Pheu Thai 'will not' withdraw blanket amnesty bill

[webfact]

Pheu Thai 'Will Not' Withdraw Blanket Amnesty Bill
BY Khaosod Online


Protesters against the 'blanket amnesty' bill, which is also nicknamed as 'Mao Keng (all in the basket' amnesty, in front of the United Nations office in Bangkok, 24 October 2013.
Image source

BANGKOK: -- A top official of the ruling Pheu Thai Party has insisted the party will go ahead with its controversial amnesty bill, in spite of the growing dissents among the party cadets against the bill.

Nicknamed ′amnesty for all′, ′blanket amnesty′, ′Suud Soi (the end of the alley)′, and ′Mao Keng (all in the basket)′, the draft offers amnesty to all parties involved in the political conflict dated back to 2006, including former leaders Thaksin Shinawatra and Abhisit Vejjajiva, the military, and protesters of all sides and their leaders that are facing legal action.

The current version of the draft, after it had been revised by a House committee, significant departure from the original draft proposed to the Parliament by Pheu Thai MP Worachai Hema, who exempts Mr. Abhisit, Mr. Thaksin, and the protest leaders from his amnesty draft.

Many activists and political allies of Pheu Thai Party denounced the revised bill, arguing that it would upset the ongoing legal process against Mr. Abhisit who had authorised a military crackdown against the Redshirts protesters in 2010, which led to deaths of over 90 people, mostly civilians.

But Mr Phumtham Vejjayachai, Secretary-General of Pheu Thai Party, said there would be no going back.

"I can confirm that we will not withdraw the draft" in favour of Mr. Worachai′s proposal, Mr. Phumtham told Khaosod.

He denied "betraying the people", as many Redshirts activists has claimed, saying that Mr. Worachai′s bill might be subject to legal challenge if Pheu Thai Party were to adopt it.

The original draft of the bill, which promised amnesty only to ordinary protesters and those currently detained for protests-related charges, might violate the Constitutional body that insists on non-discrimination in all laws passed by the Parliament, Mr. Phumtham said.

"We don′t want the entire bill to be killed," said Mr. Phumtham, "The people won′t get anything out of it".

He added that the process of the bill is transparent and based on rightful principles.

Mr. Phumtham also dismissed the opposition to the draft, saying that they "belong to the same old groups" that have been campaigning against the government.

However, apart from anti-government critics who oppose the bill out of fear that Mr. Thaksin will return to power in Thailand, the dissenting voices also came from within Pheu Thai Party itself.

Pheu Thai MP Weng Tojirakarn said in a press conference today that he wants to ask his fellow Pheu Thai cadets whether they "truly love Mr. Thaksin".

"Do they want Mr. Thaksin to return to Thailand in an unblemished manner?" Mr. Weng asked, arguing that the revised amnesty bill would only turn the public opinion against the former Prime Minister.

He also warned that even if the bill is passed by the Parliament, it would still be subject to scrutiny by the Constitutional Court, its chance of survival uncertain. "The [revised] amnesty bill will never succeed in brining Mr. Thaksin home," Mr. Weng added.

His comments followed the insistence of other prominent Pheu Thai figures such as Mr. Nattawut Saikua who similarly argued against the ′amnesty for all′. Ms. Thida Tojirakarn, the chairwoman of the official Redshirts leadership, also rejected the bill, noting that those responsible for 2010 crackdown do not deserve amnesty.

In the letter submitted today to the House Committee on the amnesty bill, Ms. Payao Akhard, a representative of families of the victims who died in 2010 crackdown, stressed her position that she will not accept the amnesty for the authorities behind the lethal crackdown.

Ms. Payao, who lost her daughter in the last day of the military operation in May 2010, urged Pheu Thai Party to reconsider its stance on the ′blanket amnesty′, recalling that the party had previously called for legal prosecution against the security forces and Mr. Abhisit during the election season of 2011.

She also lashed out at former Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat who had urged "all sides to sacrifice" and adopt the ′amnesty for all′. "Mr. Somchai said we have to make sacrifices so that the country can move forward. But we have been making so much sacrifice already," Ms. Payao said.

She continued, "The Redshirts have lost their family members. Is their sacrifice not big enough? I would like to see Mr. Thaksin making his own sacrifice, too".

Source: http://www.khaosod.co.th/en/view_newsonline.php?newsid=TVRNNE1qWXdOemM1TVE9PQ==

-- KHAOSOD English 2013-10-24

related topic

Mother of slain paramedic calls for exemption of Abhisit, Suthep from amnesty

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/676862-mother-of-slain-paramedic-calls-for-exemption-of-abhisit-suthep-from-amnesty/

[tomross46]

"We don′t want the entire bill to be killed," said Mr. Phumtham, "The people won′t get anything out of it".

​Are we being told that the politicians will not get anything, if the bill is not approved? Is this another case of politicians caring more about their new Bentley, than the people of Thailand? Is this a Democracy or a Dictatorship?

We need a government of the people, by the people, for the people.

[gemini81]

Proof for all foreign nut job supporters of PTP: this is most clearly a dictatorship with no regard for law, and only their own total control agenda.

[Pib]

Let's just forget about all the corruption and deaths for the good of the country. Sounds like a good plan if you are one of the folks involved in/accursed of causing corruption or death. Another plan might be to truly and aggressively bring those involved in corruption/death to justice instead of just letting them leave the country or slow leak the legal system. TIT

[up-country_sinclair]

A top official of the ruling Pheu Thai Party has insisted the party will go ahead with its controversial amnesty bill, in spite of the growing dissents among the party cadets against the bill.

Of course they're going ahead with the amnesty bill. Why would anyone think otherwise? This has always been about getting one man back on Thai soil--the negative effects on the country be damned.

[LuckyLew]

and why would they .....

They answer to no one

They care about only themelves

The country as a whole is their least concern

Bring on the protest .. riots ... demonstrations and few grenades .. makes for great television

[bigbamboo]

A top official of the ruling Pheu Thai Party has insisted the party will go ahead with its controversial amnesty bill, in spite of the growing dissents among the party cadets against the bill.

Of course they're going ahead with the amnesty bill. Why would anyone think otherwise? This has always been about getting one man back on Thai soil--the negative effects on the country be damned.

That's pretty much the state of play in a nutshell.

And I'm sure KT himself agrees with me.

Edited October 24, 2013 by bigbamboo

[IMA_FARANG]

and why would they .....

They answer to no one

They care about only themelves

The country as a whole is their least concern

Bring on the protest .. riots ... demonstrations and few grenades .. makes for great television

----------------------------

And, most importantly, does wonders for the Dollar/Baht and the Pound/Baht exchange rates as the Baht drops in value.

[Soi Sauce]

and why would they .....

They answer to no one

They care about only themelves

The country as a whole is their least concern

Bring on the protest .. riots ... demonstrations and few grenades .. makes for great television

----------------------------

And, most importantly, does wonders for the Dollar/Baht and the Pound/Baht exchange rates as the Baht drops in value.

Which, as I've said many times before, was always part of the plan.

Kill the baht, can buy the country for nothing.

Job done.

[FangFerang]

I don't take sides in this 'Them versus Us' issue. Both sides think they are Us, and the other side is Them.

Yes, there are more shady characters in this play than a Batman movie...but where is the Good Guy in this? I can't see one. Not ONE. Worse, I do NOT have enough information to have an informed opinion. I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Especially outstanding questions for which I have never read any lucid answers---

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government?

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions?

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur?

Who shot se Dang?

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands?

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands?

Shooting Thais who took refuge in a Temple is beyond bad form.

This whole thing is more like team sport than a discussion about politics, even among the foriegners. I am a guest here, and am not getting involved in a family argument, but what am I supposed to think? Voices on this forum take sides really fast, but seem short on explanations for any ONE of the above issues. If anyone has information beyond speculation on any of the listed questions above, please write me or respond in forum. Information is thin, and opinion runs rampant. Again, I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Okay, resume rants.

[Neilly]

She continued, "The Redshirts have lost their family members. Is their sacrifice not big enough? I would like to see Mr. Thaksin making his own sacrifice, too".

I'd like to see him stop drawing breath for what he has done to this country

[Artisi]

I don't take sides in this 'Them versus Us' issue. Both sides think they are Us, and the other side is Them.

Yes, there are more shady characters in this play than a Batman movie...but where is the Good Guy in this? I can't see one. Not ONE. Worse, I do NOT have enough information to have an informed opinion. I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Especially outstanding questions for which I have never read any lucid answers---

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government?

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions?

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur?

Who shot se Dang?

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands?

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands?

Shooting Thais who took refuge in a Temple is beyond bad form.

This whole thing is more like team sport than a discussion about politics, even among the foriegners. I am a guest here, and am not getting involved in a family argument, but what am I supposed to think? Voices on this forum take sides really fast, but seem short on explanations for any ONE of the above issues. If anyone has information beyond speculation on any of the listed questions above, please write me or respond in forum. Information is thin, and opinion runs rampant. Again, I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Okay, resume rants.

First up, there wasn't any coup to overthrow an elected government, at the time there wasn't an elected government only an caretaker government.

The rest of your questions can be easily researched.

[billd766]

I don't take sides in this 'Them versus Us' issue. Both sides think they are Us, and the other side is Them.

Yes, there are more shady characters in this play than a Batman movie...but where is the Good Guy in this? I can't see one. Not ONE. Worse, I do NOT have enough information to have an informed opinion. I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Especially outstanding questions for which I have never read any lucid answers---

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government?

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions?

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur?

Who shot se Dang?

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands?

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands?

Shooting Thais who took refuge in a Temple is beyond bad form.

This whole thing is more like team sport than a discussion about politics, even among the foriegners. I am a guest here, and am not getting involved in a family argument, but what am I supposed to think? Voices on this forum take sides really fast, but seem short on explanations for any ONE of the above issues. If anyone has information beyond speculation on any of the listed questions above, please write me or respond in forum. Information is thin, and opinion runs rampant. Again, I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Okay, resume rants.

Taking your points one at a time.

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government? There was NO elected government at the time and Thaksin having quit Thai politics for ever (his words) went to the King and formally resigned. He then handed over to a caretaker PM who swore his oath to the King. 7 weeks later Thaksin took back control but never went formally to the King.

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions? They cahnged the constitution and gave themselves amnesty. The coup leader is now in a partnership with the PTP and is a Minister I believe.

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur? Thaksin changed the rules of ownership to allow foreigners to own 49% of a company in Thailand, up from a previous 25%. A week later he bought all the shares of AIS from Ample Rich, a company owned offshore by his son at $1 per share and sold them to a Singapore company, Temasek for approximately US$1.88 Bn and paid no capital gains tax or anyother tax on the sale.

Who shot se Dang? There are probably a few poeple inside and outside Thailand who know for sure and they aren't saying. The Reds are saying it was the army, the yellows are blaming the Reds but most people have no real idea.

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands? The Red Shirts and their supporters do.

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands? The Democrats and their supporters do.

I include the TVF posters as well on each side.

Each side is pointing fingers and talking a lot but nothing is really happening

[rubl]

"Pheu Thai MP Weng Tojirakarn said in a press conference today that he wants to ask his fellow Pheu Thai cadets whether they "truly love Mr. Thaksin"."

Will he ask his fellow 'cadets' to solemnly swear in it as well? Afterwards will he let us, the public now the results? Transparently and so?

[bigbamboo]

I don't take sides in this 'Them versus Us' issue. Both sides think they are Us, and the other side is Them.

Yes, there are more shady characters in this play than a Batman movie...but where is the Good Guy in this? I can't see one. Not ONE. Worse, I do NOT have enough information to have an informed opinion. I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Especially outstanding questions for which I have never read any lucid answers---

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government?

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions?

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur?

Who shot se Dang?

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands?

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands?

Shooting Thais who took refuge in a Temple is beyond bad form.

This whole thing is more like team sport than a discussion about politics, even among the foriegners. I am a guest here, and am not getting involved in a family argument, but what am I supposed to think? Voices on this forum take sides really fast, but seem short on explanations for any ONE of the above issues. If anyone has information beyond speculation on any of the listed questions above, please write me or respond in forum. Information is thin, and opinion runs rampant. Again, I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Okay, resume rants.

Taking your points one at a time.

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government? There was NO elected government at the time and Thaksin having quit Thai politics for ever (his words) went to the King and formally resigned. He then handed over to a caretaker PM who swore his oath to the King. 7 weeks later Thaksin took back control but never went formally to the King.

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions? They cahnged the constitution and gave themselves amnesty. The coup leader is now in a partnership with the PTP and is a Minister I believe.

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur? Thaksin changed the rules of ownership to allow foreigners to own 49% of a company in Thailand, up from a previous 25%. A week later he bought all the shares of AIS from Ample Rich, a company owned offshore by his son at $1 per share and sold them to a Singapore company, Temasek for approximately US$1.88 Bn and paid no capital gains tax or anyother tax on the sale.

Who shot se Dang? There are probably a few poeple inside and outside Thailand who know for sure and they aren't saying. The Reds are saying it was the army, the yellows are blaming the Reds but most people have no real idea.

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands? The Red Shirts and their supporters do.

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands? The Democrats and their supporters do.

I include the TVF posters as well on each side.

Each side is pointing fingers and talking a lot but nothing is really happening

Seh Deng's shooting has similarities to JFK's in that in order to find the truth you need to look beyond the obvious and ask the one key question.

Who actually benefitted from his murder?

[Soi Sauce]

It's Naziism in Asia.

Anyone want to argue?

[rubl]

I don't take sides in this 'Them versus Us' issue. Both sides think they are Us, and the other side is Them.

Yes, there are more shady characters in this play than a Batman movie...but where is the Good Guy in this? I can't see one. Not ONE. Worse, I do NOT have enough information to have an informed opinion. I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Especially outstanding questions for which I have never read any lucid answers---

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government?

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions?

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur?

Who shot se Dang?

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands?

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands?

Shooting Thais who took refuge in a Temple is beyond bad form.

This whole thing is more like team sport than a discussion about politics, even among the foriegners. I am a guest here, and am not getting involved in a family argument, but what am I supposed to think? Voices on this forum take sides really fast, but seem short on explanations for any ONE of the above issues. If anyone has information beyond speculation on any of the listed questions above, please write me or respond in forum. Information is thin, and opinion runs rampant. Again, I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Okay, resume rants.

Taking your points one at a time.

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government? There was NO elected government at the time and Thaksin having quit Thai politics for ever (his words) went to the King and formally resigned. He then handed over to a caretaker PM who swore his oath to the King. 7 weeks later Thaksin took back control but never went formally to the King.

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions? They cahnged the constitution and gave themselves amnesty. The coup leader is now in a partnership with the PTP and is a Minister I believe.

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur? Thaksin changed the rules of ownership to allow foreigners to own 49% of a company in Thailand, up from a previous 25%. A week later he bought all the shares of AIS from Ample Rich, a company owned offshore by his son at $1 per share and sold them to a Singapore company, Temasek for approximately US$1.88 Bn and paid no capital gains tax or anyother tax on the sale.

Who shot se Dang? There are probably a few poeple inside and outside Thailand who know for sure and they aren't saying. The Reds are saying it was the army, the yellows are blaming the Reds but most people have no real idea.

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands? The Red Shirts and their supporters do.

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands? The Democrats and their supporters do.

I include the TVF posters as well on each side.

Each side is pointing fingers and talking a lot but nothing is really happening

Seh Deng's shooting has similarities to JFK's in that in order to find the truth you need to look beyond the obvious and ask the one key question.

Who actually benefitted from his murder?

In a different universe with less strict defamation laws I'd be tempted to point to the UDD leader team our renegade general said Thaksin agreed on being replaced by a more 'strong' management under our general.

In this universe with the current government striving to get top position on 'freedom' indices I stay quiet in my corner

Edited October 25, 2013 by rubl

[rametindallas]

Pheu Thai 'will not' withdraw blanket amnesty bill

Of course, Puea Thai will not withdraw the bill. They answer to a higher authority (Dr. Thaksin) then the people. When the master returns, he will fix it so they never need to have election again or be accountable to anyone but him. Or so it seems they think that way. I sincerely hope there is a reckoning soon.

[rametindallas]

I don't take sides in this 'Them versus Us' issue. Both sides think they are Us, and the other side is Them.

Yes, there are more shady characters in this play than a Batman movie...but where is the Good Guy in this? I can't see one. Not ONE. Worse, I do NOT have enough information to have an informed opinion. I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Especially outstanding questions for which I have never read any lucid answers---

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government?

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions?

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur?

Who shot se Dang?

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands?

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands?

Shooting Thais who took refuge in a Temple is beyond bad form.

This whole thing is more like team sport than a discussion about politics, even among the foriegners. I am a guest here, and am not getting involved in a family argument, but what am I supposed to think? Voices on this forum take sides really fast, but seem short on explanations for any ONE of the above issues. If anyone has information beyond speculation on any of the listed questions above, please write me or respond in forum. Information is thin, and opinion runs rampant. Again, I am forced into nervous speculation as much as the Thai public.

Okay, resume rants.

Taking your points one at a time.

Why was there a coup to overturn an elected government? There was NO elected government at the time and Thaksin having quit Thai politics for ever (his words) went to the King and formally resigned. He then handed over to a caretaker PM who swore his oath to the King. 7 weeks later Thaksin took back control but never went formally to the King.

Why were the coup architects given Constituitional protection from their actions? They cahnged the constitution and gave themselves amnesty. The coup leader is now in a partnership with the PTP and is a Minister I believe.

How did Thaksin raid the country, and if so why was it permitted to occur? Thaksin changed the rules of ownership to allow foreigners to own 49% of a company in Thailand, up from a previous 25%. A week later he bought all the shares of AIS from Ample Rich, a company owned offshore by his son at $1 per share and sold them to a Singapore company, Temasek for approximately US$1.88 Bn and paid no capital gains tax or anyother tax on the sale.

Who shot se Dang? There are probably a few poeple inside and outside Thailand who know for sure and they aren't saying. The Reds are saying it was the army, the yellows are blaming the Reds but most people have no real idea.

Why would anyone think Thaksin has clean hands? The Red Shirts and their supporters do.

Why would anyone think Abhisit has clean hands? The Democrats and their supporters do.

I include the TVF posters as well on each side.

Each side is pointing fingers and talking a lot but nothing is really happening

Seh Deng's shooting has similarities to JFK's in that in order to find the truth you need to look beyond the obvious and ask the one key question.

Who actually benefitted from his murder?

Everyone! Especially the Red Shirt, benefitted from his death as he was a 'loose cannon' and was trying to usurp the power of the Red Shirt Leaders, His death made him a 'martyr' for the cause, also. Does anyone think that the Red Shirt leadership wanted to turn their leadership over to Seh Daeng (he said he was sent to do just that)? I have to think that even Dr. Thaksin, who sent Seh Daeng, was a little mortified when Seh Daeng exceeded his mandate from Thaksin, 'to keep the Red Shirts in line', and tried to take over the movement. On the other hand, why would the Democrat led government want him dead? He was giving contradicting and embarrassing, to the Red cause, interviews daily to the World's press, he was causing internal strife within he Red Shirt movement, and if they killed him, they knew many would be pointing a finger at them. To the military, he was an annoyance and not a serious threat to their power or ability to control the situation. When it happened, I said to myself, "No way the government is that stupid to take him out so publicly". It is still my belief.