State Of Emergency Announced In Bangkok

[paulfromphuket]

i think its interesting to see the mood swing away from pad.

Taksin was a thief of that there is no doubt, but so was robin hood.

I wasn't aware that Robin Hood kept 95% of the takings for himself.

and Taksin took 95% of just what? can you put some bones on that claim/guess

normally you are so keen to establish facts and accuacy.

[Insight]

PPP rallying behind Samak in defiant of the looming verdict on his qualifications

<H2></H2>

The People Power Party is ready to reinstall Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej in office if he was disqualified by the judicial review on his involvement in two cooking shows, Finance Minister Surapong Suebwonglee said on Tuesday just hours before the afternoon's verdict.

Many PPP MPs have already been in contacts with coalition parties lobbying for their supports of Samak.

PPP spokesman Kudep Saikrajang said Samak remains a most qualified leader at this juncture to steer the country.

The Nation

Maybe these guys should start looking for people less qualified...?

[kurtgruen]

i think its interesting to see the mood swing away from pad.

No change of heart. I still support the PAD in bringing down this corrupt government, who violated democratic principles through vote buying and coercion and later wanting to change the constitution, to avoid punishment for their crimes!

I am just really busy with my company all of a sudden and don't have as much time to post. Another Pro PAD poster was banned and another I know of is on a visa run. Plus, a lot of us are getting tired of hearing the same rhetoric over and over again, I think.

I can sit here and post all day and maybe change one or two peoples opinions, by stating facts, (people who are not allowed to vote in this country anyways), or I can go out with my wife and talk to the local community, make them aware of the issues and get the ball rolling that way, with better results. Plus I can stay in contact with my Union back home, urging them to support the Unions over here.

So, rather than repeating a million times over, that the current government is corrupt and in power illegally (which are both facts), which to me is very undemocratic, I just drop in once in a while and post a news clipping or make a quick reply to something blatently wrong or to some wrong assumptions, such as the one above.

Sounds like when Pro Government posters, in the beginning where posting that the PAD rally was getting smaller and that it would fizzle away. Once again, they where proven wrong.

On the other hand, Samak could barely scrape together 1000 people, in a Coalition stronghold, on his road show to show support for his government (most of them probably paid as usual and the rest coming for the free medical clinic and other things he has set up), as the following article shows....

By The Nation

Published on September 9, 2008

Some 1,000 members of a pro-government group rallied behind the Samak Sundaravej administration yesterday on the eve of a mobile Cabinet meeting to be held today in the northeastern province of Udon Thani.

The "We Love Udon Thani" group held their rally around Udon Thani provincial hall.

Provincial police beefed up security by deploying 700 officers. They dismissed fears about possible clashes between pro and antigovernment supporters. However, locals are afraid that wearing a shirt with the wrong colour could lead to retribution.

The multipurpose lawn in front of the provincial hall was filled with people as the government launched a mobile medical clinic and set up booths to offer advice about land and agriculture. Suphot Laowansiri, governor of Udon Thani, said the activities provided a one-stop service for local people.

Are those the so called majority and masses that are supporting the Govennment, that you guys keep talking about??? Out of the 1000 people (which is a pathetically small amount, after he advertised it on his Propaganda channel (NBT), who many of them where paid to be there, how many of them where there to get free medical from the mobile clinic?

Anyways, I really don't have time for this right now. Work to do

Cheers

Kurt

[Siripon]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Banharn take up the reins if Samak is disqualified today. He attacked the PAD for planting rice at Government House and yesterday Samak said the next mobile cabinet would be in Supanburi. Of course that could be gratitude for continued support for Samak as PM, but handing him the helm for a while would take some heat off the nominee criticisms; which would be deafening if Somchai or Surapong took over.

[kurtgruen]

Oh yeah....Thaksin the real modern day, Capitalist Robin Hood....Take from the Rich and Poor and give to himself. lol

[paulfromphuket]

Oh yeah....Thaksin the real modern day, Capitalist Robin Hood....Take from the Rich and Poor and give to himself. lol

I made it quite clear that taksin was a thief, but my point was to ask another poster to clarify what was a very wild statement, just what did takin take 95% of, we need facts here not guesses.

[sriracha john]

Now Reuters got it... the PPP Plan...

Thai ruling party vows to stick with Samak as PM

BANGKOK, Sept 9 (Reuters) - Thailand's ruling People Power Party (PPP) said on Tuesday it would renominate Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej as premier if a court disqualified him for hosting TV cooking shows while in office.

"We believe the court will give us justice, but if the court rules otherwise, we will nominate Samak as the prime minister again," PPP spokesman Kudeb Saikrachang told Reuters.

"The majority of the PPP think that he is still qualified to be prime minister. He is no longer a TV show host and remains the party leader," he said.

If found guilty of conflict of interest, Samak will have to step down along with his cabinet.

The PPP's continued support for Samak, which renders the court decision largely irrelevant, is likely to outrage protesters *as well as most reasonable people around the world who would view this re-selection as PM as a travisty.* barricaded inside Samak's Government House compound for the last two weeks demanding his resignation.

Analysts had expected Thai markets to react positively to a court ruling against Samak, seeing it as a possible short-term solution to three years of political turmoil.

That is unlikely now to be the case.

Edited September 9, 2008 by sriracha john

[JoeInSurin]

Now Reuters got it... the PPP Plan...

Thai ruling party vows to stick with Samak as PM

BANGKOK, Sept 9 (Reuters) - Thailand's ruling People Power Party (PPP) said on Tuesday it would renominate Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej as premier if a court disqualified him for hosting TV cooking shows while in office.

"We believe the court will give us justice, but if the court rules otherwise, we will nominate Samak as the prime minister again," PPP spokesman Kudeb Saikrachang told Reuters.

"The majority of the PPP think that he is still qualified to be prime minister. He is no longer a TV show host and remains the party leader," he said.

If found guilty of conflict of interest, Samak will have to step down along with his cabinet.

The PPP's continued support for Samak, which renders the court decision largely irrelevant, is likely to outrage protesters *as well as most reasonable people around the world who would view this re-selection as PM as a travisty.* barricaded inside Samak's Government House compound for the last two weeks demanding his resignation.

Analysts had expected Thai markets to react positively to a court ruling against Samak, seeing it as a possible short-term solution to three years of political turmoil.

That is unlikely now to be the case.

Since there needs to be a "conflict of interest" I would think "most reasonable people around the world" would have trouble finding one and find this court decision as pure BS. What conflict of interest is there between being PM and being a guest on a cooking show?

[kurtgruen]

Now Reuters got it... the PPP Plan...

Thai ruling party vows to stick with Samak as PM

BANGKOK, Sept 9 (Reuters) - Thailand's ruling People Power Party (PPP) said on Tuesday it would renominate Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej as premier if a court disqualified him for hosting TV cooking shows while in office.

"We believe the court will give us justice, but if the court rules otherwise, we will nominate Samak as the prime minister again," PPP spokesman Kudeb Saikrachang told Reuters.

"The majority of the PPP think that he is still qualified to be prime minister. He is no longer a TV show host and remains the party leader," he said.

If found guilty of conflict of interest, Samak will have to step down along with his cabinet.

The PPP's continued support for Samak, which renders the court decision largely irrelevant, is likely to outrage protesters *as well as most reasonable people around the world who would view this re-selection as PM as a travisty.* barricaded inside Samak's Government House compound for the last two weeks demanding his resignation.

Analysts had expected Thai markets to react positively to a court ruling against Samak, seeing it as a possible short-term solution to three years of political turmoil.

That is unlikely now to be the case.

I certainly would view it as such, but then again, the PPP is by no means democratic and continuously shows it's true colours. The PPP had absolutely no respect for democracy (as their vote buying shows) and no respect for the law. Just a bunch of lawless criminals!

Just read the following on the Nation:

Verdict on Samak ready for reading: Charan

Constitution Court judge Charan Pakdeethanakul said on Tuesday that the verdict on the prime minister's qualifications was ready for release this afternoon as scheduled.

The Nation

[sriracha john]

but then again, perhaps the re-selection is not a sure thing...

Elements conspire against Samak

Samak's days as PM could be numbered - and not because he is giving in to demands for his resignation. The Constitution Court will today decide whether to disqualify him due to his hosting of two televised cooking shows after taking office. If Samak is found guilty of breaching the charter, he will be dismissed from his premiership according to Article 182 (7). However, he would have a chance to be re-elected by MPs in the House of Representatives. Then again, due to the nature of politics, coalition parties might decide against supporting an attempt by Samak to return as PM in a re-election. Indeed, many members of the Thai public have said they no longer want Samak as leader. Not to mention a power struggle between factions within the PPP that Samak has struggled to get under control. Perhaps most importantly, exiled but influential ex-PM Thaksin has reportedly intimated to his aides in the PPP that Samak should not be a contender in any re-election. The continuing pressure on Samak could work in favour of former PM Banharn Silpa-archa, a leader of the Chart Thai coalition party. He might get another shot at the premiership. Newin Chidchob, a key executive of the dissolved TRT party, has reportedly approached Banharn, asking if he was ready to be PM again.

Besides the Constitution Court's ruling, the Appeals Court's verdict on the defamation lawsuits filed against Mr Samak and Dusit Siriwan, former Prime Minister's Office minister, by former deputy Bangkok governor Samart Ratchapolsitte, is expected on Sept 25. If the Appeals Court upholds the verdict, Samak will face jail time.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.net/090908_News/09Sep2008_news15.php

========================================================

and jail time is something the PPP can't "re-select" Samak from...

[kurtgruen]

but then again, perhaps the re-selection is not a sure thing...

Elements conspire against Samak

Samak's days as PM could be numbered - and not because he is giving in to demands for his resignation. The Constitution Court will today decide whether to disqualify him due to his hosting of two televised cooking shows after taking office. If Samak is found guilty of breaching the charter, he will be dismissed from his premiership according to Article 182 (7). However, he would have a chance to be re-elected by MPs in the House of Representatives. Then again, due to the nature of politics, coalition parties might decide against supporting an attempt by Samak to return as PM in a re-election. Indeed, many members of the Thai public have said they no longer want Samak as leader. Not to mention a power struggle between factions within the PPP that Samak has struggled to get under control. Perhaps most importantly, exiled but influential ex-PM Thaksin has reportedly intimated to his aides in the PPP that Samak should not be a contender in any re-election. The continuing pressure on Samak could work in favour of former PM Banharn Silpa-archa, a leader of the Chart Thai coalition party. He might get another shot at the premiership. Newin Chidchob, a key executive of the dissolved TRT party, has reportedly approached Banharn, asking if he was ready to be PM again.

Besides the Constitution Court's ruling, the Appeals Court's verdict on the defamation lawsuits filed against Mr Samak and Dusit Siriwan, former Prime Minister's Office minister, by former deputy Bangkok governor Samart Ratchapolsitte, is expected on Sept 25. If the Appeals Court upholds the verdict, Samak will face jail time.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.net/090908_News/09Sep2008_news15.php

========================================================

and jail time is something the PPP can't "re-select" Samak from...

Ahh, the puppet master strikes again ;-)

[sriracha john]

Now Reuters got it... the PPP Plan...

Thai ruling party vows to stick with Samak as PM

The PPP's continued support for Samak, which renders the court decision largely irrelevant, is likely to outrage protesters *as well as most reasonable people around the world who would view this re-selection as PM as a travisty.* barricaded inside Samak's Government House compound for the last two weeks demanding his resignation.

Since there needs to be a "conflict of interest" I would think "most reasonable people around the world" would have trouble finding one and find this court decision as pure BS. What conflict of interest is there between being PM and being a guest on a cooking show?

Where do you get "conflict of interest" in this?:

The constitution prohibits a prime minister from holding any position in a partnership, company or an organisation involved in business with a view to sharing profits or income, or being an employee of any other person.

The law simply states the PM can't be moonlighting with a second job... it doesn't have to be in conflict with any government interests and it is fairly consistent to what most other nations would expect of their Leader.

Edited September 9, 2008 by sriracha john

[ubonjoe]

What if?

1. Ruling goes against Samak

2. The coalition government backs him and is ready to vote him back in.

3. Samak says no thank you.

No resignation (that would be giving into PAD). A very honorable exit. Also a very good face saving move.

But who would replace him? Not one from PAD's short list of two for sure.

Would this satisfy PAD and they move out of Government house?

[sylviex]

Some 2,000 students in Phuket skip classes to rally against Samak Government on Tuesday morning. They campaigned for motorists to turn on front lights of vehicles and blow horns to show their disapproval of the govternment.//Yongyot Phruksarak (The Nation)

I find it rather extraordinary that school kids are attending protests. They seem to be in uniform. Do parents give permission ? Do teachers arrange this ? How does this come about ?

(Apologies if discussed already -- impossible to keep up with everything.)

[JoeInSurin]

Now Reuters got it... the PPP Plan...

Thai ruling party vows to stick with Samak as PM

BANGKOK, Sept 9 (Reuters) - Thailand's ruling People Power Party (PPP) said on Tuesday it would renominate Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej as premier if a court disqualified him for hosting TV cooking shows while in office.

"We believe the court will give us justice, but if the court rules otherwise, we will nominate Samak as the prime minister again," PPP spokesman Kudeb Saikrachang told Reuters.

"The majority of the PPP think that he is still qualified to be prime minister. He is no longer a TV show host and remains the party leader," he said.

If found guilty of conflict of interest, Samak will have to step down along with his cabinet.

The PPP's continued support for Samak, which renders the court decision largely irrelevant, is likely to outrage protesters *as well as most reasonable people around the world who would view this re-selection as PM as a travisty.* </B>barricaded inside Samak's Government House compound for the last two weeks demanding his resignation.

Analysts had expected Thai markets to react positively to a court ruling against Samak, seeing it as a possible short-term solution to three years of political turmoil.

That is unlikely now to be the case.

I certainly would view it as such, but then again, the PPP is by no means democratic and continuously shows it's true colours. The PPP had absolutely no respect for democracy (as their vote buying shows) and no respect for the law. Just a bunch of lawless criminals!

Just read the following on the Nation:

Verdict on Samak ready for reading: Charan

Constitution Court judge Charan Pakdeethanakul said on Tuesday that the verdict on the prime minister's qualifications was ready for release this afternoon as scheduled.

The Nation

The PPP is undemocratic for vote buying. The PAD are undemocratic for wanting the 30 - 70 plan and suggesting that Thailand is maybe not ready for a democracy.

The PPP has no respect for the law because af vote buying. The PAD has no respect for the law by taking over NBT and the Government house

One is a bad as the other. I could not see anyone supporting either.

Edited September 9, 2008 by JoeInSurin

[ubonjoe]

Coalition members say they support Samak

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=130515

[Meerkat]

What if?

1. Ruling goes against Samak

2. The coalition government backs him and is ready to vote him back in.

3. Samak says no thank you.

No resignation (that would be giving into PAD). A very honorable exit. Also a very good face saving move.

But who would replace him? Not one from PAD's short list of two for sure.

Would this satisfy PAD and they move out of Government house?

Well no. PAD have now decreed that Samak's ouster is only the precondition for them to then start negotiating to rip up the Constitution and find ways of implementing "New Politics". Oh, and only negotiating with those with whom it agrees. Everyone else can take a hike.

Dark days.

(I like your what if scenario though)

[brewsterbudgen]

Since when hasn't vote buying been a factor in Thai politics? Prosecute the offenders but don't resort to "mob" rule.

[h90]

i think its interesting to see the mood swing away from pad.

No change of heart. I still support the PAD in bringing down this corrupt government, who violated democratic principles through vote buying and coercion and later wanting to change the constitution, to avoid punishment for their crimes!

I am just really busy with my company all of a sudden and don't have as much time to post. Another Pro PAD poster was banned and another I know of is on a visa run. Plus, a lot of us are getting tired of hearing the same rhetoric over and over again, I think.

I can sit here and post all day and maybe change one or two peoples opinions, by stating facts, (people who are not allowed to vote in this country anyways), or I can go out with my wife and talk to the local community, make them aware of the issues and get the ball rolling that way, with better results. Plus I can stay in contact with my Union back home, urging them to support the Unions over here.

So, rather than repeating a million times over, that the current government is corrupt and in power illegally (which are both facts), which to me is very undemocratic, I just drop in once in a while and post a news clipping or make a quick reply to something blatently wrong or to some wrong assumptions, such as the one above.

Sounds like when Pro Government posters, in the beginning where posting that the PAD rally was getting smaller and that it would fizzle away. Once again, they where proven wrong.

On the other hand, Samak could barely scrape together 1000 people, in a Coalition stronghold, on his road show to show support for his government (most of them probably paid as usual and the rest coming for the free medical clinic and other things he has set up), as the following article shows....

By The Nation

Published on September 9, 2008

Some 1,000 members of a pro-government group rallied behind the Samak Sundaravej administration yesterday on the eve of a mobile Cabinet meeting to be held today in the northeastern province of Udon Thani.

The "We Love Udon Thani" group held their rally around Udon Thani provincial hall.

Provincial police beefed up security by deploying 700 officers. They dismissed fears about possible clashes between pro and antigovernment supporters. However, locals are afraid that wearing a shirt with the wrong colour could lead to retribution.

The multipurpose lawn in front of the provincial hall was filled with people as the government launched a mobile medical clinic and set up booths to offer advice about land and agriculture. Suphot Laowansiri, governor of Udon Thani, said the activities provided a one-stop service for local people.

Are those the so called majority and masses that are supporting the Govennment, that you guys keep talking about??? Out of the 1000 people (which is a pathetically small amount, after he advertised it on his Propaganda channel (NBT), who many of them where paid to be there, how many of them where there to get free medical from the mobile clinic?

Anyways, I really don't have time for this right now. Work to do

Cheers

Kurt

Yes, boring+I know two who are banned....

[sriracha john]

I see a major player in the midst of all of this is in the news again...

House Speaker Chai Chidchob (right) with his arm draped around designated Parliamentary kung-&lt;deleted&gt; master, PPP MP Karun Hosakul (left)

EC to discuss House Speakers stock holdings today

Chairman of the Election Commission (EC) Apichart Sukakanont stated that today's EC meeting will have an agenda concerning House Speaker Chai Chidchob's stake holdings in a government concessioned company.

Mr. Apichart mentioned however, that the commission will not be able to conclude today whether or not to forward the matter to the Constitution Tribunal. He said if the matter is not completed it will be continued tomorrow as most other matters are minor local issues.

The case was submitted to the EC by the Democrat party in response to People Power Party MP's seeking similar charges against Democrat MPs. The issue is cited in Constitution Article 265 (2).

- ThaiNews / 2008-09-09

[catmac]

It seems to me a lot of people here are missing the point about the current conflict. This is not a battle against Thaksin, Samak, the PPP or the TRT.

It is a battle where by a minority want to overturn a democratic system in favour of a grossly socially inequitable feudalistic form of government.

Thailand is a corrupt country relative to western democracies. It is a developing democracy moving from a feudal system through an absolute Monarchy to a democratic Monarchy. There will be winners and losers in such a change. However, the power-brokers of today wish to turn back the clock to a more archaic form of government which is generally not accepted in western countries which have already undergone this political evolutionary process in past centuries.

The sins of Samak or Thaksin are not an issue here. They can be dealt with by the courts. What really is at stake here is Thailands future as a developing democracy and its future in developing from a basically third world country into a modern economic world partner.

Its far too easy (and emotive I would add) to focus on the politically "hot" topics of the day and to not see the bigger picture.

I couldn't have said it better.

The obsessed tunnel vision some posters have against members of the present and former governments, or entire government at all, is almost sickening. The day-in-day-out posts they write have nothing to do anymore with the reality and future of Thailand.

These same people will ALWAYS find a new target to bash upon to filter their own narrow minded views.

It's the same as if some obsessed Thai people would write and object against (members of) governments in the countries they live in, abroad.

Having an opinion is nothing wrong with but to make it a personal battle is something one has to think about twice. Trying to be objective is not their strongest point; on the contrary, they can't even listen or try to accept views from others which differ from theirs.

The complete Thai system and society is so deeply rotten that the people behind the Thai velvet curtains are now even trying to to overthrow the democratically elected and formed coalition government because the PM showed up in a cooking show and the same afore mentioned posters go along with that...

The ENTIRE world will look and almost laugh themselves to death if the Thai government is overthrown because of a cooking PM..........

It's just sick; speaking about losing face for Thailand....

LaoPo

Brilliantly put, Ando and LaoPo.

All that's been said, plus a couple of other points:-

Their absolute refusal to accept facts, e.g. vote buying is sadly rife amonst ALL parties and has been for decades, most of them are just as guilty as PPP (which is why nearly every party is up before the EC), yet we hear only the endless bleat "they weren't elected, they bought it!"

PAD's leadership make is crystal clear that their principal aim is not just to get rid of Samak/PPP, but to redraw the whole democratic framework - the New Politics. Yet so many pro-PAD posters are in denial of that fact, as even they can't stomach the prospect of an appointed, unelected junta with the military playing a prominent role in keeping the status quo safe for evermore.

[Meerkat]

Since when hasn't vote buying been a factor in Thai politics? Prosecute the offenders but don't resort to "mob" rule.

Ah, but according to Sondhi the EC is corrupt. Which is odd considering that they seem to be doing a great job of prosecuting exactly those people whom Sondhi is accusing them of taking bribes to protect.

[JoeInSurin]

Now Reuters got it... the PPP Plan...

Thai ruling party vows to stick with Samak as PM

The PPP's continued support for Samak, which renders the court decision largely irrelevant, is likely to outrage protesters *as well as most reasonable people around the world who would view this re-selection as PM as a travisty.* barricaded inside Samak's Government House compound for the last two weeks demanding his resignation.

Since there needs to be a "conflict of interest" I would think "most reasonable people around the world" would have trouble finding one and find this court decision as pure BS. What conflict of interest is there between being PM and being a guest on a cooking show?

Where do you get "conflict of interest" in this?:

The constitution prohibits a prime minister from holding any position in a partnership, company or an organisation involved in business with a view to sharing profits or income, or being an employee of any other person.

The law simply states the PM can't be moonlighting with a second job... it doesn't have to be in conflict with any government interests and it is fairly consistent to what most other nations would expect of their Leader.

Samak's perfect stew

BangkokPost.com, with Agency reports)

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej told the Constitution Court on Monday that he cooked for TV because he enjoyed it, not as a job for money - and the court announced it will rule on Tuesday whether he violated the law and has to resign.

A judge at the tribunal said before Mr Samak testified that it will rule quickly on whether Mr Samak violated the constitutional ban on outside work by hosting television cooking shows.

"I presented the cooking show and got paid for my acting," said Samak.

He is charged with conflict of interest. If he is guilty, Mr Samak will have to step down, along with his cabinet.

In his testimony, Mr Samak denied charges that he had broken the constitution by hosting a television cooking show while also serving as premier, claiming the programme had been done on a freelance basis.

He was responding to charges made in May by a group of Thai senators, who charged Mr Samak with violating the constitution by continuing his job as a TV presenter on his personal cooking show, Chim pai, bon pai (Tasting and Complaining), after he had been appointed prime minister on Feb 6.

Mr Samak appeared before the Constitution Court Monday to refute the charges.

"I consulted with legal counsel after I became prime minister, and they all agreed it was not a breach of the constitution if I was not a regular employee of a company," he told the court.

He said he had only hosted the show a few times after becoming prime minister and only on a freelance basis.

"I did it because I liked doing it," Mr Samak said. "I was the first TV presenter to do my cooking right in the market, and it was delicious too."

Sakchai Khaewwaneesakul, the managing director of the company that produced the cooking show, testified in support of Samak, saying it paid him 80,000 baht (US$2,300) for the four shows.

"The presenters of our shows are not our employees, but we pay them honorariums," he told the court.

Under Thailand's 2007 constitution, no elected politician is allowed to hold a second job while in office. The clause was designed to avoid conflicts of interest.

Mr Samak, 73, a veteran politician with more than four decades of experience in Thailand's tempestuous politics, is also an accomplished cook.

[ubonjoe]

What if?

1. Ruling goes against Samak

2. The coalition government backs him and is ready to vote him back in.

3. Samak says no thank you.

No resignation (that would be giving into PAD). A very honorable exit. Also a very good face saving move.

But who would replace him? Not one from PAD's short list of two for sure.

Would this satisfy PAD and they move out of Government house?

Well no. PAD have now decreed that Samak's ouster is only the precondition for them to then start negotiating to rip up the Constitution and find ways of implementing "New Politics". Oh, and only negotiating with those with whom it agrees. Everyone else can take a hike.

Dark days.

(I like your what if scenario though)

Yes that has been their stated position. My error.

But PAD could do a "flip flop" as they have already done on various occasions.

[ubonjoe]

It seems to me a lot of people here are missing the point about the current conflict. This is not a battle against Thaksin, Samak, the PPP or the TRT.

It is a battle where by a minority want to overturn a democratic system in favour of a grossly socially inequitable feudalistic form of government.

Thailand is a corrupt country relative to western democracies. It is a developing democracy moving from a feudal system through an absolute Monarchy to a democratic Monarchy. There will be winners and losers in such a change. However, the power-brokers of today wish to turn back the clock to a more archaic form of government which is generally not accepted in western countries which have already undergone this political evolutionary process in past centuries.

The sins of Samak or Thaksin are not an issue here. They can be dealt with by the courts. What really is at stake here is Thailands future as a developing democracy and its future in developing from a basically third world country into a modern economic world partner.

Its far too easy (and emotive I would add) to focus on the politically "hot" topics of the day and to not see the bigger picture.

I couldn't have said it better.

The obsessed tunnel vision some posters have against members of the present and former governments, or entire government at all, is almost sickening. The day-in-day-out posts they write have nothing to do anymore with the reality and future of Thailand.

These same people will ALWAYS find a new target to bash upon to filter their own narrow minded views.

It's the same as if some obsessed Thai people would write and object against (members of) governments in the countries they live in, abroad.

Having an opinion is nothing wrong with but to make it a personal battle is something one has to think about twice. Trying to be objective is not their strongest point; on the contrary, they can't even listen or try to accept views from others which differ from theirs.

The complete Thai system and society is so deeply rotten that the people behind the Thai velvet curtains are now even trying to to overthrow the democratically elected and formed coalition government because the PM showed up in a cooking show and the same afore mentioned posters go along with that...

The ENTIRE world will look and almost laugh themselves to death if the Thai government is overthrown because of a cooking PM..........

It's just sick; speaking about losing face for Thailand....

LaoPo

Brilliantly put, Ando and LaoPo.

All that's been said, plus a couple of other points:-

Their absolute refusal to accept facts, e.g. vote buying is sadly rife amonst ALL parties and has been for decades, most of them are just as guilty as PPP (which is why nearly every party is up before the EC), yet we hear only the endless bleat "they weren't elected, they bought it!"

PAD's leadership make is crystal clear that their principal aim is not just to get rid of Samak/PPP, but to redraw the whole democratic framework - the New Politics. Yet so many pro-PAD posters are in denial of that fact, as even they can't stomach the prospect of an appointed, unelected junta with the military playing a prominent role in keeping the status quo safe for evermore.

I agree.

Also some great posts with links overnight. Gave me a lot to read this morning.

[sjaak327]

Lao Po u are completly out of touch regarding the situation with the rural 'poor' and their relationship with the government. I can't believe you can be so naieve. You are defending the people in the poorer areas who have no education and are being PAID by the ruling party to vote... how silly are you ?

What are you suggesting then, take away their right to vote ?

What is it with the 'no education' remarks. Did you ever meet some of the people you speak about, I actually did, as I have spent quite some time there, and I know quite some people there. They are not that uneducated as you seem to think.

[hammered]

I was just talking to my secretary about politcs, something I dont usually do. She has always been a huge fan and supporter of Thaksin, but she was telling me while she still respected Tahksin and hoped he would come back she hated this current government and hopes they will soon be gone.

I only post his as it is a viewpoint I didnt expect. Maybe it is more prevalent than I think.

[Tony Clifton]

Some of these posters are denying the reality of the situation.

Sondhi and his illegal band of thugs were armed to the teeth long before AAD showed up:

LOL... thanks for that one, I had never before seen an oar being described as "armed to the teeth"... usually those description refer to firearms or at least something more like this...

I'm sure you would be equally amused if the PAD thugs smacked you on the head with it SJ?

Big knives make good photos but the story line someone was trying to give us is that the band of thugs who took over Government House were unarmed, peaceful protesters.

There are hundreds of media pictures out there that show they were anything but unarmed or peaceful.

There are firsthand reports from Bloomberg and other reporters the night of the confrontation of bullets flying by them coming from the Government House toward the AAD mob.

PAD is for the most part armed and paid by the royalist/military/Bangkok elite who wish to overthrow an elected government and install their own henchmen to continue looting the government. Anything else is just fluff to disguise their motives.

~WISteve

May I suggest you look at this post of mine AND ESPECIALLY the two pics included.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...t&p=2193747

[Soontorn]

Samak's Judgement Day

By Supon Thanukrit

The Nation

Published on September 9, 2008

Constitution Court to decide today if PM violated charter by hosting TV cooking show

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej's fate will be decided this afternoon when the Constitution Court rules on whether he violated the charter by hosting commercial television shows while in office.

The court, led by President Chat Chonlaworn, is scheduled to read its verdict at 2pm.

If Samak is found guilty, he will have to step down. The entire Cabinet will have to go with him, and Parliament will have to pick a new prime minister.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2008/09/09...cs_30082931.php

[sjaak327]

The law simply states the PM can't be moonlighting with a second job... it doesn't have to be in conflict with any government interests and it is fairly consistent to what most other nations would expect of their Leader.

Of course it seems (judging from news articles that have been published about the court hearing yesterday) that having a second job is not the problem here. As he apparently wasn't paid for participating in the cooking show. It actually seems that the concerned shows were merely re-runs. I'm sure there is not ONE country, where the PM would be made to step down because he hosted a cooking show. It's ludricous even to take such a trivial matter serious.