NATO should recruit Thailand, Singapore, Philippines, Japan, and more, ex-commander says

[Ben Zioner]

1 hour ago, Jiggo said:

Seen some talk about Australia joining makes sense.

Now there's no SEATO

Totally. But Israel should be there too.

[Shetraveler]

10 hours ago, ikke1959 said:

Only problem is that Thailand is no democracy, and has no liberty, no human rights and no vision of freedom... Examples more over as look in prisons how they deal with inmates, the Thaksin soap, and of course the coming dissloving of the MFP and the refusal of Pita as PM....and many more

Still, you choose to live in Thailand, despite the horrors?  Says something about you.

[eisfeld]

25 minutes ago, Schnicnac said:

Wrong, or maybe you missed that specific history lecture day. The interest to join NATO dates back to Gorbachev already. A little bit more of foresight to seize that olive branch and then integrating an "enemy" could have prevented so much of what we see today.

 

That misses the fact that it's not NATO who is asking countries to join but countries are applying for membership. It doesn't work the way you think it does. If Gorbachev wanted to join NATO then he should have applied. If Putin was sincere in his desire to join NATO he'd done a proper application. Didn't happen.

 

25 minutes ago, Schnicnac said:

The last straw was that salami-slicing-tactic of bringing Ukraine into EU/ Western fold and calling the invasion of Ukraine (yes it is an invasion by Russia) an act of defense is obviously wrong, but it is simply a way to remove a too western friendly regime that would be another pearl on the string around Russia's western border.

 

It's a joke of an excuse to invade Ukraine. It's up to Ukraine who they want to align themselves with and it's none of Russias business. On top it has achieved exactly the opposite of what would be in Russias interest. It has moved Ukraine even further away from Russia, it has made more countries join NATO and it has been the last straw when it comes to the West removing itself from Russia. The west has since WW2 tried to play nice with Russia. It has done a lot of trades. It has co-operated in science. They thought that would stop Russia from being a threat to the European countries. Russia has now shown that was a wrong assumption. They can't be trusted and they will continue to be aggressive. It's a very simple truth.

 

25 minutes ago, Schnicnac said:

In any case, fair game, when a country feels threatened by being invaded directly or by sponsored regime change operations, then yea why not ask buddies to protect you. That's what buddies do, right?

 

Yea sure. I'm pro strong countries helping smaller ones in terms of defense because otherwise a bully like Russia or China just comes and invades you like we've seen with Ukraine or with Tibet. If they were members of NATO at the time then those invasions wouldn't have happened. But it should be purely defensive in nature.

 

BTW to get a bit more on-topic again, there exists the ANZUS organization which is between Australia, New Zealand and the US. Not sure if they need to join NATO but they would be a fit.

[Gknrd]

Joke of the day

[Schnicnac]

1 minute ago, Shetraveler said:

Still, you choose to live in Thailand, despite the horrors?  Says something about you.

 

I'm also wondering often why so many moaning people linger around here, complaining about Thailand, while praising the western paradises they come from, yet make no move to follow through on what they preach... there is enough border exit points 🙂

[eisfeld]

13 minutes ago, frank83628 said:

Nato was not supposed to expant Eastward, that was the deal back in 97... so nato moved closer to Putin. and if you knew  anything. about Ukraine you would know this did't start 2 years ago!

 

Did I claim it started 2 years ago? No. So please don't make things up. NATO also did not promise any non-expansion in any way. If you know of any evidence then please link to that. Some claimed verbal promises without anything written or recorded that are only claimed by one side don't count.

[Shetraveler]

17 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

Totally. But Israel should be there too.

Why?  Israel is in the middle east, and expanding.

[Schnicnac]

3 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

 

That misses the fact that it's not NATO who is asking countries to join but countries are applying for membership. It doesn't work the way you think it does. If Gorbachev wanted to join NATO then he should have applied. If Putin was sincere in his desire to join NATO he'd done a proper application. Didn't happen.

 

 

It's a joke of an excuse to invade Ukraine. It's up to Ukraine who they want to align themselves with and it's none of Russias business. On top it has achieved exactly the opposite of what would be in Russias interest. It has moved Ukraine even further away from Russia, it has made more countries join NATO and it has been the last straw when it comes to the West removing itself from Russia. The west has since WW2 tried to play nice with Russia. It has done a lot of trades. It has co-operated in science. They thought that would stop Russia from being a threat to the European countries. Russia has now shown that was a wrong assumption. They can't be trusted and they will continue to be aggressive. It's a very simple truth.

 

 

Yea sure. I'm pro strong countries helping smaller ones in terms of defense because otherwise a bully like Russia or China just comes and invades you like we've seen with Ukraine or with Tibet. If they were members of NATO at the time then those invasions wouldn't have happened. But it should be purely defensive in nature.

 

BTW to get a bit more on-topic again, there exists the ANZUS organization which is between Australia, New Zealand and the US. Not sure if they need to join NATO but they would be a fit.

 

There is something especially people here in this part of the world call face. Filing an application to be then publicly rejected or openly played with, yes even more humiliating when the USSR was just falling apart. Again, if the puppet masters at NATO had any honest foresight and streamlined the "application process" they wouldn't need to shiver now for Europe having turned into a warzone.  

 

As other posters pointed out, there was a tacit understanding NATO would not expand eastwards, yet had done so without hitting the breaks and now even fantasizing about offices in Tokyo.

 

Look, even for Taiwan you seem to miss the point that there is a significant percentage of the populace supporting the very party that sees Taiwan as part of China... so what are US troops there for? Also encirclement (along with South Korea, Japan, Philippines and cozying up to Vietnam which it just bombed along with Laos a few decades ago?

 

There is something called Karma, in Oz it's called boomerang. Time well tell 🙂

 

[Jiggo]

32 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

Totally. But Israel should be there too.

And Egypt MFO

[sikishrory]

Calm down buddy

[eisfeld]

26 minutes ago, Schnicnac said:

There is something especially people here in this part of the world call face. Filing an application to be then publicly rejected or openly played with, yes even more humiliating when the USSR was just falling apart. Again, if the puppet masters at NATO had any honest foresight and streamlined the "application process" they wouldn't need to shiver now for Europe having turned into a warzone.  

 

So you are suggesting that some vague play on feelings and corrupting themselves and bend their rules would have been the right way to go about it. Playing it the russian way. Yea nope. It is purely on Putin to have fscked that up. What's so difficult to just play by the rules? He can't. It's not in his nature. He's a spy turned dictator. How can we even expect him to be a well meaning leader? Don't think NATO is shivering. If Russia would be so stupid as to attack any NATO country then that's the end of Russia. The size of and capabilities of the two are not even remotely similar. Russia is already struggling with Ukraine which is a thousand times easier target. In fact it has just exposed their own incapabilities and weekness. Putin even had one of his own men march on him and nearly got to Moscow. What a joke.

26 minutes ago, Schnicnac said:

As other posters pointed out, there was a tacit understanding NATO would not expand eastwards, yet had done so without hitting the breaks and now even fantasizing about offices in Tokyo.

 

One side claims there was such an understanding. The other side disagrees. And that's nothing new. If you really think that such a guarantee would be as important as to the breach justifying an invasion of another country then you'd think the least they'd ask for is to put it in writing. Curiously no single treaty mentions anything like that. Weird hu? But now suddenly it's sooooo important and we feel sooooo betrayed by the evil west who is looring all those little countries into their evil evil defense pact. Now we must crush them!

26 minutes ago, Schnicnac said:

Look, even for Taiwan you seem to miss the point that there is a significant percentage of the populace supporting the very party that sees Taiwan as part of China... so what are US troops there for? Also encirclement (along with South Korea, Japan, Philippines and cozying up to Vietnam which it just bombed along with Laos a few decades ago?

 

It's a democracy. The majority does not see themselves as part of China. End of story. Same <deleted> as in Ukraine. Some part of the population is pro Russia so Russia can just go and take it. BS. The US troops are there by Taiwans invitation for Taiwans defense against an invasion. Why do I need to explain that even? None of the countries you listed have ambitions to invade China. Nobody threatens China. China is not encircled. Neither is Russia. It's Russia and China who are doing the invading.

 

The two top ranking dictators in human history when it comes to people killed are Chinese (Mao) and Russian (Stalin). They killed many more of their own people than Hitler even killed enemies. Several times over. Maybe countries are a little bit afraid of what these two countries might do given all their recent aggressions.

Edited April 11 by eisfeld

[ericthai]

9 hours ago, DjSilver said:

Haha, what a joke, everyone knows that Thailand is Chinas puppet. If China says jump, than Thailand says yes Master and jumps 🤣

actually Thailand takes what it can get from anyone and is always playing both sides of the fence. 

[Schnicnac]

1 minute ago, eisfeld said:

 

So you are suggesting that some vague play on feelings and corrupting themselves and bend their rules would have been the right way to go about it. Playing it the russian way. Yea nope. It is purely on Putin to have fscked that up. What's so difficult to just play by the rules? He can't. It's not in his nature. He's a spy turned dictator. How can we even expect him to be a well meaning leader? Don't think NATO is shivering. If Russia would be so stupid as to attack any NATO country then that's the end of Russia. The size of and capabilities of the two are not even remotely similar. Russia is already struggling with Ukraine which is a thousand times easier target. In fact it has just exposed their own incapabilities and weekness. Putin even had one of his own men march on him and nearly got to Moscow. What a joke.

 

One side claims there was such an understanding. The other side disagrees. And that's nothing new. If you really think that such a guarantee would be as important as to the breach justifying an invasion of another country then you'd think the least they'd ask for is to put it in writing. Curiously no single treaty mentions anything like that. Weird hu? But now suddenly it's sooooo important and we feel sooooo betrayed by the evil west who is looring all those little countries into their evil evil defense pact. Now we must crush them!

 

It's a democracy. The majority does not see themselves as part of China. End of story. Same <deleted> as in Ukraine. Some part of the population is pro Russia so Russia can just go and take it. BS. The US troops are there by Taiwans invitation for Taiwans defense against an invasion. Why do I need to explain that even? None of the countries you listed have ambitions to invade China. Nobody threatens China. China is not encircled. Neither is Russia. It's Russia and China who are doing the invading.

 

The two top ranking dictators in human history when it comes to people killed are Chinese (Mao) and Stalin. They killed many more of their own people than Hitler even killed enemies. Several times over. Maybe countries are a little bit afraid of what these two countries might do given all their recent aggressions.

 

Yes, it might be incredible for some people from across the pond (or continent for that matter) without any slightest cultural nor linguistic insight into how others may think, nevertheless we'd be hard-pressed to find a country that would take public humiliation diplomatically lightly 🙂

 

Since you mention treaties, I'm not aware of any treaty in which Russia recognized the pattern of its borders with Ukraine. Yes it recognizes there are borders, but how are the exactly defined? That hasn't been solved since 1991.

 

The reason that the US has troops stationed in Taiwan is simply to access world class computer chips, deny China an unsinkable carrier, and prolong its meddling into a civil war by backing the losing side which since then has evolved into a vibrant democracy. It's all about stopping Chinas rise as superpower, clinging onto its decades long preeminent leadership in global affairs which is now waning by the day, with the majority of jurisdictions across planet earth having China already as their most important trading partner.

 

Certainly they did not put troops there because Taiwan is a democracy. This is just laughable "good guy" marketing propaganda many of the wannabe self-entitled folks in the west with their narrow opinion corridors fall for as well (since the US didn't bother about the authoritarian leadership under the KMT there during the Cold War either).

 

 

6 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

 

So you are suggesting that some vague play on feelings and corrupting themselves and bend their rules would have been the right way to go about it. Playing it the russian way. Yea nope. It is purely on Putin to have fscked that up. What's so difficult to just play by the rules? He can't. It's not in his nature. He's a spy turned dictator. How can we even expect him to be a well meaning leader? Don't think NATO is shivering. If Russia would be so stupid as to attack any NATO country then that's the end of Russia. The size of and capabilities of the two are not even remotely similar. Russia is already struggling with Ukraine which is a thousand times easier target. In fact it has just exposed their own incapabilities and weekness. Putin even had one of his own men march on him and nearly got to Moscow. What a joke.

 

One side claims there was such an understanding. The other side disagrees. And that's nothing new. If you really think that such a guarantee would be as important as to the breach justifying an invasion of another country then you'd think the least they'd ask for is to put it in writing. Curiously no single treaty mentions anything like that. Weird hu? But now suddenly it's sooooo important and we feel sooooo betrayed by the evil west who is looring all those little countries into their evil evil defense pact. Now we must crush them!

 

It's a democracy. The majority does not see themselves as part of China. End of story. Same <deleted> as in Ukraine. Some part of the population is pro Russia so Russia can just go and take it. BS. The US troops are there by Taiwans invitation for Taiwans defense against an invasion. Why do I need to explain that even? None of the countries you listed have ambitions to invade China. Nobody threatens China. China is not encircled. Neither is Russia. It's Russia and China who are doing the invading.

 

The two top ranking dictators in human history when it comes to people killed are Chinese (Mao) and Stalin. They killed many more of their own people than Hitler even killed enemies. Several times over. Maybe countries are a little bit afraid of what these two countries might do given all their recent aggressions.

 

[eisfeld]

5 minutes ago, Schnicnac said:

Yes, it might be incredible for some people from across the pond (or continent for that matter) without any slightest cultural nor linguistic insight into how others may think, nevertheless we'd be hard-pressed to find a country that would take public humiliation diplomatically lightly 🙂

 

Corrupting yourself and bending rules to please someone who doesn't want to play by them without good reason is not a good justification. Neither are any of Russias justifications for the invasion. Either there are rules or there aren't. The West don't want to end up like a corrupt country like Russia.

7 minutes ago, Schnicnac said:

Since you mention treaties, I'm not aware of any treaty in which Russia recognized the pattern of its borders with Ukraine. Yes it recognizes there are borders, but how are the exactly defined? That hasn't been solved since 1991

 

Well you might want to look up the "Treaty on Friendship, Cooperation, and Partnership between Ukraine and the Russian Federation" signed by Russia and Ukraine in 1997 which settled the border question. Your claim that it hasn't been solved since 1991 is flat out wrong. Russia decided to violate the treaty when it started its war in 2014 and annexation of crimea.

12 minutes ago, Schnicnac said:

The reason that the US has troops stationed in Taiwan is simply to access world class computer chips, deny China an unsinkable carrier, and prolong its meddling into a civil war by backing the losing side which since then has evolved into a vibrant democracy

 

Sorry what? The US had troops in Taiwan before anything we call today a computer was even a thing. The US put troops there to stop Chinas continued efforts of fighting with Taiwan. They helped end the civil war. China doesn't want to let go and wants to crush the democracy and absorb Taiwan completely. The only thing stopping China from doing so is the threat of the US entering into war if China would pull the trigger on an invasion. Taiwan just wants to be left alone and live in peace. Why can't China allow that?

[Schnicnac]

14 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

 

Corrupting yourself and bending rules to please someone who doesn't want to play by them without good reason is not a good justification. Neither are any of Russias justifications for the invasion. Either there are rules or there aren't. The West don't want to end up like a corrupt country like Russia.

 

Well you might want to look up the "Treaty on Friendship, Cooperation, and Partnership between Ukraine and the Russian Federation" signed by Russia and Ukraine in 1997 which settled the border question. Your claim that it hasn't been solved since 1991 is flat out wrong. Russia decided to violate the treaty when it started its war in 2014 and annexation of crimea.

 

Sorry what? The US had troops in Taiwan before anything we call today a computer was even a thing. The US put troops there to stop Chinas continued efforts of fighting with Taiwan. They helped end the civil war. China doesn't want to let go and wants to crush the democracy and absorb Taiwan completely. The only thing stopping China from doing so is the threat of the US entering into war if China would pull the trigger on an invasion. Taiwan just wants to be left alone and live in peace. Why can't China allow that?

 

 

🤣 

[Andrew65]

This would mean European powers committing to the defence of countries 6,000 miles away. 

[Iron Tongue]

3 hours ago, Schnicnac said:

Look, even for Taiwan you seem to miss the point that there is a significant percentage of the populace supporting the very party that sees Taiwan as part of China... so what are US troops there for? Also encirclement (along with South Korea, Japan, Philippines and cozying up to Vietnam which it just bombed along with Laos a few decades ago?

No there isn't.

You are just regurgitating Chinese propaganda.

The Taiwanese wish to remain free and Taiwanese, and have never considered themselves as part of China.

The results of multiple elections in democratic Taiwan, from local to Presidential prove you are incredibly incorrect.

[Iron Tongue]

What a dumb article.

So if Russia invaded Romania, Thailand should send troops and material to fight and die in Europe?

I doubt that most Thais could name 5-members of NATO, they certainly shouldn't fight for them.

 

[kiwikeith]

14 hours ago, pegman said:

Well this admiral went to work for the Carlyle Group which is heavily invested in the American military industrial complex. NATO expansion is a long running scam. Each new NATO country must conform to NATO standards for all their mutations.  Corrupt politicians who receive campaign contributions from munitions manufacturers pay them back by creating these new customers.  

Blackrocks baby. 

[eisfeld]

2 hours ago, Schnicnac said:

 

 

🤣

 

I see you ran out of arguments and propaganda talking points with only a silly smiley left. I guess getting yourself caught with your history pants down regarding the border treaty was a bit much. But hey, you're welcome 🙂

[ericthai]

11 hours ago, soalbundy said:

Exactly, what??? Democracy, like communism, is a philosophy, a theory, they don't exist in reality. Asians have their own philosophies and are doing nicely thank you, they don't need Caucasians to drag them into their wars. Australia and NZ aren't Asian societies and already cooperate with the West....AUKUS and the 5 eyes are examples. Japan, South Korea and the Philippines already brush shoulders with the US while keeping their respective Asian identities while Thailand is pragmatic, dodging and weaving, shadow boxing and placating, it serves them well. Keep your cold wars and arms races in the labyrinths they are already locked in and don't make the world even more dangerous than it already is. Nato, i.e. the US caused the Ukraine/Russian war by poking the bear in this region for years, talks of Nato and EU membership (against all agreements) were the last straw but it's never the US that suffers the consequences.

Please tell me how the US in not facing consequences from the Ukraine war? The US is sending billions upon billions to help Ukraine fight off an invader.

How is NATO a threat to Russia? NATO is an agreement between nations to support each other if invaded. If Russia has no plans to invade anyone why does he need to worry about NATO?

 

[SAFETY FIRST]

16 hours ago, webfact said:

suggested the military alliance recruit Asia-Pacific countries that share ‘its vision of freedom’

I'd like to see more training for these guys first. 

 

 

 

Edited April 11 by SAFETY FIRST

[Schnicnac]

5 hours ago, Iron Tongue said:

No there isn't.

You are just regurgitating Chinese propaganda.

The Taiwanese wish to remain free and Taiwanese, and have never considered themselves as part of China.

The results of multiple elections in democratic Taiwan, from local to Presidential prove you are incredibly incorrect.

 

You just seem to miss the point that the KMT plus allied parties have a significant voter base... and it just so happened this week the former KMT leader just showed up in Beijing. Tip: a quick check what they stand for may quickly lead to some more enlightenment outside of CNN 🙂

 

 

[Schnicnac]

5 hours ago, eisfeld said:

 

I see you ran out of arguments and propaganda talking points with only a silly smiley left. I guess getting yourself caught with your history pants down regarding the border treaty was a bit much. But hey, you're welcome 🙂

 

Just had a good laugh at your euro-centric school knowledge with the occasional wikipedia backups you are ardently googling for, followed by post edits 🙂

 

The Ukraine-Russia border demarcation topic is a bit more nuanced than you may believe. Again it has not been solved, and no some bilateral murky agreements don't do that either 🙂 There is a good article on Chatham House about this topic you may look up. 

 

Also I regret to disappoint you but the Civil War in China didn't end because of the US, I don't know in which propaganda school they teach this 🤣 Yes the US helped ending World War by nuking not just one, but two entire cities in Japan, and US military advised KMT leaders (while also establishing links to Mao btw), but troops that stopped the war.... 🤣 Only with the onset of the Korean War the US decided to not let the KMT go down in history and protect the losing party of the civil war that fled to Taiwan and has then used that ever since against Mainland China. Yes even the Republic of China in Taiwan represented the Whole of China in the UN and the Security Council, so guess everyone acknowledged Taiwan as part of a Greater China 🙂Didn't matter much that the regime that fled to Taiwan was authoritarian and not kind to indigenous tribes, but hey, it's a buddy so then "democracy" doesn't matter so much 🙂

 

And yes, while most people prefer the current status quo vs anything else, the respective camps and their voter bases have their own preferences on how to go from there and this is what I recommend to look at for those who are not so firm in the miniscule details of dynamics there...

 

 

5 hours ago, eisfeld said:

 

I see you ran out of arguments and propaganda talking points with only a silly smiley left. I guess getting yourself caught with your history pants down regarding the border treaty was a bit much. But hey, you're welcome 🙂

 

[soalbundy]

3 hours ago, ericthai said:

Please tell me how the US in not facing consequences from the Ukraine war? The US is sending billions upon billions to help Ukraine fight off an invader.

How is NATO a threat to Russia? NATO is an agreement between nations to support each other if invaded. If Russia has no plans to invade anyone why does he need to worry about NATO?

 

It was Henry Kissinger who said, "To be an enemy of America is dangerous but to be its friend is fatal."

Let us start with the premise that no major power is benevolent. If we take an old democracy like the UK we can see that during its long history it has invaded more countries than any other nation.

When you say the US which US are you referring to? The industrial military complex, the government, CIA, its Central bank, the FED, Wall street, all of whom have enormous power, or the ordinary people who have no power in the daily workings of government.?

People are like sheep, they are easy to manipulate, every government is aware of the power of propaganda through the media which is controlled by the elite for their own nefarious purposes. 'America bad, Russia good', 'Russia bad, America good'. It is impossible for the normal citizen to see beyond the curtain of lies propagated by every country and government. As Churchill once said, "A lie can travel half way around the world before truth has its boots on'' The truth doesn't matter, perception is everything. Mccarthyism, 'reds under the bed' is a typical example of how the Industrial military complex was able to make vast amounts of money (and still does) by fearmongering, dissenters were classed as communists. Likewise the Soviet governments (the elite) were able to keep their grip on power by identifying the West as fascists who wanted to destroy the 'workers paradise'. Both the Soviets and the US have crushed the will of the ordinary people worldwide if they dared to vote for a system that brought them out of their respective control, the CIA and MI6 were veritable experts at the subtle undermining of the peoples will while the Soviets were unashamed at using brute force.

Some have made a lot of money from the Ukraine/Russian war but not the tax payer (sheep). It has caused turbulence in the whole world, increasing inflation and interrupting supply chains for industry. Nato (America) (the elite not the people) seeks to widen its sphere of influence and Russia (the elite not the people) perceives itself as threatened.

Georgia was offered Nato membership, Russia invades, Ukraine in talks regarding Nato and EU membership, Russia invades. America put rockets in Turkey, Russia puts rockets in Cuba....the Cuban crisis. It's poking the bear, it doesn't end well. Nobody asked a farmer in America or Russia for their opinion because if the truth be known all they want is to get on with their lives. Ukraine is a pawn, a plaything.

[Schnicnac]

27 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

It was Henry Kissinger who said, "To be an enemy of America is dangerous but to be its friend is fatal."

Let us start with the premise that no major power is benevolent. If we take an old democracy like the UK we can see that during its long history it has invaded more countries than any other nation.

When you say the US which US are you referring to? The industrial military complex, the government, CIA, its Central bank, the FED, Wall street, all of whom have enormous power, or the ordinary people who have no power in the daily workings of government.?

People are like sheep, they are easy to manipulate, every government is aware of the power of propaganda through the media which is controlled by the elite for their own nefarious purposes. 'America bad, Russia good', 'Russia bad, America good'. It is impossible for the normal citizen to see beyond the curtain of lies propagated by every country and government. As Churchill once said, "A lie can travel half way around the world before truth has its boots on'' The truth doesn't matter, perception is everything. Mccarthyism, 'reds under the bed' is a typical example of how the Industrial military complex was able to make vast amounts of money (and still does) by fearmongering, dissenters were classed as communists. Likewise the Soviet governments (the elite) were able to keep their grip on power by identifying the West as fascists who wanted to destroy the 'workers paradise'. Both the Soviets and the US have crushed the will of the ordinary people worldwide if they dared to vote for a system that brought them out of their respective control, the CIA and MI6 were veritable experts at the subtle undermining of the peoples will while the Soviets were unashamed at using brute force.

Some have made a lot of money from the Ukraine/Russian war but not the tax payer (sheep). It has caused turbulence in the whole world, increasing inflation and interrupting supply chains for industry. Nato (America) (the elite not the people) seeks to widen its sphere of influence and Russia (the elite not the people) perceives itself as threatened.

Georgia was offered Nato membership, Russia invades, Ukraine in talks regarding Nato and EU membership, Russia invades. America put rockets in Turkey, Russia puts rockets in Cuba....the Cuban crisis. It's poking the bear, it doesn't end well. Nobody asked a farmer in America or Russia for their opinion because if the truth be known all they want is to get on with their lives. Ukraine is a pawn, a plaything.

 

Well said

[ChaiyaTH]

Good luck with that NATO, and the world, it seems our foreign prime minister will be the new chief of NATO soon, and he sucks trust me (Netherlands). He is the perfect guy to help with the start of a WW3 too.

Edited April 12 by ChaiyaTH

[frank83628]

11 hours ago, eisfeld said:

It's a democracy. The majority does not see themselves as part of China. End of story. Same <deleted> as in Ukraine. Some part of the population is pro Russia so Russia can just go and take it. BS. The US troops are there by Taiwans invitation for Taiwans defense against an invasion. Why do I need to explain that even? None of the countries you listed have ambitions to invade China. Nobody threatens China. China is not encircled. Neither is Russia. It's Russia and China who are doing the invading.

 

The two top ranking dictators in human history when it comes to people killed are Chinese (Mao) and Russian (Stalin). They killed many more of their own people than Hitler even killed enemies. Several times over. Maybe countries are a little bit afraid of what these two countries might do given all their recent aggressions.

seems to be a lot more US bases round China then there are Chinese bases around the US.

how many countries have the US invaded in the last 30rs compared to Russia and China?

 

 keep Russia and China as the evil dictators to the public with lies and propaganda, it's called manufacturing consent.

 

[frank83628]

13 hours ago, Jingthing said:

It's impossible to know that.

according to all the western propaganda he was dying of cancer 2 years ago and numerous other illnesses!

[Gweiloman]

7 hours ago, eisfeld said:

 

I see you ran out of arguments and propaganda talking points with only a silly smiley left. I guess getting yourself caught with your history pants down regarding the border treaty was a bit much. But hey, you're welcome 🙂

You have really embraced all the western propaganda and washed it down with tonnes of kool aid. If ever there’s such a thing as a paid shill, you are it.

 

All your arguments are straight out of the playbooks of the NED, RWB/RSF, USAID etc. To you, it’s ok for the US and it’s puppets to surround China and Russia with military bases but … Munro Doctrine ring any bells?

 

To you, China and Russia are aggressors and bullies but which country has over 800 military bases around the world and which countries have been involved in more wars in the last few decades than China and Russia (and probably many other countries) combined? I of course know your response to that so you can save yourself some energy and no need to answer.

 

Is Taiwan part of China? There is an uninformed poster who states that the Taiwanese don’t consider themselves part of China. There’s a clue in its name; Republic of China. 
 

The global majority sees very clearly what the US is trying to do. Cling onto its declining hegemony but still caught up in its hubris and ignorance. It’s only a matter time before the new world order and multipolarity and the peace that it hopefully brings will come to fruition.