Who said you bank/s aren't passing on your information to governments. Expats be advised !

[KhunHeineken]

12 minutes ago, Roo Island said:

If you access their website or send an email, they know your ip address

The IP address is not the issue.  I can VPN back to my own house in Australia. 

 

It's where the transfers are going, and who to. 

 

Also, possibly for Australians in the near future, in a similar way to Thailand, immigration will know an Australian is outside of Australia for 183 days and inform the Australian Tax Office.  As discussed in the Australia forum, those chances are on their way. 

Edited June 8 by KhunHeineken

[John49]

If we are talking about exchange of such information between say Singapore and Australia, then all information available can, or will be exchanged in the near future.

 

Talking about exchange of such information between Thailand and say Australia – from what my Thai accountant told me in Bangkok – at present, there would be nil response from Thailand to any overseas request.

 

My guess is that it will be years before such a level of cooperation is achieved, some high level criminal activity excepted.

[EVENKEEL]

On 6/4/2024 at 7:59 PM, BritManToo said:

The obvious answer is not to tell your bank you live overseas.

People just talk too much. I'm just on an extended vacation in Thailand. I pay all the requires taxes, pay car registration, car Ins. in my home country.

[digbeth]

On 6/5/2024 at 10:18 AM, timendres said:

It is interesting.

The gold sitting in my safe is not asking me to fill out any forms, nor is it reporting itself to any government agency...

 

try buying lots of gold in one lot and see how the shops have to report you

[JohnnyBD]

10 hours ago, Roo Island said:

If you access their website or send an email, they know your ip address

Thanks to whoever invented VPN. I use the VPN in my home country so my financial institutions and any government agencies will not know when I'm out of the country.

[JBChiangRai]

A few years ago, I had a call from my UK bank and they asked me where I was tax resident, and I told them the UK.

 

It's not a smart move to tell them you are tax resident in Thailand (or stay in Thailand >180 days per year).

 

The bank doesn't care whether what you tell them is true, they just need to know to comply with local regulations.

 

I have wondered if it's possible for me to be tax resident nowhere, that would be very useful.

[MangoKorat]

All this information sharing/anti money laundering aimed at 'normal' people must cost the governments/financial institutions of the countries involved, trillions! Probably far more than they actually retrieve.

 

How dare us 'normal' lowlifes try to avoid paying tax on money we have probably already been taxed on? How dare Brits try to maintain a UK address to avoid their pension being frozen?

 

Meanwhile, the real tax evaders, the 'fat cats' and 'oligarchs' - even country leaders, employ armies of 'advisers' and accountants to move their money around using networks of 'shell companies' and 'tax havens' to avoid paying tax.

 

Global companies locate their registered headquarters in zero/low tax domains then send 'management charges' forward that negate any profits made by their subsidiary companies in the countries where their actual income is received. I suspect that a 'shop floor' worker in such companies probably pays more tax than their chairman.  All of this mind, is totally legal and the countries where the money is 'hidden' do not share information with anyone.

 

Anyone remember The Panama Papers?

 

Drug cartels shift their money through unregulated crypto currencies to avod detection and then 'wash' it by forming companies that buy and sell properties on a massive scale. Don't they then have to pay tax on any 'washed' profits they make?  See the paragraph above.

 

Never mind though, we can all sleep easy knowing our law enforcement/tax authorities are busy working away to locate those nasty tax evading expats living just above the breadline in countries such as Thailand. The same people that have probably paid tax all their lives! 

 

One only has to glance through The Panama Papers to see what goes on above the heads of us minions.

 

 

Edited June 9 by MangoKorat

[Galong]

45 minutes ago, MangoKorat said:

Meanwhile, the real tax evaders, the 'fat cats' and 'oligarchs' - even country leaders, employ armies of 'advisers' and accountants to move their money around using networks of 'shell companies' and 'tax havens' to avoid paying tax.

 

Global companies locate their registered headquarters in zero/low tax domains then send 'management charges' forward that negate any profits made by their subsidiary companies in the countries where their actual income is received. I suspect that a 'shop floor' worker in such companies probably pays more tax than their chairman.  All of this mind, is totally legal and the countries where the money is 'hidden' do not share information with anyone.

 

 

Yes, ALL energy should be spent going after the REAL criminals instead of us working stiffs.  Casting a net over the ocean to catch a certain few fish is both insane and the certain fish have been warned and are probably taking measures to avoid the net. 

[Doctor Tom]

16 hours ago, Roo Island said:

If you access their website or send an email, they know your ip address

I do neither of those things.,  I also have a private, discrete  IP on my VPN.  

[KhunHeineken]

9 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

The bank doesn't care whether what you tell them is true, they just need to know to comply with local regulations.

And if what you tell your bank doesn't match up with immigration records????????  You just made a false declaration. 

 

9 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

I have wondered if it's possible for me to be tax resident nowhere, that would be very useful.

Those days are coming to an end. 

Edited June 9 by KhunHeineken

[KhunHeineken]

4 hours ago, Doctor Tom said:

I do neither of those things.,  I also have a private, discrete  IP on my VPN.  

So do I, but how does using a VPN get around immigration records that show you are not in the country?  

[Doctor Tom]

21 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

So do I, but how does using a VPN get around immigration records that show you are not in the country?  

Okay, firstly, there are no immigration records that record UK departures, that was abandoned years ago.  Unless you tell the authorizes where you are, there is no mechanism available to them to find out.  My discrete private IP I use to, for example,  file a UK tax return, its another level of privacy for me.  I value freedom from any kind of scrutiny by the UK, what I do and where I am is none of their business. 

[JBChiangRai]

10 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

A few years ago, I had a call from my UK bank and they asked me where I was tax resident, and I told them the UK.

 

It's not a smart move to tell them you are tax resident in Thailand (or stay in Thailand >180 days per year).

 

The bank doesn't care whether what you tell them is true, they just need to know to comply with local regulations.

 

I have wondered if it's possible for me to be tax resident nowhere, that would be very useful.

 

40 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

And if what you tell your bank doesn't match up with immigration records????????  You just made a false declaration. 

 

Those days are coming to an end. 

 

No, I haven't made a false declaration.

 

My UK bank asked me where I was tax resident, I told them UK.  That's an elective choice.  I chose to remain tax resident in the UK.

 

They didn't ask the question "Should I be tax resident in another country? eg Thailand".

[Liverpool Lou]

58 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

Okay, firstly, there are no immigration records that record UK departures, that was abandoned years ago.

But that doesn't mean that if the UK authorities want to know they have no way of checking on who has left the UK.  They know - or can easily find out. 

[Liverpool Lou]

On 6/7/2024 at 11:50 AM, 4MyEgo said:

I have done that just this moment, explaining them that I am a resident, but not a resident for tax purposes as I do not have an assessable income, and am not required to lodge a tax return, nor am I required to have a TIN.

What you are not understanding is that you are a resident here for tax purposes even though you pay no tax at the moment.  That you have no current tax liability does not exclude you from being resident for tax purposes.

[Doctor Tom]

23 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

But that doesn't mean that if the UK authorities want to know they have no way of checking on who has left the UK.  They know - or can easily find out. 

Pray tell us how? They cannot find out. because that information is not recorded and stored anywhere .  

[Liverpool Lou]

3 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

28 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

But that doesn't mean that if the UK authorities want to know they have no way of checking on who has left the UK.  They know - or can easily find out. 

Pray tell us how? They cannot find out. because that information is not recorded and stored anywhere . 

Pray tell?  Huh?    You think?   How do you leave the country...using what means?  

[save the frogs]

11 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

Meanwhile, the real tax evaders, the 'fat cats' and 'oligarchs' - even country leaders, employ armies of 'advisers' and accountants to move their money around using networks of 'shell companies' and 'tax havens' to avoid paying tax.

 

But taxes help avoid corruption. Cops need to be well-paid or they wont protect the average person. 

 

Let's face it. No one here is a genius economist to determine how govts should collect taxes and distribute them fairly. 

So I'm not sure I'm on board with "vigilante tax villains" taking matters into their own hands with fake IP addresses.

 

Tax system seems fair enough to me. It's the ones making over 60K paying a lot of tax ... and so what? How much do you need to horde?

You can always work less if you're paying too much tax. 

And horde less useless crap. 

 

 

[Doctor Tom]

3 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Pray tell?  Huh?    You think?   How do you leave the country...using what means?  

Airline and ship PNRs are kept for 90 days.  Private flights are not kept at all. GA flights are not recorded by name bar the pilot and are not kept after the flight plan expires. There is no search facility available across data bases to find a particular individual, bar those used by the Security Services and Interpol, who are hardly looking for Joe Bloggs on holiday. The Home Office can only estimate emigration numbers, which by definition, will be highly inaccurate.  UK is way behind Thailand in knowing where immigrants are and how many have left.  Its pathetic but true. 

[MangoKorat]

37 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

 

But taxes help avoid corruption. Cops need to be well-paid or they wont protect the average person. 

 

Let's face it. No one here is a genius economist to determine how govts should collect taxes and distribute them fairly. 

So I'm not sure I'm on board with "vigilante tax villains" taking matters into their own hands with fake IP addresses.

 

Tax system seems fair enough to me. It's the ones making over 60K paying a lot of tax ... and so what? How much do you need to horde?

You can always work less if you're paying too much tax. 

And horde less useless crap. 

 

 

My point is that most low, middle and even high earners pay their taxes. The super rich find ways of paying very little or not paying any at all. 60K?  Some of these people earn in excess of 60 million.

[KhunHeineken]

6 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

 

 

No, I haven't made a false declaration.

 

My UK bank asked me where I was tax resident, I told them UK.  That's an elective choice.  I chose to remain tax resident in the UK.

 

They didn't ask the question "Should I be tax resident in another country? eg Thailand".

I'm not a Brit.  So happy to learn from you. 

 

So, you can live in Thailand for say 10 years, and tell your bank / government, or both, that you are still a tax resident of the UK, despite immigration records showing you have not been back to the UK in 10 years. Is this correct? 

[KhunHeineken]

7 hours ago, Doctor Tom said:

Okay, firstly, there are no immigration records that record UK departures, that was abandoned years ago.  Unless you tell the authorizes where you are, there is no mechanism available to them to find out.  My discrete private IP I use to, for example,  file a UK tax return, its another level of privacy for me.  I value freedom from any kind of scrutiny by the UK, what I do and where I am is none of their business. 

Once again, I am not a Brit, so happy to learn, but I read on this website about "pension locks" or "pension freezes" for Brit's living overseas.  Wouldn't that mean the government knows you are outside of the UK, thus lock / freeze the pension? 

 

I won't go into the whole Brexit / Schengen area thing, but I would have thought flights out to non Schengen countries would see immigration recording a Brit leaving the UK / Europe.  

 

Also, if they don't record departures, as you say, they certainly must record arrivals, so how can one "arrive" when they have never "departed?" 

 

I would be interested in where / how you renew your Brit passport, given that you never "departed." 

[JBChiangRai]

In this the computer age, I am sure departures and arrivals are recorded and kept in perpetuity.

[JBChiangRai]

4 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

I'm not a Brit.  So happy to learn from you. 

 

So, you can live in Thailand for say 10 years, and tell your bank / government, or both, that you are still a tax resident of the UK, despite immigration records showing you have not been back to the UK in 10 years. Is this correct? 

 

Yes that's correct.

 

In the UK you are automatically a tax resident if you live there, if you don't and are a British subject, you can elect to be a tax resident.

[Ben Zioner]

10 hours ago, save the frogs said:

Tax system seems fair enough to me. It's the ones making over 60K paying a lot of tax ... and so what? How much do you need to horde?

I just don't like the hordes takings my hard earned cash.  And I don't get your statement "60K" what does this mean? I make THB 4M and I am not hoarding a Satang. 

[Doctor Tom]

6 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

Wouldn't that mean the government knows you are outside of the UK, thus lock / freeze the pension? 

Only if you tell them

 

Also, if they don't record departures, as you say, they certainly must record arrivals, so how can one "arrive" when they have never "departed?" 

 

Good question. but they cant cross check with the system they have in place. 

[dddave]

On 6/5/2024 at 9:59 AM, BritManToo said:

The obvious answer is not to tell your bank you live overseas.

I don't know about the UK but as far as the US is concerned, one has to be very careful about making any kind of inaccurate statement on an official form, either governmental or financial.  It's prosecutable, as Hunter Biden has found out.

 

[jerrymahoney]

NB

 

United States - Information on residency for tax purposes *
Section I – Criteria for Individuals to be considered a tax resident

As a general matter, under the U.S. Internal Revenue Code (Code), all U.S. citizens and U.S. residents are treated as U.S. tax residents.

 

NB2 All my USofA banks know where I am as, when I log in at 9 AM Thai time, they say:

"Good morning, Jerry'

 

* https://www.oecd.org/tax/automatic-exchange/crs-implementation-and-assistance/tax-residency/United-States-Tax-Residency.pdf

Edited June 10 by jerrymahoney

[4MyEgo]

14 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

What you are not understanding is that you are a resident here for tax purposes even though you pay no tax at the moment.  That you have no current tax liability does not exclude you from being resident for tax purposes.

 

Your point being ?

 

What you are not understanding is that regardless of residency status, I do not fit into their basket as a tax resident because I do not have an assessable income, meaning that I am not required to register for a TIN or lodge a tax return, simple really, in other words, if I was deriving an income, I would have to register for a TIN and lodge a tax return.

 

Does this register for you now ?

[KhunHeineken]

4 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

 

Yes that's correct.

 

In the UK you are automatically a tax resident if you live there, if you don't and are a British subject, you can elect to be a tax resident.

So, by volunteering to remain a tax resident of the UK, you would be looking at utilizing the UK's DTA with Thailand in order to not have the same money taxed twice.  Is this correct?  If so, wouldn't the goal be to not have the money taxed at all, either in the UK and / or Thailand? 

Edited June 10 by KhunHeineken