1 hour ago, Stiddle Mump said:

Oh no it hasn't. That is monumental humbug.

 

Injecting muck into monkey's brains proved nothing except that the poor monkeys didn't like it.

 

I actually got polio when I was young. Couldn't walk for a couple of months. Long time in hospital. Spent the summer recovering at Heathercombe Break School in Devon. A school for poor London kids who had suffered bad illnesses and needed to recuperate.

 

Big emphasis on nature and - dare I say it - religion. That would be 1957.

 

 

The famous 'Jay's Grave' was with walking distance. Went there many times to place flowers.

 

And how did you get it?

On 9/13/2025 at 7:26 PM, richard_smith237 said:

This argument assumes a sweeping conspiracy where an entire global industry, every regulator, countless independent scientists, and diverse governments are all not only complicit but perfectly coordinated in deceiving billions of people for decades.

It only needs the professional institutions on board.

Then any dissenters will be struck off and/or given no place to publish.

 

As for governments, all part of the new world order.

18 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

I guess my question now (and I should stress that the intent is not to be confrontational or vindictive, but I am merely interested in your take on things) is whether you agree that the response to vaccine sceptics was excessive, and if so, whether you consider you had a minor degree of personal involvement, and I do mean personal, not collective, as expressing things under a general "we" tends to dilute responsibility.

 

hahaha   said poster is the master of wee wee .    wee weed me off ( i have not the same tolerance to wee wee that thou dost possess) ......... 

and so i quickly turned my fan on to high , turned it towards the offender,   and showered him with my answer .   (would that be vindictive ? )   

7 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

It only needs the professional institutions on board.

Then any dissenters will be struck off and/or given no place to publish.

 

As for governments, all part of the new world order.

 

The fact that the plandemic raced around the world in record speed .... with all the dominoes falling into place to instill the mandated narrative on the world ...

 

is a "theory"  that is way above the heads of sooooo many .    even the genius that you  responded to 

39 minutes ago, jaywalker2 said:

And how did you get it?

I honestly don't know. Back in the 1950s virtually everyone took all the jabs. Not that there were many. TBH, I don't know if the polio was a jab even.

 

I can recall - like it was yesterday - fainting in the kitchen. My mum was at home and she got me into the front room, and ran round to get the doctor. Although I couldn't walk hardly at all, I didn't go to hospital for a few weeks. That was Oldchurch Hospital in Romford, Essex.

 

Came out of hospital early summer, and went off to Devon until October. Even when I returned home, I didn't go to school 'til the following year; 1958. So lost nearly 2 years of schooling.  And couldn't do any sport for another 2 years.

18 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

I don't recall you expressing an understanding of why some people harboured doubts on the mRNA jab back in 2022, and that is the point I am making. It was a period of extreme pressure and discrimination against the unvaccinated, who were designated as enemies of society, with hardly veiled implications of what potential 'measures' could be taken against them against their will. I was on the receiving end of this political and societal pressure and discrimination, and I can assure you it was stressful (and I am not easily stressed).

 

I took a lot of screenshots of what people were saying against the unjabbed at the time, because I was sure the tide would eventually turn and that those who had condoned what happened would be quick to pretend they hadn't. What you said was far from being the worst stuff I saw, but you did use derogatory language against people who were merely stating they didn't want to take it based on their understanding of things (I was one of them). So whether you like it or not, you objectively condoned what happened.

 

I guess my question now (and I should stress that the intent is not to be confrontational or vindictive, but I am merely interested in your take on things) is whether you agree that the response to vaccine sceptics was excessive, and if so, whether you consider you had a minor degree of personal involvement, and I do mean personal, not collective, as expressing things under a general "we" tends to dilute responsibility.

 

You’re right - those early pandemic months really did bring out extremes in people, from remarkable solidarity to some very nasty and vindictive comments. I can understand how being on the receiving end of that could feel deeply stressful, even for someone who doesn’t usually get rattled.

 

From a public health standpoint, I’ve always supported vaccination. Vaccines like MMR, for example, are crucial for societal immunity. While there will always be a small group of people who refuse them, their numbers are low enough that the risk to wider society remains manageable.

 

Covid was different in some ways. Early on, when the severity, case fatality rates, and transmissibility of the virus weren’t fully understood, authorities had little choice but to push vaccination aggressively. The aim was to protect as many people as possible and prevent health systems from being overwhelmed.

 

I do acknowledge that later, when more became known about the disease, some of the continued measures - especially extended lockdowns - caused real social and personal harm. Looking back, while the science behind the vaccines was solid, the societal handling of scepticism and the pressure on the unvaccinated could sometimes be excessive. Of course, criticism is easy with 20/20 hindsight.

 

At the time, I personally believed that those who wished not to receive the Covid-19 vaccines should not be permitted to travel and should be isolated, in order to reduce transmission risks. In my view, public health requires everyone to make as much effort as possible to protect the community, and vaccination is part of that collective responsibility.

 

Most people I know took the vaccines without issue, though a few, such as yourself, chose otherwise.

Today, no one I know continues to take the Covid-19 vaccine except my parents, who are older and in a high-risk group.

 

I have not taken the Covid-19 vaccine since 2021 because I’m not in a high-risk group and do not consider it necessary. That said, I sometimes wonder: when I had Covid-19 last year (again) resulting in a couple of very rough days during a holiday, might a booster have helped? The answer is unknown. I’ve also fallen ill after flights, likely contracting influenza from other passengers, which is why I now take influenza vaccines to reduce my risk when travelling in Europe during winter holidays.

 

I recognise that this perspective won’t sit well with people who oppose vaccines entirely. I do hold skepticism regarding financial corruption within the pharmaceutical industry, but I still believe vaccines are necessary - just that better oversight is required.

 

 

I also have strong opinions about some people I’ve known who fall under the ‘anti-Covid-vax’ banner yet demonstrate very little understanding of vaccines and spread claims that are simply untrue - such as the idea that mRNA vaccines can alter a person’s DNA. There has been a huge amount of ignorance and misinformation circulating, and I find it difficult to tolerate those who unquestioningly believe memes and social media posts.

 

At the same time, I recognise that there are people, like yourself (Rattlesnake), who seem to have made more informed decisions, even if we might question the sources of information each of us relied upon. The difference, in my view, is that well-researched, thoughtful scepticism is a lot more defensible when an overwhelming degree of experts support the science - and this is not the case with vaccines in general, or the Covid-19 vaccine itself. 

 

 

 

 

40 minutes ago, rumak said:

 

hahaha   said poster is the master of wee wee .    wee weed me off ( i have not the same tolerance to wee wee that thou dost possess) ......... 

and so i quickly turned my fan on to high , turned it towards the offender,   and showered him with my answer .   (would that be vindictive ? )   

 

Impressive, in a tragic sort of way. Your contribution reveals, with alarming clarity, just how spectacularly unprepared you can be when attempting to engage with minds that have a grasp on this subject.

14 minutes ago, Stiddle Mump said:

I honestly don't know. Back in the 1950s virtually everyone took all the jabs. Not that there were many. TBH, I don't know if the polio was a jab even.

 

I can recall - like it was yesterday - fainting in the kitchen. My mum was at home and she got me into the front room, and ran round to get the doctor. Although I couldn't walk hardly at all, I didn't go to hospital for a few weeks. That was Oldchurch Hospital in Romford, Essex.

 

Came out of hospital early summer, and went off to Devon until October. Even when I returned home, I didn't go to school 'til the following year; 1958. So lost nearly 2 years of schooling.  And couldn't do any sport for another 2 years.

The first vaccine was the Salk vaccine, which was approved in 1955 and required an injection. For some reason, I didn't get that. Instead, I received the Sabin vaccine, which was introduced in 1961. It was an oral vaccine, drunk from a cup, I remember everyone in the school received it at the same time, class by class. The Sabin vaccine was made from a live (weakened virus) as opposed to the Salk vaccine, which was made from an inactivated vaccine. The Sabin vaccine replaced the Salk vaccine, presumably because it was cheaper and easier to administer, until it was discovered that on rare occasions it could lead to full-blown polio. I think a newer version of the Sabin vaccine is still in use today, for reasons of cost and also because it's better at stopping the transmission of wild polio since it immunizes in the intestines (polio is transmitted through faeces).

 

Although the polio virus resulted in relatively few cases annually (some tens of thousands in contrast to measles, which regularly had millions of cases a year) it was such a devastating disease that everyone was terrified of it. The announcement of a successful vaccine led to national celebrations.

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Impressive, in a tragic sort of way. Your contribution reveals, with alarming clarity, just how spectacularly unprepared you can be when attempting to engage with minds that have a grasp on this subject.

 

"you did use derogatory language against people who were merely stating they didn't want to take it based on their understanding of things "

 

you were wrong .    and still are .  

5 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

That said, I sometimes wonder: when I had Covid-19 last year (again) resulting in a couple of very rough days during a holiday, might a booster have helped? The answer is unknown. I’ve also fallen ill after flights, likely contracting influenza from other passengers, which is why I now take influenza vaccines to reduce my risk when travelling in Europe during winter holidays.

 

Here is an empirical anecdote, for what it's worth:

 

Last Christmas, my dad and brother visited my sister at Christmas for a few days. There was a resurgence of Covid at the time in the two countries involved (France/UK) and my dad and brother caught it, their symptoms appeared while they were there. My sister and her young son did not catch it.

 

Here is the Covid vaccination status of the protagonists:

 

My dad: 3 shots

My brother: unvaccinated

My sister: unvaccinated

My nephew: unvaccinated

 

It was a nasty Covid variant and in retrospect, I am glad I was not able to be there. My brother was unwell for a few days, and it took another few days for him to completely shake off the headaches and fatigue. My dad, however, was badly affected and spent nearly a month pretty much in bed, he lost a lot of weight and suffered minor internal injuries because of the relentless, uncontrollable coughing. He fortunately eventually made a full recovery, but in his own words, he has never been so ill in his life (it is worth mentioning that he was initially a strong guy who was never sick).

 

Now if you look at the figures dispassionately, at face value, the fact that the one person who took several Covid shots is the one who suffered the most from the ailment they should theoretically be the most protected against… well let's say it raises questions, and very legitimate ones, I will add. According to the accepted principle, my brother, sister and nephew should have been agonising while my dad remained unscathed.

 

The European Union's vaccine regulators said in 2022 that excessive use of COVID booster shots could impair immune response and lead to system 'overload' – the truth is there isn't enough science to back up the way this product was unilaterally imposed… but it did make some people very rich.

10 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

..., I recognise that there are people, like yourself (Rattlesnake), who seem to have made more informed decisions, even if we might question the sources of information each of us relied upon. The difference, in my view, is that well-researched, thoughtful scepticism is a lot more defensible when an overwhelming degree of experts support the science - and this is not the case with vaccines in general, or the Covid-19 vaccine itself. 

 

When discussing 'neutral' subjects I would wholeheartedly agree with what you wrote.  

Unfortunately 'vaccines' and virology, are not neutral subjects but captured by a multi-billion $ industry that has made sure that only studies and research supporting pre-determined outcomes will be funded and conducted.  And non-funded studies by independent scientists or studies that show inconventient facts/data for the vax industry, will not be published in the main medical journals that rely on Big Pharma funding.  

As a result of that mechanism, it is no surprise that an 'overwhelming degree of experts' support the Pharma-narrative.  

It provides hope for humanity, that with all Big Pharma's dirty tricks, they are not able to silence integer scientists and researchers who keep on searching for truth despite the career- and reputation killing consequences of going that road.  

 

Note:  Here the link to an 'inconvenient' study conducted by Henry Ford Medical Institute researchers that hoped with their study of +18.000 children over a period of more than a decade to prove once for all the benefits of the child inoculation scheme.  The study was conducted some 4 years ago, but confronted with the results showing that vaccinated children were multiple times more prone to chronic diseases than unvaccinated children, the researchers decided not to publish it as it would be a job and career-killer doing so.  

In his testimony for the congressional committee on the child inoculation schedule, Aaron Siri's testimony went into depth addressing the findings of that study, and it has just now been added to the official records of that hearing. 

> https://www.hsgac.senate.gov/wp-content/uploads/Entered-into-hearing-record-Impact-of-Childhood-Vaccination-on-Short-and-Long-Term-Chronic-Health-Outcomes-in-Children-A-Birth-Cohort-Study.pdf 

 

22 hours ago, Stiddle Mump said:

Both are the result of toxicity.

 

The body will self-heal is given the tools.

Indeed, the tools seem to think they can solve all global health issues.

1 hour ago, Red Phoenix said:

Here the link to an 'inconvenient' study conducted by Henry Ford Medical Institute researchers

 

multitudes of "inconvenient"  studies , expert testimonies,  data from gov. sources, and

even peer reviewed analysis by doctors who are shunned by MSM has been presented over the last few years . .... and much of it posted here (now that it is "allowed" ) . Of course, the readership is very low for this unpopular presentation of facts/opinions that pertain to shots which many if not most of them already took .

  

i guess some "progress"  has been made in breaking through the bias of some percentage of  paid for govt. believers.    But i just heard a Moderna ad during a sporting event for the "latest"  covid shot .    

The same old narrative is still being pushed,  and there are plenty of smiths and jones' out there who are so commited to believing they did the right thing that they still are "baffled" by what any common sense person should see.   

To be honest ........ i am baffled why anyone even bothers debating with those whose sole purpose is to display their arrogance (" an attitude of superiority manifested in an overbearing manner or in presumptuous claims or assumptions ")......  

 

I empathize with those few who realize that their injuries and /or new health issues are almost certainly attributed to those covid "vaxxes" .   As far as other past (non mRNA) vaccines are concerned ,  there are "expert" opinions and conflicting "facts"  as whether or not the vastly INCREASED use of so many MORE shots now , as opposed to the 3 or 4 that were required 50 years ago ,  has led to the downward state of health as so easily witnessed in the first world countries.    

 

Certainly the vax free people , like the Amish ,  make a good case for staying vax free. 

 

 

On 9/12/2025 at 6:16 PM, Red Phoenix said:

 

Yes, spot on!  Except for a couple of sociopaths on this Covid sub-Forum, the majority of posters here shouting 'conspiracy nonsense' on every new revelation about these killer-shots, by now do know deep-down that they have been played.  It's a combination of pride (not wanting to admit they were fooled), guilt (when they harmed their loved ones by having them jabbed) and shame (when they demonized those that tried to warn them).  

It will be a hard awakening...

Why would I think I have been played? I had two vaccine shots (Johnson and Pfizer). After that I came down with the Omicron variant while in Thailand, was 8 days sick but not seriously.

 

Even supposing the vaccines didn't protect me against Covid, they enabled me to travel between continents. For this alone I am grateful to the vaccines.

14 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Then any dissenters will be struck off and/or given no place to publish.

We certainly saw that happening during the plandemic  and it is still happening  but  fortunately   many more people are now aware of such shenanigans..and there seems to be some hope with RFKjr,Jay Bhattacharya and Robert Malone  in the positions they now hold.

 

edit  typo  Jay Bhattacharya 

2 minutes ago, johng said:

We certainly saw that happening during the plandemic  and it is still happening  but  fortunately   many more people are now aware of such shenanigans..and there seems to be some hope with RFKjr,Jayanta Bhattacharya and Robert Malone  in the positions they now hold.

 

yes, many more .    but imo still a vast minority..... as the propaganda MSM  still controls most of the "airways" .   Even my somewhat intelligent longtime friends here in Thailand can not be bothered to say more than repeat what CNN does .   

Both got jabbed ...... both have been sick twice since .   One very sick .  And i believe the "batches"  of vax here in Thailand were not as dangerous as put out in some other areas.

 

21 minutes ago, JackGats said:

...

Even supposing the vaccines didn't protect me against Covid, they enabled me to travel between continents. For this alone I am grateful to the vaccines.

Nope, not the vaccines themselves but the sociopaths that mandated being Covid vaccinated as a requirement to travel, 'allowed' you to do so when you complied with their harmful nonsense.  Seems you suffer from Stockholm syndrome, being grateful for the privilege of being poisoned in order to travel.

 

 

14 hours ago, rumak said:

 

The fact that the plandemic raced around the world in record speed .... with all the dominoes falling into place to instill the mandated narrative on the world ...

 

is a "theory"  that is way above the heads of sooooo many .    even the genius that you  responded to 

No it is a hypothesis that has failed under intensive scrutiny. MRNA vaccines are safe and work. They are also the future, so get used to them. Stiddle and Red have an agenda.

1 hour ago, Red Phoenix said:

Nope, not the vaccines themselves but the sociopaths that mandated being Covid vaccinated as a requirement to travel, 'allowed' you to do so when you complied with their harmful nonsense.  Seems you suffer from Stockholm syndrome, being grateful for the privilege of being poisoned in order to travel.

 

 

 

My favorite is :  "i would have been much sicker if i hadn't taken the jab" 

 

(this even from those who were very sick ! )      ...... how do you fix this type of brainwashing ?

 

edit :  and you can add cj  to the list .   as i stated previously..... the majority still believe CNN and the rest of MSM .   No debate will get them to accept otherwise .  

 

but thank you CJ for keeping your comment /  viewpoint under 500 words , and i will not attack you with insults .   Hopefully you do not also believe that others should be forced to shoot things into their bodies that they do not want .

1 hour ago, Red Phoenix said:

Nope, not the vaccines themselves but the sociopaths that mandated being Covid vaccinated as a requirement to travel, 'allowed' you to do so when you complied with their harmful nonsense.  Seems you suffer from Stockholm syndrome, being grateful for the privilege of being poisoned in order to travel.

 

 

If I suffer from a Scandinavian syndrome, I can't think from how many syndromes you must be suffering from. It must be hard to keep count of them.

7 minutes ago, JackGats said:

If I suffer from a Scandinavian syndrome, I can't think from how many syndromes you must be suffering from. It must be hard to keep count of them.

 

i think RP is what they call a Forumasachist .   Pleasure clearly defined by the number of insults thrown at him by keyboard punchers.    

16 minutes ago, cjinchiangrai said:

No it is a hypothesis that has failed under intensive scrutiny. MRNA vaccines are safe and work. They are also the future, so get used to them. Stiddle and Red have an agenda.

Curious to know what Agenda I might have.  

Scared stiff that I will be exposed by CJ Sherlock in ChiangRai - 555

10 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

It was a nasty Covid variant and in retrospect, I am glad I was not able to be there. My brother was unwell for a few days, and it took another few days for him to completely shake off the headaches and fatigue. My dad, however, was badly affected and spent nearly a month pretty much in bed, he lost a lot of weight and suffered minor internal injuries because of the relentless, uncontrollable coughing. He fortunately eventually made a full recovery, but in his own words, he has never been so ill in his life (it is worth mentioning that he was initially a strong guy who was never sick).

 

Yes,  there are a few substackers (Gaert , and ? ) who have laid out what damage the covid shot causes to the human immune system.   Increasing with each shot/booster.  

Common sense would indicate that elderly people with already compromised immune systems,

"The elderly immune system deteriorates with age through a process called immunosenescence, which involves a decline in both innate and adaptive immunity"....

 

well.... they ( elderly in ok health)  should be the last subjects to be encouraged to take the mRNA shots.   Of course , just the opposite of what was scaremongered . 

7 minutes ago, rumak said:

 

Yes,  there are a few substackers (Gaert , and ? ) who have laid out what damage the covid shot causes to the human immune system.   Increasing with each shot/booster.  

Common sense would indicate that elderly people with already compromised immune systems,

"The elderly immune system deteriorates with age through a process called immunosenescence, which involves a decline in both innate and adaptive immunity"....

 

well.... they ( elderly in ok health)  should be the last subjects to be encouraged to take the mRNA shots.   Of course , just the opposite of what was scaremongered . 

And yet the statistics on the vaccinations tell the opposite story. Nearly all of the later deaths were unvaccinated MAGA morons. Those that were vaccinated lived,

49 minutes ago, cjinchiangrai said:

And yet the statistics on the vaccinations tell the opposite story. Nearly all of the later deaths were unvaccinated MAGA morons. Those that were vaccinated lived,

 

you will get a few LIKES and Trophies from the usual posters who refuse to understand that your/their "sources"  are owned by big pharma advocates and are being shown to be outright lies (not facts) .   Proof of what i just said has been given on this site over and over by people who searched and used critical thinking .  

You and those others i refer to refuse to try to read other "sources"  because of ingrained bias .  Plus it does take some intelligence to grasp ... but of course y'all

Just fall back on the old "MAGA morons"   line , amongst others.   Not too bright .

 

i usually will answer someone like you once .    Then..... no more.

Go get your shots .     

 

5 minutes ago, rumak said:

 

you will get a few LIKES and Trophies from the usual posters who refuse to understand that your/their "sources"  are owned by big pharma advocates and are being shown to be outright lies (not facts) .   Proof of what i just said has been given on this site over and over by people who searched and used critical thinking .  

You and those others i refer to refuse to try to read other "sources"  because of ingrained bias .  Plus it does take some intelligence to grasp ... but of course y'all

Just fall back on the old "MAGA morons"   line , amongst others.   Not too bright .

 

i usually will answer someone like you once .    Then..... no more.

Go get your shots .     

 

I have read other sources and they tent to be nonsense from Putins Q mill. The science is clear.

3 hours ago, rumak said:

but thank you CJ for keeping your comment /  viewpoint under 500 words , and i will not attack you with insults .   Hopefully you do not also believe that others should be forced to shoot things into their bodies that they do not want .

 

5 hours ago, JackGats said:

Even supposing the vaccines didn't protect me against Covid, they enabled me to travel between continents. For this alone I am grateful to the vaccines.

 

Unless you went to the US or Indonesia, the vaccine was never necessary to travel.

2 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

 

Unless you went to the US or Indonesia, the vaccine was never necessary to travel.

Hi Rattles,

I have much respect for your always interesting and well-researched posts and responses on this sub-forum. 

But I do not fully agree with the statement you made higher (note that I could be mistaken).  Your statement might be true for international travel, but - unless my memory is playing tricks with me - I remember that in the early days of the hysterical scamdemic you needed proof of Covid-vaccination when wanting to travel domestically in Thailand, as some Thai provinces required it to enter.  And as that requirement could be implemented on the spot, it was risky crossing a domestic provincial border, as you might not be allowed 'back in' without proof of Covid-vaccination.  Reason I remember this so vividly, was that it was used as an argument to have me and my lady Covid-vaccinated when a 10-person Public Health delegation entered our garden to Covid-vaccinate us.  Obviously I refused, and they tried to persuade us with different arguments (the domestic travel issue being one those) but they quickly saw that this Crazy Farang did not want to receive any of their '100% safe and effective' shots, unlike the intimidated villagers they visited before and after.  They left visibly disappointed, surely not out of concern for our health but rather because that @#$%^ foreigner prevented them showing a perfect vax-report to their boss...    

32 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

Hi Rattles,

I have much respect for your always interesting and well-researched posts and responses on this sub-forum. 

But I do not fully agree with the statement you made higher (note that I could be mistaken).  Your statement might be true for international travel, but - unless my memory is playing tricks with me - I remember that in the early days of the hysterical scamdemic you needed proof of Covid-vaccination when wanting to travel domestically in Thailand, as some Thai provinces required it to enter.  And as that requirement could be implemented on the spot, it was risky crossing a domestic provincial border, as you might not be allowed 'back in' without proof of Covid-vaccination.  Reason I remember this so vividly, was that it was used as an argument to have me and my lady Covid-vaccinated when a 10-person Public Health delegation entered our garden to Covid-vaccinate us.  Obviously I refused, and they tried to persuade us with different arguments (the domestic travel issue being one those) but they quickly saw that this Crazy Farang did not want to receive any of their '100% safe and effective' shots, unlike the intimidated villagers they visited before and after.  They left visibly disappointed, surely not out of concern for our health but rather because that @#$%^ foreigner prevented them showing a perfect vax-report to their boss...    

 

Hi Red,

 

I am 99.99% certain that it was never a requirement to be vaccinated to travel within Thailand.

 

There were travel restrictions betweeen provinces at times, but never was it required to show a proof of vaccination to be allowed to pass (i.e. the police would block the road and nobody was going through, regardless of vax status), and it never lasted very long.

 

What was prevalent, though (and your example shows this) was people propagating rumours in an authoritative tone. I recall some Thai people I know, well 'connected' in Phitsanulok, calling and saying that proof of vaccination would soon be required to access hospitals – these types of anxiety-inducing predictions were always paired with an encouragement to 'just do it' and go get jabbed in order to escape impending doom. The least one can say about these troubled times is that cool heads did not prevail.

 

On this forum too, it was often claimed that proof of vaccination would be required to renew one's visa, and of course to go to Europe, etc.

 

All false rumours propagated by people who had already taken the shot and wanted others to join them. There definitely was a psychological element to it, a group effect.