Phuket Immigration cracks down on yachting, marine industry

[Phuket electrician]

According to you lot  Thais' don't know anything yet one word from an official and you're all clucking like mother hens, grow a pair. If you are legit there is no problem.

 

How hard can it be?

 

[grimblegrumble]

Crazy. I wash, clean, repair a car, I'd be considered working. Install your own water pump, do the garden and so many other things and they could claim you are working illegally. It is about time the Thai authorities realised many of us are handymen and understand DIY and we are not doing this for profit. A sad state of affairs indeed.

[lensta]

 

You can improve your house/property and sell for a profit or pimp a car and sell for a profit. A lot of hobby related stuff could potentially make money.

Your not allowed to own a house as a falang

 

 

A foreigner can own a house, they can't own the land it is built on

[pagallim]

 Pull your necks in, idiots. 

 

Don't know or like the laws here? GO HOME. Simple.

 

We all love to criticise but seriously, if you want to live somewhere, know the laws. Stop blaming people for finally upholding their own laws - even if to foreigners the laws seem bonkers.

 

Haven't been through all of the posts on this thread yet, though this particular one stood out for a response.

 

I live in this area (Chalong, Phuket).   I also own a boat.   Many others in this part of Phuket are similar, with boats of various types and in various storage situations (moorings, marina berths, trailers etc).   Any boat owner spends a lot of time in maintenance, far more than the actual time 'enjoying' the boating experience.   The marine industry is recognised as being important to Thailand, and hence there is no import duty for boats (unlike cars and motorbikes for example).

 

Over the last year or so, I've occasionally driven past this house with the catamaran being built  and this is not a commercial boat building enterprise.    Ultimately I think it's about the definition of 'work' and 'employment'.   For me, it is an activity for which there is a form of payment for work or activities undertaken.   Building something for your own use, for which you have paid for the materials and will not be sold afterwards does not constitute work.

 

For 'Johnnie99', I doubt that you even live here in Thailand, let alone a boating area, and are poorly qualified to dispense the utter BS in your post. 

[up2you2]

For those that want to know just how restrictive it is to work legally in Thailand, read this post;

 

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/643735-just-how-restrictive-is-it-to-work-in-thailand/

[puukao]

IF I see someone running, I assume they are training for the Olympics and consider it work.  reported, arrested.

IF I see someone eating, I assume they are a food critic and report them immediately.  they are working!!!  fined, arrested.  

IF I hear a foreigner discuss anything, I assume they are doing a research paper and currently working!!!!  reported, arrested.

 

  

[IrishIvan]

I have had some time to think about this and now I think the Thais are right. There has to be a line in the sand. If I bought a yacht in Phuket. Fixed it and sold it as a profit then technically its not a hobby and I have made money. What if I do it 2 or even 3 times a year? Then I am profiting from this. I am certain this is illegal in any western country

[Tchooptip]

I made myself beans on toast this morning, should I turn myself in?

No no no, certainly not turning your self in!  Stay underground 

[pagallim]

As usual you're all incorrect. these two clowns were arrested for overstays, one from 2011. Bunch of spanners.

Think that you're wrong.   Or maybe (and not unusually) the local press has got the stories mixed up.   

[IrishIvan]

 Pull your necks in, idiots. 
 
Don't know or like the laws here? GO HOME. Simple.
 
We all love to criticise but seriously, if you want to live somewhere, know the laws. Stop blaming people for finally upholding their own laws - even if to foreigners the laws seem bonkers.

 
Haven't been through all of the posts on this thread yet, though this particular one stood out for a response.
 
I live in this area (Chalong, Phuket).   I also own a boat.   Many others in this part of Phuket are similar, with boats of various types and in various storage situations (moorings, marina berths, trailers etc).   Any boat owner spends a lot of time in maintenance, far more than the actual time 'enjoying' the boating experience.   The marine industry is recognised as being important to Thailand, and hence there is no import duty for boats (unlike cars and motorbikes for example).
 
Over the last year or so, I've occasionally driven past this house with the catamaran being built  and this is not a commercial boat building enterprise.    Ultimately I think it's about the definition of 'work' and 'employment'.   For me, it is an activity for which there is a form of payment for work or activities undertaken.   Building something for your own use, for which you have paid for the materials and will not be sold afterwards does not constitute work.
 
For 'Johnnie99', I doubt that you even live here in Thailand, let alone a boating area, and are poorly qualified to dispense the utter BS in your post. 

No import duty for boats? Are you completely off your head? Why do you think a big slice of private boat owners register their boats outsude of Thailand?? So they can avoid paying Thai taxes and employing Thai crews

[Phuket electrician]

Neither were caught working. Just checked by Immigration officers. As is happening in Phuket at the moment. 1 individual had overstayed from Jan 2013, the other from Feb 2011. 

 

 

[Phuket electrician]

If you know anything about Thai culture being humble and subservient can get you out of trouble. The opposite has the potential to make life difficult. This is not the west where you can tell an officer of the law to do 1. 

[zappalot]

If I bought a yacht in Phuket. Fixed it and sold it 

 

there is no report that in this case yachts were bought, fixed and sold... so what are you talking about. 

 

few saying now this case does not even has anything to do with these yachts but with overstay...

 

who knows? as TiT you can not even trust the local news to be correct...

[pagallim]

 

 

 Pull your necks in, idiots. 
 
Don't know or like the laws here? GO HOME. Simple.
 
We all love to criticise but seriously, if you want to live somewhere, know the laws. Stop blaming people for finally upholding their own laws - even if to foreigners the laws seem bonkers.

 
Haven't been through all of the posts on this thread yet, though this particular one stood out for a response.
 
I live in this area (Chalong, Phuket).   I also own a boat.   Many others in this part of Phuket are similar, with boats of various types and in various storage situations (moorings, marina berths, trailers etc).   Any boat owner spends a lot of time in maintenance, far more than the actual time 'enjoying' the boating experience.   The marine industry is recognised as being important to Thailand, and hence there is no import duty for boats (unlike cars and motorbikes for example).
 
Over the last year or so, I've occasionally driven past this house with the catamaran being built  and this is not a commercial boat building enterprise.    Ultimately I think it's about the definition of 'work' and 'employment'.   For me, it is an activity for which there is a form of payment for work or activities undertaken.   Building something for your own use, for which you have paid for the materials and will not be sold afterwards does not constitute work.
 
For 'Johnnie99', I doubt that you even live here in Thailand, let alone a boating area, and are poorly qualified to dispense the utter BS in your post. 

 

No import duty for boats? Are you completely off your head? Why do you think a big slice of private boat owners register their boats outsude of Thailand?? So they can avoid paying Thai taxes and employing Thai crews

 

 

I own a Thai registered boat, imported new with only 7% tax applied.  Do you?  

 

Some places have minimal tax applied (hence the popularity of Langkawi, Malaysia), but the downside is that a foreign registered boat has to leave Thai waters every 6 months.   Seamans immigration requirements are pretty much standard throughout the world.   If you're wealthy enough to employ a full time crew, you'd probably opt for Filipino or Malaysian rather than Thai, so there would be immigration issues to deal with, but again a Seamans visa takes care of that.

[jbrain]

I can clearly see from the OP that Thailand is ready for Asean . NOT?

[Businessman]

" definition of the term “work” under Thai work permit law. The term work is defined as “engaging in work [seems rather circular at this point, but it goes on to provide the definition as] exerting energy or using knowledge whether or not in consideration of wages or any other benefits.”"

The above is the definition of work under thai labour law. It matters not if you are paid or not. If you exert energy or use knowledge, then technically you are working. So the safest thing to do is lie completely still and babble nonsense. Do not walk, do not lift, don't feed yourself, don't chew, avoid constipation as all these require that you exert energy and hence break the law.

OMG... oops now I've gone and done it. I used knowledge of the labour laws above and I expended energy typing. Pleeeeeese take me away and lock me up. I cannot stand the guilt.

Oh hang on a sec,... never mind, it wasn't me... it was spirits and a mysterious "third hand".


sent from my mobile

[12DrinkMore]

What you can do for sure: drink like hell in the bars and feed the girls with cash money

But no shagging them.

 

That would be considered work.

 

And only for Thais....

[bkk_mike]

surely building a boat for yourself on your own property is a hobby not work......if i do my own gardening am i working?

 

I don't know for sure.

It might actually be classed as farming, which would mean it's a reserved occupation and foreigners aren't allowed to do it.

 

Even if it's not illegal, I'm definitely going to try out that excuse with the wife.

[Saradoc1972]

I have had some time to think about this and now I think the Thais are right. There has to be a line in the sand. If I bought a yacht in Phuket. Fixed it and sold it as a profit then technically its not a hobby and I have made money. What if I do it 2 or even 3 times a year? Then I am profiting from this. I am certain this is illegal in any western country

 

Quite astute. In most countries this will be in the relevant law as what we call an "undistinct term" such as  "businesslike". So doing it once may be a windfall, following a one-time opportunity, the second time may be too much without the appropriate permit.

 

Boils down to the usual lawyer's work in determining "how long is a piece of string ?".

 

With your well-educated and adequately paid Thai official it may be more like "if you only got a hammer, everything starts looking like a nail." They don't know for themselves, have no legal background to establish binding guidelines over time, so you can run unlucky. And once in the mill, I doubt you can work things out short paying a fine and having to leave the country.

 

I've just researched an article on chiangmainews.com about those musicians napped for jamming in Blues bars.

 

So when is 'work' officially considered as employment? Ruchuchai [the local chief of police leading the raids] answered, "If you work at home it's none of my business, gardening, sweeping, painting, it's all fine. It's when you perform activities which help someone (or yourself) earn an income, that is not OK." If you were to make furniture at home and gave a set to a restaurant owner friend, that wouldn't be a problem," when asked if one were to make 10 sets for a restaurant, Ruchuchai responded with an ambivalent, "ah..." which I can only assume that means 'not OK'

 

Lovely. Professional.

 

I am after putting myself to reading the relevant Alien Working Act, B.E.2551 (2008). Here, it clearly states:

"Working" means a working by physical strength or kowledge whether or not intended for wages or any other benefits.

 

Hmmm... so working is ... working, yes?

 

May be just the translation on thailaw.com, but that seems circular and a bit unhelpful.

[Pomthai]

Neither were caught working. Just checked by Immigration officers. As is happening in Phuket at the moment. 1 individual had overstayed from Jan 2013, the other from Feb 2011. 
 
 

You've got two separate articles mixed up. The two that were caught on overstay were not working and both british and both in the news yesterday (Thursday 19th).

This thread is about two foreigners caught building boats a Swiss man and a German and the article hit the news this evening (Friday 20th).

 

Edited September 20, 2013 by LivinginKata
rude comment removed

[IrishIvan]

 

 

 Pull your necks in, idiots. 
 
Don't know or like the laws here? GO HOME. Simple.
 
We all love to criticise but seriously, if you want to live somewhere, know the laws. Stop blaming people for finally upholding their own laws - even if to foreigners the laws seem bonkers.

 
Haven't been through all of the posts on this thread yet, though this particular one stood out for a response.
 
I live in this area (Chalong, Phuket).   I also own a boat.   Many others in this part of Phuket are similar, with boats of various types and in various storage situations (moorings, marina berths, trailers etc).   Any boat owner spends a lot of time in maintenance, far more than the actual time 'enjoying' the boating experience.   The marine industry is recognised as being important to Thailand, and hence there is no import duty for boats (unlike cars and motorbikes for example).
 
Over the last year or so, I've occasionally driven past this house with the catamaran being built  and this is not a commercial boat building enterprise.    Ultimately I think it's about the definition of 'work' and 'employment'.   For me, it is an activity for which there is a form of payment for work or activities undertaken.   Building something for your own use, for which you have paid for the materials and will not be sold afterwards does not constitute work.
 
For 'Johnnie99', I doubt that you even live here in Thailand, let alone a boating area, and are poorly qualified to dispense the utter BS in your post. 
 

No import duty for boats? Are you completely off your head? Why do you think a big slice of private boat owners register their boats outsude of Thailand?? So they can avoid paying Thai taxes and employing Thai crews
 

 
I own a Thai registered boat, imported new with only 7% tax applied.  Do you?  
 
Some places have minimal tax applied (hence the popularity of Langkawi, Malaysia), but the downside is that a foreign registered boat has to leave Thai waters every 6 months.   Seamans immigration requirements are pretty much standard throughout the world.   If you're wealthy enough to employ a full time crew, you'd probably opt for Filipino or Malaysian rather than Thai, so there would be immigration issues to deal with, but again a Seamans visa takes care of that.

In one post you say that there is no duty on boats. Then the next you say you paid 7%. Lets establish 1 thing. Duty=tax $$$.

I thought you had the rules was that the foreign registered boat has to leave every 3 months. But your the expert right?

No I dont own a boat at the moment but I have owned 2. And I wont buy another as I dont like hemorrhaging money.

[IrishIvan]

Neither were caught working. Just checked by Immigration officers. As is happening in Phuket at the moment. 1 individual had overstayed from Jan 2013, the other from Feb 2011. 
 
 

You've got two separate articles mixed up. The two that were caught on overstay were not working and both british and both in the news yesterday (Thursday 19th).

This thread is about two foreigners caught building boats a Swiss man and a German and the article hit the news this evening (Friday 20th).

Now go back and read the varoius news sources properly this time instead of spouting off inaccurate assumptions.

2 Brits in Cherng Talay wernt building boats in Chalong

[Saradoc1972]

" definition of the term “work” under Thai work permit law. The term work is defined as “engaging in work [seems rather circular at this point, but it goes on to provide the definition as] exerting energy or using knowledge whether or not in consideration of wages or any other benefits.”"
 

You beat me to it. But the second half sentence is never a definition, as one can well be exerting energy walking to your hotel's restaurant or during that massage you brought a bar girl home for and so far that has not been criminalized.

 

But isn't it cute how they try emulating first world legalese putting "definitions" first in a law and then screw up?

[Phuket electrician]

if you think this story has any merit may I suggest you get back on the nest and keep your brood nice and warm  - jog on.

[Saradoc1972]

 

 

I own a Thai registered boat, imported new with only 7% tax applied.  Do you?  
 
Some places have minimal tax applied (hence the popularity of Langkawi, Malaysia), but the downside is that a foreign registered boat has to leave Thai waters every 6 months.   Seamans immigration requirements are pretty much standard throughout the world.   If you're wealthy enough to employ a full time crew, you'd probably opt for Filipino or Malaysian rather than Thai, so there would be immigration issues to deal with, but again a Seamans visa takes care of that.

 

In one post you say that there is no duty on boats. Then the next you say you paid 7%. Lets establish 1 thing. Duty=tax $$$.

I thought you had the rules was that the foreign registered boat has to leave every 3 months. But your the expert right?

No I dont own a boat at the moment but I have owned 2. And I wont buy another as I dont like hemorrhaging money.

 

 

I fail to see how this is relevant to the topic apart from involving a boat. But kindly distinguish between custom duty and import sales tax while I'm uncurling my toe-nails.

 

Apart, it's six months extendable to 2y, as with all custom caret regulations internationally, just alleviated a bit for boats.

 

[Shurup]

This has got to be the greatest display of childish madness I have seen ever since I arrived here years ago.....

 

About time our home countries started to apply these rules to Thais when they arrive there....Tit for Tat.

My god...don't they realize the potential, of utilizing the expertise and experience they have here, that FALANGS can provide....if treated equally.

 

This country will die a horrible death economically if they don't wake up soon, and stop this crap.....

 

Rant over...

Unfortunately this will not happen as long as then have nice beaches and hot girls and remain fairly cheap country.

[Beetlejuice]

The article says; building their own boats. But it doesn`t mention whether or not they had intentions of selling these boats as a business, for a profit?

 

 

[JetsetBkk]

Things I've done that I can be arrested for:

1. Cut some bananas off a tree.
2. Picked up some coconuts off the ground and put them in a basket.
3. Built my own computer.
4. Fed some cats that didn't belong to me.
5. Washed the pickup and pumped up the tyres.
6. Put up a shelf in the kitchen.
7. Oiled the front gate.

Immigration, just come and shoot me.

[jbrain]

The article says; building their own boats. But it doesn`t mention whether or not they had intentions of selling these boats as a business, for a profit?

 

 

 

And who gonna determine what someones intention in the future will be.

[IrishIvan]

Things I've done that I can be arrested for:

1. Cut some bananas off a tree.
2. Picked up some coconuts off the ground and put them in a basket.
3. Built my own computer.
4. Fed some cats that didn't belong to me.
5. Washed the pickup and pumped up the tyres.
6. Put up a shelf in the kitchen.
7. Oiled the front gate.

Immigration, just come and shoot me.

Is owning 2 taxis illegal? I dont drive them but my TGF pays the bills with the money we get from them