Blood pressure

[GarryP]

As said get a good blood pressure testing unit for home use is not that expensive and as you are at least suspect and may have to take medication likely a good investment - Many of use do have 'white coat' induced pressure from fear of the unknown so it is very important to get a baseline range rather than base medication on what may be a peak when making the hospital visit. Arm band is much more reliable from most reports (and my only attempt at a wrist unit was a write off - could not get any reading near accurate no matter how I positioned it or myself).

This is so true. Going to the doctors does not bother me, but whenever my son needs to go, his blood pressure readings are often high. We bought a good blood pressure monitor so we could check at home. What a waste of money (joking) all my son's readings at home are in the normal range. I know the monitor works properly because it showed my rates are elevated from time to time, or at least they used to be before I started on medication.

[PMNL]

Telling people to do things that you are not qualified to do is so wrong! You can advise herbs as supplement or encourage people to do exercise, suggest diet control, those do no harm. But telling people not to take medication for their high blood pressure because you are living in your own world and believe in your internet research without any medical qualification and evidence based medicine is sooooo wrong and dangerous. Would you take responsible for the OP's health if he had stroke or Heart attack, as a macrovascular complication from hypertension!

To the OP, medication can be obtained easily but how would you know which one you could take which one is contraindicated in your condition?

For example; patient with HTN and asthma should avoid beta blocker as it cause bronchoconstriction.

HTN with bad kidney should avoid ACEI/ARB as it worsen the kidney.

HTN with Proteinuria or diabetes should take ACEI/ ARB as it improves the Proteinuria and prevent the kidney in the long term, off course if your creatinine is over 2.5 and K is over 5.5 you should not be prescribed with this class of medication

These are compelling indication that the health care professional would give you a good advise on what to do best for your specific condition.

And it is so wrong to ask on a forum like this what meds to take for HTN unless you have already prescribed from home country and genuine looking for the generic equivalent then I apologize.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Sheryl]

OP has already been advised to see a doctor and given recommendations as to who/where.

[Kalbo]

Since being in Bangkok, I have been under the Sukhumvit Hospital at Ekkamai for high blood pressure and cholesterol - the tablets they recommend for me are Ramipril, Bestatin,and Anlopine and are provided by the hospital pharmacy. They cost about 5000 baht for 3 months supply.

For what it's worth, I believe all those medications you mentioned above are available in generic form in Thailand and will cost you a lot less than what you may be paying for them now.

[meatboy]

Since being in Bangkok, I have been under the Sukhumvit Hospital at Ekkamai for high blood pressure and cholesterol - the tablets they recommend for me are Ramipril, Bestatin,and Anlopine and are provided by the hospital pharmacy. They cost about 5000 baht for 3 months supply.

For what it's worth, I believe all those medications you mentioned above are available in generic form in Thailand and will cost you a lot less than what you may be paying for them now.

this is what I pay. bisoprolil 5mg x 100=550bht.

amlodipine 5mg x100=220bht.

bestatin 40mg x100=320.

total for over 3months supply 1,090bht.

cassde.i sugest you jump on the bus to korat and give me a bell.

.

[KhunBENQ]

this is what I pay. bisoprolil 5mg x 100=550bht.

amlodipine 5mg x100=220bht.

bestatin 40mg x100=320.

total for over 3months supply 1,090bht.

cassde.i sugest you jump on the bus to korat and give me a bell.

Can you tell where/how you get it?

Some said such medication is available over the counter?

My wife feels ripped off paying 480 Baht for 30 amlodipine 5mg at the doctor here in the sticks.

Edited May 19, 2014 by KhunBENQ

[Bkungbank]

Eat less meat , take more vegetable, buy fruits machine.

[canman]

I got an Omran fully automatic for around 1600 Baht at Boots.

Omron

What we have (Omron HEM-7211):

http://www.ddmedicalshop.com/index.php?route=product/product&keyword=HEM-7211&category_id=0&product_id=116

I have ordered it online. 3090 Baht. Paid too much?

Model overview:

http://www.ddmedicalshop.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=59

I am considering buying one of these myself. I would suggest that any time you visit a doctor and have your BP taken you bring along the home unit and test at the same time. This will allow you to establish a calibration number to adjust the reading of the home unit. I intend to do this any time I have my BP taken by a proffesional.

[CaptHaddock]

I got an Omran fully automatic for around 1600 Baht at Boots.

Omron

What we have (Omron HEM-7211):

http://www.ddmedicalshop.com/index.php?route=product/product&keyword=HEM-7211&category_id=0&product_id=116

I have ordered it online. 3090 Baht. Paid too much?

Model overview:

http://www.ddmedicalshop.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=59

I am considering buying one of these myself. I would suggest that any time you visit a doctor and have your BP taken you bring along the home unit and test at the same time. This will allow you to establish a calibration number to adjust the reading of the home unit. I intend to do this any time I have my BP taken by a proffesional.

As long as the doctor/nurse is using a sphygmomanometer with a mercury column, which is the gold standard. All the hospitals I have been visited here use a mechanical device themselves which may or may not have been calibrated recently. If you request a sphygmomanometer though, they will likely accommodate you.

Edited May 19, 2014 by CaptHaddock

[meatboy]

this is what I pay. bisoprolil 5mg x 100=550bht.

amlodipine 5mg x100=220bht.

bestatin 40mg x100=320.

total for over 3months supply 1,090bht.

cassde.i sugest you jump on the bus to korat and give me a bell.

Can you tell where/how you get it?

Some said such medication is available over the counter?

My wife feels ripped off paying 480 Baht for 30 amlodipine 5mg at the doctor here in the sticks.

I live in korat and get all my presciptions[meds] at siam pharmacy.manufacter berlin.

[lopburi3]

My wife feels ripped off paying 480 Baht for 30 amlodipine 5mg at the doctor here in the sticks.

That does appear to be a high cost as is about what I pay, after discount, at second cost tier private hospital here in Bangkok but only using 1/2 tab so not a great expense compared to other items.

[Issangeorge]

I think I pay less than ฿10 a tablet for 5mg of amlodipine at a family pharmacy in a district town in Isaan. I would say your wife is paying way to much. If she is farang they are charging her a farang price. I had a pharmacy in my local town try to do that to me, I went down the street and never went back.

Sent from my i-mobile IQ 6 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[papa al]

I went into Klaimor Hospital this morning to get a health certificate (2 copies) for motorbike and car licence. My blood pressure has always bounced around mostly to the high side.

Top: 135-175

Bottom 80-95

This morning it was 170 over 90 (or 95) which is a bit on the high side

Drs over the years have frequently suggested I look at taking some kind of meds for high blood pressure but since mine varies I never followed thru, except I take the occasional Lorazapam (Ativan) when I feel a bit stressed which helps.

The Dr. suggested I again consider medication. I told him it bounces around and I just had 2 cups of coffee which likely bumped it up. He asked me to come back in a week, do not drink coffee, and have another test. I think I will follow thru this time. Perhaps the long term ringing in my ears is connected to high blood pressure?

He seemed like a nice guy, 55-60yo, great manner, genuine. Occasionally someone gives a great first impression.

If interested his name and hours available at Klaimor below:

Dr. Vichai

Tues & Thurs 8-12am at Klaimor Hospital

(Klaimor is just before Tesco on Hang Dong Rd (same side) car parking 30m past the hospital, bike parking in front.)

His office: go thru the main entrance right to the back, far left corner, ask for Dr. Vichai

Doug

Please don't delay in getting this investigated and treated. Continuous fluctuations in BP are not a healthy sign, see:

Recommend you get a home BP measuring device (I've had an Omron for 3 years which has worked flawlessly) Take readings morning, noon and night - on BOTH arms, as a wide difference in both readings can mean something is wrong. Show the results to your Klaimor doc for his appraisal.

If he is not a cardiologist, I suggest you consult one to be on the safe side.

BP always fluctuates.

[Sheryl]

That is correct, it is in no way a static number.

However the range that ThaiHerbs describes flunctuating over is entirely above normal. That it fluctuates as described is not the problem, the problem is that it is always above the desired range.

[papa al]

Some evidence suggests that sugar inflames the artery lining contributing to vascular & other health problems so cutting refined sugars from diet may be very helpful...

same for trans-fats.

Good luck.

[GaryB1263]

I like my Omron BP machine. The cuff will wear out in a year or so. It did for me anyways. It was easily reordered in the US.

I just bought 10 tablets of 5mg Amlodipine for 40 Baht. They are generic from the Thai company Berlin Pharm. This is the first time I used Berlin.

[papa al]

That is correct, it is in no way a static number.

However the range that ThaiHerbs describes flunctuating over is entirely above normal. That it fluctuates as described is not the problem, the problem is that it is always above the desired range.

"I went into Klaimor Hospital this morning to get a health certificate (2 copies) for motorbike and car licence. My blood pressure has always bounced around mostly to the high side.

Top: 135-175

Bottom 80-95"

Sheryl: 135/80 mm is WNL, no?

Also there may be value in addressing the cause of HT rather than just treating the symptoms.

[partington]

That is correct, it is in no way a static number.

However the range that ThaiHerbs describes flunctuating over is entirely above normal. That it fluctuates as described is not the problem, the problem is that it is always above the desired range.

"I went into Klaimor Hospital this morning to get a health certificate (2 copies) for motorbike and car licence. My blood pressure has always bounced around mostly to the high side.

Top: 135-175

Bottom 80-95"

Sheryl: 135/80 mm is WNL, no?

Also there may be value in addressing the cause of HT rather than just treating the symptoms.

Unfortunately, in the vast majority of cases, the exact cause of hypertension is unknown. Plenty of people are neither overweight, diabetic or sedentary, yet still display idiopathic hypertension that increases with age.

People who say they are treating the causes are therefore either genuinely in error, or being less than truthful.

[Sheryl]

No, 135/80 is not WNL. It falls into the "pre-hypertensive" category. As an isolated reading it would not be of concern, but in this case it appears to be the lowest the poster's pressure ever runs.

http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/hbp/detect/categ.htm

[papa al]

That is correct, it is in no way a static number.

However the range that ThaiHerbs describes flunctuating over is entirely above normal. That it fluctuates as described is not the problem, the problem is that it is always above the desired range.

"I went into Klaimor Hospital this morning to get a health certificate (2 copies) for motorbike and car licence. My blood pressure has always bounced around mostly to the high side.

Top: 135-175

Bottom 80-95"

Sheryl: 135/80 mm is WNL, no?

Also there may be value in addressing the cause of HT rather than just treating the symptoms.

Unfortunately, in the vast majority of cases, the exact cause of hypertension is unknown. Plenty of people are neither overweight, diabetic or sedentary, yet still display idiopathic hypertension that increases with age.

People who say they are treating the causes are therefore either genuinely in error, or being less than truthful.

Acting on the advise of one of those genuinely-in-error or untruthful people I was able to drop my BP from 142 to 103 in 30 days without patent drugs.

May times vitamin D, (cheap or free, just sit outside in the sun), is as effective as an ACE inhibitor.

I would rather take a beating rather than take statin drugs.

But for those into doctors & pills, go for it.

Is the following statement genuinely in error or merely less than truthful?:

"However the range that ThaiHerbs describes flunctuating over is entirely above normal. That it fluctuates as described is not the problem, the problem is that it is always above the desired range."

Verify: 135/80 is WNL, no?

[Sheryl]

No, as explained already. Not WNL.

[partington]

That is correct, it is in no way a static number.

However the range that ThaiHerbs describes flunctuating over is entirely above normal. That it fluctuates as described is not the problem, the problem is that it is always above the desired range.

"I went into Klaimor Hospital this morning to get a health certificate (2 copies) for motorbike and car licence. My blood pressure has always bounced around mostly to the high side.

Top: 135-175

Bottom 80-95"

Sheryl: 135/80 mm is WNL, no?

Also there may be value in addressing the cause of HT rather than just treating the symptoms.

Unfortunately, in the vast majority of cases, the exact cause of hypertension is unknown. Plenty of people are neither overweight, diabetic or sedentary, yet still display idiopathic hypertension that increases with age.

People who say they are treating the causes are therefore either genuinely in error, or being less than truthful.

Acting on the advise of one of those genuinely-in-error or untruthful people I was able to drop my BP from 142 to 103 in 30 days without patent drugs.

May times vitamin D, (cheap or free, just sit outside in the sun), is as effective as an ACE inhibitor.

I would rather take a beating rather than take statin drugs.

But for those into doctors & pills, go for it.

Is the following statement genuinely in error or merely less than truthful?:

"However the range that ThaiHerbs describes flunctuating over is entirely above normal. That it fluctuates as described is not the problem, the problem is that it is always above the desired range."

Verify: 135/80 is WNL, no?

I'm sorry I don't understand why you would ask this. That statement is absolutely true. Blood pressure readings above those values, as Sheryl says, are undesirable. This means that in epidemiological studies people with blood pressure values like these show statistically increased risk of stroke, end organ damage, and mortality, compared to people with lower (normal) readings. That is how these elevated blood pressures are recognised as undesirable: they damage your health.

What I said was the reasons why people's blood pressure are elevated to these values are very often not understood, therefore a claim to treat the causes is based on a fallacy: that the cause is understood.

Am I missing the point to your question?

[Issangeorge]

I have a booklet that came with my blood pressure machine. It lists a normal rate as 140 over 90, a borderline rate as 160 over 95 and Hypertension as anything above this. This is an old machine (around 1990). I know that at that time the health authorities in North America went by those rates, as far as I can figure Thailand still does. A friend of mine once suggested that the rates were lowered because of pressure from Big Pharma, they wanted to sell more drugs. I tend to agree with him.

[CaptHaddock]

I have a booklet that came with my blood pressure machine. It lists a normal rate as 140 over 90, a borderline rate as 160 over 95 and Hypertension as anything above this. This is an old machine (around 1990). I know that at that time the health authorities in North America went by those rates, as far as I can figure Thailand still does. A friend of mine once suggested that the rates were lowered because of pressure from Big Pharma, they wanted to sell more drugs. I tend to agree with him.

Good luck at generating your own medical standards based on nothing more than unsubstantiated opinion.

[KhunBENQ]

Thats not his own "medical standards" but an ongoing dispute about the acceptable values.

Those who determine the values/standards are not independent reseachers. but sit in the boards of the pharmaceutical companies or earning otherwise from these companies.

I read that they want to lower the values even further, Everyone above 130: take pills!

What a chance...

[Sheryl]

Thats not his own "medical standards" but an ongoing dispute about the acceptable values.

Those who determine the values/standards are not independent reseachers. but sit in the boards of the pharmaceutical companies or earning otherwise from these companies.

I read that they want to lower the values even further, Everyone above 130: take pills!

What a chance...

Actually, not at all true. "Those who dteterine values/standards" are government health agencies/expert panels and do not work for/get paid for -- let alone "sit on the boards of" -- pharmaceutical companies.

And they do not recommend that everyone with a systolic over 130 -- or any other number - "take pills".

Lifestyle modifications -- weight loss, exercise and sodium restriction -- are universally recommended as the first step in managing hypertension with medication reserved for those in whom these measures are insufficient.

130 falls into what is currently considered "pre-hypertension". This will almost always respond to just lifestyle modification.

[philcon]

Hi firstly thank you for responding to this topic, I appreciate your response.

I did take the advise about visiting the Hospital, I went to

Chaing Mai Ram Hospital stroke and heart hospital adjacent to lotus hotel. Filled out the necessary form, saw the Doctor. I informed him I had bought Ampoline from chemist and took one that morning. He took my blood pressure and said ok now and this medication would be ok to continue with.

To my amazement when I went to front desk to pay, they refused to bill me and said, "we not not charge if we do not give medicine"? I asked to pay for their time and registration. No forget it no medicine no bill.

Still in shock

Ok thanks once again cheers Phil

[EyesWideOpen]

My blood pressure has always been borderline high. I became more diligent with my

exercise, and started taking cod liver oil as well as extra virgin olive oil. Within a few

weeks my pressure had dropped to normal. Taking medication is a slippery path

that is treating the symptoms rather than the root causes. Also not easy to get off of....

[tkramer]

Dr. John McDougall has a nice 2 minute explanation of what 'high blood pressure' is, and how to treat it.

[ThaiHerbs]

This is not as simple a situation as many would like to think. I do believe as some have mentioned that pushing drugs (and unnecessary surgeries, chemo etc) is rampant in western society/medicine. The FDA and BIG Pharma play musical chairs with key positions of power and have for some time. Drugs for the most part treat the symptom and are not a cure for most disease, and most have very serious side effects. Diet and lifestyle issues are definately important as discussed in this article http://www.naturalnews.com/030039_high_blood_pressure_prevention.html

I am not anti-drugs, they have a place in treatment but I prefer to place them in the category of "emergency medicine". For instance: I had a motorbike accident this past Feb 28, unconscious for over one hour, nothing broken but my hip was badly twisted on impact and I was on crutches for approx 5 weeks. I was proscribed 3 drugs: for pain, swelling/inflamation and muscle relaxant. They did an amazing job of relieving my pain and discomfort and allowed me to be somewhat mobile. However, my online research on these drugs (ORPHENADRINE/NORGESIC, nidol, PARCONO) and discussions with the doctor made me realize there were potential VERY serious side effects with taking these drugs so I weaned myself off them as soon as possible/tolerable. I was grateful for the drugs but in no way were they going to be put into my body longer than absolutely necessary for a decent quality of life.

I have the same attitude about my fluctuating blood pressure, but I do not pretend to have all the answers.

My father: had perfect blood pressure all the time all his life, it was a subject of conversation in our house. From memory, it was always 120/80 or very very close to that number. He died at 89yo but during the last approx 30 years he had a series of strokes, often many many years apart. He lost partial use of one hand, one eye went wonky (pointed off to one side), and he had short periods of recovery time where his thinking was a bit confused. Between strokes his blood pressure continued to be "normal".

One size does not fit all, we are all unique and continually changing. The above true story of my father breaks the accepted theory of high blood pressure being THE cause of strokes. It may be one of the causes for some people but I believe much more is involved.

Doug