Israel is at War - General discussion (pt3)

[Jingthing]

21 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

And the rest of the world is telling them to stop, including the US, who support them financially and give them bombs. Even the POTUS said they were bombing indiscriminately!! 

This will not end well for Israel.  

You wish.

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Is there a reason they are targeting schools?

Not just schools, but apparently hospitals, mosques and public facilities such as water desalination plants and power stations.

It almost looks like they want to make it too difficult for them to live there after the conflict ends, hmmmmmm?

[thaibeachlovers]

7 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

 

Unfortunately, the reality is quite different, and lots of media outlets (which were traditionally rather Israel-friendly) have covered it, such as in this MSNBC article from last November:

 

Immediately there were signs that Israel viewed its military operation as not just an operation for self-defense, but for inflicting excruciating pain on Gazans. As Netanyahu vowed “mighty vengeance” that would be felt for “generations,” Israel’s defense minister announced a siege, cutting off food, water, fuel, electricity and medicine to the entire Gaza Strip as part of its bid to fight those he called “human animals.” As Israel began aerial bombardment, an IDF spokesman said that “the emphasis is on damage, and not on accuracy,” and Israel’s president insinuated that no Gazan had the rights of a civilian as he bellowed that “it is an entire nation out there that is responsible.”

https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/israel-target-civilians-gaza-fetterman-rcna123890

WOW. If MSNBC is taking a less "israel all the way" stance, can the beginning of the end for the israeli "good", Arabs "bad" BS have started? From small acorns large trees grow.

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Israel's long-term security depends on its ability to engage constructively with Palestine, uphold democratic values, and work towards a just and sustainable peace in the region. Sadly, they are not doing this and just care about getting the land, at any cost. 

Do you condone Ethnic cleaning?

The poster you quoted seems oblivious to the fact that millions of Palestinians live outside of israel where they will plan their revenge on israelis. Unless israel wants to make Gaza version 2, or more, in surrounding countries, they can't touch them.

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

And the rest of the world is telling them to stop, including the US, who support them financially and give them bombs. Even the POTUS said they were bombing indiscriminately!! 

This will not end well for Israel.  

The poster you quoted posts without a mention of the causes of October 7. It's almost as if he believes Hamas decided to do it without any reason, ignoring that the israelis treated Palestinians in an appalling fashion for decades.

[Nick Carter icp]

37 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The poster you quoted posts without a mention of the causes of October 7. It's almost as if he believes Hamas decided to do it without any reason, ignoring that the israelis treated Palestinians in an appalling fashion for decades.

 

    Maybe the poster wants to stay on topic and adheres to the request to stop giving history lessons ?

[Nick Carter icp]

4 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Israel's long-term security depends on its ability to engage constructively with Palestine, uphold democratic values, and work towards a just and sustainable peace in the region. Sadly, they are not doing this and just care about getting the land, at any cost. 

Do you condone Ethnic cleaning?

 

   That will never happen, the Palestinians will never accept Israel as a neighbour .

The only chance Israel has of living in peace is the the Palestinians to no longer be there 

80 years of them causing trouble, they need to be evicted as they are problematic neighbours

That is the only solution and hopefully a final solution to the Palestinian problem

[Bkk Brian]

The BBC taking a battering on their Israeli news coverage bias.....

 

MPs demand inquiry Gaza doctors at centre of harrowing BBC report are Hamas supporters

The BBC's director-general, Tim Davie, has acknowledged the need for action in response to these allegations, calling some of the social media posts "unacceptable." However, critics argue that more comprehensive measures are needed to address systemic bias within the organization.

https://aseannow.com/topic/1323156-mps-demand-inquiry-gaza-doctors-at-centre-of-harrowing-bbc-report-are-hamas-supporters/

 

[Jingthing]

55 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   That will never happen, the Palestinians will never accept Israel as a neighbour .

The only chance Israel has of living in peace is the the Palestinians to no longer be there 

80 years of them causing trouble, they need to be evicted as they are problematic neighbours

That is the only solution and hopefully a final solution to the Palestinian problem

That's very extremist and even if that was a good idea, it's never going to happen. But I have no answer. One state solution -- end of Israel. Two state solution -- most Palestinians would see that as a stepping stone to bullding a stronger military to then .... end Israel.

[ozimoron]

8 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

That's very extremist and even if that was a good idea, it's never going to happen. But I have no answer. One state solution -- end of Israel. Two state solution -- most Palestinians would see that as a stepping stone to bullding a stronger military to then .... end Israel.

 

The Israeli solution - a one state solution without Palestinians.

[ozimoron]

[AOC] doubled down on these comments Sunday, telling Tapper, “I think it is extremely clear and it is extremely important that all people understand the difference between people and their governments, Israelis and the Israeli government, Palestinians from Hamas.” 

 

“But what we are seeing here, I think, with a forced famine, is beyond our ability to deny or explain away. There is no targeting of Hamas in precipitating a mass famine of a million people, half of whom are children,” she continued. 

 

https://thehill.com/homenews/4552889-ocasio-cortez-defends-accusing-israel-of-genocide-i-believe-we-have-crossed-the-threshold-of-intent/

 

 

[Jingthing]

8 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

The Israeli solution - a one state solution without Palestinians.

So says you who is obsessed with demonizing Israel while ignoring the genocidal intentions of Hamas.

[Bkk Brian]

Senator John Fetterman

Israel has the right to prosecute Hamas to surrender or to be eliminated. Hamas owns every innocent death for their cowardice hiding behind Palestinian lives.

[ozimoron]

Sabri Saidam, a senior Fatah official, told me that the resignation of the government was designed to "open up the floor" to other factions - like Hamas - and give them "the space to reconsider their political stance, and their obligations in the future - and also their role, given the changes that have happened since 7 October".

 

"We have been talking to Hamas indirectly," he said. "We have restated the importance of adhering to the […] two-state solution," referring to the idea that Israelis and Palestinians could live side-by-side in separate countries.

 

"And we have received positive signs."

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68636033

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

So says you who is obsessed with demonizing Israel while ignoring the genocidal intentions of Hamas.

 

Stop being dishonest.

[Bkk Brian]

Hamas lashes out at Abbas's 'unilateral' designation of new PM

Hamas on Friday criticized the "unilateral" designation by Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas of an ally and leading business figure as prime minister with a mandate to help reform the Palestinian Authority (PA) and rebuild Gaza.

Mohammad Mustafa's appointment comes after mounting pressure to overhaul the governing body of the occupied Palestinian territories and improve governance in the occupied West Bank where it is based.

Hamas said the decision was taken without consulting it despite recently taking part in a meeting in Moscow also attended by Abbas's Fatah movement to end long-time divisions weakening Palestinian political aspirations.

https://www.newarab.com/news/hamas-lashes-out-mohammad-mustafa-designation-new-pm

[Jingthing]

9 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Senator John Fetterman

Israel has the right to prosecute Hamas to surrender or to be eliminated. Hamas owns every innocent death for their cowardice hiding behind Palestinian lives.

Love that guy. He's really pissing off the ignorant "River to the Sea" so called progressives.

[ozimoron]

23 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Love that guy. He's really pissing off the ignorant "River to the Sea" so called progressives.

 

Deputy Knesset speaker Nissim Vaturi from the ruling Likud party wrote on X, formerly known as Twitter, that Israelis had one common goal, “erasing the Gaza Strip from the face of the earth.” Israeli Heritage Minister Amichay Eliyahu, from the far-right Jewish Power party, suggested that Israel drop a nuclear bomb on Gaza and said there were “no uninvolved civilians” in the territory.

 

Lawyer Sfard appealed to the country’s attorney general earlier this month on behalf of a group of prominent Israeli figures, demanding to know why the rhetoric hasn’t been reined in.

 

https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-south-africa-genocide-hate-speech-97a9e4a84a3a6bebeddfb80f8a030724

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

Deputy Knesset speaker Nissim Vaturi from the ruling Likud party wrote on X, formerly known as Twitter, that Israelis had one common goal, “erasing the Gaza Strip from the face of the earth.” Israeli Heritage Minister Amichay Eliyahu, from the far-right Jewish Power party, suggested that Israel drop a nuclear bomb on Gaza and said there were “no uninvolved civilians” in the territory.

 

https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-south-africa-genocide-hate-speech-97a9e4a84a3a6bebeddfb80f8a030724

Cherry picking extremist quotes. Sleazy posting tactic. 

[Sigmund]

When it's Russia it's a uproar and sanctions imposed by the bully USA. But when it's a war crimes and a open genocide towards women and children in Gaza, nothing. When will the sanctions against Israel arrive ? Hamas are terrorists who are no better.

[Nick Carter icp]

12 minutes ago, Sigmund said:

When it's Russia it's a uproar and sanctions imposed by the bully USA. But when it's a war crimes and a open genocide towards women and children in Gaza, nothing. When will the sanctions against Israel arrive ? Hamas are terrorists who are no better.

 

  Because there are no war crimes happening and there isn't a genocide against woman and children .

You shouldnt believe all the pro Palestinian false propaganda .

   Israel is fighting back against terrorists , the USA supports the fight against terrorists 

[WDSmart]

12 hours ago, Jingthing said:

If they need to go after the terrorists which they do as a war goal in response to October 7, how is it possible to avoid human shields? 

By reaching an agreement about how to end this war...

[WDSmart]

12 hours ago, Jingthing said:

As far as the narrative of imbalance between Israel and Hamas, it's not as cut and dried as the Israel demonizers paint it.

Hamas through October 7 clearly BAITED Israel in to a massive response knowing that they had

 

A huge tunnel network

That taking so many hostages would complicate things

That they provided no bomb shelters for their civilians (which they could have well afforded as part of their tunnel network)

Using their age old tactic of using civilians as human shields

Knowing there would be large casualties of women and children

Knowing that it would all be on social media and  they and their Tik Tok River to the Sea agents could win a huge global propaganda victory falsely accusing Israel of genocide

 

So yes Israel is winning the military part but Hamas is winning the propaganda part and its arguable that in the long run the propaganda part may be more important.

 

For a change, I agree with everything you said above, except for the "falsely" adverb in the last point...

[WDSmart]

12 hours ago, Wobblybob said:

Are you deliberately being obtuse.

Well start blaming Hamas for putting them into that position and not Israel that has done everything possible to warn civilians of the future attacks. 

That's a bad argument. If you accepted that line of reasoning, you could blame Israel for the Oct 7 attack by saying they shouldn't have allowed an open-air concert so close to the border with Gaza. 

[Nick Carter icp]

3 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

That's a bad argument. If you accepted that line of reasoning, you could blame Israel for the Oct 7 attack by saying they shouldn't have allowed an open-air concert so close to the border with Gaza. 

 

   The October 6 th festival attendees were not being used as human shields and there was no war at the time and the terror attack was unexpected .

   There are no similarities between the festival attendees and Hamas's human shields  .

Although with hindsight, it wasn't a good idea to have a festival so close to Gaza

[WDSmart]

12 hours ago, Wobblybob said:

You will never get a truthful answer from somebody so full of hatred for Israel.

No, you (Wobblybob) will never accept an answer as being truthful if it comes from someone you think hates Israel.

[WDSmart]

11 hours ago, ozimoron said:

 

Every country stands behind it's military in time of war. During the Vietnam war I was vehemently against our participation but stood ready to do my duty if I got drafted.

 

edit: I came from a proud military family.

I did not support my country's (USA) military during the Vietnam War. I would have refused to go if I had been drafted.

 

[Hummin]

In meantime while this kindergarden of world politics wannabees, innocent people, innocent children starving, bombed, injured, dying, die, and the world continue to watch because a few countries have veto in UN Safety Council.

 

There is no humanity left if this continues! Kindergarden politics at its best

[WDSmart]

8 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Exactly. 

They need to win to survive as a nation. 

A country like the US can afford to lose wars.

Israel loses one and its over.

I agree they cannot LOSE this war, but they do not have to WIN it. They could sit down with Hamas and work out all the ceasefire/hostages/prisoners issues and then move on to creating a two-state solution. 

[Nick Carter icp]

3 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

I agree they cannot LOSE this war, but they do not have to WIN it. They could sit down with Hamas and work out all the ceasefire/hostages/prisoners issues and then move on to creating a two-state solution. 

 

   And Then they would all live happily ever after with the Palestinians and Israelis enjoying each others company and having a cup of lemon tea over the open border between the two .

   Yep, all live happily ever after