2 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

Not judgemental at all then?

 

 

I find short time very rewarding and it suits me and my chosen partner. I do not have a damaged view of women at all.

How do you know it suits them? Unless it's a transaction. If there wasn't something called sex, what would a woman be to you?

One post removed for a public comment on moderation along with the poster.

Please don't do that.

14 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

How do you know it suits them? Unless it's a transaction. If there wasn't something called sex, what would a woman be to you?

 

 

I know.

 

 

They keep coming back.........................

2 hours ago, Celsius said:

 

Not after you and a bunch of Arabs and Indians before you.

 

I'll pass.

Are you racist?

Why Arabs and Indians?

51 minutes ago, NowNow said:

 

Do you feel good trying to have sex with someone who does not like you?

 

How about you actually answer the question, rather than than trying to deflect, wriggling around like a snake? 😊

 

Do you feel good or not?

There is a certain rapey feel about it for sure.

3 hours ago, NowNow said:

 

You are trying to twist what I wrote. I wrote many simply have no choice, due to their woeful characters.

We have a choice.

But the choice is an overweight middle aged frump.

So a slim girl just out of her teens for a pittance is a better choice.

 

1 hour ago, NowNow said:

 

Even if links to papers were published here, you wouldn't read them. You would just make up some other nonsense.

It's a discussion forum, no one else has come up with any facts. If you have any facts to disprove their assertions, you are welcome to post them here. 

You're quite sensitive today, aren't you?

Go and have a little lie down.... but not in a short-time hotel, of course!

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Not if it is an objective, accurate, reasonable observation!  

I really like the 'new' Liverpool Lou! 💪👌🍻

3 hours ago, NowNow said:

How are you doing?

Fine thank you. And you?

PAYG especially STs are so more honest. You get these hypocritical guys who fund their wives and girlfriends but despise guys that pay for STs

Just now, scubascuba3 said:

PAYG especially STs are so more honest. You get these hypocritical guys who fund their wives and girlfriends but despise guys that pay for STs

 

What idiot funds their wife?

 

Not me.

39 minutes ago, Celsius said:

 

What idiot funds their wife?

 

Not me.

Most do, but one day when older you'll want someone younger, then you'll pay

3 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Most do, but one day when older you'll want someone younger, then you'll pay

 

For what? To gloat how I have a young wife while every idiot knows the deal?

 

 

11 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

 

You asked to "unpack" your observations, so let's  give it a go;

1. Whenever I see a post from somebody (here on AN) talking about going short-time, or taking part in the nightlife in Thailand there will inevitably be some other posters on here who will then comment something to the effect of "sad" or "shallow", but I never understood why.   

Why not just use the correct term of prostitute?  As soon as the euphemisms are used, it indicates that the user is reluctant to admit to the use of a prostitute and is in a defacto state of denial.  Shallow is used, because the people who must rely on the sex trade typically have unpleasant unattractive personalities    And yes, the use of a sex worker is "sad". Some older men, and even rotund guys, are capable of pulling in sexual partners, doing so regularly. They do it because of their innate qualities. Charm, personality, manners, style, good looks and self comportment all are factors. The assumption that someone "old"  can't attract partners is unfounded.  The retired brigadier in my condo had a large number of women companions. He was a dashing, fit and impeccably turned out. A man's man with a big heart and outgoing personality and big smile. He was 75 years old and still charming the ladies. In Thailand farangs who do not smile, alienate Thais. It's a red flag.

 

First off, why is it anyone's right or business to say something condescending about another person's lifestyle, especially someone else whom they personally know nothing about? 

 Well, let's start with some basic facts about Thai sex trade workers. In most cases they are  working the trade because of a financial need. Usually from dysfunctional families,  of limited education, poor and often with a gambling or drug addiction, they need the money. Many have emotion or mental health  problems. Others are trafficked in from other countries.  A large number have cognitive  limitations i.e. have low intelligence and are tricked into the trade with promises of easy money and the option of picking who they service.   In effect, a large amount are exploited.  How can one respect a person who exploits a person with a low IQ and in debt? University graduates  and skilled tradespeople do not typically work in the Thai sex trade. Poor and dumb do.  

 

Next, what is actually sad or shallow about it? Some men simply may not want to share their life with a partner full-time, but they also don't want to be forced to be celibate. So short-time works really well for them. Nothing wrong with that.

Already answered above.

 

Then are there any real moral issues? No. Are they helping to put some much needed money into the lower end of the local economy? Yes. 

You do not see a moral issue because you do not  want to see it. You are looking for validation for a personal choice.

 

So somebody explain to me how it's sad or shallow. And furthermore, explain to me how it isn't the perfect thing for someone who still has biological needs and/or carnal desires, but feels happier being alone. 

If you are unable to understand how much of a loser a person is who must rely on a Thai prostitute  no amount of explaining can help. You know the answer, but again what you are  seeking is validation for the use of sex workers.

 

I suspect many of the posters making these condescending comments are ones who are in longtime monogamous relationships, and who can't envision or understand how someone else could possibly live a happy life in any other way. 
Maybe you are correct. Or maybe, the people you condemn just have an inherent understanding of the concept of right and wrong and firmly believe in not intentionally harming those less fortunate than them. After all, who really wants to have sex with these johns. The poor hygiene, the overbearing ugliness, the lack of personality and the general unpleasantness of not being able to have an emotional connection with someone is not particularly alluring.

 

But truth be told, the guy living the short-time lifestyle might be a lot happier than the guy judging him and who feels stuck in a married position. And perhaps it's the guy who is not living the short-time lifestyle who is actually the one who's feeling sad. 

Maybe. It doesn't matter. All you are doing now is trying to justify  the use of a prostitute.

 

Whenever, someone who uses a Thai sex hooker is exposed publicly, it can become a journey of public humiliation. Most everyone  will laugh at the john because invariably they are the embodiment of a loser. Unlikeable and almost always unattractive. Good looking  men with positive personalities do not need prostitutes. 

Crap

8 minutes ago, Celsius said:

 

For what? To gloat how I have a young wife while every idiot knows the deal?

 

 

you'll get tired of an old bird and want a younger one, kinda normal, exception is the  guys who have zero sex drive

56 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

PAYG especially STs are so more honest. You get these hypocritical guys who fund their wives and girlfriends but despise guys that pay for STs

Good point / Well said.

2 hours ago, NowNow said:

 

Even if links to papers were published here, you wouldn't read them. You would just make up some other nonsense.

It's a discussion forum, no one else has come up with any facts. If you have any facts to disprove their assertions, you are welcome to post them here. 

Is it another FACT that I wouldn't read them and would just make up some other nonsense, as you claim?

Do I need facts to disprove the existence of a god, or do I need to wait for someone to prove his existence?

Lots of funny ‘morality’ here, mostly an offshoot of Judeo-Christian ideology.

 

Someone asked if a guy cares if he has sex with a woman who doesn’t like him. Well, how about getting a massage from a woman who doesn’t like you? How about getting a dinner order filled by a chef that doesn’t like you? Is it only if particular body parts touch does it become reprehensible and immoral? By whose philosophy? Does one get bonus points at death for never engaging in any form---sex, massage, food, a tailor shop, car dealer, plumber---with someone who doesn’t like you? How are those bonus points cashed in the hereafter?

 

Some guys like a massage. Some like a ‘special massage’. One is okay, but the other is evil? Says who?

 

So a woman sells a service---her body as some say---for money. Maybe she enjoys her work, maybe not. To reduce to the ridiculous, how about the guy who goes to sewers and sucks out all the literal crap people have blown out their backside? He likes his work? He has sold his body for money, and gotten a bad smell for it. A women in P4P might sometimes have a good day at work. I seriously doubt the guy who sucks out sewers for a living ever has a good day at work.

 

I used to live in Japan. I dated many Japanese women, some from my office, some I met through friends. They seemed to have a very different view of sex than the guys lambasting short timers here. The women expected sex at the end of a date. It was considered fun…you know…a physical pleasure. I got used to it. I didn’t complain. I went local, so to speak. I did not feel used, as I could consent or not. Of course, if I asked a woman out, I tended to be attracted to her, so if she expected a nightcap, I was game for it.

 

The other evening I visited an agogo. I watched a number of men purchase the services of women and go out the door together. Some of the men were old and chubby. Others were young, fit and handsome…the kind of guy who has no problem getting dates. Both types just wanted some physical pleasure, or a special massage. But massage is only bad if special body parts are touched?

 

A lovely young woman came and sat with me. I bought her a few drinks. She was a university graduate, quite attractive, obviously intelligent, and quite fit from the gym. No tatts, no kids. She told me she likes sex. She said she sometimes went to clubs like Sugar or Levels, and if a guy hit on her she liked, she often went home with him. She said she realized she could make money doing that in an agogo. Her choice. I don’t impose my morality on her, and she won’t impose hers on me. She isn’t going to kill anybody, nor steal anything, so what harm is done? She says she chooses with whom she goes, so is under no pressure to do anything she doesn’t want. Faux moralists will likely see a problem with her. I see a woman who has chosen her own path, damn what anyone else thinks. In 100 years she, her customers, and all the moralists looking down on her will be dead, so in the overall scheme of things it means nothing….except she enjoys it and gets paid.

 

The negative mindset stems from lugging Western morality to a place nobody asked for it. If someone thinks themselves morally superior because they only touch particular body parts with women they believe love them, good for them. They can knock themselves silly. They can cash their bonus points for their self-perceived good behavior at the checkout window upon death.

 

Treat people with kindness and respect, and there is little wrong in that. A woman offers a service and is willing to provide it in exchange for cash. Moralists have no problem if the service is a massage or cooking a meal or doing a company’s accounting, but woe to those who purchase the service of particular body parts touching. Up to you. Just don’t impose your morality on others, and perhaps others won’t impose theirs on you.

 

1 hour ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

I know.

 

 

They keep coming back.........................

Most do if the cash is there.

27 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Most do, but one day when older you'll want someone younger, then you'll pay

Taking care of a wife and also children, isn't funding but a responsibility. Funding is a transaction done between a prostitute and the man she wouldn't sleep with unless the cash was there. Everyone pays money for everything, but taking care of someone isn't a transaction.

16 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

you'll get tired of an old bird and want a younger one, kinda normal, exception is the  guys who have zero sex drive

With that attitude, she'll get tired of you long before you get tired of her. Only lazy people with unrealistic expectations get tired of their partners. Also those who always look at women as objects to be used instead of appreciated.

In all my years, 40+ chasing tail. I have never found a woman who gives it away for free. There is always some quid pro quo involved. What is the difference between taking a woman out for dinner, a movie or dancing then expecting a happy ending vs giving her the cash equivalent of dinner/movie/dancing and then going to the bed? Why is paying someone to have sex on camera legal and paying someone to have sex off camera illegal? 90% of the girls I go ST with message me for a repeat, They are looking for money to take care of their kids/parents/life and they won't make anything near that in 7/11. Most of those that moralize are sad unhappy geezers that are either envious of those of us that have chosen a different lifestyle or are stuck in an unhappy relationship and want others to be miserable with them . Yet what I find funny "Their body their choice" unless they want to make some money from selling sex. 

12 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

@NowNow

You asked to "unpack" your observations, so let's  give it a go;

1. Whenever I see a post from somebody (here on AN) talking about going short-time, or taking part in the nightlife in Thailand there will inevitably be some other posters on here who will then comment something to the effect of "sad" or "shallow", but I never understood why.   

Why not just use the correct term of prostitute?  As soon as the euphemisms are used, it indicates that the user is reluctant to admit to the use of a prostitute and is in a defacto state of denial.  Shallow is used, because the people who must rely on the sex trade typically have unpleasant unattractive personalities    And yes, the use of a sex worker is "sad". Some older men, and even rotund guys, are capable of pulling in sexual partners, doing so regularly. They do it because of their innate qualities. Charm, personality, manners, style, good looks and self comportment all are factors. The assumption that someone "old"  can't attract partners is unfounded.  The retired brigadier in my condo had a large number of women companions. He was a dashing, fit and impeccably turned out. A man's man with a big heart and outgoing personality and big smile. He was 75 years old and still charming the ladies. In Thailand farangs who do not smile, alienate Thais. It's a red flag.

FIRST THERE IS NO PROSTITUTION IN THAILAND THE POLICE AND GOVERNMENT HAVE SAID SO.

 

Further, many of the people partaking in a short time are tourists who do not want to find out where to go pay for a nice dinner, movie, and drinks on the chance that maybe.

 

If you want to go out and you are looking to be guaranteed that you are going to get your money's worth, then going to a bar and getting a short time or long time is what makes sense.

 

I take it you do not go to bars that have bar girls or you would see that most clients are dressed nicely and are turned out. 

 

 

12 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

 

First off, why is it anyone's right or business to say something condescending about another person's lifestyle, especially someone else whom they personally know nothing about? 

 Well, let's start with some basic facts about Thai sex trade workers. In most cases they are  working the trade because of a financial need. Usually from dysfunctional families,  of limited education, poor and often with a gambling or drug addiction, they need the money. Many have emotion or mental health  problems. Others are trafficked in from other countries.  A large number have cognitive  limitations i.e. have low intelligence and are tricked into the trade with promises of easy money and the option of picking who they service.   In effect, a large amount are exploited.  How can one respect a person who exploits a person with a low IQ and in debt? University graduates  and skilled tradespeople do not typically work in the Thai sex trade. Poor and dumb do.  

And you know this how  Have you done a survey of bar girls?  Many of these girls simply realize that they can make more money at a bar even if it is just bar drinks than they could at 7/11.  many are married. Go to nana and you will find that there are very few working in bars that fit your medical description also there are very few that have addictions.  The mamasans don't need the head aches.  Believe it or not, some university girls work in the bars as a means of paying for their education.

 

Not all girls are poor and dumb that work in bars.  Street walkers may be a different thing but 

 

I think you need to look at other countries that hve prostitution and you will find that there is a mix of highly educated and middle of the road.

 

12 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

 

Next, what is actually sad or shallow about it? Some men simply may not want to share their life with a partner full-time, but they also don't want to be forced to be celibate. So short-time works really well for them. Nothing wrong with that.

Already answered above.

There is nothing sad or shallow about it.  It is simply a business transaction and entertainment.  Consider that very few of the Thai girls you talk about will be put out on the first or second date.  Therefore you take them out and you buy them dinner and go to a movie.  2000 baht  The next date you go out to dinner and watch another movie or you go to a club  2000-4000 baht.  so you are out in 4k with no guarantee that you're going to get lucky, and you have invested 2 weeks of your time.    Also she may or maynot know what to do when you do get her to bed.

3000 baht at a bar, and you are guaranteed to get what you want with a lady that will only explain if you do not take a shower and use a condom. 

 

12 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

 

Then are there any real moral issues? No. Are they helping to put some much needed money into the lower end of the local economy? Yes. 

You do not see a moral issue because you do not  want to see it. You are looking for validation for a personal choice.

The only moral issue to this is that the government and country turns a blind eye to it instead of regulating it and making it legal.  

12 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

 

So somebody explain to me how it's sad or shallow. And furthermore, explain to me how it isn't the perfect thing for someone who still has biological needs and/or carnal desires, but feels happier being alone. 

If you are unable to understand how much of a loser a person is who must rely on a Thai prostitute  no amount of explaining can help. You know the answer, but again what you are  seeking is validation for the use of sex workers.

GAIN THERE RE NOT PROSTITUTES IN THAILAND

 

Besides that most guys are not losers that is your guess and biased opinion.  It maynot be your cup of tea and that is ok BUT LADIES OF THE EVENING AND BAR GIRLS HAVE BEEN AROUND FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS.

 

 

12 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

 

I suspect many of the posters making these condescending comments are ones who are in longtime monogamous relationships, and who can't envision or understand how someone else could possibly live a happy life in any other way. 
Maybe you are correct. Or maybe, the people you condemn just have an inherent understanding of the concept of right and wrong and firmly believe in not intentionally harming those less fortunate than them. After all, who really wants to have sex with these johns. The poor hygiene, the overbearing ugliness, the lack of personality and the general unpleasantness of not being able to have an emotional connection with someone is not particularly alluring.

 

But truth be told, the guy living the short-time lifestyle might be a lot happier than the guy judging him and who feels stuck in a married position. And perhaps it's the guy who is not living the short-time lifestyle who is actually the one who's feeling sad. 

Maybe. It doesn't matter. All you are doing now is trying to justify  the use of a prostitute.

Some guys do not want to get tied down to a long term relationship with a family or GF that they have to look after and listen to every day.  That is their choice.  NOT YOURS TO DENIGRATE 

 

12 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

 

Whenever, someone who uses a Thai sex hooker is exposed publicly, it can become a journey of public humiliation. Most everyone  will laugh at the john because invariably they are the embodiment of a loser. Unlikeable and almost always unattractive. Good looking  men with positive personalities do not need prostitutes. 

I think you would be surprised about this comment.  It is not a journey in public humiliation in fact I am willing to bet that tourists go home and brag about it to their male friends.  Also I am sure there are a lot of people here on the forum that have, Had a soapy, a happy ending, a short time or a long time.  It is a way of life here.  not something that is laughed at or emmbarassing.  Please donot bring your Western belilefs to a THAI gun fight.

51 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Taking care of a wife and also children, isn't funding but a responsibility. Funding is a transaction done between a prostitute and the man she wouldn't sleep with unless the cash was there. Everyone pays money for everything, but taking care of someone isn't a transaction.

Yeah keep kidding yourself, your wife only stayed because you were paying

51 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

With that attitude, she'll get tired of you long before you get tired of her. Only lazy people with unrealistic expectations get tired of their partners. Also those who always look at women as objects to be used instead of appreciated.

Didn't your mrs get tired of you?

2 hours ago, NowNow said:

 

Going short-time only, shallow or succulent? Have a read of the OP if you need a reminder.

 

48 posts on this topic. Every one of them drivel. You obviously know nothing about short-time, or pretty much anything for that matter. You must be very lonely and have nothing better to do with your time other than drink heavily and negatively pass judgment on topics you obviously know zero about. Get a life.

8 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Didn't your mrs get tired of you?

No, try keeping up. She hit me because she was mad at others and kidnapped our daughter four times because she was raised in an abusive and neglected home, which makes one a covert narcissist. This is someone who hates themselves and others because they never knew real love as a child, so they take this anger out on others who happen to be empaths. People they can try to control because they have no control over their emotions and only know hate. Shes been, after me, with two Thai and one foreign man, who she's visiting now. The other Thai men beat her up because she tried this behavior with them. One threatened to kill everyone in her family because of how she is. She wants to come back to me, but I'm not the one who stays with these types long, so I leave. I got tired of her so now you should understand.

11 minutes ago, RSD1 said:

 

48 posts on this topic. Every one of them drivel. You obviously know nothing about short-time, or pretty much anything for that matter. You must be very lonely and have nothing better to do with your time other than drink heavily and negatively pass judgment on topics you obviously know zero about. Get a life.

If you think every one of them  is drivel, you surely have seen where he mentioned he's married, and has had experience in these matters before. Again , Patong summed it up pretty well, but there are those that are into this kind of lifestyle, and can justify their actions, no matter how off they might be.

17 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Yeah keep kidding yourself, your wife only stayed because you were paying

My ex wife stayed because I treated her better than she's ever been treated before or since, and this is why she still wants to come back. It's always better to refrain from commenting unless you know the whole truth of the matter. I've tried explaining this to you before, and again now, but I'm sure you still won't get it, as your thinking doesn't match my logic. All wives will stay if they are treated well, even if the money's not that much, unless they are gold diggers or mentally ill, or suffer from depression, which makes them over think and second guess themselves. And how can you comment when you always pay for your women, in a much different way than I and others who have a relationship do? Yours are transactions, while mine and others are a relationship. Most adults understand the difference.

12 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

If you think every one of them  is drivel, you surely have seen where he mentioned he's married, and has had experience in these matters before. Again , Patong summed it up pretty well, but there are those that are into this kind of lifestyle, and can justify their actions, no matter how off they might be.

He's not married he's special needs on the spectrum, no person unless desperate would go down that road