How Is Phnom Penh And Vicinity Now?

[dmax]

Avoid the brothels unless you want to get your picture taken and be followed around by various NGO's looking for funding.

Brothels were not on my list of things to do, but I find this comment interesting. Are NGO's blackmailing tourists who visit brothels? Are they real NGO's or locals with fake credentials?

No, looking for funding from back where they come from. They ride around in new Land Rovers and other SUV's pretending to be hot shots all the while playing like policemen and policewomen. At one recent point the Cambodians were going to toss them out but again, foreign money talked. The linked article is an example of how slanted it can get. While I don't know if the guy was a criminal, I know it isn't the role of NGO's to build cases againist them. Watch the video to see what I mean.

http://spectator.org/blog/2009/09/17/beyond-acorn

when they are tracking and uncovering filthy foreign peadophiles then fair play to them..wots the big deal ?

[BruceMangosteen]

when they are tracking and uncovering filthy foreign peadophiles then fair play to them..wots the big deal ?

The big deal is the motivation. It is for their own purposes, financial, not for the good of the children. And they are not law enforcement, not qualified to do criminal investigations in any country let alone a third world country, and perhaps you still fail to grasp the seriousness of being wrongly accused of a crime...Picture yourself being wrongly accused by some NGO of for example dealing drugs to children....

[maxjay]

Have a look here: http://www.mekongesl.com/v9/

The site covers Cambodia, Laos, and Vietnam.

[MartinBKK]

What a load of 'Twaddle' , which back streets did you wander off to ? I have lived here 4 years now and I noticed a lot of changes for the good , it only has the same smells I noticed in Thailand and the old piles of garbage on the streets has greatly diminished . One thing is for sure , the people are much more polite and helpfull plus they speak far better English than Thai , more to the point , they understand it far better . The charm of Thai disappeared a long time ago , that is why I left , that and the constant scamming . The river-side is undergoing a great improvement , that is for sure , this is still a poor country , if you cannot appreciate that I feel sorry for you .

When you fly in to PP there is no hastle at the airport , nor are there a host of punters awaiting the chance to rip you off , quite the opposite , you are made to feel welcome .

Well i have to agree with the OP its not a load of "twaddle". I was not impressed at all with my first visit to PP 3 months ago. When i arrived at the airport there were plenty of ppl trying to rip me off for my taxi to town. Luckily i had a friend go 2 weeks before so i knew what the correct prices were. Some people were quite friendly but generally i found the service in restaurants and shops to be below the standard found in Thailand (and Thailand is not good as we all know). The people did speak much better english though i would agree with that. After 2 days i was desperate to return to Thailand. On the other hand i have heard many people speak positively about PP so i guess it suits some but not others.

Cheers

[ALFREDO]

I come to Thailand since 1990 and since 2000 I live more in TH than in Europe -mostly Isaan and Phuket,

have Thai GF and children here.

About 4 years ago was my first trip to Phnom Penh and with Motorbike to Sihanoukville and Koh Kong, I am since than now every year in Cambodia, PP and mostly Snookys for weeks.

For PP its now cleaner than during my first trip, overall its different than TH but I like that and I like Cambodia,

more layed back, more relaxed.

I read somewhere KM 11 in the postings, I heared 4 year ago already that, that place is closed.

For the ABC Video, I looked only the first part, I heared and mentioned in that report,

-MARTINIS, a Disco club for underaged Prostitutes-

Thats wrong, I never saw something like underaged whores there,

just a place where you can find Prostitutes. Not underaged one! Sure not usual there, I never saw such a scene there.

When a mother gives her underaged child to a man for relationship and sex, as to see in the ABC report,

than she also has to face the law.

I got something like that told from a man with a Lao mother, family and a 14,5 year young girl and it is still a good working? relationship, they live in TH, -since 4 years.

I know a Tattooed Thai girl from a Internet dating sight, just 18, her mother brought her to a brothel on Koh Panghan with 16!

And here in BKK just 2 days ago on Sukhumvit, a lady she seemed to help out to bring customers to a street Restaurant,

at 3 AM she stopped me, was under the influence of Alc. Big Tattoo on the breast and on the shoulder,

wanted to spend the night with me.

She looked about 24 for me, she said no, 19. Ok, I thought she looked older than 19, asked for her ID-,

she was first unwilling to let me have a look, I insisted and I read born 2335,

so she was 17 or will be this year 17, I could not translate the month.

Are not also the parents responsible when the daughter is at 3 AM working? in a makeshift Sukhumvit roadside Rest?

Not also responsible when she has at that age big Tattoos?

Did she not work already some time in a brothel in the countryside with Thai customers who like to share the hours with very young ladys?

We should not think only from bad, sick, misbehaving Falangs and Barangs,

go to the roots, where the rich Thais and Cambodians are willing to pay a lot of money for the first night or week with a young also underaged girl, I got storys like that told!

[dumball]

Pedophiles in Asia have been reported to be 95% asian , But practicaly all reporting of such has been concerning Farang foreigners , whom so ever they may be , they need to be locked in a mental institute because it has also been reported they are incurable .

[dumball]

Plenty of people at the airport trying to 'Rip me off for my ride into town' , all twenty or so of them picked on you ? Should that be even half true , compare that to the HUNDREDS At BKK airport that the authorities SAY they are trying to control/disperse , I will say it was that way maybe some years ago , but many visitors on a much less controversial forum paint quite a different finding . We are all entitled to our own opinions on any given subject , that is what (should) make forums interesting , Martin , at least you gave a fair report , not completely one-sided i.e. the good with the bad .

[britmaveric]

dumball - still $10 by taxi from airport to FCC? Last time had a car service pick me up - thinking using taxi, but obviously dont want to be taken.

[dumball]

dumball - still $10 by taxi from airport to FCC? Last time had a car service pick me up - thinking using taxi, but obviously dont want to be taken.

There was a taxi driver off to the right asking $7.00 same as the 'Airport' tuk-tuks , most tuk-tuk drivers do it for $5.00 . My guy comes in from the city to collect me and only charges $5.00 , used him for almost 4 years now though , he is more like a family friend , have an enjoyable visit .

[britmaveric]

Cheers mate - looking forward to be back in PP. Enjoyed our last visit immensely.

[phuketrichard]

ok my opinion might be valid as have been living in Thailand since '84 and travelling here since 75. Used to go to Cambodia in the early 90's by going to trat and taking a boat to Koh kong, travelling around for a few days/weeks then come back to thailand same way. no stamps out of thailand no hassles coming back.

If u want save taxi fare stay at Flamingo hotel and get the free ride to town and then change hotels if u dont like it there.$35-35/night. I was there 2 weeks ago and its a nice room with cable air and wifi and location. Otherwise just pay the $7 tuk tuk.

ONE word of advice , if ur going to get ur visa on arrival make sure u sit towards the front of the plane ( if ur flying airasia pay to choose a seat up front) and get off as fast as u can

Garbage, Yes its everywhere in PP. The shops and people pile it up outside the doors for the trucks to pick up. Saw few bins and i lived there for 10 monnths last year but the system works. The trash is gone thru on the streets then again at the landfil Not as sanatary as the recylcling bins in Switzerland but ...

The Cambodia are a gentle people and they do speak more english. They have lived thru so many horrors in the past 40 years its almost unbelieveable it happened. Where were the Americans and NATO when POL POT was there? NO where cause they don't have oil in Cambodia, ( unless its found in the gulf off Snooky in the future) so no one cared. Still they go on and it might be years before its a "developed" as thailand but thats fine for me :-)

[ALFREDO]

Yes -SIR-, I mean PHUKETRICHARD, the right words, thank you.

[ALFREDO]

-psyclon-

DOB, date of born is just now applyied on new ID cards also recognicable and printed in Christian-Roman calendar dates.

But you still find old ID cards where you only can read the Thai numbers. Like that it has been for a long time!

If you do not know that, I understand why you say WOW, do not know what to say.

I do not know what to say to your posting either!

[Oberkommando]

I also found a grocery store very similar to Foodland in Thailand (I think the name was Lucky Foodmart or something like that).......great cheese and meat products (and better bread than you find in Thailand).

2) virtually everything seems more expensive in Cambodia than in Thailand (no idea why)

Better bread is available everywhere, even on the street from only 2000 riels.

Bayon Supermarket on Monivong has arguably a better selection of Western food items than Foodland or Villa in Bangkok and they are cheaper from my experience. Wine in Cambodia is far cheaper than in Thailand. Bottle of 2005 Mouton Cadet 350thb ($10) in Cambodia. In Thailand the same wine is 1,200thb down from 2,500thb when it was first imported.

Beer and Western food is cheaper in Cambodia and better IMO. You can have a decent steak in a French restaurant for $12. Simply not possible in Thailand. Anchor beer is better than any Thai beers and is $1 a can.

If you are craving Western stodge get yourself to the Green Vespa. Alan's menu is fantastic. Hope he's still open.

[Credo]

I was there a couple of weeks ago (King's Birthday in Thailand). It is not clean, but I wouldn't call it dirty. It's a little dusty. Driving is pretty bad, but at least traffic moves slowly, but rather steadily.

It has a charm of it's own.

As for the NGO pedophile stuff, I don't know too much about it, but I had a friend who got 'arrested' with a 17 year old girl. He was trapped by an NGO. The guy actually took him to the place. First time they left together, the next night the guy brought the police. The police settled the case for $200 . It was hardly clear cut and he wasn't looking for a 'child'.

The problem I have with this approach from NGO's is there job is to assist and help children--not to use them for bait in entrapping farangs. He has been back since, and the girl is still working in the brothel--no NGO has tried to help her in anyway. No arrest for the owner, no offer for training/education etc. This is not how an NGO is supposed to work.

Governments--including EU and US--can help their counterparts in Cambodia by training the police and building the judicial system so that they do their end of the job and the NGO's can stick to assisting children and families.

[duchovny]

Been in South East Asia for 12 years have you dumbell? You must have spent most of it looking in the other direction then. Phnom Penh stinks, there are no garbage bins and foul smelling rubbish is strewn all over the 'pavements'. Walk out of your shoe box and have a look right now. As Robroy above states. Open your eyes sunshine.

Self contradiction? <deleted> are you talking about. Suggest you buy yourself a dictionary.

I've spent a lot of time in Cambodia in the last 5 years and completely disagree.

Phnom Penh is a clharming, vibrant city and is being gentrified at a very fast rate. The change there in a few years is truly amazing.

For me personally, I prefer Sihanoukville which is also moving ahead in leaps and bounds, but some prefer PP.

You sound like one of these struggling Thailand business owners desperately trying to cling on to your customers and not see them go to a far better place, Cambodia, by deriding the place with false claims. That happens a lot on this forum. Also, when it comes to arguments about prices and cost of living, Cambodia is cheaper, I've lived in both countries.

And as for the people, well, never have I come across a more xenophobic people than the Thais. I simply couldn't take that shit anymore and left the country. It's not the case in Cambodia.

The best area of Phnom Penh is Boeung Keng Kang (BKK1) and surrounds. The river side is an over-rated touristy place.

[duchovny]

Well i have to agree with the OP its not a load of "twaddle". I was not impressed at all with my first visit to PP 3 months ago. When i arrived at the airport there were plenty of ppl trying to rip me off for my taxi to town.

When you arrive at PP, there is a desk that gives you a voucher anywhere downtown in a decent taxi for $9 that you pay to the driver upon arrival at your hotel. Where's the rip-off?

If you want to carry your luggage all the way out to the main road and wait, you might be lucky enough to get someone to take you downtown for $7 or $8, a saving of a massive $1-2.

Are you English by any chance?

[Oberkommando]

When you arrive at PP, there is a desk that gives you a voucher anywhere downtown in a decent taxi for $9 that you pay to the driver upon arrival at your hotel. Where's the rip-off?

I have been dozens of times and never even been the victim of an attempted rip-off.

Taxi is flat rate $9 anywhere downtown.

Simples.

[JR Texas]

Been in South East Asia for 12 years have you dumbell? You must have spent most of it looking in the other direction then. Phnom Penh stinks, there are no garbage bins and foul smelling rubbish is strewn all over the 'pavements'. Walk out of your shoe box and have a look right now. As Robroy above states. Open your eyes sunshine.

Self contradiction? <deleted> are you talking about. Suggest you buy yourself a dictionary.

I've spent a lot of time in Cambodia in the last 5 years and completely disagree.

Phnom Penh is a clharming, vibrant city and is being gentrified at a very fast rate. The change there in a few years is truly amazing.

For me personally, I prefer Sihanoukville which is also moving ahead in leaps and bounds, but some prefer PP.

You sound like one of these struggling Thailand business owners desperately trying to cling on to your customers and not see them go to a far better place, Cambodia, by deriding the place with false claims. That happens a lot on this forum. Also, when it comes to arguments about prices and cost of living, Cambodia is cheaper, I've lived in both countries.

And as for the people, well, never have I come across a more xenophobic people than the Thais. I simply couldn't take that shit anymore and left the country. It's not the case in Cambodia.

The best area of Phnom Penh is Boeung Keng Kang (BKK1) and surrounds. The river side is an over-rated touristy place.

I have to agree with you.........no idea what the guy is talking about unless he is talking about the past.

I would say, maybe five years ago, PP was dirty and you could see too much trash......the last time I was there things had changed rather dramatically.

I think the govt. has gotten serious about improving infrastructure, especially around the riverfront area.

Sihanoukville is also changing fast.........I was shocked to see the brand new roads and signs.

Also, many of those old shacks have been torn down.

You know, after Hun Sen set up residence there, the area will improve, especially security.

Too bad about the recent murder (Swiss citizen?).

I hope that does not continue because I don't want the place to turn into another Pattaya-Jomtien.

[jimbob]

The Cambodia are a gentle people and they do speak more english. They have lived thru so many horrors in the past 40 years its almost unbelieveable it happened. Where were the Americans and NATO when POL POT was there? NO where cause they don't have oil in Cambodia, ( unless its found in the gulf off Snooky in the future) so no one cared.

Well actually it was the pulling out of US troops and end of military and financial support to the Lon Nol regime that led directly to the fall of Phnom Penh and take over of the Pol Pot regime.

Of course the US did not know that there was oil off the coast of Sihanoukville at the time...

[gpdjohn]

The Cambodia are a gentle people and they do speak more english. They have lived thru so many horrors in the past 40 years its almost unbelieveable it happened. Where were the Americans and NATO when POL POT was there? NO where cause they don't have oil in Cambodia, ( unless its found in the gulf off Snooky in the future) so no one cared.

Well actually it was the pulling out of US troops and end of military and financial support to the Lon Nol regime that led directly to the fall of Phnom Penh and take over of the Pol Pot regime.

Of course the US did not know that there was oil off the coast of Sihanoukville at the time...

it was SEATO forces then (which dissolved in 1977) not NATO forces.

[JR Texas]

NATO, SEATO, TOTO.........????????

Back to topic: Are there any nice and reasonably priced condos now in PP?

(Maybe talk about Sihanoukville too.......thanks)

[mel2surf]

I've been in Cambodia for about a year now,and find PP a decent place as far as cities go...nice breeze near the river...ok food (Though IMHO Thai food way better)...good nightlife...ok internet,etc. but I mostly live in Sihanoukville,and save alot of dough there as compared to Thailand.

I stay simple and don't need Aircon or fancy schmancy but I do like CLEAN and near the beach.I stay in a clean new guest house with fan, two large windows,basic shower w/hot water,a large bed,and cable TV.I have my DVD player and movies to keep me amused. (rooms cleaned as often as u like)...all for the rate of under $5 USD/day.

I stay month to month and also the staff are very friendly.I am within minutes walk of Ocheateal Beach and restaurants/bars.I like the friendly people,the weather and the affordable lifestyle.having said that,it can be boring here sometimes. To each his own i guess.

[ozzydom]

NATO, SEATO, TOTO.........????????

Back to topic: Are there any nice and reasonably priced condos now in PP?

(Maybe talk about Sihanoukville too.......thanks)

Depends on what you call reasonably priced

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

Resurrecting a year-old old thread . . .

Just came back from 8 days in Cambo, including five in PP. What a difference six years make! That was the last time I was in Phnom Penh, a bit of a dump then. Couldn't believe how revitalized everything was and how clean the sidewalks and streets were. New roads, new medians, new signs. New offices and residences everywhere. (Yes, there were some nasty garbage piles on some side streets.)

Prices pretty good compared to TH, especially beer at a buck a glass and very good beer too. Jameson $2-2.50 (60-75 baht). And my brand of cigs 30 baht, compared to 95 in BKK! Well, $1.-1.25 on street. Had good espresso almost everywhere.

You could count on nearly everyone, especially the young people, speaking decent English. I found service to be pretty good -- mistakes were made but nothing on the scale of Thailand. And lots of smiles, good humour and courtesy.

Overall, it was a breath of fresh air, compared to my Bangkok home.

I'm going back in about a month for a longer period to see if I could live there. I can't help but think that my Thailand days are numbered. (I knew this before visiting Cambodia.)

Edit: punctuation.

[Jingthing]

A quick question about the annual Cambodian visa if anyone knows (the 200 dollar travel agent kind). Can you go in and out with that and keep the visa or if not, is there a way to buy reentry permits as for Thai non-O visas?

[cat5]

I've lived in Phnom Penh 2 years.

The city is trash-strewn & the driving is the worst on Earth. Be careful crossing roads & try to avoid using motodups.

The people are very friendly. I'm only rarely ripped off in shops & never in markets. English level MUCH lower than in Thailand.

Strange how experiences differ. I've only been there for short visits - no more than 4 days in total - and found the level of English considerably higher than in Thailand. I met several motorcycle taxi riders and basic shop workers (equivalent of 7-11, etc.) who spoke an excellent standard of English. Overall, I found them to be very friendly and helpful people.

[SantiSuk]

I've lived in Phnom Penh 2 years.

The city is trash-strewn & the driving is the worst on Earth. Be careful crossing roads & try to avoid using motodups.

The people are very friendly. I'm only rarely ripped off in shops & never in markets. English level MUCH lower than in Thailand.

Strange how experiences differ. I've only been there for short visits - no more than 4 days in total - and found the level of English considerably higher than in Thailand. I met several motorcycle taxi riders and basic shop workers (equivalent of 7-11, etc.) who spoke an excellent standard of English. Overall, I found them to be very friendly and helpful people.

I smell a rat. IMO Robroy's posting was aimed at diverting the attention of the Thai falang community away from PP and Cambodia. I understand why! I hope it doesn't get flooded with expats too quickly also.

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

I've lived in Phnom Penh 2 years.

The city is trash-strewn & the driving is the worst on Earth. Be careful crossing roads & try to avoid using motodups.

The people are very friendly. I'm only rarely ripped off in shops & never in markets. English level MUCH lower than in Thailand.

Strange how experiences differ. I've only been there for short visits - no more than 4 days in total - and found the level of English considerably higher than in Thailand. I met several motorcycle taxi riders and basic shop workers (equivalent of 7-11, etc.) who spoke an excellent standard of English. Overall, I found them to be very friendly and helpful people.

I smell a rat. IMO Robroy's posting was aimed at diverting the attention of the Thai falang community away from PP and Cambodia. I understand why! I hope it doesn't get flooded with expats too quickly also.

Heh, heh. Yes, I'd hate to see the place flooded with more expats, but everyone I met was a disgruntled previous resident of Thailand. You can imagine rents and prices rising with a rising influx of foreigners. To stoke the fires of discouragement, I'm told that more Africans are showing up there after being kicked out of TH. <<< I'm not making this up.

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

A quick question about the annual Cambodian visa if anyone knows (the 200 dollar travel agent kind). Can you go in and out with that and keep the visa or if not, is there a way to buy reentry permits as for Thai non-O visas?

If you're talking about the business visa, I remember reading earlier today a post saying you have to sign up for 6-month or 12-month visa to get multi-entry status.