24 minutes ago, jerrymahoney said:

From the above CBSnews link:

 

Venezuela also accused * the U.S. of seizing a fishing vessel in its exclusive economic zone and detaining nine fishermen for several hours.

 

* Venezuela accuses U.S. of seizing fishing boat in Caribbean amid standoff

 

Venezuela on Saturday accused the United States of allegedly seizing a fishing boat for eight hours in its exclusive economic zone, as the U.S. military patrols the Caribbean to target drug cartels.

 

The vessel carrying nine fishermen was "illegally and hostilely" detained on Friday by the USS Jason Dunham, a destroyer, the foreign ministry in Caracas said in a statement.

 

The ministry said the boat was manned by tuna fishermen, which was sailing 48 nautical miles northeast of La Blanquilla Island, which belongs to Venezuela.

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/venezuela-accuses-u-s-of-seizing-fishing-boat-in-caribbean/

 

So Venezuelan dictatorship says not narco drug runners but fishermen. Must be true then. 

This is all part of the plan to teach (threaten) military members.

Remember all those generals brought into a room to get lectured? Word is that they were being scanned to see who was looking disloyal.

 

This is all an assault in what is right to do and civility. I'm a vet, if that matters.

14 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

So Venezuelan dictatorship says not narco drug runners but fishermen. Must be true then. 

Likely some aren't; likely some are.

1 hour ago, dinsdale said:

This isn't creativity it's comparison. You had no problem with Obama dropping missiles on civilians?

Again, a lame presumption. I criticized Obama endlessly. By the 3rd year of his first term I realized he was a liar and stopped supporting him. Will any MAGA members show an equal degree of independent thinking? Is it possible? Can you? 

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

How about if Americans stopped using the drugs? They will find their way in regardless, if there is crazy demand from a broken nation. Sorry to burst your little bubble of fiction, but most drugs from Venezuela end up in Europe. 

 

? made reference to that matter.

20 hours ago, bamnutsak said:

"The Fog of War" invoked by SecDef Pete "Happy Hour" Hegseth.

A phrase normally associated with another SecDef, Robert McNamara.

2003 The Fog of War Official Trailer 1 HD Sony Pictures Classics

 

 

It is possible that Pete thinks it refers to the smoke from the cannons, things in flames, etc.

 

I think the pro Trumpers here are from a paid troll farm in Somalie.

On 12/2/2025 at 6:38 PM, Wingate said:

Once the enemy or terrorist org is legally established, they can be struck, provided the intel justifies it.

 

Next, the Law of War Manual specifically states how one must deal with the injured or survivors. They are to be aided and rescued if possible,

 

Like the wmd intel that justified the war in Iraq? 

 

Also where in the Manual does it talk about waterboarding and torture. I need to brush up to make sure the manual is followed.

On 12/2/2025 at 6:52 PM, Wingate said:

So you will ignore the facts I posted about what's in the Pentagon's Law of War Manual?

 

Bad attempt at obfuscation, and makes your screen name seem.....ironic.

I did not address the Pentagon's Law of War Manual; I addressed your hateful rhetoric. You lack reading comprehension skills.

How to square the following two facts? One, the Trump administration is escalating its campaign against drug cartels. It is blowing up boats in the Caribbean that it says are involved in narcotrafficking. Two, President Trump has just pardoned a former president of Honduras, a man convicted in the United States of drug-trafficking charges. The former Honduran president is Juan Orlando Hernandez. He was serving a 45-year sentence for conspiring to import cocaine to the U.S. Now he's been released from a West Virginia prison.

 

So what is the Trump administration drug strategy and how does pardoning an ex-leader convicted of drug trafficking help to advance it?

The idea that you're going to raise the stakes in the Caribbean and play Whac-A-Mole against boats that are hardly a threat to the United States and then at the same time, free a convicted felon who actually did traffic drugs to the United States, seems confounding and highly hypocritical. 

 

A coherent strategy would involve not blowing up boats, but actually boarding them, arresting those involved, collecting evidence and intelligence on the boat and working your way through the networks that are involved in narcotics trafficking. It would seem to me that you would look more closely at the trafficking that's going through Central America, up through Mexico, through our southern border, where we know this is happening. And at the same time, you're going after those networks in the Caribbean.

 

So, does Trump sell his pardons? It would sure appear to be a strong possibility. $25 million? $50 million a whack? 

On 12/3/2025 at 7:56 AM, Chomper Higgot said:

 

 

Did it dawn on you that the slaughter of ‘alleged’ drug’ smugglers took place without evidence being presented?

 

The Trump administration made ‘judgement’, decided guilt, passed a sentence and executed the ‘suspects’ with absolutely no evidence being presented.

 

 

There are analysts tasked with tracking drug networks with access to resources in various government departments. So just because all  evidence is not presented to local news is irrelevant 

On 12/3/2025 at 6:22 AM, dinsdale said:

You say it was a crime so now support this claim. Whist your at it tell us why Obama's drone attacks that killed civilians including two US citizens wasn't.

It is absolutely a crime under the laws of war, specifically  mentioned as a crime in the US military code of justice. It has the cube root of <deleted> all to do with Obama, he hasn't been President for over 8 years.

 

As for the unedifying sight of the President ( Commander in Chief) and the Secretary of State for Defence now trying to blame it on any subordinate they can, I doubt that the "brass" are even remotely surprised.

2 minutes ago, JAG said:

It is absolutely a crime under the laws of war, specifically  mentioned as a crime in the US military code of justice. It has the cube root of <deleted> all to do with Obama, he hasn't been President for over 8 years.

 

As for the unedifying sight of the President ( Commander in Chief) and the Secretary of State for Defence now trying to blame it on any subordinate they can, I doubt that the "brass" are even remotely surprised.

You have obviously not seen the latest news. No order to kill all was issued.

7 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

You have obviously not seen the latest news. No order to kill all was issued.

Yet a second strike was conducted against survivors. That is beyond dispute. If it was done without orders to do so then it was a crime. The people responsible for ordering the strike in the first place (one must assume Trump and Hegseth) bear the ultimate responsibility.

 

Have you considered the delicious and ridiculous irony of your stance that Obama bore personal responsibility for an attack during his time in office, yet Trump and Hegseth do not?

1 minute ago, JAG said:

Yet a second strike was conducted against survivors. That is beyond dispute. If it was done without orders to do so then it was a crime. The people responsible for ordering the strike in the first place (one must assume Trump and Hegseth) bear the ultimate responsibility.

 

Have you considered the delicious and ridiculous irony of your stance that Obama bore personal responsibility for an attack during his time in office, yet Trump and Hegseth do not?

I have already stated that Obama dropping missiles on civilians was not deemed illegal as it was classified as collateral damage in the war on terrorism.