I extended my non 'O' retirement visa yesterday at Khon Kaen.  What a trek that now is!

The IO was a little surprised to see two bank books.  One was full, that's all.  But she spent ages checking the closing balance in one was the opening balance in the other and that the account numbers were the same.  But all was well, she stamped in the new visa extension and also did my 90 day report as well, that not being due until Oct.  But then she says "where does your money come from?"  I  said "England"  She asked where.  It's some years since I've been asked that but always bring with me in my "Possibly" folder statements from my pension providers.  I'm 77, where does she think it comes from.  I handed over the evidence, she looked at it and was satisfied.  But what has it got to do with them.  the law says I must bring 65,000 baht per month into a Thai bank.  It's nothing to do with them where it originates.  What if I had no proof?  Or am I wrong.  Any thoughts?

7 hours ago, lungbing said:

But what has it got to do with them.  the law says I must bring 65,000 baht per month into a Thai bank.  It's nothing to do with them where it originates.  What if I had no proof?  Or am I wrong.  Any thoughts

Quite frankly your OP is naive. 

Using income method you need to show 12 monthly transfers from abroad. 

Generally a 12 month bank statement with correct codes indicating transfers from abroad is sufficient. 

Many threads regarding this as sometimes the codes do not show this and " Credit advice" Is required. 

You are lucky io accepted the docs in your folder. 

Regarding the 90 day report... the io did that as courtesy. 

In reality 90 reports have nothing to do with annual extensions. 

 

Finally... Yes you were incorrect. 

Just consent what the IMM ask for or say no and take the risk that ur visa will be cancelled.

Ur own choice.

12 minutes ago, lungbing said:

I extended my non 'O' retirement visa yesterday at Khon Kaen.  What a trek that now is!

The IO was a little surprised to see two bank books.  One was full, that's all.  But she spent ages checking the closing balance in one was the opening balance in the other and that the account numbers were the same.  But all was well, she stamped in the new visa extension and also did my 90 day report as well, that not being due until Oct.  But then she says "where does your money come from?"  I  said "England"  She asked where.  It's some years since I've been asked that but always bring with me in my "Possibly" folder statements from my pension providers.  I'm 77, where does she think it comes from.  I handed over the evidence, she looked at it and was satisfied.  But what has it got to do with them.  the law says I must bring 65,000 baht per month into a Thai bank.  It's nothing to do with them where it originates.  What if I had no proof?  Or am I wrong.  Any thoughts?

 

 

I am sure, after all your years here, that you that an IO is perfectly at liberty to ask questions about income sources. They are usually on the look out for expats working illegally.

 

If you recall, there was a case where an expat took umbrage being asked the same question when using 800k in the bank method. As the IO said, the balance simply shows he has money - the follow up question was "how do you live in Thailand..."...perfectly reasonable question IMO.......and one that you could comfortably answer.

3 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

If you recall, there was a case where an expat took umbrage being asked the same question when using 800k in the bank method. As the IO said, the balance simply shows he has money - the follow up question was "how do you live in Thailand..."...perfectly reasonable question IMO.......and one that you could comfortably answer

Yes I recall that post. 

The io question was not "perfectly reasonable question" at all. 

The financial requirements for money in bank method are crystal clear. 

The io was out of line with ridiculous question. 

1 hour ago, DrJack54 said:

Yes I recall that post. 

The io question was not "perfectly reasonable question" at all. 

The financial requirements for money in bank method are crystal clear. 

The io was out of line with ridiculous question. 

 

You are wrong. An IO has every right to delve into sources of income.

 

 

I disagree entirely and would refer you to the Thai Immigration Bureau website... https://www.immigration.go.th/?p=14695

 

Required supporting documents:-

 

 

Application form TM.7

A copy of the applicant's passport

Evidence of income such as pensions, interest or dividends, etc., and/or

A bank deposit certificate from a Thai bank and a copy of the bank account

 

 

6 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

Application form TM.7

A copy of the applicant's passport

Evidence of income such as pensions, interest or dividends, etc., and/or

A bank deposit certificate from a Thai bank and a copy of the bank account

Oh please. Stop.

You referred in your first post about using "funds in bank method" (800k)

For extensions using money in bank the funds do NOT need to be shown came from abroad.

 

Then jump to reference to "income method" (65k min per month transfers from abroad)

For income method proof of monthly transfers are from abroad is absolutely required. 

 

You are so confused it's useless to explain 

58 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Oh please. Stop.

You referred in your first post about using "funds in bank method" (800k)

For extensions using money in bank the funds do NOT need to be shown came from abroad.

 

Then jump to reference to "income method" (65k min per month transfers from abroad)

For income method proof of monthly transfers are from abroad is absolutely required. 

 

You are so confused it's useless to explain 

 

Not sure if you have been drinking or are just struggling with comprehension.

 

I never said the 800k needed to come from overseas...apologise please for that lie .

 

I said that notwithstanding the 800k satisfying the money in the bank criteria an IO has every right to ask an applicant how they live in Thailand (and therefore where their income is derived).

5 hours ago, lungbing said:

But what has it got to do with them.  the law says I must bring 65,000 baht per month into a Thai bank.  It's nothing to do with them where it originates.  What if I had no proof?  Or am I wrong.  Any thoughts?

It's not uncommon.  There have been more and more reports of people being asked for "proof" of where the monthly income is coming from. Without it, you would likely have been sent away to obtain this proof and return. If unable to produce satisfactory proof, you would have had to use an agent (as you wouldn't have time to season the required bank deposit) or you would've had to leave Thailand and apply for a non-O to start over on the bank deposit method.

Although it's not out of the realm of possibility they were just being nosy and would have let it drop had you not had the paperwork, but it is a requirement at some offices.

IME (Jomtien - since the British embassy stopped issuing income letters in 2019)

.Letter from BBL to prove I have a Thai bank account (100THB fee).

.12 month bank statement from BBL.

.Letter from BBL, listing each monthly foreign transfer (minimum 65,000THB) (100THB fee).

.Proof of foreign source of my income (in my case a letter from my pension provider). 

.Copy of each page of bank book (I don't keep my bank book up to date, so there are many gaps, but that doesn't seem to matter).  

 

 

 

 

2 hours ago, chickenslegs said:

Copy of each page of bank book (I don't keep my bank book up to date, so there are many gaps, but that doesn't seem to matter)

The reason it didn't matter is because you obtained 12 month bank statement. 

6 hours ago, hotandsticky said:

I said that notwithstanding the 800k satisfying the money in the bank criteria an IO has every right to ask an applicant how they live in Thailand (and therefore where their income is derived).

Using a Fixed Term deposit account, I was asked the same question some years ago.
The IO even suggested the possibility I could be working illegally to fund my daily living expenses.

Since that time, I always request the bank letter to provide details of both my FTD and Savings account. Never been asked again.

12 minutes ago, Liquorice said:

Using a Fixed Term deposit account, I was asked the same question some years ago.
The IO even suggested the possibility I could be working illegally to fund my daily living expenses.

Since that time, I always request the bank letter to provide details of both my FTD and Savings account. Never been asked again.

You can bring up to 500k baht into Thailand any time you get into the country without the need to declare it and provide any paperwork. 

43 minutes ago, gearbox said:

You can bring up to 500k baht into Thailand any time you get into the country without the need to declare it and provide any paperwork. 

Not very useful for expats living in Thailand. 

Many do not exit Thailand or very rarely if they do.. 

11 hours ago, lungbing said:

Any thoughts?

 

Always have the "Possibly" folder.

 

I renewed my ext stay/ret-income at CW on Friday.

 

No ask for the "source" of the 'income', although I have documentation to back-up the source.

 

My twelve Qualifying Foreign Transfers were scrutinized, three times by the Doc Check officer in cubicle L27.

 

Passbook, copies, Account Ownership Letter, same day B/F (with copy), twelve Credit Advice Receipts, Credit Advice Summary Letter

 

No ask for a 12-month statement - I didn't get one in time (due tomorrow) but I did have the app-derived 12-month statement, hoping that would be enough if asked (I know it shouldn't be).

 

 

My "possibly" folder is large.

 

 

At CW, for me, the Doc Check officer and process address all the required documentation, and are assembled in order so no issues when you sit down with the IO. Just a photo of me holding a piece of paper (not sure, maybe the overstay penalties?) and payment of 1,900 THB. No questions.

 

 

 

7 minutes ago, bamnutsak said:

No ask for the "source" of the 'income', although I have documentation to back-up the source.

Have been awaiting your report. 

Good CW not looking for details of monthly transfers apart from coming from abroad. 

For what it is worth ...

 

If, or more probably when, the Thai government decides to crackdown on the movement of "illegal" monies into the country, Immigration may be required to ask those extending their stays/visas in Thailand to provide more details on the source(s) of their remittances, eg foreign pension letters, foreign share dividend documents, foreign rental income documents, foreign inheritance, etc., etc.  Who knows.

 

Every year my pension fund sends me a letter detailing the annual increase in my monthly pension, and every year I attach a copy of this letter to my "retirement" visa extension application.  Just in case.

 

Things are changing, and seemingly changing more quickly.  Be prepared for changes, the best you can.

1 minute ago, JimHuaHin said:

Immigration may be required to ask those extending their stays/visas in Thailand to provide more details on the source(s) of their remittances, eg foreign pension letters, foreign share dividend documents, foreign rental income documents, foreign inheritance, etc., etc.  Who knows.

 

 

I can't see this ever happening.

 

Immigration officers suddenly become forensic accountants? Really?

 

 

2 minutes ago, JimHuaHin said:

Every year my pension fund sends me a letter detailing the annual increase in my monthly pension, and every year I attach a copy of this letter to my "retirement" visa extension application.  Just in case.

 

Yeah, I have this in hand, along with the SWIFT documents which show the origin and destination, but I would never submit these. If asked, I would produce these.

 

 

12 hours ago, norsurin said:

Just consent what the IMM ask for or say no and take the risk that ur visa will be cancelled.

Ur own choice.

My State Pension goes directly into my UK Bank which I then transfer to Bkk Bank every month via Wise. I do not have any paperwork from DWP, only deposits into my Nationwide. Here in Phitsanulok I have never been asked the source. Good IO here!

11 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Oh please. Stop.

You referred in your first post about using "funds in bank method" (800k)

For extensions using money in bank the funds do NOT need to be shown came from abroad.

 

Then jump to reference to "income method" (65k min per month transfers from abroad)

For income method proof of monthly transfers are from abroad is absolutely required. 

 

You are so confused it's useless to explain 

I think you are the confused one, Doc. Unusual for you.
The "where" was not referring to geographic origin but source of income - pension, interest, ransoms, horse trading, etc. 
I was asked for source once. I take my latest SSA statement for annual renewal.

1 hour ago, amexpat said:

The "where" was not referring to geographic origin but source of income - pension, interest, ransoms, horse trading, etc

That should not be required when doing extensions using money in bank method. 

I was replying to a specific post. This one....... 

 

"If you recall, there was a case where an expat took umbrage being asked the same question when using 800k in the bank method" 

 

3 hours ago, KannikaP said:

My State Pension goes directly into my UK Bank which I then transfer to Bkk Bank every month via Wise. I do not have any paperwork from DWP, only deposits into my Nationwide. Here in Phitsanulok I have never been asked the source. Good IO here!

I understand what u mean.Anyway if people not complying what the IO ask for it will be a problem.

U should ask ur pension provider if they can state ur pension and then u will have the proof and also a summary about the money goes into ur bike bank account.Just in case.

6 minutes ago, norsurin said:

I understand what u mean.Anyway if people not complying what the IO ask for it will be a problem.

U should ask ur pension provider if they can state ur pension and then u will have the proof and also a summary about the money goes into ur bike bank account. Just in case.

Thanks. My UK bank statement shows that my State Pension is paid every week, and that it is transferred to Bkk Bank monthly, via Wise, from whom I get a statement every time, which says Bangkok Bank is the recipient. I have not had any problems for quite a few years.

16 hours ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

I am sure, after all your years here, that you that an IO is perfectly at liberty to ask questions about income sources. They are usually on the look out for expats working illegally.

 

If you recall, there was a case where an expat took umbrage being asked the same question when using 800k in the bank method. As the IO said, the balance simply shows he has money - the follow up question was "how do you live in Thailand..."...perfectly reasonable question IMO.......and one that you could comfortably answer.

 

A 77-year-old foreigner, who has possibly done several extension renewals in the past, all with proof that the money comes monthly from overseas is suspected of "working illegally"?

 

Yes, the IO's pretty much have carte blanche on what they can ask for, including additional documents that are not listed anywhere.

 

Don't some immigration offices require that the extension applicant who is a pension claimant in their homeland and is remitting that pension, either in part  or whole, needs to show paperwork that specifically refers to being the recipient of a state pension? This in addition to the much easier foreign bank statements?

Just now, NanLaew said:

 

A 77-year-old foreigner, who has possibly done several extension renewals in the past, all with proof that the money comes monthly from overseas is suspected of "working illegally"?

 

Yes, the IO's pretty much have carte blanche on what they can ask for, including additional documents that are not listed anywhere.

 

Don't some immigration offices require that the extension applicant who is a pension claimant in their homeland and is remitting that pension, either in part  or whole, needs to show paperwork that specifically refers to being the recipient of a state pension? This in addition to the much easier foreign bank statements?

Thailand trying to implement the same money loundring anti schemes we got in EU, and also part of international agreements as well taxation cooperation or future cooperations. 

 

77 year old pensioners can do money laundry as much as one in any other age. 

2 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

 

A 77-year-old foreigner, who has possibly done several extension renewals in the past, all with proof that the money comes monthly from overseas is suspected of "working illegally"?

 

Yes, the IO's pretty much have carte blanche on what they can ask for, including additional documents that are not listed anywhere.

 

Don't some immigration offices require that the extension applicant who is a pension claimant in their homeland and is remitting that pension, either in part  or whole, needs to show paperwork that specifically refers to being the recipient of a state pension? This in addition to the much easier foreign bank statements?

 

Yes, a friend experienced this with Buriram Immigration office.....not every time......but he was asked for a letter from DWP confirming his pension.

I see that for some members, Stockholm Syndrome is growing.

I would say no. I consider it the bank you have here is responsible. If your money comes from a reputable overseas bank then there should never be a question about it. If it comes from the UK the HMRC will automatically know about it and if it was some form of illegal deposit.

I am so confused about this. Thank you to Hotsticky for pointing me to https://www.immigration.go.th/?p=14695

and "Evidence of income such as pensions, interest or dividends, etc., and/or"

I  was always under the impression that for a Retirement extension it had to be Pensions only or from a Government source,  which I know now was possibly wrong.

  My question is , would the "etc" above apply to rental income? If I had my Canadian tenants,  as they have been doing for several years, direct deposit monthly into my Canadian bank and I then transfer  65000 baht myself each month into my Thai bank account. When asked by IO where the money came from I would honestly answer rental payments and have available with me , if questioned further, Canadian Bank account statements along with Titles (Deeds),  for the Canadian properties?

 

11 minutes ago, JDMCanuck said:

When asked by IO where the money came

 

the money came from your account in Canada.

 

Don't over-think this.

 

And don't start producing title deeds.