Another factor which we often forget is that, besides martyrdom, there is something else these people want.... publicity. There the media play right into their hands (though how you could keep the Woolwich and Boston incidents quiet, I don't know).

We could treat it with the same gravity and concern that we treat all knife crime. Unless we think this is just the tip of the iceberg, and that at any minute, young Muslim radicals are going to start attacking figures of authority. However, the indications are that this is not the case.

So the motives behind one murder in London are no more important than the motives for any other, whether that murder be provoked by jealousy in an emotional entanglement, or feelings of persecution, or robbery, or a desire for publicity and empathy with the perceived problems of a foreign country.

No-one is suggesting that we rise up and throw the heterosexuals out of Britian, yet crimes of passion claim many more lives than events such as this.

SC

Another factor which we often forget is that, besides martyrdom, there is something else these people want.... publicity. There the media play right into their hands (though how you could keep the Woolwich and Boston incidents quiet, I don't know).

It is obvious that the media were going to report this appalling crime; had to even.

But to broadcast the hate speech made by the perpetrators afterwards; that was wrong.

Another factor which we often forget is that, besides martyrdom, there is something else these people want.... publicity. There the media play right into their hands (though how you could keep the Woolwich and Boston incidents quiet, I don't know).

It is obvious that the media were going to report this appalling crime; had to even.

But to broadcast the hate speech made by the perpetrators afterwards; that was wrong.

Wrong indeed, but if it attracts viewers, readers, listeners, the media will do it.

Another factor which we often forget is that, besides martyrdom, there is something else these people want.... publicity. There the media play right into their hands (though how you could keep the Woolwich and Boston incidents quiet, I don't know).

It is obvious that the media were going to report this appalling crime; had to even.

But to broadcast the hate speech made by the perpetrators afterwards; that was wrong.

Wrong indeed, but if it attracts viewers, readers, listeners, the media will do it.

Were their words spoken by an actor? I felt that really gave Gerry Adams an undeserved credibility.

SC

Another factor which we often forget is that, besides martyrdom, there is something else these people want.... publicity. There the media play right into their hands (though how you could keep the Woolwich and Boston incidents quiet, I don't know).

It is obvious that the media were going to report this appalling crime; had to even.

But to broadcast the hate speech made by the perpetrators afterwards; that was wrong.

Wrong indeed, but if it attracts viewers, readers, listeners, the media will do it.

Indeed the media are partly to blame in stiring up the pot.

Especially when it comes to WMD/ Iraq.

Also the media seem to have Iran in their sights now!

The media at times is more powerful than goverments.

Back on topic-It's nice to see the family of the killers say sorry although they did take their time.

CCC

If the government is serious about clamping down on those preaching hatred, otherwise known as radical Islam then it had better get to grips with the problem on university campuses, which are infested with radicals. I have my doubts though as tuition fees are a lucrative revenue source.

• Video posted on YouTube by London Metropolitan University group
• Film claims that Lee Rigby's death was a conspiracy and used 'fake blood'
• Six-minute video named 'Woolwich false flag b*******' seen by 300,000 people
• LMU considered banning alcohol on campus as it might offend Muslims
• 
  
• Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2335224/Street-killing-soldier-Lee-Rigby-faked-claim-members-controversial-London-universitys-Islamic-society.html#ixzz2VKGookBE
  Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

If the government is serious about clamping down on those preaching hatred, otherwise known as radical Islam then it had better get to grips with the problem on university campuses, which are infested with radicals. I have my doubts though as tuition fees are a lucrative revenue source.

• Video posted on YouTube by London Metropolitan University group
• Film claims that Lee Rigby's death was a conspiracy and used 'fake blood'
• Six-minute video named 'Woolwich false flag b*******' seen by 300,000 people
• LMU considered banning alcohol on campus as it might offend Muslims
• Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2335224/Street-killing-soldier-Lee-Rigby-faked-claim-members-controversial-London-universitys-Islamic-society.html#ixzz2VKGookBE

  Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

The university's are also infested with far left commie/socialists corrupting innocent and impressionable minds.

Freedom of thought, guys; that's what universities are about. Unless a specific law is broken, it is difficult to see how this can, or indeed should, be controlled.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/may/30/far-right-day-demonstrations-england

The EDL and the BNP plan demonstrations across England to exploit the Woolwich murder. So far the police have taken a fairly tough line with them; I hope this continues.

And the follow-up:-

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/jun/05/police-edl-link-blaze-islamic-centre

The mosque attacks are among 222 anti-Muslim incidents reported to Faith Matters' Tell Mama project in the past fortnight, well above the normal average of four to eight a day.

London Metropolitan University was formed by the amalgamation of what were two reasonable polytechnics in their day.

Both turned themselves into 'universities' a few years ago, as polytechnics were phased out. Thus they were able to teach subjects such as social studies and art history instead of mechanical engineering and electronics. And when they merged they made a fortune out of the issuance of student visas to non-EU/EEA people who wanted a way to enter the UK from South Asia and other places. The UK government withdrew this privilege when it was discovered that the majority of holders of these visas did not attend the 'university', but rather went to work in take-aways and similar. The privilege has now been restored, however.

LMU should be closed down. As separate polytechnics these institutions did good work for their local catchment areas, in bringing the brighter youth of North and East London into skilled trades, but now it is the festering centre of extremism in both politics and religion.

Easy to agree with you, HB! If the university is not functioning as a university, and the students are working rather than studying, of course this should be clamped down on.

But if it is a real university, functioning as such, it is difficult to know how and where curbs should be imposed.... always provided, of course, that the extremists do not break the law of the land.

Calling for the death penalty for these people is just playing into their hands. Don't you realise that they want to die? Execution is a quick route to heaven.

BTW, I saw somewhere that they were not Somalis, but British-born Christian Nigerians who had converted to Islam. Sorry I can't find the reference.

" BTW, I saw somewhere that they were not Somalis, but British-born Christian Nigerians who had converted to Islam. Sorry I

can't find the reference"

That is what was reported on Sky TV News, just after the sad incident happened...

This may have been the comment of a silly girl, but it is still sympomatic of the thinking of African immigrants to the UK.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2337635/Lee-Rigby-murder-Student-tweeted-people-wearing-Help-Heroes-shirt-deserve-beheaded-sentenced-community-service.html

• Deyka Ayan Hassan, 21, meant the comment to be a jokey criticism of the design of the t-shirt worn by supporters of the forces charity
• 
  
• She was arrested at home after admitting to police she had tweeted 'to be honest, if you wear a Help for Heroes t-shirt you deserve to be beheaded'
• 
  
• Ordered to do 250 hours of unpaid work by magistrates today, having admitted a charge of sending a malicious electronic message

This may have been the comment of a silly girl, but it is still sympomatic of the thinking of African immigrants to the UK.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2337635/Lee-Rigby-murder-Student-tweeted-people-wearing-Help-Heroes-shirt-deserve-beheaded-sentenced-community-service.html

• Deyka Ayan Hassan, 21, meant the comment to be a jokey criticism of the design of the t-shirt worn by supporters of the forces charity
• She was arrested at home after admitting to police she had tweeted 'to be honest, if you wear a Help for Heroes t-shirt you deserve to be beheaded'
• Ordered to do 250 hours of unpaid work by magistrates today, having admitted a charge of sending a malicious electronic message

Well, to be honest, that seems like a stiff call on the borderline between free speech and incitement to violence. Are we now agreed that freedom of speech only applies to sensible people? That stupid people and bigots are not allowed to express their views? If they cannot express their views, how can we know how stupid they are? Thank goodness for parliamentary immunity!

SC

This may have been the comment of a silly girl, but it is still sympomatic of the thinking of African immigrants to the UK.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2337635/Lee-Rigby-murder-Student-tweeted-people-wearing-Help-Heroes-shirt-deserve-beheaded-sentenced-community-service.html

• Deyka Ayan Hassan, 21, meant the comment to be a jokey criticism of the design of the t-shirt worn by supporters of the forces charity
• She was arrested at home after admitting to police she had tweeted 'to be honest, if you wear a Help for Heroes t-shirt you deserve to be beheaded'
• Ordered to do 250 hours of unpaid work by magistrates today, having admitted a charge of sending a malicious electronic message

Well, to be honest, that seems like a stiff call on the borderline between free speech and incitement to violence. Are we now agreed that freedom of speech only applies to sensible people? That stupid people and bigots are not allowed to express their views? If they cannot express their views, how can we know how stupid they are? Thank goodness for parliamentary immunity!

SC

I agree, but would draw the line at letting stupid people decide where the boundary between free speech and hate speech is.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/seanthomas/100220436/the-muslim-hate-preacher-and-the-t-shirt-salesman-a-bizarre-study-in-double-standards/

Well, to be honest, that seems like a stiff call on the borderline between free speech and incitement to violence. Are we now agreed that freedom of speech only applies to sensible people? That stupid people and bigots are not allowed to express their views? If they cannot express their views, how can we know how stupid they are? Thank goodness for parliamentary immunity!

SC

Parliamentary immunity is fine, but each MP has to jump a number of hurdles before getting elected, not least convincing people to vote for him.

Libel and slander laws are useful when the hate is personalised, but not otherwise.

Yes, freedom of speech only applies to sensible people, that means me and you (and I'm not so sure about you). There's the problem; where do you draw lines between free speech and hate speech, between harmless bigotry and inflammatory bigotry? You can say what you like about the Catholic Church or the Bible Belters because they won't retaliate with force, but you can't say what you like about Muslims, because they may.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/08/uk-mosques-panic-alarms-safe-rooms

Mosques need more security since the murder of Drummer Rigby; and whose fault is that but Muslim hate preachers?

It is the fault of the morons who blame all Muslims for the actions of a very small minority.

This may have been the comment of a silly girl, but it is still sympomatic of the thinking of African immigrants to the UK.

So how do you work that one out?

How many African immigrants have you canvassed for their opinion?

Most African immigrants to the UK are Christian!

It is the fault of the morons who blame all Muslims for the actions of a very small minority.

Quite true, but why do those morons (of whom there seem to be a very large number) blame all Muslims? Because of those very hate preachers. It only needs one deranged fanatic to queer the pitch for millions of decent people.

As I said much earlier, either in this thread or the now closed one in News, the hate preachers on both sides are as much to blame as each other.

Whether they are religious fanatics, the EDL, the BNP, the SWP, the UAF or anyone else who preaches hatred of and violence toward all those who are different to them or don't agree with their view of the world..

They all feed off and need each other and the more attention they get the better they like it.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/08/uk-mosques-panic-alarms-safe-rooms

Mosques need more security since the murder of Drummer Rigby; and whose fault is that but Muslim hate preachers?

I can never recall any time in my life when synagogues throughout the UK could get by without round the clock monitoring. Though I don't condone any form of vigilantism I believe there is a degree of exaggeration regarding any so called backlash, which amounts to a diversionary tactic.The government likely agrees as it has now canned funding for the so called tell Mama group.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/journalists/andrew-gilligan/10108098/Muslim-hate-monitor-to-lose-backing.html

This may have been the comment of a silly girl, but it is still sympomatic of the thinking of African immigrants to the UK.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2337635/Lee-Rigby-murder-Student-tweeted-people-wearing-Help-Heroes-shirt-deserve-beheaded-sentenced-community-service.html

• Deyka Ayan Hassan, 21, meant the comment to be a jokey criticism of the design of the t-shirt worn by supporters of the forces charity
• She was arrested at home after admitting to police she had tweeted 'to be honest, if you wear a Help for Heroes t-shirt you deserve to be beheaded'
• Ordered to do 250 hours of unpaid work by magistrates today, having admitted a charge of sending a malicious electronic message

That's about as realistic as saying that all western immigrants to Thailand are drunken paedophiles, mafiosi or petty criminals....though that might actually be nearer the truth!

As I said much earlier, either in this thread or the now closed one in News, the hate preachers on both sides are as much to blame as each other.

Whether they are religious fanatics, the EDL, the BNP, the SWP, the UAF or anyone else who preaches hatred of and violence toward all those who are different to them or don't agree with their view of the world..

They all feed off and need each other and the more attention they get the better they like it.

Here's one side of the story:-

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/jun/05/islamophobic-hate-crime-getting-worse

Of course, if one side gets worse, the other side will get worse too. It's like a couple of boxers; if one lands a punch, the other feels he has to hit back.

Breaking news: (from the Guardian)

• Six Islamic extremists who plotted attack on English Defence League rally jailed for terms ranging from 18 years and 9 months to 19 and a half years.

Indeed;

Al-Rahma Islamic Centre destroyed in 'hate crime' fire

Four arson arrests over Islamic Darul Uloom School fire

^^ +5 years each on licence.For all 6

the real news story back in the U.K. today that some wish to ignore or maybe they'd rather you not see !

the real news story back in the U.K. today that some wish to ignore or maybe they'd rather you not see !

I'm just shocked they needed to import these types from Birmingham. Or is it a case of don't shit on your door step?

the real news story back in the U.K. today that some wish to ignore or maybe they'd rather you not see !

I'm just shocked they needed to import these types from Birmingham. Or is it a case of don't shit on your door step?

It's not a case of "if" but "when" these extremists have a major battle .... then shit will really hit the fan.

the real news story back in the U.K. today that some wish to ignore or maybe they'd rather you not see !

I'm just shocked they needed to import these types from Birmingham. Or is it a case of don't shit on your door step?

It's not a case of "if" but "when" these extremists have a major battle .... then shit will really hit the fan.

At least 2 of the London bombers went to an extremist mosque. Just 30 minutes by shanks's pony from the town centre. Non muslims are discouraged from taking photos of the outside. Although apparently Google Street have a camera nearby.