3 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Jews came to Israel much earlier than Arabs. If you go back far enough we're all from Africa and native Americans aren't native Americans as they crossed from Siberia. 

How do you prove your ethnicity to earn the right to emigrate to Israel? 

 

 

 

Just now, ozimoron said:

 

Translation: Israel doesn't want to contribute a shekel.

Your translation only, not worth much after your initial post

7 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

There were none in Gaza.

Here's a link disputing that... Israel's Occupation: 50 Years of Dispossession - Amnesty International

5 minutes ago, Hummin said:

How do you prove your ethnicity to earn the right to emigrate to Israel? 

 

 

 

Off topic but it's based on the law of return. Roughly for that a Jew is a person who had a Jewish mother but there are other ways for converts, non Jewish spouses including same sex spouses, etc.

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Israel abandoned settlements in Gaza before.

 

Yes, and now they want to establish them again. How Israeli settlers are expanding illegal outposts amid Gaza war | Israel War on Gaza | Al Jazeera

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Off topic but it's based on the law of return. Roughly for that a Jew is a person who had a Jewish mother but there are other ways for converts, spouses, etc.

It is one of the main reason for constantly need of more land! So right on topic, because the new settlers is one of the reasons for the 7 october attack. Shouldnt be a big brainer really to understand

2 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

Yes, and now they want to establish them again. How Israeli settlers are expanding illegal outposts amid Gaza war | Israel War on Gaza | Al Jazeera

They?

It's not current Israeli government policy.

16 hours ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

The writing is on the wall. Israel will get the future it deserves.

 

There is still a narrow path out of the hellscape of Gaza. A temporary ceasefire and hostage release could cause a change of Israel’s government; the rump of Hamas fighters in south Gaza could be contained or fade away; and from the rubble, talks on a two-state solution could begin, underwritten by America and its Gulf allies. It is just as likely, however, that ceasefire talks will fail. That could leave Israel locked in the bleakest trajectory of its 75-year existence, featuring endless occupation, hard-right politics and isolation. Today many Israelis are in denial about this, but a political reckoning will come eventually. It will determine not only the fate of Palestinians, but also whether Israel thrives in the next 75 years.

 

Israel’s trajectory will intensify its ethno-nationalist politics and pose legal threats to the economy. As estrangement from the West deepens, so deterrence may weaken. Firms could be blacklisted. Bosses could move high-tech businesses abroad or, if they are reservists, be arrested there.

 

https://www.economist.com/leaders/2024/03/21/at-a-moment-of-military-might-israel-looks-deeply-vulnerable

 

https://archive.is/EsctK

Agree. The reckoning is coming.

 

I see something like the anti apartheid campaign happening, and it will happen despite American protests and vetoes in the UN. How can it not? 

IMO this conflict is becoming a battle for the soul of humanity. Will the world ( outside it's leaders ) allow the atrocity to continue, or not?

Is humanity on the side of those that bomb small children to death, or on the side of the children.

 

It's a pretty clear choice, IMO. There isn't much grey between a living and a dead child, and there are thousands of dead children already.

 

When it's all over, I hope those dead children haunt the dreams of those that sent the bombs to kill them. I doubt any other penalty will happen to those that collude in the bombing. Despite lofty words about peace on Earth, our leaders seem to rejoice in killing, or at least seem reluctant to stop it happening.

7 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Off topic but it's based on the law of return. Roughly for that a Jew is a person who had a Jewish mother but there are other ways for converts, non Jewish spouses including same sex spouses, etc.

Establishing Jerusalem as Israel capital is another reason, and prove the lack of understanding of the citys importance for every etnic group and religion in the area.

2 minutes ago, Hummin said:

It is one of the main reason for constantly need of more land! So right on topic, because the new settlers is one of the reasons for the 7 october attack. Shouldnt be a big brainer really to understand

Like everything in the conflict it's complicated.

The numbers of people moving to Israel are not very high but yes Israel promotes that. Housing prices in normal Israel are very high so some are attracted to the west bank for affordable housing rather than right wing ideology. 

Just now, Hummin said:

Establishing Jerusalem as Israel capital is another reason, and prove the lack of understanding of the citys importance for every etnic group and religion in the area.

Part of Jerusalem. 

Sorry but every sovereign nation has the right to determine their capitol.

 

Just now, Jingthing said:

Part of Jerusalem. 

Sorry but every sovereign nation has the right to determine their capitol.

 

Well, the world disagree with you. Who recognize Jerusalem as their capital? 

 

It is an important question related to 7 october.

17 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Part of Jerusalem. 

Sorry but every sovereign nation has the right to determine their capitol.

 

 

Why Jerusalem is not the capital of Israel

 

No country in the world recognises Jerusalem as Israel’s capital.

 

In the 1948 war, following the UN’s recommendation to divide Palestine, Zionist forces took control of the western half of the city and declared the territory part of its state.

 

During the 1967 war, Israel captured the eastern half of Jerusalem, which was under Jordanian control at the time, and proceeded to effectively annex it by extending Israeli law, bringing it directly under its jurisdiction, in a breach of international law.

 

In response, the UN Security Council passed Resolution 478 in 1980, declaring the law “null and void”. The illegal Israeli annexation of East Jerusalem violates several principles under international law, which outlines that an occupying power  does not  have sovereignty in the territory it occupies.

 

https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2017/12/10/why-jerusalem-is-not-the-capital-of-israel

Among others

 

On December 6, 2017, the United States of America officially recognized Jerusalem as the capital city of the State of Israel.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_recognition_of_Jerusalem_as_capital_of_Israel

7 minutes ago, coolcarer said:

Among others

 

On December 6, 2017, the United States of America officially recognized Jerusalem as the capital city of the State of Israel.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_recognition_of_Jerusalem_as_capital_of_Israel

 

On December 8, U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson clarified that Trump's statement "did not indicate any final status for Jerusalem" and "was very clear that the final status, including the borders, would be left to the two parties to negotiate and decide" in reference to the recognition's impact on the Israeli–Palestinian peace process.

 

Trump's decision was rejected by the vast majority of world leaders; the United Nations Security Council held an emergency meeting on December 7, where 14 out of 15 members condemned it, but the motion was overturned by U.S. veto power.

36 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Part of Jerusalem. 

Sorry but every sovereign nation has the right to determine their capitol.

 

Do you think Palestine should also be a Sovereign nation -  if not, why?

58 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

. Roughly for that a Jew is a person who had a Jewish mother but there are other ways for converts, non Jewish spouses including same sex spouses, etc.

I waited a bit to see if anyone came with the correct answer.

 

Anyone who have converted, have equal right to emigrate to Israel.

 

"The Law of Return, 1950 (hereinafter - the Law of Return), and the Citizenship Law, 1952, give a Jew - defined as anyone born of a Jewish mother or who converted, and is not a member of another religion - and his family members the right to immigrate to the State of Israel and get citizenship"

 

https://www.gov.il/en/departments/about/aboutconversion

 

 

When asked what country the Western Wall is in, State Department spokeswoman Heather Nauert said "We're not taking any position on the overall boundaries. We are recognizing Jerusalem as the capital of Israel."[34]

7 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I waited a bit to see if anyone came with the correct answer.

 

Anyone who have converted, have equal right to emigrate to Israel.

 

"The Law of Return, 1950 (hereinafter - the Law of Return), and the Citizenship Law, 1952, give a Jew - defined as anyone born of a Jewish mother or who converted, and is not a member of another religion - and his family members the right to immigrate to the State of Israel and get citizenship"

 

https://www.gov.il/en/departments/about/aboutconversion

 

 

There is an interesting wrinkle which excludes a person born a Jew who is practicing another religion.

As far as I know Jewish atheists do qualify though it would likely be more diplomatic to say non-religious or secular Jew. 

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

There is an interesting wrinkle which excludes a person born a Jew who is practicing another religion.

As far as I know Jewish atheists do qualify though it would likely be more diplomatic to say non-religious or secular Jew. 

Rather discriminatory law? 

8 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Do you think Palestine should also be a Sovereign nation -  if not, why?

With conditions such as accepting the right of Israel to exist and proper security guarantees so that it doesn't result in a neighboring state developing a strong military that will destroy Israel.

The Arabs had their chance to accept the UN partition in 1948. Instead the Arab world attacked Israel. That was before a specific Palestinian Arab idenitity developed.

8 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Rather discriminatory law? 

Oh please.

Every country has a right to set their own immigration policies.

Don't be so bigoted against the one Jewish state.

There are many Islamic states but Jew hating bigots can't seem to ever accept the existence of one quite tiny Jewish state. Such hypocrisy.

Many countries have immigration rights based on descent, for example having an Italian grandparent for Italy, etc.

To add, it is my understanding that the right of return is not the only way to migrate to Israel. Such as desirable high skilled people similar to how Australia screens applicants.

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

With conditions such as accepting the right of Israel to exist and proper security guarantees so that it doesn't result in a neighboring state developing a strong military that will destroy Israel.

The Arabs had their chance to accept the UN partition in 1948. Instead the Arab world attacked Israel. That was before a specific Palestinian Arab idenitity developed.

Do you understand why the Arabs attacked them? 

 

 

Just now, Hummin said:

Do you understand why the Arabs attacked them? 

 

 

I understand they made a mistake. Of course they could have won, they were expected to win, and then all the Jew hating bigots would be happy because there never would have been an Israel. 

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Oh please.

Every country has a right to set their own immigration policies.

Don't be so bigoted against the one Jewish state.

Many countries have immigration rights based on descent, for example having an Italian grandparent for Italy, etc.

 

But this is purely dependent on religion, no other country does this - non-Jewish Palestinians, including descendants of Palestinians who were living in the territory that became Israel prior to 1948, do not have an automatic right to citizenship under the Law of Return.

16 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I waited a bit to see if anyone came with the correct answer.

 

Anyone who have converted, have equal right to emigrate to Israel.

 

"The Law of Return, 1950 (hereinafter - the Law of Return), and the Citizenship Law, 1952, give a Jew - defined as anyone born of a Jewish mother or who converted, and is not a member of another religion - and his family members the right to immigrate to the State of Israel and get citizenship"

 

https://www.gov.il/en/departments/about/aboutconversion

 

 

This discriminatory policy grants automatic citizenship and preferential treatment to Jews from around the world, while denying the same rights to Palestinians who were born in Israel or forcibly displaced during the creation of the state. This means that a Palestinian non-Jew born in Israel faces significant barriers to citizenship and equal rights, despite being a native to the land, while a Jew born in the United States or any other country is granted immediate citizenship upon arrival in Israel. This obviously  hinders any peace process or reconciliation between Israelis and Palestinians. 

4 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

 

But this is purely dependent on religion, no other country does this - non-Jewish Palestinians, including descendants of Palestinians who were living in the territory that became Israel prior to 1948, do not have an automatic right to citizenship under the Law of Return.

It is NOT based on religion. It is based on being a Jew. 

Jewish mother. The Jewish mother could have been an atheist.

Also as I said non Jewish spouses including gay ones.

Try to find that in the Islamic world. 

If Israel granted right of return to Palestinian Arabs which has been a demand from Palestinians, Israel would no longer exist. It's crystal clear that's what you and other obsessive Israel demonizers want. So nice try, no cigar. 

Just now, Jingthing said:

It is NOT based on religion. It is based on being a Jew. 

If Israel granted right of return to Palestinian Arabs which has been a demand from Palestinians, Israel would no longer exist. So nice try, no cigar. 

And therefor state of Israel should never existed in the first place, because the establishing state of Israel, automatically excluded people who lived there, and came from the area.

 

The only way Israel could exist, was because of massive deportation of people who had lived there for centuries and longer.

3 minutes ago, Hummin said:

And therefor state of Israel should never existed in the first place, because the establishing state of Israel, automatically excluded people who lived there, and came from the area.

 

The only way Israel could exist, was because of massive deportation of people who had lived there for centuries and longer.

No it didn't!

The Arabs that stayed became part of the 20 percent Arab Israeli citizens today.

Israel was never seeking 100 percent Jews. You're thinking of the Arabs that want Jew free states. 

But Israel can't continue to exist without a MAJORITY Jewish demographic.

If that offends you, so be it. That's the way it is. Israel won't commit national suicide to people to please the likes of you.

 

11 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I understand they made a mistake. Of course they could have won, they were expected to win, and then all the Jew hating bigots would be happy because there never would have been an Israel. 

Do you understand, it could had been the Palestinians who got the right of the land now called Israel? 

 

A tragic coincidence made it possible for the Jews to establish Israel, and here we are.