Baht Bus Bottleneck From Jomtien To Pattaya During Peak Hours -- Worse Than Ever!

[advancebooking]

I totally agree with OP about this issue and was intending on writing a thread about this same topic.

A few nights ago I had to wait 10 min to be picked up- maybe 15 min. The greedy drivers with their empty seats looking for private charter....

The only way to stop these greedy buggers is for the council to charter their own public buses - like the dodgy ones you see in bangkok with no air con. If the council put on buses like this rotating the walking street to jomtien route then the situation is solved.

Cant wait for peak season to be over...

[BlackPuddingBertha]

Gosh I hate to sound like a troll, but without "haven't had any first hand experience", how can anyone claim they know 10B is adequate (for the operators). Would not knowledge of what is adequate require a cost analysis of annual (not just one season) baht bus operating costs vs baht bus revenue / customer usage?

I have been taking Pattaya bahtbuses for 35 years so I think that I do know something about them. I havent had any first-hand experience of this particular problem (drivers refusing regular fares in favour of charter fares) but even the most superficial calculation of the likely costs and expenditure will show that that bahtbus drivers do not do badly at 10B for the basic fare.

[xminator]

Gosh I hate to sound like a troll, but without "haven't had any first hand experience", how can anyone claim they know 10B is adequate (for the operators). Would not knowledge of what is adequate require a cost analysis of annual (not just one season) baht bus operating costs vs baht bus revenue / customer usage?

I have been taking Pattaya bahtbuses for 35 years so I think that I do know something about them. I havent had any first-hand experience of this particular problem (drivers refusing regular fares in favour of charter fares) but even the most superficial calculation of the likely costs and expenditure will show that that bahtbus drivers do not do badly at 10B for the basic fare.

Maybe not, but I guess they do better with 200 baht charter. And that is what the market want now. Or at least that is what the baht bus drivers think the market want. So unless there is political will to enforce a public bus service, be it scheduled or the traditional pick up scheme, nothing is going to change.

[DiNiro]

It's surprising that the developers/businesses with major investments in Jomtien, Pratamnak Hill, Naklua, 3Rd Road etc. don't demand the City enforce the contracts with the meter taxies and baht busses.

When you go looking to purchase or rent a condo or home around town, or want to engage in commerce, you soon find out about the transport nightmare you would face going about daily business if you choose to live there.

[brewsterbudgen]

the fault really is with new people coming here and not doing some research beforehand, you have the one visit wonders (never coming back) that are ripe to be ripped off and don't know any better - India - middle east - russia etc, then into the mix are the 2 week millionaire falangs throwing money around like it hurts to keep it in their pocket, there is a cycle going on here regarding tourism and there are very few Thais smart enough to see it - I'm seeing it already with 4000 baht bar fines in walking street - the business model is all wrong - it's like having a resturant charging for a comfy seat because nobodiy is eating

I don't think so!

[fakename]

I have been to Jomtien beach a few times this week, and watched many people trying to flag down a baht bus and many went by, and all had room for a few more passengers, so apparently they are mostly working charter, and once these customers are dumped off, they race up to the other end of the beach and start to look for another charter. I hope the low season is a long one, for these drivers, they deserve it!

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

I hope the low season is a long one, for these drivers, they deserve it!

In that vein, I remember during low season last summer standing on Central Rd late at night when the odd baht bus would peel off the lineup of buses turning into Buakhao and pick me up for a single 10-baht fare to Big C Extra. Then that disappeared with high season. Well, now my 10-baht coins go to the gasoline stations. Judging by the number of red-plated moto's, cars and trucks in my building's garage, some others may have made the same choice.

Anyway, good forum topic, Jingthing.

Edited January 22, 2013 by Kaoboi Bebobp

[Baloo22]

I don't think doubling the fare would solve a thing. They would just double the charter prices and do the same thing. Human greed knows no limits and I speak from experience being a human. There needs to be top level organized oversight, real rules, and real enforcement. Yes kick the violators out of the business.

"There needs to be top level organized oversight, real rules, and real enforcement."

First; You know that is not going to happen in Pattaya for a long, long, time into the future. Pattaya, along with a bunch of other cities in Thailand does not have a government or "real" police force that is up to that task. Yes, if Pattaya were a city in USA, Canada, Europe, Australia, Japan, Korea, Singapore, and a few select other locales, there would be an effective bus system present already. Those countries also have city governments/management/planners with at least a semblance of competency. They also have real police that actually do, for the most part, care about public safety, public order, and enforcement of laws. I used to say that's western thinking but it is not really just western thinking anymore. It's more "first-world" thinking and I do consider countries like Japan, Korea, and Singapore to be "first-world".

Second; You are assuming that the purpose/goal of the Pattaya "public transportation system" is effective transportation. I don't believe that is true at all. The real reasoning behind the current "herds of baht-bus" system is to keep a large group of the "lower-class" people with subsistence-level jobs. It's working fine.

It's the same problem with the thinking that we tend to apply to the "rice-pledging" program! Loads of us TV members post about how bad it is and how ineffective it is. When, actually, the "rice-pledging" program is doing exactly what it's creators expect it to do. It's lining the pockets of millers, dealers, and select others and buying the votes of a large segment of the voters. It's working just fine!!

Edited January 22, 2013 by Baloo22

[yoslim]

yesterday I passed two brand new aircon city buses (public bus layout not tour bus !!) on pattaya klang. They looked really nice and all but they were empty.. I wonder why city hall doesn't setup those buses to loop from dolphin to jomtien

[johng]

yesterday I passed two brand new aircon city buses (public bus layout not tour bus !!) on pattaya klang. They looked really nice and all but they were empty.. I wonder why city hall doesn't setup those buses to loop from dolphin to jomtien

They tried that a few years ago...one of the first drivers was pulled from the bus and given a severe beating ( can't remember if he died or not )

also the fare structure wasn't very good for short distance 30 baht flat fee.

[Jingthing]

yesterday I passed two brand new aircon city buses (public bus layout not tour bus !!) on pattaya klang. They looked really nice and all but they were empty.. I wonder why city hall doesn't setup those buses to loop from dolphin to jomtien

They tried that a few years ago...one of the first drivers was pulled from the bus and given a severe beating ( can't remember if he died or not )

also the fare structure wasn't very good for short distance 30 baht flat fee.

Wasn't it 20 baht? In any case it was a great service, though too infrequent, because it covered a HUGE area. You could from Jomtien beach to far out Naklua and then over to Sukhumwit passing BPH then going far south again ... No reason to take for a standard baht bus route assuming you can get a baht bus. Edited January 22, 2013 by Jingthing

[johng]

I think they put the price down just before going bust.

Pattaya’s Beach Bus is the latest victim of the increase in gasoline prices, with the operator axing one of the routes because it is no longer profitable to run.

Pattaya Beach Bus Co Ltd, which has a seven-year contract to operate a scheduled bus service and which began operations in August 2005, has found itself with an inadequate number of passengers and escalating costs of running its vehicles.

The company’s general manager, Suriyont Klindee, has announced that the Yellow Line has been axed. The buses had run on a Soi Chayapreuk-Thepprasit Road-Thappraya Road-Third Road-South Pattaya-Central Pattaya-North Pattaya-Pattaya City Hall-Sukhumvit Road route. Suriyont said there were too few passengers for the route to be viable.

The Red Line and the Green Line services remain. Suriyont said that the travel time for these routes is 45 minutes and that the buses run from 8 a.m. to 6 p.m. every day. The buses, however, must have at least 25 passengers for the service to be sustainable, he said.

The fare remains at 20 baht per route.

[Baloo22]

yesterday I passed two brand new aircon city buses (public bus layout not tour bus !!) on pattaya klang. They looked really nice and all but they were empty.. I wonder why city hall doesn't setup those buses to loop from dolphin to jomtien

They tried that a few years ago...one of the first drivers was pulled from the bus and given a severe beating ( can't remember if he died or not )

also the fare structure wasn't very good for short distance 30 baht flat fee.

Wasn't it 20 baht? In any case it was a great service, though too infrequent, because it covered a HUGE area. You could from Jomtien beach to far out Naklua and then over to Sukhumwit passing BPH then going far south again ... No reason to take for a standard baht bus route assuming you can get a baht bus.

I read about an incident of "one of the first drivers was pulled from the bus and given a severe beating" that happened on Phuket Island when they tried to start a bus service in Patong. I would not be surprised to hear the same thing happening in Pattaya.

IMO, a series of smaller but more frequent buses would provide better service. Small buses would allow more of them, more frequency, and they would be easier to handle on the poorly-maintained and congested roads. Start with a simple route and with clearly marked bus stops. A route starting at the south end of Jomtien Beach Road and heading north along Jomtien Beach Road, on to Thap Phraya into Pattaya, then north along Pattaya Second Road, continuing north into Naklua. Then turn around and head south from Naklua onto Pattaya Beach Road, south on Thap Phraya, south on Jomtien Beach Road. Repeat and repeat and repeat.

That route would handle passengers going Jomtien <-->Pattaya, and also Naklua <--> Pattaya. It would be nice if the government would train some of the current baht-bus drivers to drive those buses, collect fares, perform maintenance, etc and relieve some of the potential job loss for them.

[ZZZ]

IMO, a series of smaller but more frequent buses would provide better service. Small buses would allow more of them, more frequency, and they would be easier to handle on the poorly-maintained and congested roads. Start with a simple route and with clearly marked bus stops. A route starting at the south end of Jomtien Beach Road and heading north along Jomtien Beach Road, on to Thap Phraya into Pattaya, then north along Pattaya Second Road, continuing north into Naklua. Then turn around and head south from Naklua onto Pattaya Beach Road, south on Thap Phraya, south on Jomtien Beach Road. Repeat and repeat and repeat.

That route would handle passengers going Jomtien <-->Pattaya, and also Naklua <--> Pattaya. It would be nice if the government would train some of the current baht-bus drivers to drive those buses, collect fares, perform maintenance, etc and relieve some of the potential job loss for them.

So the govenment should use a series of smaller busses (Baht busses) to be driven by the current drivers on a rout they are currently using??

I'm not sure this is changing anything.

[Baloo22]

IMO, a series of smaller but more frequent buses would provide better service. Small buses would allow more of them, more frequency, and they would be easier to handle on the poorly-maintained and congested roads. Start with a simple route and with clearly marked bus stops. A route starting at the south end of Jomtien Beach Road and heading north along Jomtien Beach Road, on to Thap Phraya into Pattaya, then north along Pattaya Second Road, continuing north into Naklua. Then turn around and head south from Naklua onto Pattaya Beach Road, south on Thap Phraya, south on Jomtien Beach Road. Repeat and repeat and repeat.

That route would handle passengers going Jomtien <-->Pattaya, and also Naklua <--> Pattaya. It would be nice if the government would train some of the current baht-bus drivers to drive those buses, collect fares, perform maintenance, etc and relieve some of the potential job loss for them.

So the govenment should use a series of smaller busses (Baht busses) to be driven by the current drivers on a rout they are currently using??

I'm not sure this is changing anything.

Even when we falang use the term "baht-bus", they are still not buses. They are still just pick-up trucks with two benches!

When I wrote "smaller buses", I am referring to a small bus like this with a passenger capacity of 30, instead of using a large bus like this with a passenger capacity of 56.

Disclaimer: The above links are examples only. Many other companies produce similar buses.

[DiNiro]

yesterday I passed two brand new aircon city buses (public bus layout not tour bus !!) on pattaya klang. They looked really nice and all but they were empty.. I wonder why city hall doesn't setup those buses to loop from dolphin to jomtien

They tried that a few years ago...one of the first drivers was pulled from the bus and given a severe beating ( can't remember if he died or not )

also the fare structure wasn't very good for short distance 30 baht flat fee.

The scamming is so severe, your life is now in danger if you attempt to provide a legitimate service.

Sad but true.

[ZZZ]

There is really only one way to solve the problem and that is for City Hall and Department of Land Transport to take charge and enforce the contract with the Baht Bus Cooperative. A 10Baht fare should be adequate but as all drivers now are competing at the most trafficked routes there are not enough customers to make a decent living.

A fixed set of main routs with a fixed set of baht busses per rout should be established and enforced. If one rout would be less profitable they could arrange some kind of rotation system between the routes for the drivers.

I would like to see four main routes:

1. Jomtien to Naklua via Second rd and back via Beach rd with half the busses going via Pratumnak and the other half via Thappraya rd.

2. North Pattaya rd/Sukhumvit via North Pattaya rd, Beach rd, South Pattaya rd to Sukhumvit. Same return trip but via Second Rd.

3. Central Pattaya rd/Sukhumvit via Central Pattaya rd, Beach rd and back via Central Pattaya rd.

4. Bali Hai via Third rd to North Pattaya rd bus station/Sukhumvit.

There will also be a need for minor routes such as Theprasit rd to Sukhumvit and a number of feeder services from the dark side to the main routes at Sukhumvit/North/Central and South Pattaya rd.

If a system like this was implemented it would help to lessen the current traffic congestion and maybe cut down on the number of drunk drivers, It should also provide a decent living for the baht bus drivers as more people would use the system.

All this is probably wishful thinking as it depends 100% on City Hall doing their job.

[Jingthing]

...

All this is probably wishful thinking as it depends 100% on City Hall doing their job.

...

The same City Hall that approved the fake taxi meters being owned by the same Baht Bus "Cooperative" that owns the buses. I think that's our answer. When hell freezes over and all that jazz ...

[rgs2001uk]

All this is probably wishful thinking as it depends 100% on City Hall doing their job.

Some people should acquaint themselves with the political history of some of the "players" involved.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/Kamnan-Poh-The-long-living-godfather-66927.html

http://asiafoundation.org/in-asia/2011/07/13/dark-reality-to-vote-buying-in-thailand/

[Lenthai]

I really belive this situation will never change. The same as the chaotic traffic, not enough water, not stopping for traffic lights, the hugh amount of these motorbike "shops and restaurants", the unique slow driving and stopping traffic of these "advertisement" cars, the double parking, the parking on red/white zones, the confiscating of the whole road for private parking, drying laundry etc. in front of shops, the cheating Ladyboys etc. etc. Because this is Thailand.

[Jingthing]

All this is probably wishful thinking as it depends 100% on City Hall doing their job.

Some people should acquaint themselves with the political history of some of the "players" involved.

http://www.nationmul...ther-66927.html

http://asiafoundatio...ng-in-thailand/

Another reason I put the "Cooperative" in Baht Bus "Cooperative" in quotes.

[Jingthing]

I was curious about the idea that if you need to get a bus from Jomtien to Pattaya during peak hours that a strategy would be to take a bus in the OPPOSITE direction to catch a bus GOING BACK before they were all full.

Not a bad idea, doubles the fare, and adds time, but a seat is a seat.

So I happened to be out around Soi Chayuphruek at 7:30 PM tonight, peak dinner hours, and attempted to get a bus back towards Pattaya.

Actually I walked in a little further to Hotel Furama.

OK, between 7:30 and 8:00 PM I counted approximately:

50 empty buses, would not be flagged down for a bus as they were intent on a FAT charter fare

Half of those I was standing near another bus seeker so they would have at least picked up an instant two

5 buses fully packed, no room for even one stander

10 buses engaged as taxis

I gave up and walked towards Soi Welcome.

There I got a bus.

FOURTY-FIVE MINUTES LATER.

Do the math.

This is dreadful.

Edited January 25, 2013 by Jingthing

[DiNiro]

I was curious about the idea that if you need to get a bus from Jomtien to Pattaya during peak hours that a strategy would be to take a bus in the OPPOSITE direction to catch a bus GOING BACK before they were all full.

Not a bad idea, doubles the fare, and adds time, but a seat is a seat.

So I happened to be out around Soi Chayuphruek at 7:30 PM tonight, peak dinner hours, and attempted to get a bus back towards Pattaya.

Actually I walked in a little further to Hotel Furama.

OK, between 7:30 and 8:00 PM I counted approximately:

50 empty buses, would not be flagged down for a bus as they were intent on a FAT charter fare

Half of those I was standing near another bus seeker so they would have at least picked up an instant two

5 buses fully packed, no room for even one stander

10 buses engaged as taxis

I gave up and walked towards Soi Welcome.

There I got a bus.

FOURTY-FIVE MINUTES LATER.

Do the math.

This is dreadful.

Well, one phone call to the Mayors office should clear up this simple problem.

Certainly he would put a stop to this in an instant if he knew about it.

He would never tolerate tourists being abused like this I'm sure.

[Jingthing]

Well, one phone call to the Mayors office should clear up this simple problem.

Certainly he would put a stop to this in an instant if he knew about it.

He would never tolerate tourists being abused like this I'm sure.

Sarcasm Font Alert!

[BlackPuddingBertha]

OK, between 7:30 and 8:00 PM I counted approximately:

50 empty buses, would not be flagged down for a bus as they were intent on a FAT charter fare

Half of those I was standing near another bus seeker so they would have at least picked up an instant two

Can you be absolutely certain that those buses weren't actually heading for the queue by the police box where they are certain to get a full trip to Pattaya? As far as I know they are not allowed to be on that queue with passengers in the back.

At more or less the same time last night I caught a bus to Pattaya from near the Hanuman statue without the slightest trouble. I waited only about 2 minutes for a half-full bus to arrive, and this was preceded by a couple of completely full ones, one that stopped but was fuller than I fancied, and a couple that were empty but didn't appear to be interested in taking any sort of fare, charter or otherwise (presumably shift-change or meal break or something). So clearly there is something that doesn't add up here.

[stailmanki]

I was curious about the idea that if you need to get a bus from Jomtien to Pattaya during peak hours that a strategy would be to take a bus in the OPPOSITE direction to catch a bus GOING BACK before they were all full.

Not a bad idea, doubles the fare, and adds time, but a seat is a seat.

So I happened to be out around Soi Chayuphruek at 7:30 PM tonight, peak dinner hours, and attempted to get a bus back towards Pattaya.

Actually I walked in a little further to Hotel Furama.

OK, between 7:30 and 8:00 PM I counted approximately:

50 empty buses, would not be flagged down for a bus as they were intent on a FAT charter fare

Half of those I was standing near another bus seeker so they would have at least picked up an instant two

5 buses fully packed, no room for even one stander

10 buses engaged as taxis

I gave up and walked towards Soi Welcome.

There I got a bus.

FOURTY-FIVE MINUTES LATER.

Do the math.

This is dreadful.

\

Sure it's not guaranteed that you will find a seat on the "bus" going back to Pattaya but it worked for me twice , the best was when I just stayed on the same bus , handed the driver another fare , U turn at Chayapruk & away we went ( sitting in the front)

Who knows where all the other people come from down there ,it's a scramble for sure, easier when travelling alone but I refuse to stand on the back , it's more dangerous than riding a motorbike.

I'm going to try Thepprasitt/Sukumvitt/ Tai next time & see if it's any quicker or easier.

[Jingthing]

OK, between 7:30 and 8:00 PM I counted approximately:

50 empty buses, would not be flagged down for a bus as they were intent on a FAT charter fare

Half of those I was standing near another bus seeker so they would have at least picked up an instant two

Can you be absolutely certain that those buses weren't actually heading for the queue by the police box where they are certain to get a full trip to Pattaya? As far as I know they are not allowed to be on that queue with passengers in the back.

At more or less the same time last night I caught a bus to Pattaya from near the Hanuman statue without the slightest trouble. I waited only about 2 minutes for a half-full bus to arrive, and this was preceded by a couple of completely full ones, one that stopped but was fuller than I fancied, and a couple that were empty but didn't appear to be interested in taking any sort of fare, charter or otherwise (presumably shift-change or meal break or something). So clearly there is something that doesn't add up here.

I am absolutely certain there weren't 50 empty buses headed to the queue area and also this was well AFTER beach hours. I don't stand at the queue but I have noticed it being used a TAXI CHARTER waiting area anyway and who enforces these rules you speak of, I haven't noticed any enforcers there. Dude, I am not God. I can't explain why you got lucky with a bus at that time. Out of 50 surely a few who didn't get a charter decided to do the bus thing later on the route. I am not saying it would ALWAYS take 45 minutes. I am saying it is ridiculous the ratio of empty buses to people waiting for buses obviously caused by the greed motivation to make more money quicker with a fat charter. This isn't rocket science and they are acting in the their own self interest. You can't really blame them as INDIVIDUALS trying to rake in the baht, but you CAN blame the collective which seems to care nothing about the SYSTEM they are providing. As they are the only PUBLIC TRANSPORT service in these parts, this is not working at a reasonably acceptable level AS a public transport service. Most likely, after high season and especially during non peak hours, it will become OK again, and then NEXT YEAR if nothing is done which it won't be, it will be even WORSE. Edited January 26, 2013 by Jingthing

[Beardog]

I used to use the worthless baht buses In 2004 when I moved to Pattaya. After 3 months I got tired of the joke of waiting & the charter scams. That was in 04. The problem is much worse now, Especially with Bangkok traffic here since the floos permanently. I can walk faster than the baht buses on central. The best move I ever did was buying a scooter to avoid the baht buses! 2006 I moved to Bang Saray & have to use the baht bus maybe 2 days a year & it is spiteful. over an hour to get to Bang Saray & only 22 minutes on my nuovo 17 minutes on my Ninja 650. I can't wait to get out of the Pattaya BKK traffic nightmare. Just like Los Angelos freeways in rush hour.

The drivers could be a little more courtious thats for sure!Looks like with the trend it will be just getting worse.

I decided my next bike will look like this one to insure being able to move maximum speeds LOL

[wpcoe]

For those people suggesting that JT get a bike (or car), I'm aware that you may be intending just to target (harrass?) JT, but in effect you are telling EVERYBODY who is having the baht bus availability problem to do so.

Do you REALLY want an extra mass of inexperienced riders, often elderly with slow responses, on the streets? Or, even more boozed up drivers who would otherwise avail themselves of readily available, cheap transit? Urban mass transit serves a purpose when it's implemented properly: reduces traffic and keeps certain people who should not be on the road off the road.

[Beardog]

For those people suggesting that JT get a bike (or car), I'm aware that you may be intending just to target (harrass?) JT, but in effect you are telling EVERYBODY who is having the baht bus availability problem to do so.

Do you REALLY want an extra mass of inexperienced riders, often elderly with slow responses, on the streets? Or, even more boozed up drivers who would otherwise avail themselves of readily available, cheap transit? Urban mass transit serves a purpose when it's implemented properly: reduces traffic and keeps certain people who should not be on the road off the road.

Not to harrass anyone - but the cold hard facts are Pattaya has been backsliding on the baht bus scene & it is continuing to get worse.

Short of an ultralight (not feasable to land in Pattaya traffic) a bike is the only way around the inevitable poor service. I doubt the mayor could care less . & 1 more inexperienced rider not a big deal in time you learn how to mitigate the traffic & stay alive ----or not pending on your inept abilility in survival tactics. I have been struck once by a baht bus in 03 as a tourist(not life threatening at all & once down on a Kawasaki Boss not life threatening again) They are both just as dangerous. So it is up to the person to live with the problem till they move back to thier home country or die at this point. Some things never change & Pattaya is one of those things.........unfortunately!

Edited January 28, 2013 by Rimmer
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