Family shocked by UK suicide bomber's reported death in Iraq

[Steely Dan]

"Peace loving law-abiding British muslim family"? That they may be but obviously this lad/idiot did not have the same way of thinking..

There is a very serious problems in parts of Yorkshire.

The hub of grooming gangs.

Other news from today.

Three sisters from Bradford are feared to have travelled to Syria with their nine children after going on a pilgrimage to Saudi Arabia.

The sisters and their children, aged between three and 15, were due back in the UK on Thursday, Khan Solicitors said on behalf of the family.

Ten are thought to have boarded a flight to Istanbul in Turkey on 9 June.

Lawyer Balaal Khan confirmed concerns about them "travelling to Syria". West Yorkshire Police is investigating.

Allegedly

According to the solicitors, it is thought the group travelled to Syria where a brother of the three sisters is understood to be fighting with extremists. It is feared they have met up with him.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-33140851

Yes Dewsbury does indeed have a serious problem. Twelve angry men springs to mind. This remember is all from one smallish Yorkshire town.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/06/one-uk-town-linked-to-over-12-islamic-jihadis

Edited June 16, 2015 by Scott

[JockPieandBeans]

Yes Dewsbury does indeed have a serious problem. Twelve angry men springs to mind. This remember is all from one smallish Yorkshire town.

http://www.jihadwatc...islamic-jihadis

Look who else from Dewsbury is getting her belly warmers in a twist.

Government 'disengaged from Muslims'Robin Brant, Political Correspondent, BBC News

The government has "disengaged" from some British Muslim groups in an "incredibly worrying" move, according to prominent Muslim former cabinet minister Sayeeda Warsi.

Dewsbury-born Baroness Warsi has told BBC Radio 4 there needs to be an "evidence base" to try to understand why some British Muslims are radicalised and go to join Islamic State (IS).

She was commenting on reports that three women and their nine children have gone missing from Bradford and are feared to have travelled to Syria to join IS.

http://www.bbc.com/news/live/uk-england-leeds-33081321

Some Muslim groups being kicked into touch by the Government. Not before time.

She says there needs to be an evidence base to try to understand. No there doesn't. Muslims need to rapidly extract the finger from their collective @sses and get with the program.

The sands have shifted. The genie is out the bottle.

Edited June 16, 2015 by JockPieandBeans

[canuckamuck]

Parental fail level 10

Smug post.You bring up children?Not easy no matter how hard you try as a parent children in the end will do their own thing.

If it were my kid I'd blame myself.

[Chicog]

Kids, don't they blow up fast these days?

That is an absolutely ABHORRENT statement!

(read: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!)

[Chicog]

Parental fail level 10

Smug post.You bring up children?Not easy no matter how hard you try as a parent children in the end will do their own thing.

If it were my kid I'd blame myself.

If I spent the formative years telling my kids (or letting other people tell my kids) that the afterlife matters more than life itself, I'd blame myself as well.

Edited June 16, 2015 by Chicog

[7by7]

I see the usual suspects are peddling their usual ignorant prejudices about British Muslims; usually from 6000 miles away.

According to these people, when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage girls are the victims of grooming by perverted sexual predators it is only the grooming gangs who are to blame and the parents are blameless.

Yet when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage boys, and girls, are the victims of terrorist grooming gangs it is the fault of the parents; and those parents even encouraged them!

Double standards; but that is what one expects from them.

In both situations the parents must, of course, take some responsibility for not knowing what their children were doing, who they were chatting to in person and online, where they were going, who they were meeting; but it is the groomers who bear the greater blame.

The overwhelming majority of British Muslims want nothing to do with IS or any other terrorist or extremist group. From Muslim community leaders and representatives such as the Muslim Council of Britain through Imams to ordinary people such as the Not In MY Name campaign, British Muslims regularly and consistently condemn the terrorists and extremists and preachers of hate.

Like, I hope, all other British citizens of all religions or none, the overwhelming majority of British Muslims are law abiding people who simply want to live in a free and open society. Most of them are as hard working as members of any other group and contribute to British society.

But they don't get the headlines, Muslim doesn't commit child rape; Muslim doesn't join IS, Muslim lives peacefully with his non Muslim neighbours etc. wont sell any papers, and certainly wont be of interest to the hate sites such as jihadwatch.

Sites which called the death of two pedestrians in a RTC last December a 'jihadist attack' because one, just one, of the four, yes four, drivers involved was Muslim!

Sites which headlined the idiot Emerson's absurd, and since withdrawn, assertion that Birmingham was a 100% Muslim city where non Muslims feared to tread!

How can any educated, intelligent person take anything on such sites seriously?

[Lokie]

Do muslims have any' affinity with their adopted state/country or only to Islam?

[Thongkorn]

great news, another one we dont have to worry about, now he is flying mince meat, hope he gets his 14 stergones.

[wooloomooloo]

Now move to the BBC coverage of this story I watched last night : you would think this boy was the most honourable and noble of people who (by no fault of his own or his family) happened to get groomed by some unspecified evil man and that is why he did what he did. It could happen to anybody.

I've never experienced a jihadi pop-up attempting to sell me a better life in Syria or Iraq, so I can only assume that some go looking for extremist websites.

Not so many decades ago such treasonous behaviour would have seen you primed for the gallows or, at the very least, interned.

These communities know exactly wants going on, but they choose to stay, in the main, silent.

I fear another 7/7 before we finally wake up, though, I personally considered 7/7 a good time to wake up but we all went back to sleep. Jeez.

[MAJIC]

Let's not put a failure universally on this,it's purely lack of culturally education and parental guidance.

How many of us would expect our children to plan it,go for it, and disappear in Iraq.and not a parental clue what the children were up to <deleted>,before they went? don't these people talk to their children?

PS Here comes another Bill,winging it's way to the British Tax payer!

Edited June 16, 2015 by MAJIC

[F430murci]

I see the usual suspects are peddling their usual ignorant prejudices about British Muslims; usually from 6000 miles away.

According to these people, when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage girls are the victims of grooming by perverted sexual predators it is only the grooming gangs who are to blame and the parents are blameless.

Yet when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage boys, and girls, are the victims of terrorist grooming gangs it is the fault of the parents; and those parents even encouraged them!

Double standards; but that is what one expects from them.

In both situations the parents must, of course, take some responsibility for not knowing what their children were doing, who they were chatting to in person and online, where they were going, who they were meeting; but it is the groomers who bear the greater blame.

The overwhelming majority of British Muslims want nothing to do with IS or any other terrorist or extremist group. From Muslim community leaders and representatives such as the Muslim Council of Britain through Imams to ordinary people such as the Not In MY Name campaign, British Muslims regularly and consistently condemn the terrorists and extremists and preachers of hate.

Like, I hope, all other British citizens of all religions or none, the overwhelming majority of British Muslims are law abiding people who simply want to live in a free and open society. Most of them are as hard working as members of any other group and contribute to British society.

But they don't get the headlines, Muslim doesn't commit child rape; Muslim doesn't join IS, Muslim lives peacefully with his non Muslim neighbours etc. wont sell any papers, and certainly wont be of interest to the hate sites such as jihadwatch.

Sites which called the death of two pedestrians in a RTC last December a 'jihadist attack' because one, just one, of the four, yes four, drivers involved was Muslim!

Sites which headlined the idiot Emerson's absurd, and since withdrawn, assertion that Birmingham was a 100% Muslim city where non Muslims feared to tread!

How can any educated, intelligent person take anything on such sites seriously?

Hilarious! How can anyone take you seriously?

[JDGRUEN]

I notice the NUMBER ONE TVF Muslim excuse maker has arrived.

[exbikey]

Suicide bombers!

Dunno what makes 'em tick!

To quote Basil Brush "boom, boom"

[samuibeachcomber]

Parental fail level 10

Smug post.You bring up children?Not easy no matter how hard you try as a parent children in the end will do their own thing.

If it were my kid I'd blame myself.

If I spent the formative years telling my kids (or letting other people tell my kids) that the afterlife matters more than life itself, I'd blame myself as well.

But you dont know that's what they did.I would rather give them the benefit of the doubt first.All we know is he got led astray,made a crazy decision and paid for it with his life,and his parents are grieving.Easy to make assumptions.

[samuibeachcomber]

I notice the NUMBER ONE TVF Muslim excuse maker has arrived.

No i think 7by7 is making a valid point.Extremists are a minority that appeal to dissafected youth,just like BF appeal to the same but are white.

[Scott]

...and I notice that the group of Muslim bashers have had their little pitty-party crashed.

Stay on topic. The thread is not about other members.

[JockPieandBeans]

I notice the NUMBER ONE TVF Muslim excuse maker has arrived.

No i think 7by7 is making a valid point.Extremists are a minority that appeal to dissafected youth,just like BF appeal to the same but are white.

Did these disaffected youth and young children force their mothers to take them to Syria ? Or did the mothers force them ?

West Yorkshire police knew brother of three missing sisters and nine children had gone to Syria two years ago, claims lawyer acting for two of sisters’ husbands

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jun/16/bradford-missing-women-children-syria-police-risk-brother-islamic-state

[Steely Dan]

No argument from me.

Whether it be wilful, pretend, willing to pretend or kid yourself. It is now becoming very evident that is nothing more than BS.

Those with an ounce of common sense know exactly who are avoiding facts.

Yes - absolutely ...and in the U.K. those who are avoiding the facts reside in Parliament and at 10 Downing Street.

Agreed.

However, I get a feeling that this has began to swing in the other direction, particularly over the last 2 years.

It also might be true to say, that this has been forced by the sheer weight of evidence that has came to the fore over the last 2 years.

The shackles have came off to a certain extent.

The genie will not be going back in the bottle.

The genie is indeed out of the bottle and politicians are not going to be able to stuff it back in.

http://www.christiantoday.com/article/think.muslim.think.terrorist.poll.reveals.british.attitudes.toward.islam/56254.htm

[Ace of Pop]

Why do they let em make such a bloody noise, im sure they would love My God , Chas n Dave blastin out every mornin when they wanna kip.. Hows me Cockney Inglish dooin T.A. ?.

[JockPieandBeans]

Agreed.

However, I get a feeling that this has began to swing in the other direction, particularly over the last 2 years.

It also might be true to say, that this has been forced by the sheer weight of evidence that has came to the fore over the last 2 years.

The shackles have came off to a certain extent.

The genie will not be going back in the bottle.

The genie is indeed out of the bottle and politicians are not going to be able to stuff it back in.

http://www.christiantoday.com/article/think.muslim.think.terrorist.poll.reveals.british.attitudes.toward.islam/56254.htm

I read this the other day, but cannot remember what newspaper.

At this juncture, I do not think that Politicians have any intention of stuffing it back in the bottle. Hence the new laws regarding FGM and forced marriages. There has already been a case where a 3 year has been made a ward of the court over FGM.

A High Court judge has granted an order protecting a three-year-old girl believed to be at risk of female genital mutilation.

The girl was made a ward of court at a family court hearing following a South Yorkshire Police investigation.

The decision also prevents her family from taking the child out of the country or making travel plans.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-33145724

The Government have already broken contact with various different Muslim groups, which of course, as I posted on this thread had Warsi throwing tantrums on radio 4.

[JockPieandBeans]

I see the usual suspects are peddling their usual ignorant prejudices about British Muslims; usually from 6000 miles away.

According to these people, when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage girls are the victims of grooming by perverted sexual predators it is only the grooming gangs who are to blame and the parents are blameless.

Yet when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage boys, and girls, are the victims of terrorist grooming gangs it is the fault of the parents; and those parents even encouraged them!

Double standards; but that is what one expects from them.

In both situations the parents must, of course, take some responsibility for not knowing what their children were doing, who they were chatting to in person and online, where they were going, who they were meeting; but it is the groomers who bear the greater blame.

The overwhelming majority of British Muslims want nothing to do with IS or any other terrorist or extremist group. From Muslim community leaders and representatives such as the Muslim Council of Britain through Imams to ordinary people such as the Not In MY Name campaign, British Muslims regularly and consistently condemn the terrorists and extremists and preachers of hate.

Like, I hope, all other British citizens of all religions or none, the overwhelming majority of British Muslims are law abiding people who simply want to live in a free and open society. Most of them are as hard working as members of any other group and contribute to British society.

But they don't get the headlines, Muslim doesn't commit child rape; Muslim doesn't join IS, Muslim lives peacefully with his non Muslim neighbours etc. wont sell any papers, and certainly wont be of interest to the hate sites such as jihadwatch.

Sites which called the death of two pedestrians in a RTC last December a 'jihadist attack' because one, just one, of the four, yes four, drivers involved was Muslim!

Sites which headlined the idiot Emerson's absurd, and since withdrawn, assertion that Birmingham was a 100% Muslim city where non Muslims feared to tread!

How can any educated, intelligent person take anything on such sites seriously?

So you are saying us farangs cannot discuss our thoughts because you are a protector of some sort..?

Mr T

You cannot speak to the Grand Mufti of the UK, who can speak for the vast majority of UK Muslims, like that

[7by7]

I see the usual suspects are peddling their usual ignorant prejudices about British Muslims; usually from 6000 miles away.

According to these people, when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage girls are the victims of grooming by perverted sexual predators it is only the grooming gangs who are to blame and the parents are blameless.

Yet when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage boys, and girls, are the victims of terrorist grooming gangs it is the fault of the parents; and those parents even encouraged them!

Double standards; but that is what one expects from them.

In both situations the parents must, of course, take some responsibility for not knowing what their children were doing, who they were chatting to in person and online, where they were going, who they were meeting; but it is the groomers who bear the greater blame.

The overwhelming majority of British Muslims want nothing to do with IS or any other terrorist or extremist group. From Muslim community leaders and representatives such as the Muslim Council of Britain through Imams to ordinary people such as the Not In MY Name campaign, British Muslims regularly and consistently condemn the terrorists and extremists and preachers of hate.

Like, I hope, all other British citizens of all religions or none, the overwhelming majority of British Muslims are law abiding people who simply want to live in a free and open society. Most of them are as hard working as members of any other group and contribute to British society.

But they don't get the headlines, Muslim doesn't commit child rape; Muslim doesn't join IS, Muslim lives peacefully with his non Muslim neighbours etc. wont sell any papers, and certainly wont be of interest to the hate sites such as jihadwatch.

Sites which called the death of two pedestrians in a RTC last December a 'jihadist attack' because one, just one, of the four, yes four, drivers involved was Muslim!

Sites which headlined the idiot Emerson's absurd, and since withdrawn, assertion that Birmingham was a 100% Muslim city where non Muslims feared to tread!

How can any educated, intelligent person take anything on such sites seriously?

So you are saying us farangs cannot discuss our thoughts because you are a protector of some sort..?

Not at all, which I would have thought was obvious to anyone with an open mind.

It is very noticeable that most, if not all, of those members who pontificate about living in the UK and British Muslims live in Thailand.

So what I am saying is that many of these posters, as is obvious in this topic, base their remarks on ignorance and prejudice because they are 6000 miles away from the UK and so do not have as full a picture of life in the UK as those of us who actually live here do.

An obvious example of this was in another topic one such a member asked another member who challenged his prejudices if he had ever visited the UK. The same member who regularly dismisses my comments with juvenile insults, even though, unlike him, I do actually live in the Uk in a town with a substantial Muslim population!

BTW, who do you think I am trying to protect?

It is certainly not child abusers, terrorists, groomers or any other criminal; as anyone who has actually read and understood what I have posted will know.

[Steely Dan]

I see the usual suspects are peddling their usual ignorant prejudices about British Muslims; usually from 6000 miles away.

According to these people, when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage girls are the victims of grooming by perverted sexual predators it is only the grooming gangs who are to blame and the parents are blameless.

Yet when young, naïve, vulnerable, teenage boys, and girls, are the victims of terrorist grooming gangs it is the fault of the parents; and those parents even encouraged them!

Double standards; but that is what one expects from them.

In both situations the parents must, of course, take some responsibility for not knowing what their children were doing, who they were chatting to in person and online, where they were going, who they were meeting; but it is the groomers who bear the greater blame.

The overwhelming majority of British Muslims want nothing to do with IS or any other terrorist or extremist group. From Muslim community leaders and representatives such as the Muslim Council of Britain through Imams to ordinary people such as the Not In MY Name campaign, British Muslims regularly and consistently condemn the terrorists and extremists and preachers of hate.

Like, I hope, all other British citizens of all religions or none, the overwhelming majority of British Muslims are law abiding people who simply want to live in a free and open society. Most of them are as hard working as members of any other group and contribute to British society.

But they don't get the headlines, Muslim doesn't commit child rape; Muslim doesn't join IS, Muslim lives peacefully with his non Muslim neighbours etc. wont sell any papers, and certainly wont be of interest to the hate sites such as jihadwatch.

Sites which called the death of two pedestrians in a RTC last December a 'jihadist attack' because one, just one, of the four, yes four, drivers involved was Muslim!

Sites which headlined the idiot Emerson's absurd, and since withdrawn, assertion that Birmingham was a 100% Muslim city where non Muslims feared to tread!

How can any educated, intelligent person take anything on such sites seriously?

So you are saying us farangs cannot discuss our thoughts because you are a protector of some sort..?

Not at all, which I would have thought was obvious to anyone with an open mind.

It is very noticeable that most, if not all, of those members who pontificate about living in the UK and British Muslims live in Thailand.

So what I am saying is that many of these posters, as is obvious in this topic, base their remarks on ignorance and prejudice because they are 6000 miles away from the UK and so do not have as full a picture of life in the UK as those of us who actually live here do.

An obvious example of this was in another topic one such a member asked another member who challenged his prejudices if he had ever visited the UK. The same member who regularly dismisses my comments with juvenile insults, even though, unlike him, I do actually live in the Uk in a town with a substantial Muslim population!

BTW, who do you think I am trying to protect?

It is certainly not child abusers, terrorists, groomers or any other criminal; as anyone who has actually read and understood what I have posted will know.

I don't suppose it has occurred to you that many UK born expats take a keen interest in their Country of Birth and most have many friends and relatives that still live there to provide anecdotal as well as other evidence.

P.s It's fun to spot the logical fallacy with all your posts, the current case aside from your usual ad hominem stuff is that expats are generically out of touch with the UK.

Edited June 17, 2015 by Steely Dan

[7by7]

Again, you have (deliberately?) misinterpreted what I have posted.

S.O.P.

Again, anything which interferes with your prejudice is dismissed as "logical fallacy."

S.O.P.

Again, it is very noticeable that not one of you has actually presented a single argument to counter what I originally posted and have instead resorted to juvenile attacks.

S.O.P.

[nev]

Again, you have (deliberately?) misinterpreted what I have posted.

S.O.P.

Again, anything which interferes with your prejudice is dismissed as "logical fallacy."

S.O.P.

Again, it is very noticeable that not one of you has actually presented a single argument to counter what I originally posted and have instead resorted to juvenile attacks.

S.O.P.

Nice you finished your post with juvenile attacks thanks for getting back on topic.

[DividendGuy]

You know what really burns my ass, is that after a horrendous act like blowing up people, the loving family of the <deleted> who did it try and get sympathy from the public. I believe they knew down deep that their little murderer was capable of such acts and then when it finally does happen they try to cover their trail by saying they are such a bla, bla, bla peace-loving family because maybe someone will hold them accountable.

[EnglishJohn]

... and tonight we have the Muslim communities blaming the police because 3 women have gone there and taken their children.

Let anyone go who wants to. If they sympathise with ISIS then good riddance I say : they have no place in our society. Then revoke their British citizenship or (if the European Court of Human Rights tells us we can't, which it will) charge everyone who returns with aiding terrorists with a minimum sentence of 5 years. Let's see how many go if they know for sure they cannot come back.

[Jay Sata]

I have not waded through the three pages of response to the OP but I will make a couple of points.

Most of the extreme fundamentalist muslims in the UK come from northern Pakistan and are Pashtun.

7by7 you take a simplistic approach to the problem having no knowledge of the different sectors of the religion.

I doubt you have ever spent any time in Leicester or many of the old northern towns such as Dewsbury,Rotherham etc.

These are now breeding grounds for those who want to see an overthrow of what they see as a decadent western society.

It is like trying to explain 19th century Christianity to a modern Thai buddhist.

A lot of the migrants from northern Pakistan and indeed Bangaldesh and elsewhere allowed free reign to enter the UK under the Blair regime arrived for purely economic reasons and have never integrated. Hence the desire to bite the hand that feeds them while trying to change the world as they see it.

I have made the point so many times here on many threads that immigrations where a migrant wants to enter a country and integrate,speak the language and be part of the host society is fine.

However I abhor anyone who comes to the UK and wants to destroy our history,culture and society.

In the case of the migrants flooding in across Greece and Italy they are mostly economic and should be treated in the way Australia has avoided the issues.

.

[MAJIC]

I have not waded through the three pages of response to the OP but I will make a couple of points.

Most of the extreme fundamentalist muslims in the UK come from northern Pakistan and are Pashtun.

7by7 you take a simplistic approach to the problem having no knowledge of the different sectors of the religion.

I doubt you have ever spent any time in Leicester or many of the old northern towns such as Dewsbury,Rotherham etc.

These are now breeding grounds for those who want to see an overthrow of what they see as a decadent western society.

It is like trying to explain 19th century Christianity to a modern Thai buddhist.

A lot of the migrants from northern Pakistan and indeed Bangaldesh and elsewhere allowed free reign to enter the UK under the Blair regime arrived for purely economic reasons and have never integrated. Hence the desire to bite the hand that feeds them while trying to change the world as they see it.

I have made the point so many times here on many threads that immigrations where a migrant wants to enter a country and integrate,speak the language and be part of the host society is fine.

However I abhor anyone who comes to the UK and wants to destroy our history,culture and society.

In the case of the migrants flooding in across Greece and Italy they are mostly economic and should be treated in the way Australia has avoided the issues.

.

Since you mentioned Integration,Thais also have a problem with reluctance to Integrate in the UK,and never forgetting the Thai way! Sad really considering Thailand has done **** *** for them as Thai Citizens. And Integration should not be Thai' using Thai' as cheap labour,as I see all too often in the UK!

Edited June 17, 2015 by MAJIC

[ABCer]

I do not believe in parental failure.

I do not believe in parental ignorance.

I do not believe in parental grief.

I do not believe in these young people innocence.

I do not believe in these young people being brainwashed by IS propaganda.

I firmly believe these young people being brainwashed by their Religion from childhood.

I firmly believe that unless Religion of Islam is banned in the West - the West is doomed.

Note: I am not calling for any sort of violence.