategy in Thailand is to avoid (for as long as possible) dealing with the Thai bureaucracy - there is no chance an Expat will not have to pay. 

[connda]

6 hours ago, Thailand J said:

US pension and SS are covered by the tax treaty, no double tax.

And for the majority of us, that's all that counts.

My Social Security is deposited directly into a Thai bank, so I don't see an issue there.
I transfer my pension using Transferwise (Wise).  If they begin to deduct tax out of foreign funds transfers, then it's simple.  I'll leave the money in the US.  At the way T-Bill rates are going, we'll be getting in excess of 5%+ soon on short-term T-Bill, so there is incentive to not transfer those funds to Thailand.

Who loses?  Thailand.  The nit-wits in the current administration completely fail to grasp the economic ramification of the impact of a decrease of foreign currencies entering the Thai economy.  They are about to turn off the faucet to Foreign Direct Investments and foreign capital inflows at their own peril.
Morons. 

[Captain Monday]

38 minutes ago, Hamma said:

I think it is rather fair to pay tax in the country you live in, and I have no respect for people avoiding paying taxes. But I would prefer paying tax of my pension here rather than in Danmark like it is now because of the double tax agreement between the two countries. I know that many countries don’t tax pensions, but DK does (37 %). 

Fair, but what is your definition of “live”?

If it is 180~days in one country  I don’t live anywhere. 

[connda]

39 minutes ago, Hamma said:

I think it is rather fair to pay tax in the country you live in, and I have no respect for people avoiding paying taxes.

You pay taxes in Thailand.  It's called VAT.

[CTwelve]

2 minutes ago, beammeup said:

Might work for a while. But they might also suspect money laundering and go after you.

But it wouldn't be money laundering if those accounts are registered via the originating country (not Thailand) and they are just using the app..

 

The only way they could know would be to require all businesses to report every transactions for every person. 

 

 

 

 

[hughrection]

13 minutes ago, freeworld said:

In Thailand there is no tax to pay. Just keep all records of the origin, reason and transfer of the money should anyone query it later.

You may also consider  to get a Foreign transaction certificate from the bank should you want to repatriate it later.

You seem pretty sure - thank you. Do you have experience or a source for such a thing? Many thanks for any feedback.

[Mike Teavee]

2 hours ago, Celsius said:

 

Like I said, if they implement the withholding tax, this absolutely won't matter. It will be up to you to prove the money was already taxed back home.

 

 

But I wouldn't be receiving the money, I'd transfer it directly into her bank account from the UK  

[TroubleandGrumpy]

17 minutes ago, JimTripper said:

imagine getting audited and trying to explain your tax return to people with limited english ????.

even pointing to a menu at a restaurant has problems.

i guess hiring a lawyer or agent would be recommended for that just like going to immigration is now.

There are no 'agents' to get around the rues with Thai RD. like with Immigration.

Any disputes/appeals must be in Thai with all documents in English translated and certified.

You can lodge a return in English - but those forms provide nowhere to apply DTA details.

Yes - you will have to pay a lawyer/accountant if you dont agree with the Thai RD assessment.

[Mike Teavee]

2 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

If you transfer 100,000 how does anyone know from whence it came. Maybe 50,000 was a lottery win. ????

You have to provide copies of your home country bank statements so they would easily be able to see money coming in & could ask you to show where it came from.