The basic problem is that women have an in-group bias and men have an outgroup bias in favour of women. This well documented phenomenon accounts for Western society's remarkable inability to see that in the West women are the favoured sex. Indeed, women get indignant when shown the evidence. They feel an overwhelming need to possess a victim complex.

 

Since the mid-1990s, in the UK, women have outearned men until their mid 40s. If they do not have children then they outearn men for their whole lives. Obviously, having children, and their normal feminine desire to nurture their children, compromises their worklife.

 

We know from the Nordic Paradox, that the more egalitarian society, then the more feminine (low-paid) job are chosen by women. In patriarchal India, women become IT programmers, in Sweden they opt to become nurses. 

 

Women are drawn to jobs with human interaction, men are drawn more to mechanical jobs. An example of this is a medical doctor. There is roughly a 50/50 split in the UK between men and women in this job type. The women opt for the caring and nurturing jobs such as a GP; the men will choose the more mechanical jobs such as a brain surgeon.

 

Mechanical jobs generally earn more because they take more skill to master so there are fewer candidates. It simply is easy to find somebody who can mop the floor, but it is difficult to find somebody who can build a space rocket. The skill of caring is a generalised skill among all humans.

 

Feminists cannot accept these basic innate tendencies of women. Hence they blame any differences between men and women on some sexism of man.

 

The ultimate irony then is that feminism is the expression of the feminine tendencies of women, And the desire of men to protect and provide for women.

 

Feminism has always had this contradiction within itself. It cannot decide if it believes that men and women are different, or that men and women are the same and are unnecessarily treated differently, 

 

Looking ahead, the issue is solving itself. There is a collapse of marriage rates in the West, as women no longer need men to survive and it turns out they don't really care for the company of men that much. It is expected that by 2030, 50% of women at the age of 20 will never marry in the United States (this is from a now notorious Goldman Sachs market report).

 

The Boomers are the last simpy generation of men. They are the last true believers in the idea that women need to be carefully protected and nurtured by men. They will gladly sign away half their money for this belief. With baby boomers sliding off this mortal coil, women are going to have to man up.

 

In the West, men are far more likely to be homeless than women, much more likely to be the victims of murder, and more likely to experience non-reciprocated domestic violence than heterosexual women (the highest levels of domestic violence are among lesbian couples), are more likely to receive a longer prison sentence than a woman for the same crime.

 

The biases in favour of women are absolutely extraordinary. It is called the 'glass cellar effect'. Women don't notice it because their general tendency is to only look at the tiny top percentage of men (i.e. the ones they want to mate with).

Again, I feel a big disconnect from my many compatriots here.

 

They think feminists, transsexuals and The Woke are impacting their Pattaya bar stool lives in any way. It's like Thai people fearing ghosts.

 

Meanwhile, I stride purposefully through life afflicted neither by Boy George, nor Sarah Jessica Parker, nor po-faced hippies, NOR ghosts.

 

I'm bemused by the drama-queen pretend-afflicted here. They live in cheapskate sex paradise. And still, still they moan. Forever. 

 

-Partic the mopey, near-catatonic Starbucks stare-er in Canada. If they lock him up, I pledge $5 to his Go Fund Me defense fund. 

31 minutes ago, Prubangboy said:

Again, I feel a big disconnect from my many compatriots here.

 

They think feminists, transsexuals and The Woke are impacting their Pattaya bar stool lives in any way. It's like Thai people fearing ghosts.

I lost a $1m house and $30k/year a pension in my 2009 UK divorce.

Before pension and house sharing laws changed in 1997 I would have kept it all and she would have left the house with just a suitcase full of clothes ..... my loss was entirely due to relatively new woke + feminism uk laws.

If you can't see the connection, then you're either stupid or delusional.

Obviously if you never had anything, then you couldn't lose it and probably won't care about the anti-male law changes.

 

Don't know why you mentioned transsexuals, if you don't like them, then don't use their services.

55 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I lost a $1m house and $30k/year a pension in my 2009 UK divorce.

Before pension and house sharing laws changed in 1997

 

Don't know why you mentioned transsexuals, if you don't like them, then don't use their services.

Transexuals and their imminent encroachment ("they're calling from within the house!!!") is a frequent hysteria here. My gym trainer is a little on the androgynous side. I use his services.

 

Googled, couldn't find this new Brit feminazi law. Did see in '96 that homemakers were entitled to a bigger a share in one case.

 

Whatevs. 'Got divorced in England in '09 too. I was told that whatever I wanted to toss her would be fine. Obv. diff circumstances.

 

All around the world, divorce is going more and more default. In Florida, they just ended lifetime payments for wives. Republicans did it. Suck on that, Repub Country Club Crones. I laugh in their rich not really a witch faces. On that at least, we can agree.

 

15 years (YEARS!!!) later, I say let it go. Any feminazi's harshing your mellow these days? Me? No.

 

2 questions:

 

-Do you think that slack-jawed, google-eyed, agog Canadian is really at risk for jail time for staring? ("What are you in for?" "Eye contact").

 

-Is long, protracted staring any kind of sensible woman approaching-game? For me, it's a no and a no. He'd do better on Tinder.

 

But I love reading, futile, impotent rage stuff like that here. That, and girlfriend-fighting, are my fave kinds of posts.

 

I def empathize with that bitter complainer. Used to be, you could have a little chat on the ATM line or with someone sitting next to you on the plane. But the younger set has clearly voted on this (online approach only), the world has changed, and it's time to think about moving on yourself and getting a life.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Prubangboy said:

def empathize with that bitter complainer. Used to be, you could have a little chat on the ATM line or with someone sitting next to you on the plane. But the younger set has clearly voted on this (online approach only), the world has changed, and it's time to think about moving on yourself and getting a life.

Don't know, I stopped interacting with western women about 10 years back. Do chat with Asian women though, but they normally start the exchange.

On 11/27/2023 at 2:06 PM, Gaccha said:

The basic problem is that women have an in-group bias and men have an outgroup bias in favour of women. This well documented phenomenon accounts for Western society's remarkable inability to see that in the West women are the favoured sex. Indeed, women get indignant when shown the evidence. They feel an overwhelming need to possess a victim complex.

 

Since the mid-1990s, in the UK, women have outearned men until their mid 40s. If they do not have children then they outearn men for their whole lives. Obviously, having children, and their normal feminine desire to nurture their children, compromises their worklife.

 

We know from the Nordic Paradox, that the more egalitarian society, then the more feminine (low-paid) job are chosen by women. In patriarchal India, women become IT programmers, in Sweden they opt to become nurses. 

 

Women are drawn to jobs with human interaction, men are drawn more to mechanical jobs. An example of this is a medical doctor. There is roughly a 50/50 split in the UK between men and women in this job type. The women opt for the caring and nurturing jobs such as a GP; the men will choose the more mechanical jobs such as a brain surgeon.

 

Mechanical jobs generally earn more because they take more skill to master so there are fewer candidates. It simply is easy to find somebody who can mop the floor, but it is difficult to find somebody who can build a space rocket. The skill of caring is a generalised skill among all humans.

 

Feminists cannot accept these basic innate tendencies of women. Hence they blame any differences between men and women on some sexism of man.

 

The ultimate irony then is that feminism is the expression of the feminine tendencies of women, And the desire of men to protect and provide for women.

 

Feminism has always had this contradiction within itself. It cannot decide if it believes that men and women are different, or that men and women are the same and are unnecessarily treated differently, 

 

Looking ahead, the issue is solving itself. There is a collapse of marriage rates in the West, as women no longer need men to survive and it turns out they don't really care for the company of men that much. It is expected that by 2030, 50% of women at the age of 20 will never marry in the United States (this is from a now notorious Goldman Sachs market report).

 

The Boomers are the last simpy generation of men. They are the last true believers in the idea that women need to be carefully protected and nurtured by men. They will gladly sign away half their money for this belief. With baby boomers sliding off this mortal coil, women are going to have to man up.

 

In the West, men are far more likely to be homeless than women, much more likely to be the victims of murder, and more likely to experience non-reciprocated domestic violence than heterosexual women (the highest levels of domestic violence are among lesbian couples), are more likely to receive a longer prison sentence than a woman for the same crime.

 

The biases in favour of women are absolutely extraordinary. It is called the 'glass cellar effect'. Women don't notice it because their general tendency is to only look at the tiny top percentage of men (i.e. the ones they want to mate with).

Excellent post.

 

And the desire of men to protect and provide for women.

In my case becoming a nurse, which is a heavily female dominated occupation, cured me of any chivalrous inclination I help prior to doing so.

 

Women are not much when it comes to physical violence, but very much into mental violence, and bullying is a notorious problem in nursing, from female managers. I was somewhat shocked at how much bullying went on, having been subjected to it many times, and I actually retired early to get away from it.

On 11/27/2023 at 5:42 PM, BritManToo said:

Don't know, I stopped interacting with western women about 10 years back. Do chat with Asian women though, but they normally start the exchange.

I used to have a lot of female friends, with whom I had conversations, but along the way we drifted apart, and women I meet now seem ( but not all ) angry and not into platonic relationships. One of my best female friends dumped me because her new boyfriend didn't like her having a male friend- so much for female independence!

 

Good to limit control over people unless it hurts others. So post war we saw all sorts of controls reduced - isn't it grand - censorship, control over blacks, women etc. Live and let live. HARD TO ARGUE LIMITING CONTROL ISN'T A GOOD THING.

If 50 or 60 years later some 'isms are leading to introducing new controls on people then fair to push back. Always fair to push back against unnecessary controls and limitations.

 

But feminism as an idea to reduce controls on what women wanted to do, when there were clear limitations present, isn't a bad thing. Unless you care primarily about your physical or mental or psychological pleasure, or feeling of power from control of others, and you see your only possibility of attaining it as having control over women. 

 

18 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

Good to limit control over people unless it hurts others. So post war we saw all sorts of controls reduced - isn't it grand - censorship, control over blacks, women etc. Live and let live. HARD TO ARGUE LIMITING CONTROL ISN'T A GOOD THING.

If 50 or 60 years later some 'isms are leading to introducing new controls on people then fair to push back. Always fair to push back against unnecessary controls and limitations.

 

But feminism as an idea to reduce controls on what women wanted to do, when there were clear limitations present, isn't a bad thing. Unless you care primarily about your physical or mental or psychological pleasure, or feeling of power from control of others, and you see your only possibility of attaining it as having control over women. 

 

Is it still needed?Is there any thing a woman can not do or is not allowed to do?

Feminists always will let you know right away  thats what they are.

Always an angry attitude against men,why?

Some saying they do not need men,any men.

That is being delusional at least.

 

3 minutes ago, jvs said:

Is it still needed?Is there any thing a woman can not do or is not allowed to do?

Feminists always will let you know right away  thats what they are.

Always an angry attitude against men,why?

Some saying they do not need men,any men.

That is being delusional at least.

 

I think in many ways including my workplace women are well and truly equal.

I don't see angriness in women I see - the media will always find examples of the worst behaviour to make people lose faith in humanity - be they feminists or whatever. My view is to look at your own life and see if things are ever bad in that way and if yes then by all means stand up. Some western men in Thailand may think women are terrible in the west, after being away for many years,  because of what they read in the media, and they see Thai women seem nicer compared to that, but the reality is there's an awful lot of happy nice western women even if they aren't quite as compliant as Thai ladies.  Thai women do have special feminine charms I will agree but that doesn't mean many western women are strident ratbags who want to bring you down. 

2 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

I think in many ways including my workplace women are well and truly equal.

I don't see angriness in women I see - the media will always find examples of the worst behaviour to make people lose faith in humanity - be they feminists or whatever. My view is to look at your own life and see if things are ever bad in that way and if yes then by all means stand up. Some western men in Thailand may think women are terrible in the west, after being away for many years,  because of what they read in the media, and they see Thai women seem nicer compared to that, but the reality is there's an awful lot of happy nice western women even if they aren't quite as compliant as Thai ladies.  Thai women do have special feminine charms I will agree but that doesn't mean many western women are strident ratbags who want to bring you down. 

Of course not all women are like that but more and more are becoming like that.There is a reason many men from the West are scared of women and are refusing to bow down to their whims and whining.

I do admit i no longer socialize with a lot of White women but when i do i always feel sorry for their husbands.

 

Women and men are wired differently. It's nature's way of making sure that we have the best chance of both surviving and reproducing.

 

I'm all for a bit of equality. But I'm not so keen on women exchanging places with men, just to prove a point.

 

In days past, a man would see a nice bit of stuff, whack her over the head, to befuddle her, and drag her off. to a cave. Could you imagine it the other way round? Of course not! There would be uproar in the village. And rightly so.

 

Then there is this hair thing. Why do ladies think it's a good thing to shave their body hair? And smells! I want a woman to smell like a proper woman. Not stinking of some perfume. That probably is carcinogenic to boot.

 

At school after the WW11, us lads did woodwork, and the girls learned cooking and sewing. Then it changed to 'home building' and on to 'domestic science'. Who knows what they call this lady stuff now!

 

As I say, I'm all for ladies doing feminism, but they have to know their place. Their role in nature so to speak. If we could return to doing things as nature intended, we would all be much happier. Especially the females.

On 11/30/2023 at 1:14 AM, Fat is a type of crazy said:

Thai women do have special feminine charms I will agree but that doesn't mean many western women are strident ratbags who want to bring you down. 

Back before I left home country to travel the world, even my female friends thought nothing of taking men down for any excuse. I thought it was normal female behaviour till I discovered Thai women.

19 hours ago, owl sees all said:

I'm all for a bit of equality. But I'm not so keen on women exchanging places with men, just to prove a point.

I have nothing against equality, but feminism isn't about equal pay any more. IMO it's about making women superior to men.

 

I wouldn't really care ( I did work with thousands of them ) except they still want to be treated with chivalry, while getting equal pay and conditions.

 

I have to say the vast majority of the women I worked with were very nice people, but the few rotten ones were very rotten indeed.

On 11/30/2023 at 12:01 PM, owl sees all said:

Women and men are wired differently. It's nature's way of making sure that we have the best chance of both surviving and reproducing.

 

I'm all for a bit of equality. But I'm not so keen on women exchanging places with men, just to prove a point.

 

In days past, a man would see a nice bit of stuff, whack her over the head, to befuddle her, and drag her off. to a cave. Could you imagine it the other way round? Of course not! There would be uproar in the village. And rightly so.

 

Then there is this hair thing. Why do ladies think it's a good thing to shave their body hair? And smells! I want a woman to smell like a proper woman. Not stinking of some perfume. That probably is carcinogenic to boot.

 

At school after the WW11, us lads did woodwork, and the girls learned cooking and sewing. Then it changed to 'home building' and on to 'domestic science'. Who knows what they call this lady stuff now!

 

As I say, I'm all for ladies doing feminism, but they have to know their place. Their role in nature so to speak. If we could return to doing things as nature intended, we would all be much happier. Especially the females.

Hi Owl 

Once you take the shackles off a person, who has been forced into a role, it may take a while to find out what makes you happiest.  But better to have freedom of choice so you can make mistakes and find what's best for you than be shackled into a role or ostracised for being a bit different. We've all met women who are happy being housewives and others who are much happier doing woodwork or running a business. The fact is none of us know what is natural - what worked in the cave man days or in the 1950's may not work now.

If a few start attacking our way of life then we can remind them to let us do out thing too.  

20 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

Hi Owl 

Once you take the shackles off a person, who has been forced into a role, it may take a while to find out what makes you happiest.  But better to have freedom of choice so you can make mistakes and find what's best for you than be shackled into a role or ostracised for being a bit different. We've all met women who are happy being housewives and others who are much happier doing woodwork or running a business. The fact is none of us know what is natural - what worked in the cave man days or in the 1950's may not work now.

If a few start attacking our way of life then we can remind them to let us do out thing too.  

Interesting!

 

Can't get away from the fact that Women and us guys are wired differently.

 

As I say, if a lady want to be a car-mechanic, then get to it. If a guy wants to be a professional knitter, then that's OK. But there are some things that should not change.

 

Women are the life givers; men the life takers. Wouldn't want that the other way round. Men are the providers and women the home-builders. It seems to me that the more women take on men's work the more difficult life is.

 

Why do men demand that women shave their pits? Don't all men want that earthy natural smell that a woman has. Of course they do.

 

There is a lot to this subject, and I'm not suggesting that we return to pre Boudica days. As she was the one who started this feminism nonsense. But I'm also not keen on the David Beckham types either.

 

The wife makes the food and we eat it. We have money and the wife spends it. Life is so simple. 

On 11/26/2023 at 10:51 AM, owl sees all said:

Bang on the money there Mr P.

 

If there are 100 people left on earth and only one is a woman, the human race could die out. On the other hand; 99 women and just one man. We would have action! And the race would be guaranteed to bloom.

 

Nature only really cares about two things; survival and reproduction. And nature is not just ants and volcanoes and lizards; we are nature.

Exactly.  That’s why men’s opinions are irrelevant; only one dissenter is required.  
 

Without us, nature would still be nature; volcanoes and ants will not miss us, rats will struggle on and get by, mosquitoes will find someone else.  But without insects to pollinate flowers, our life would be worse. It is more precarious at the top of the food chain than at the bottom.  But ne’er mind, let’s carry on as we are going - millions of lemmings can’t all be wrong 

9 hours ago, StreetCowboy said:

Exactly.  That’s why men’s opinions are irrelevant; only one dissenter is required.  
 

Without us, nature would still be nature; volcanoes and ants will not miss us, rats will struggle on and get by, mosquitoes will find someone else.  But without insects to pollinate flowers, our life would be worse. It is more precarious at the top of the food chain than at the bottom.  But ne’er mind, let’s carry on as we are going - millions of lemmings can’t all be wrong 

Talking about hitting the nail on the head. Spot on in your analysis there SC.

 

All those who are not sure about the very essence of the whole subject, should ask themselves; Women put on lipstick for why? To attract men, or to be secure in their own belief system. Same with hair; Do women shave their pits to please a man, to attract a mate, or because their mother told them it was the done thing, when they first reached puberty. Same with nails. Could you imaging a bricklayer with two inch long nails; painted pink with dark blue spots? Of course not. What about ladies who wear vests? Are they making a point about themselves to all that care to look, or are they simply feeling the cold.

 

It's a mystery for sure. But in 2024 we could get all the answers we seek.

On 12/1/2023 at 8:02 PM, owl sees all said:

Why do men demand that women shave their pits? Don't all men want that earthy natural smell that a woman has. Of course they do.

IMO that's nothing to do with men. IMO it's an entirely female oriented thing. In the distant past it came from royalty- some royal woman would do something and then the sheeple had to do it too. Now it's celeb culture. Did men force women to wear a bustle, or break their feet so they looked smaller, or was it women that did that? Worth mentioning that it's women that did ( do ) female genital mutilation on girls, not men. In Saudi women willingly wore black cloth over every bit of potentially exposed skin.

Let's put the blame where it belongs.

 

BTW, IMO one of the reasons women wear high heels is that it makes their legs look longer and their feet look smaller. I'm so glad I wasn't born female and having to do all those mad things.

On 12/2/2023 at 3:44 PM, owl sees all said:

Women put on lipstick for why? To attract men, or to be secure in their own belief system.

Can't say if it's to be more secure, but apparently the origin of red lipstick and rouge on cheeks is that it makes them look as if they are orgasmic, as during orgasm blood rushes to the face and makes it look redder.

Humans are a weird species for sure.

 

Perfume apparently came into being because people never bathed and needed something to cover the pong.

59 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO that's nothing to do with men. IMO it's an entirely female oriented thing. In the distant past it came from royalty- some royal woman would do something and then the sheeple had to do it too. Now it's celeb culture. Did men force women to wear a bustle, or break their feet so they looked smaller, or was it women that did that? Worth mentioning that it's women that did ( do ) female genital mutilation on girls, not men. In Saudi women willingly wore black cloth over every bit of potentially exposed skin.

Let's put the blame where it belongs.

 

BTW, IMO one of the reasons women wear high heels is that it makes their legs look longer and their feet look smaller. I'm so glad I wasn't born female and having to do all those mad things.

A lot of wisdom in that post TBL.

 

Can't blame the women entirely for these fads though. Men have, mostly because they had/have the power, demand that women look a certain way. Smell a certain way, and generally present themselves in a certain way.

 

I live with a muslim girl, Fatima, for a couple of years 40+ years ago. She would ask me what I liked. She had quite a hairy back, and would go to this place to get some 'sugaring' done. I liked the hair, and she stopped that nonsense to please me. She let her under-arm hair grow also. In fact anything I wanted to do with her body; she complied.

 

It's about time women started to realise that it is us men that pay the piper. They did once before they started getting too big for their boots.

Feminism has gone off the rails and has become an ambitious mess.

5 minutes ago, novacova said:

Feminism has gone off the rails and has become an ambitious mess.

Yes it has gone overboard and is not needed anymore.

Now a man who decides he is really a woman can compete against women and even a convicted rapist can claim to be a woman and be placed in a women's jail.

Crazy !!!

On 12/5/2023 at 3:37 PM, owl sees all said:

A lot of wisdom in that post TBL.

 

Can't blame the women entirely for these fads though. Men have, mostly because they had/have the power, demand that women look a certain way. Smell a certain way, and generally present themselves in a certain way.

 

I live with a muslim girl, Fatima, for a couple of years 40+ years ago. She would ask me what I liked. She had quite a hairy back, and would go to this place to get some 'sugaring' done. I liked the hair, and she stopped that nonsense to please me. She let her under-arm hair grow also. In fact anything I wanted to do with her body; she complied.

 

It's about time women started to realise that it is us men that pay the piper. They did once before they started getting too big for their boots.

While the feminist thing has gone too far and made women unhappy because unrealistic expectations are unrealistic, no man would like to have lived as a woman back in Victorian days. To be blunt their lives were <deleted>. They almost had it in the 60s after the pill was invented, but the movement got subverted by man hating extremists.

Intellectually they didn't need men, but the genetic imperative to breed was too strong, so they became confused and lost between independence and dependence. It's only in countries that pay them to be mothers so they don't need men other than as sperm donors that they can be "satisfied".

In enlightened countries like Japan women have even gone whole hog and given up on having babies and definitely on men. Careers and independence are so much more satisfying than some man constantly moaning that she won't let him give her unsatisfying sex, or having to cater to the demands of some sprog.

 

As always the above is my OPINION.

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

While the feminist thing has gone too far and made women unhappy because unrealistic expectations are unrealistic, no man would like to have lived as a woman back in Victorian days. To be blunt their lives were <deleted>. They almost had it in the 60s after the pill was invented, but the movement got subverted by man hating extremists.

Intellectually they didn't need men, but the genetic imperative to breed was too strong, so they became confused and lost between independence and dependence. It's only in countries that pay them to be mothers so they don't need men other than as sperm donors that they can be "satisfied".

In enlightened countries like Japan women have even gone whole hog and given up on having babies and definitely on men. Careers and independence are so much more satisfying than some man constantly moaning that she won't let him give her unsatisfying sex, or having to cater to the demands of some sprog.

 

As always the above is my OPINION.

Is that how a relationship was for you? Constantly moaning at the woman to have sex with you? Why else would you write such a thing?

 

41 minutes ago, NextG said:

Is that how a relationship was for you? Constantly moaning at the woman to have sex with you? Why else would you write such a thing?

 

If she really loved him, why would she deny him sex?

It's not as if it takes long, or costs her anything!

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Careers and independence are so much more satisfying than some man constantly moaning that she won't let him give her unsatisfying sex

 

I look in on Purple Pill Debate a bit. Women def do seem to have taken the ball and gone home, partic the young. They're willing to go without partners if the guy isn't statusy, good looking, or liberal enough.

 

Much, much less leeway these days. TBL is right, a lot of them have checked out.

 

The young guys dream of Thailand. They think that Thai women are submissive.

15 minutes ago, Prubangboy said:

The young guys dream of Thailand. They think that Thai women are submissive.

I think they're ready to bang.

Nothing to do with dominant or submissive.

Feminism teaches women sex is wrong, same as all the Abrahamic religions.

4 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Feminism teaches women sex is wrong, same as all the Abrahamic religions.

How does it do that? 

11 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I think they're ready to bang.

 

I think not. Guys who get on a plane to have sex are very rare. Guys who dream about it? Prob 1 in 5.

 

Reading Purple Pill, I see the young wrestling with the same contradictions as when I was young.

 

The women want a sensitive CEO type. But usually, the CEO is not all that sensitive. They want men who don't exist: 6 foot tall+, 100K+, and politically liberal. That rare guy will not be pounding some fatty loudmouth.

 

Men want trad wives, but are not particularly trad themselves. They want them to be educated and interesting, but still deferential. They want good girls who are also very sexual -so basically Stepford Wives: She messes up the bed with you and then is frantic to re-make it.

 

Treat 'em mean to keep 'em keen is still the #1 go-to for those good looking enough to be able to pull it off (for both sexes). Nothing ever really changes.