Gaso-ol 95

[gisele]

Maybe this is a really stupid question but...

We stopped to gas up, we ask for 95 as usual, the attendant says that they don't have 95 they have gaso-ol 95 (or however it's spelled).

Unsure what to say we drove off to the next gas station, they had just plain 95 so we filled up and that was that.

However I want to know for next time.

[Jai Dee]

Good question gisele... I was in a similar situation upcountry last week too, and I too opted not to fill up with gasohol and keep going until I found a service station that sold the regular gow-ha...

Anyone know what the difference is and what effect (if any) it will have on your car?

[lampard10]

Good question gisele... I was in a similar situation upcountry last week too, and I too opted not to fill up with gasohol and keep going until I found a service station that sold the regular gow-ha... 

Anyone know what the difference is and what effect (if any) it will have on your car?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No, but my wife heard about it and decided to fill up with this new stuff. That was until I convinced her that a diesel wouldn't go on it. Thank God I was with her at the time, although most of the pump attendants are a little bit with it.

[Farma]

I had the same reaction when I first saw Gasohol in the fuel stations and continued on to another fuel stop.

The old 95 doesn't seem to be available in the areas I’ve been traveling. I’ve now used gasohol for the past month or so in our Toyota with no adverse effects. I personally think the car runs better.

The august 6? issue of Newsweek ran an issue devoted mainly to Gasohol. It appears to be the new fuel with most countries looking at increasing the use of it. Brazil and China are 2 of the major users/produces of this fuel.

I recall the article mentioned current car engines run safely on Gasohol as long as the Alcohol blend stays around 10% or less. It mentioned slightly less fuel efficiency from Gasohol but I haven’t noticed any changes. The car manufacturers are now producing engines that will safely run on pure Alcohol.

Most of the Thai fuel stations hand out booklets with FAQs on Gasohol. Unfortunately the only ones I've seen have been in Thai.

Edited September 27, 2005 by Farma

[uncle paul]

I had the same reaction when I first saw  Gasohol in the fuel stations and continued on to another fuel stop.

The old 95 doesn't seem to be available in the areas I’ve been traveling. I’ve now used gasohol for the past month or so in our Toyota with no adverse effects. I personally think the car runs better.

The august 6? issue of Newsweek ran an issue devoted mainly to Gasohol. It appears to be the new fuel with most countries looking at increasing the use of it. Brazil and China are 2 of the major users/produces of this fuel.

I recall the article mentioned current car engines run safely on Gasohol as long as the Alcohol blend stays around 10% or less. It mentioned slightly less fuel efficiency from Gasohol but I haven’t noticed any changes.  The car manufacturers are now producing engines that will safely run on pure Alcohol.

Most of the Thai fuel stations hand out booklets with FAQs on Gasohol. Unfortunately the only ones I've seen have been in Thai.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

you can read about its use in thailand here

or another site says

gasohol

Related: Organic Chemistry

a gasoline extender made from a mixture of gasoline (90%) and ethanol (10%; often obtained by fermenting agricultural crops or crop wastes) or gasoline (97%) and methanol , or wood alcohol (3%). Gasohol has higher octane, or antiknock, properties than gasoline and burns more slowly, coolly, and completely, resulting in reduced emissions of some pollutants, but it also vaporizes more readily, potentially aggravating ozone pollution in warm weather. Ethanol-based gasohol is expensive and energy intensive to produce, and can damage rubber seals and diaphragms and certain finishes if the ethanol is present in higher concentrations. Since 1998, however, many American automobiles have been equipped to enable them to run on E85, a mixture of 85% ethanol and 15% gasoline. Methanol-based gasohol is also expensive to produce and is toxic and corrosive, and its emissions produce cancer-causing formaldehyde,

i guess you had better check before using it

Edited September 27, 2005 by uncle paul

[mijan24]

In support of the above post:

Gasohol 95 is a mixture of gasoline and ethanol, that is, virgin alcohol, that has characteristics equal to those of general 95% octane gasoline, but is 1.50 baht per litre. This provides clean power for environmental protection. Combustion of Gasohol 95 produces lower levels of hydrocarbons, carbon monoxide and carbon dioxide than general 95% octane gasoline, and helps to reduce black smoke, aromatic hydrocarbon, benzene, and dust emission from exhaust pipes. Therefore, Gasohol 95 is clean gasoline that can help to reduce environmental problems.

Although some sites refer to only using unleaded gasoline mixed with ethanol ??

[Jai Dee]

you can read about its use in thailand here

Thanks for the link uncle paul.

My concerns are from PTT's Research page as follows:

1. Gasoline blended with ethanol creates slightly more effect on rubber parts of the fuel system in an engine than the petrol mixed with MTBE. However, the ethanol-blended-gasoline does not produce any effect on fuel supply system in an engine.

2. Petrol mixed with ethanol has similar effect on plastic parts of the fuel system in an engine as gasoline with MTBE mixture.

3. Ethanol-blended gasoline does not affect the property of metal parts, except on the colour of surface of copper and brass, though it does not affect the working property.

I guess the best bet is to check with your vehicle manufacturer, as a lot of engine components are now made of plastics.

[Farma]

I’ve seen an add running on Thai TV channels that I’ve been told is the manager of Volvo or Mercedes Thailand stating Gasohol is safe to use in their engines. I can’t remember which car manufacturer it was.

Checking with the engine manufacturer is definately a good idea. I recall there were plenty of engine seal problems a few years ago in Australia when naptha had been added to fuel and the public had not been informed.

Another point raised in the Newsweek articles’ regarding the environmental benefit of methanol fuel is the carbon is renewable. In effect, the carbon was recycled, plant – air – plant, rather than extra fossil petroleum based carbon being introduced into the atmosphere and adding to polution.

[Crossy]

I think the problems with rubber / plastic parts in the fuel system only affects older vehicles.

Unfortunately I have been advised by BMW (Germany) that my 1995 325i will NOT be happy on gasohol for this reason. Currently waiting on a reply regarding updated (non-affected) fuel system parts.

Hopefully I will be able to get octane-booster (so I can use 91) when sales of regular 95 stop (supposedly in January).

We shall see.

[Thetyim]

I would never want to use gasohol myself.

Quote : Alcohol was introduced into our commercial fuels in recent years. But alcohol related problems such as corrosion and water absorption have systematically been kept from the public. A very real cover-up has occurred for greed and political reasons. Mileage drops as high as 50-percent are real (in our own testing) for instance.

Quote : In conclusion, alcohol in fuel attracts water. Water acts like a fire extinguisher. It's not a smart thing to put in cars or trucks. Some cars may run badly and even quit due to the incombustible nature of the water laden fuel. We know of a dozen cars that recently stopped running due to water in the alcohol and gas mixture. They used the same Blue Planet gasoline. (One of those was my 1986 Jimmy).

[Farma]

While water in the fuel is a distinct possibility, I haven’t had any problems with Gasohol since I had to use it. Its rainy reason and I would have expected any problems with water in the fuel to occur if it was going to happen.

I think the low percentage of ethanol shouldn’t cause a major problem. Contamination could occur in the fuel stations storage tanks, but that would happen in smaller station prior to Gasohol being introdued as well.

Cars can run nicely with small amounts of water in the fuel. Look at how nice your car runs when it’s raining.

Back in the 70’s during the fuel crisis there were various aftermarket water injection kits available for cars to increase power. They consisted of a small water tank with a hose leading to a small needle valve inserted into the carburetor.

An old trick to fix the problem with water in fuel on farm vehicles was to add a cup of methylated spirits into the fuel tank to break down the water and allow it to mix into the fuel.

Some of the 707 aircraft engines used water injection to provide additional power on takeoff.

The corrosion problem does seem to be mentioned a lot in articles discussing Methanol fuels and could cause problems, but would they be any worse than the corrosion a car in a tropical climate suffers.

[Thetyim]

Farma, you are mis-informed.

Water injection does not work.

Ethanol and methylated spirit are not the same thing

A 707? Does it have a piston engine ?

[Farma]

Farma, you are mis-informed.

Water injection does not work.

Ethanol and methylated spirit are not the same thing

A 707?  Does it have a piston engine ?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thetyim, I’m not trying turn this into a detailed technical discussion or disprove your ideas on the subject.

Unfortunately, it appears Gasohol will be the only option for us needing 95 octane fuel in our cars. As stated in my earlier posts, I’ve had no alternative but use Gasohol in my car and can only speak from my experience using it. Apart from Crossy, I seem to be the only person using Gasohol. Are we the only people not driving diesel vehicles?

There’s an interesting article titled “Water Injection, It lets you safely develop more power with nearly no running costs” on this link. http://autospeed.drive.com.au/cms/article.html?&A=0115&P=1

True, 707 engines are turbines and not piston engines. The theory behind water injection applies to both piston and turbine engines.

Water injection was used to increase thrust on takeoff. Modern more efficient jet engine designs have taken away the need for water injection. Afterburners aka Reheat, provides that extra thrust requirement on military jets. The 707 was primarily a civilian airliner that needed extra thrust while adhering to noise level restrictions.

True Ethanol and Metho are not the same. Both are alcohols and react in similar ways with water. In the past I’ve used a variety of alcohols, isopropyl, Metho etc as additives in my cars fuel tank, with success, to clear the water contamination.

Ethanol is an alcohol, most commonly made using a process similar to brewing beer where starch crops are converted into sugars, the sugars are fermented into ethanol, and then the ethanol is distilled into its final form.

Methylated spirits ("metho") is a mixture of ethyl alcohol (95%) and methyl alcohol (%5). The methyl alcohol is poisonous and is added to prevent the methylated spirits being used as cheap drinking alcohol.

Maybe others can share their experience with Gasohol.

[mijan24]

ETHANOL IN THE NEWS TODAY (Ex Australian News MSN 9).

Mr Howard said further testing on the suitability and efficiency of ethanol would be carried out following findings it adversely affected cars made before 1986.

[gisele]

I took your advice and I emailed the manufacturer, the response was:

"Dear Gisele

Thank you very much for your interest in Nissan. We

would

like to inform you that Nissan Sunny B14 up can be safely

filled with

gasohol 95.

Best regards,

Customer relations

Siam

Nissan Automobile"

[danone]

I drive now for quite some time with 91 gasohol (cr-v, 2000ccm)

power is slightly less, but overall satisfying.

once in a while I get 95 to give the engine a kick.

but no worries, you'll be safe with gasohol, not a bad thing.

[Heng]

I'd rather cut my employees' wages than switch to gasahol 95.

Really though, non scientific reports from friends say that even though it's 1.50 Baht cheaper, it has a faster burn rate at higher RPMs than standard unleaded 95. Again, these were just "gut feel" reports.

[Thetyim]

"Dear Gisele

Thank you very much for your interest in Nissan. We

would

like to inform you that Nissan Sunny B14 up can be safely

filled with

gasohol 95.

Notice the wording used.

It is safe to FILL up with Gasohol, it does not say use it.

Even if we assume fill to mean use then what does safe mean.

If gasohol doubles your fuel consumption and wrecks your engine in two years it would still be safe to use.

[danone]

in brasil cars run since decades with a kind of gasohol.

the nation has not gone under yet.

[AlexLah]

I found that Gas-ol is in the end more expensive then using pure benzine.

I drive about 600 Km per full tank and about 450 on Gas-ol.

Always same route and meassured during 5 months.

One week pure 95 and next using gas-ol

Alex

[Thetyim]

* It has about 33% per liter lower energy density than gasoline, leading to a lower vehicle driving range.

* As an octane enhancer in gasoline, it increases the volatility when mixed in the 0-20 % range and unless offset by low volatility blending components tends to increase evaporative hydrocarbon emissions.

* It tends to increase aldehydes emissions.

* It absorbs water and will cause phase separation in gasoline mixtures if water comes into the distribution, storage or vehicle fuel system.

And thats from a clean air website in favour of gasohol