Fit in

[wym]

In western culture having sex with a young person below the age of consent (some jurisdictions 14 some up to 18), it is just as much a crime as forcibly raping someone, often with longer jail sentence, hardly ever just a fine.

Because they are supposed to not yet be mentally capable of giving consent,

Some jurisdictions make it not a crime if both of them are very close in age, usually just a couple of years.

But a father or uncle or neighbor raping a young girl would not only get put away in jail for a very long time, but most likely have to be put in solitary because the other inmates would kill them.

From what I've heard, this type of thing happens much more frequently in rural Thailand than in the west, and very often the girls would never tell anyone, not even their mother.

I think girls in the sex industry are disproportionally victims of this sort of crime.

[wym]

No of course not, but it'll take a LOT more than just eliminating corruption (IMO impossible anyway) for Thailand to catch up with Singapore. Education for a start, another in effect impossible situation here.

Wasn't there a dictator there for 30 years? That would fix the Thai education system I'm sure.

Still is very far from a real functioning democracy.

However they are/were blessed by having an authoritarian regime that actually worked (to some extent) for the overall well-being of the nation, as well as of course benefiting themselves and their cronies. Not saints to be sure, but at least not too greedy and short-sighted.

[Somsrisonphimai]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

In western culture having sex with a young person below the age of consent (some jurisdictions 14 some up to 18), it is just as much a crime as forcibly raping someone, often with longer jail sentence, hardly ever just a fine.

Because they are supposed to not yet be mentally capable of giving consent,

Some jurisdictions make it not a crime if both of them are very close in age, usually just a couple of years.

But a father or uncle or neighbor raping a young girl would not only get put away in jail for a very long time, but most likely have to be put in solitary because the other inmates would kill them.

From what I've heard, this type of thing happens much more frequently in rural Thailand than in the west, and very often the girls would never tell anyone, not even their mother.

I think girls in the sex industry are disproportionally victims of this sort of crime.

I am not sure I should continue with this conversation since it is not within the content of the thead and the moderators will either delete or close it. You know people talk, and gossiping is very bad in Thailand, but I have never heard anything relating to rape or child molestation in my village. Most of the time, the case of boy and girl being together is out in the open.

[NeverSure]

No wonder why the US is in debt, look at money they gave away. They are probably given more out now to other countries they involved with.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Somsrisonphimai, So many people talk of "US debt." But they forget how huge the US is, how big its economy is, how many natural resources it has, and that government debt is separate from household debt or corporation/business debt. In the US, businesses are privately owned. The people own stock in the big corporations.

Government debt is about $17 trillion dollars. But the people have a combined household net worth of $80 trillion. Link

I can't find a link that states what the net worth (not market capitalization) of all businesses in the US is, but surely it's higher than households.

So you have to look at things in perspective.

Edited March 6, 2014 by NeverSure

[wym]

I have had many conversations with upcountry girls where they've told me about being raped by family or neighbors at what would be considered a young age in the west, I'd say well over 20%, and less than half of them would have had anything to do with the sex industry.

Some it is true may have been making up stories to get sympathy, but in my judgment very few, since these generally come out only after we've been together a long time, long after the girls would have given up on getting much money out of me - the real scammers never come near me of course since I'm very open about being poor.

I'm not intending to vilify Thai culture here, this is of course a worldwide problem; in the US most credible studies show between 1 in 7 and 1 in 4 women, and between 1 in 20 and 1 in 7 men were so abused as children. These rates are much higher in Africa, and lowest in Europe.

[thailiketoo]

No wonder why the US is in debt, look at money they gave away. They are probably given more out now to other countries they involved with.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Somsrisonphimai, So many people talk of "US debt." But they forget how huge the US is, how big its economy is, how many natural resources it has, and that government debt is separate from household debt or corporation/business debt. In the US, businesses are privately owned. The people own stock in the big corporations.

Government debt is about $17 trillion dollars. But the people have a combined household net worth of $80 trillion. Link

I can't find a link that states what the net worth (not market capitalization) of all businesses in the US is, but surely it's higher than households.

So you have to look at things in perspective.

So you are trying to compare the biggest economy in the world with Thailand? Let me give you a hint. People in America pay more for a garage than Thais do for a two story home with two car garage.

The Thai baht has stayed relatively the same for the last six months of political turmoil. If there was a problem with debt or investor confidence the Thai Baht would have tanked.

People come from America to Thailand to retire because it is a good deal financially and the health care and infrastructure is on a par with the USA in many areas and in some places better.

Simply put it's still a bargain. One just needs a smidgen of common sense. Cars are expensive; public transportation is plentiful and almost free. So how do you get around? Rice is cheap and good, French bread is expensive. Do you eat rice or French bread. Pork is cheap and good; beef steak is expensive and bad. Do you eat BBQ ribs or char broiled steak?

Some people find unusual customs frightening. Some people find it makes life not boring. If you don't like rice and buses, stay home. Some people can get in an argument with a song tau driver. They should go home. How can you have an argument with a guy who is charging less than a dollar to go 10 miles?

[thailiketoo]

I have had many conversations with upcountry girls where they've told me about being raped by family or neighbors at what would be considered a young age in the west, I'd say well over 20%, and less than half of them would have had anything to do with the sex industry.

Some it is true may have been making up stories to get sympathy, but in my judgment very few, since these generally come out only after we've been together a long time, long after the girls would have given up on getting much money out of me - the real scammers never come near me of course since I'm very open about being poor.

I'm not intending to vilify Thai culture here, this is of course a worldwide problem; in the US most credible studies show between 1 in 7 and 1 in 4 women, and between 1 in 20 and 1 in 7 men were so abused as children. These rates are much higher in Africa, and lowest in Europe.

Stop pushing the rumors. If you have some factual Thai information link it. If not who cares what you imagine is happening in your dreams.

[dotpoom]

Thailand got along OK before we came here. If we choose to build our nest here it is up to us to adapt to our surroundings, not for them to fit in to our way.

[lakecross]

wym etc.

i'd always favour actual statistics over a poster's first-hand experience, purely because most people posting on message boards aren't impartial, they have their own past experiences/agenda that creates bias. They're prone to mentioning how long they have lived in thailand for every other post, like it gives them sort sort of ascendancy. i don't doubt stats can be manipulated by authorities, but one person can't possibly have enough experience of an entire country's police force or crime prevalence to make accurate assessments.

[somchaismith]

Yeah, quite common for this to come up in conversations.

I have had many conversations with upcountry girls where they've told me about being raped by family or neighbors

Edited March 7, 2014 by somchaismith

[robertthebruce]

I feel as though i am fitting in, and i do try, i dont have a problem, here, for me its an easy country to fit in...

my only negative, is the ''Driving'', so dangerous...

but as for the rest, its lovely, no complaints....

[Maroon Watcher]

Been here 9 months - I feel sorry for the Thais - having to beg/currupt steel and borrow to survive.

My friends came to visit me - they will not return

Thailand is a "Rip-off dump"

I will probably go after my contract - low pay/value

[captnhoy]

Most definitely fitting in. I cannot read or write (in Thai), know very little language, drive wherever my car will fit, even if the wrong way, pass on blind curves and hills as fast as I can get that thing to go. Someone coming? Mai Pen RAI! They can hit the ditch. I never say "I don't know" as any answer will do just to keep my face. Usually that answer is "no have" even though I am sitting on the very thing they are asking about. ANNNND I was made for eating with my spoon as primary utensil with the fork as a push tool. Saves me from using my thumb like I used to do.

[ppmacready]

The double pricing and showing no price on markets will soon be over, then Thailand is full of shoppingmalls from Central with only big shops left.

The not obeying trafficrules and being selfish on the roads will also stop one day when Thailand gets real policemen. Nobody likes to be hurt in an accident. I see more rich Thai biking now, that is a good sign.

Thailand is just still an undeveloped 3rd world country on many fronts, there is enough money these days so it is just a matter of time before civilisation kicks in.

I have been hearing about Thailand is undeveloped country since I was born. I mean can you or anyone explain what is considered developed country?

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

The people can read and write.

The people obey the law.

The police enforce the law.

The royalists have stopped treating the people like mushrooms and feeding them bullshit!

Free and fair elections take place.

[captnhoy]

The double pricing and showing no price on markets will soon be over, then Thailand is full of shoppingmalls from Central with only big shops left.

The not obeying trafficrules and being selfish on the roads will also stop one day when Thailand gets real policemen. Nobody likes to be hurt in an accident. I see more rich Thai biking now, that is a good sign.

Thailand is just still an undeveloped 3rd world country on many fronts, there is enough money these days so it is just a matter of time before civilisation kicks in.

I have been hearing about Thailand is undeveloped country since I was born. I mean can you or anyone explain what is considered developed country?

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

A developed country has a trash collection solution. Reading of someone dying from electrocution is not the norm. Traffic laws are generally obeyed because drivers know there is a consequence if they are not.

[wym]

The topic came up here:

How do you know most crime isn't recorded here? Your statement is just as unfounded as you are claiming mine is, at least mine is based on statistics which are actually in the public domain.

Tell me how many rapes in Thailand last year then?

My point is that there aren't accurate statistics being collected.

Exactly because that allows some to claim these problems don't exist, they'd love to continue to ignore them because AFATC they aren't problems at all, not worth even starting to investigate as social issues.

Heinous IMO to collaborate in these very serious crimes against humanity by touting the same line.

[Jubes]

Yes....into me, one mouthful at a time

[Somsrisonphimai]

No wonder why the US is in debt, look at money they gave away. They are probably given more out now to other countries they involved with.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Somsrisonphimai, So many people talk of "US debt." But they forget how huge the US is, how big its economy is, how many natural resources it has, and that government debt is separate from household debt or corporation/business debt. In the US, businesses are privately owned. The people own stock in the big corporations.

Government debt is about $17 trillion dollars. But the people have a combined household net worth of $80 trillion. Link

I can't find a link that states what the net worth (not market capitalization) of all businesses in the US is, but surely it's higher than households.

So you have to look at things in perspective.

So you are trying to compare the biggest economy in the world with Thailand? Let me give you a hint. People in America pay more for a garage than Thais do for a two story home with two car garage.

The Thai baht has stayed relatively the same for the last six months of political turmoil. If there was a problem with debt or investor confidence the Thai Baht would have tanked.

People come from America to Thailand to retire because it is a good deal financially and the health care and infrastructure is on a par with the USA in many areas and in some places better.

Simply put it's still a bargain. One just needs a smidgen of common sense. Cars are expensive; public transportation is plentiful and almost free. So how do you get around? Rice is cheap and good, French bread is expensive. Do you eat rice or French bread. Pork is cheap and good; beef steak is expensive and bad. Do you eat BBQ ribs or char broiled steak?

Some people find unusual customs frightening. Some people find it makes life not boring. If you don't like rice and buses, stay home. Some people can get in an argument with a song tau driver. They should go home. How can you have an argument with a guy who is charging less than a dollar to go 10 miles?

I do somehow feel Thailand is tried to fit into you, read your post again and see how much Thailand has changed adopting to the western standard of living, why? To attract foreigners to come to Thailand or to provide better quality of life for its people? When I was growing up, we were fine with no dime in the bank. Never had to pay for utilities, cable, Internet, and phone bills. We grew our own vegetable, we fished in the river, we raised chicken and hen, and we hardly paid for any meat, so...

[stickylies]

Yep as a visitor is thier country I'm just expected to bend over, gently part my bumcheeks and take it...not allowed to complain.

now i understand why every 7/11 sells "personal" lubricant... i never saw a thai person buying it so it's for farang!

[Berkshire]

But a father or uncle or neighbor raping a young girl would not only get put away in jail for a very long time, but most likely have to be put in solitary because the other inmates would kill them.

From what I've heard, this type of thing happens much more frequently in rural Thailand than in the west, and very often the girls would never tell anyone, not even their mother.

I think girls in the sex industry are disproportionally victims of this sort of crime.

I am not sure I should continue with this conversation since it is not within the content of the thead and the moderators will either delete or close it. You know people talk, and gossiping is very bad in Thailand, but I have never heard anything relating to rape or child molestation in my village. Most of the time, the case of boy and girl being together is out in the open.

Khun Som, I hope you've figured out by now that the point-of-view of many farangs in Thailand is highly distorted. NOT ALL, but many farangs interact mostly with females from the lower rungs of Thai society. For example, I'd agree with Wym that Thai girls in the sex industry are there typically because they are damaged goods. Single mothers, victims of molestation, desperately poor, uneducated, zero prospects, drug issues, etc. And predictably, many are from dysfunctional families.

Now consider that many farangs interact exclusively with Thai women from this background--including their families and circle of friends--and try to render their opinion about the whole of Thai society from that perspective. Many farangs in Thailand don't even have Thai male friends from the middle class or above. This is why the opinion of many farangs that you may read on TV is pretty close to complete BS. Some of what they say may be true in their small circle of association, but it's not representative of the rest of "normal" Thailand.

[Somsrisonphimai]

Most definitely fitting in. I cannot read or write (in Thai), know very little language, drive wherever my car will fit, even if the wrong way, pass on blind curves and hills as fast as I can get that thing to go. Someone coming? Mai Pen RAI! They can hit the ditch. I never say "I don't know" as any answer will do just to keep my face. Usually that answer is "no have" even though I am sitting on the very thing they are asking about. ANNNND I was made for eating with my spoon as primary utensil with the fork as a push tool. Saves me from using my thumb like I used to do.

At least they give you a spoon, 555. Most of the time, my dad eats with his fingers.

[nanapong]

I was in the military as a young man and my family also traveled a lot. I never accepted one culture as being better than another and first arrived in Thailand barely out of my teens. Now as I approach 100 years of age things haven't changed that much.

I don't insist on pronouncing words in Thailand in a way that feels good to my tongue. I don't insist in living a morality that feels good to my mothers morals. I don't insist on living a religion that feels comfortable to my parents.

Some people find out how smart their parents were as they get older I'm finding out that is not the case. Although well traveled my parents only lived in one country and were quite provincial. To be honest my parents were full of sh**. They were exposed to other cultures but were so busy being judgmental they forgot to learn anything new.

There is a book out called, All I really ned to know I learned in kindergarten. That was the case for my parents and grandparents and school teachers until grad school.

My Western family would not make it in Thailand. A lot of Farang here try to create problems by attacking Thai behavior. I'm trying to understand what it feels like to be Thai.

Although I see many things wrong about Thailand, I feel pride and proud to be Thai. What about you? What it feels like to be Canadian? You are from Canada, right?

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

What things make you proud?

I am proud of our family value, taking care of the elders mentality and close nit.

I am proud of our carefree concept that is going easy in life, mai pen rai, don't worries your trouble will always find its way out.

I am proud of the country as a whole for being able to hold it together for many years, we were never colonized by the Western countries.

I am proud of our pad Thai, somtum, kow neuw and gai ping,555.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

" we we're never colonized " , and therin lay the problem. You should have been , things would be better.

[stickylies]

I have been hearing about Thailand is undeveloped country since I was born. I mean can you or anyone explain what is considered developed country?

The people can read and write.

The people obey the law.

The police enforce the law.

The royalists have stopped treating the people like mushrooms and feeding them bullshit!

Free and fair elections take place.

true but then in a developed country it's so less FUN!

i love it when i have an "issue" here (whatever issue) and thai say no probrem! and most of the cases it indeed turns out NO PROBLEM ; whereas where i come from it would imply major fees, major kafka, major stress...

developed countries lost the art of taking things easy. everything is way too serious and complex and in the end the actual result (benefit) is not always better than some 3rd world solution to said issue. whenever i'm back in the west i AVOID at all costs all this shit, even when i could get some money out of it, they can keep their cash.

[sirchai]

A pretty much difficult question, similar to: " Would you like to make Somtham Lao for your wife, or let them make their own stuff?"

I know where you come from, those guys who always complain about everything should just go back to their country of origin.

It's that easy. If I don't like to ride on a buffalo, I won't do it. But some posters here seem to not understand this country, its people and culture.

Your country is one of the most beautiful ones on this planet and I appreciate that we don't need metal detectors at schools here to check if students carny a gun.

Cheers-

[stickylies]

But a father or uncle or neighbor raping a young girl would not only get put away in jail for a very long time, but most likely have to be put in solitary because the other inmates would kill them.

From what I've heard, this type of thing happens much more frequently in rural Thailand than in the west, and very often the girls would never tell anyone, not even their mother.

I think girls in the sex industry are disproportionally victims of this sort of crime.

I am not sure I should continue with this conversation since it is not within the content of the thead and the moderators will either delete or close it. You know people talk, and gossiping is very bad in Thailand, but I have never heard anything relating to rape or child molestation in my village. Most of the time, the case of boy and girl being together is out in the open.

Khun Som, I hope you've figured out by now that the point-of-view of many farangs in Thailand is highly distorted. NOT ALL, but many farangs interact mostly with females from the lower rungs of Thai society. For example, I'd agree with Wym that Thai girls in the sex industry are there typically because they are damaged goods. Single mothers, victims of molestation, desperately poor, uneducated, zero prospects, drug issues, etc. And predictably, many are from dysfunctional families.

Now consider that many farangs interact exclusively with Thai women from this background--including their families and circle of friends--and try to render their opinion about the whole of Thai society from that perspective. Many farangs in Thailand don't even have Thai male friends from the middle class or above. This is why the opinion of many farangs that you may read on TV is pretty close to complete BS. Some of what they say may be true in their small circle of association, but it's not representative of the rest of "normal" Thailand.

true, and many of these farang u describe above are basically also damaged goods... let's not forget that.

[sirchai]

Most definitely fitting in. I cannot read or write (in Thai), know very little language, drive wherever my car will fit, even if the wrong way, pass on blind curves and hills as fast as I can get that thing to go. Someone coming? Mai Pen RAI! They can hit the ditch. I never say "I don't know" as any answer will do just to keep my face. Usually that answer is "no have" even though I am sitting on the very thing they are asking about. ANNNND I was made for eating with my spoon as primary utensil with the fork as a push tool. Saves me from using my thumb like I used to do.

At least they give you a spoon, 555. Most of the time, my dad eats with his fingers.

Maybe this guy should buy his own kitchen tolls and teach your fellow countrymen how to eat properly?\

I always use my hands when having sticky rice and Somtham. What's wrong with that? Some foreigners seem to use their toes to think.( Menn).-

[Somsrisonphimai]

But a father or uncle or neighbor raping a young girl would not only get put away in jail for a very long time, but most likely have to be put in solitary because the other inmates would kill them.

From what I've heard, this type of thing happens much more frequently in rural Thailand than in the west, and very often the girls would never tell anyone, not even their mother.

I think girls in the sex industry are disproportionally victims of this sort of crime.

I am not sure I should continue with this conversation since it is not within the content of the thead and the moderators will either delete or close it. You know people talk, and gossiping is very bad in Thailand, but I have never heard anything relating to rape or child molestation in my village. Most of the time, the case of boy and girl being together is out in the open.

Khun Som, I hope you've figured out by now that the point-of-view of many farangs in Thailand is highly distorted. NOT ALL, but many farangs interact mostly with females from the lower rungs of Thai society. For example, I'd agree with Wym that Thai girls in the sex industry are there typically because they are damaged goods. Single mothers, victims of molestation, desperately poor, uneducated, zero prospects, drug issues, etc. And predictably, many are from dysfunctional families.

Now consider that many farangs interact exclusively with Thai women from this background--including their families and circle of friends--and try to render their opinion about the whole of Thai society from that perspective. Many farangs in Thailand don't even have Thai male friends from the middle class or above. This is why the opinion of many farangs that you may read on TV is pretty close to complete BS. Some of what they say may be true in their small circle of association, but it's not representative of the rest of "normal" Thailand.

Yes, that is maybe truth in the past but not anymore. I believe more and more of normal girls and educated girls are becoming the working girl. It is quick and easy earnings. For example, the girl works at bank during day but becomes bar girl at night because banking salary is not enough to accommodate a living style. Again, when think of it, Thailand is trying to fit into the foreigners, accommodating them with type of services. I am wrong with this view?

[Somsrisonphimai]

I was in the military as a young man and my family also traveled a lot. I never accepted one culture as being better than another and first arrived in Thailand barely out of my teens. Now as I approach 100 years of age things haven't changed that much.

I don't insist on pronouncing words in Thailand in a way that feels good to my tongue. I don't insist in living a morality that feels good to my mothers morals. I don't insist on living a religion that feels comfortable to my parents.

Some people find out how smart their parents were as they get older I'm finding out that is not the case. Although well traveled my parents only lived in one country and were quite provincial. To be honest my parents were full of sh**. They were exposed to other cultures but were so busy being judgmental they forgot to learn anything new.

There is a book out called, All I really ned to know I learned in kindergarten. That was the case for my parents and grandparents and school teachers until grad school.

My Western family would not make it in Thailand. A lot of Farang here try to create problems by attacking Thai behavior. I'm trying to understand what it feels like to be Thai.

Although I see many things wrong about Thailand, I feel pride and proud to be Thai. What about you? What it feels like to be Canadian? You are from Canada, right?

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

What things make you proud?

I am proud of our family value, taking care of the elders mentality and close nit.

I am proud of our carefree concept that is going easy in life, mai pen rai, don't worries your trouble will always find its way out.

I am proud of the country as a whole for being able to hold it together for many years, we were never colonized by the Western countries.

I am proud of our pad Thai, somtum, kow neuw and gai ping,555.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

" we we're never colonized " , and therin lay the problem. You should have been , things would be better.

Please give the example of how things would be better.

[vadimbz]

I would say that I already fit. My country has prepared me for Thailand's dark side. Yes, thais are narrowminded, shortsited, and corrupt, and it causes lots of problems. But my people are world champions in narrowmindedness, short site, and corruption, while thais are more like high-school amateurs, so from bad side perspective Thailand feels like lighter easier version of home, there's no cognitive dissonance at all, in fact Europe and other "falang" places are much less fitting for me — too controlling, too limiting, too "lawful".

E.g. if you catch a pickpocket in Thailand, he or she will smile to you like nothing happened, pickpocket from my country will try to stab you. Thailand: Road cop stops you and asks for 100 baht for food. My place: Road cop stops you, takes your license with some absurd justification, and tells you to pay 5000 to get it back. Et cetera. Also, unlike my people thais don't crave for blood, and strong hand, and they are much less hateful and hypocritic.

On the other hand, good sides of LoS — absense of government control, mai bpen rai/go with a flow/live and let live attitude, as well as the obvious stuff, like climate, women, and costs, make it truly priceless.

Care to guess the country?

Edited March 7, 2014 by vadimbz

[ggt]

_{Lets see...I now drive like there are no rule for the road...crowd into intersections...make new lanes where there are none...and try ever chance I get to make pedestrians run for their lives...I short change ever one...and if I get caught I just glare back at them and say nothing...I now watch Thai soaps...movies...and other forms of entertainment which portrays farangs as villains...I can hardly wait to go to immigration where everyone is so nice and helpful...and God bless the bank...they are safe keeping my money...and even let me have a small portion at their convenience...and I have learned to keep a few hundred baht in my pocket to contribute to the police benevolent fund...and I no longer worry about my gold necklace or smart phone...I involuntarily contributed them to promote Thai culture...}