Koh Tao murders: 2 DNA profiles from alleged murder weapon do not match defendants' DNA

[realenglish1]

Again poor inept police work. From the beginning I was not convinced these 2 where guilty. Its clear now that they are not. They need to be compensated and the police need to

publicly apologize to them . They need to be granted Thai citizenship and be made whole again

And now the real murder is walking free

This is soooooo sad

[stephenterry]

So they should walk I would guess

Why should they? If the prosecution was using a DNA match between the two defendants and the murder weapon yes they should. But that's not what they are basing their case on, the DNA results could be from any other person that handled the hoe before or after the murders.

Utter tripe. The re-enactment facade clearly indicated that the prosecution based the defendants confession on using the hoe as the murder weapon. And if they are basing their case on anything else it has not been shown in court reports.

Their case: DNA, confession, re-enactment. All of which has been successfully challenged. As to the MURDER WEAPON, the bloody hoe, it doesn't take an Einstein to figure out that had either of the B2 handled the hoe, in all probability their DNA would also have been found along with two unidentified males.

[AleG]

So they should walk I would guess

Why should they? If the prosecution was using a DNA match between the two defendants and the murder weapon yes they should. But that's not what they are basing their case on, the DNA results could be from any other person that handled the hoe before or after the murders.

One set of DNA is almost certainly from the beach cleaner/gardener. It is highly probable that the other is from the assailant who smashed Hannah's head in. It is clutching at straws to suggest otherwise.

At any rate, it appears the "perfect investigation" using a magnifying glass to check for DNA, was not quite as effective as real forensic analysis.

I just stated the obvious, this is not positive proof of the innocence of the two Burmese; clutching at straws is, IMO, declaring that the case is over based on DNA results from a source that has been known to be contaminated since day one.

Once again, the case was not built upon a DNA match between the hoe and the defendants.

[MaxLee]

Again poor inept police work. From the beginning I was not convinced these 2 where guilty. Its clear now that they are not. They need to be compensated and the police need to

publicly apologize to them . They need to be granted Thai citizenship and be made whole again

And now the real murder is walking free

This is soooooo sad

Somyod will be on the way to boast and put on a angry FACE

[elgordo38]

We were expecting some breaking news from Dr Pornthip but this is more explosive than I thought, and we have still got to hear the other evidence from the UK! There's enough now to call a complete halt to these unjust and farcical proceedings

They will not stop the trial now the loss of face would be just to great. Better to stumble on to the end and then plead S*******y

[BritTim]

BBC have got it now to

Thai beach killings: Expert questions DNA evidence

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-34217544

This is a key point that the BBC has right

Defence lawyers had asked for the samples to be independently verified but were told there was nothing left of them to re-test.

The original samples were "used up". What the prosecution was offering was replication from an intermediate step in the DNA testing that cannot be distinguished between semen and saliva.

[StealthEnergiser]

11 September 2015, Last update at 12:54:00 GMT

Koh Tao Murders: Celebrity Scientist Takes Stand For Defense

Pornthip Rojanasunand speaks outside the Koh Samui courthouse today where two migrant Burmese workers are on trial for the murders of two British travelers in 2014.

SURAT THANI – A celebrity forensic scientist called by lawyers defending two Burmese men on murder charges said today she will present her findings today at their trial today.

Defense lawyers said Pornthip Rojanasunand, head of the Central Institute of Forensic Science, would provide vital testimony in the case because her agency is independent of the Royal Thai Police, who insist their DNA analyses implicated Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo in the brutal killings of two British backpackers on Koh Tao in September 2014.

“I am not here today to help anybody,” Pornthip said. “I am here to present information about the forensic science, about what happened. It doesn’t matter who will benefit from this information. I will perform my duty impartially.”

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1441951320

[bangkokrick]

The repercussions of this are enormous given the the alleged Erawan bombers have just been arrested and charged.

[DKUNPUTAF713]

<<<It shows the world how bad the RTP are. But more importantly it shows the corruption that controls Thai society.>>>

Release the B2 and ensure they are properly compensated and, restart the investigation and apprehend the 2 or 3

pretty well-known ​perpetrators who may still be on Death Island!!!!

[fritzzz25]

1317 user(s) are reading this topic

And one continues to defend this investigation. What on earth would possess someone to do this?

[Patanawet]

Makes you wonder about the veracity of the DNA samples the RTP are basing their Erawan identifications on!

[IamNoone88]

Well done Dr Porntip. She is best in class in forensics and the police should fear her professionalism as shown in many cases.

[bangkokrick]

They should put the Island on lock down as of now and DNA test all the males within the demographic.This news will surely make some people run. I remember that this tactic worked many years in the UK and they got their man.

[BritTim]

I just stated the obvious, this is not positive proof of the innocence of the two Burmese; clutching at straws is, IMO, declaring that the case is over based on DNA results from a source that has been known to be contaminated since day one.

Once again, the case was not built upon a DNA match between the hoe and the defendants.

To be fair, this is all true. The Burmese could have smashed Hannah's head in with their bare hands. Also, the prosecution evidence is based on confessions extracted by torture and DNA from semen samples that were all used up. Other evidence was simply ignored.

You are correct that this does not prove the Burmese kids are innocent. It also does not prove that you or the prime minister are innocent. It does raise real doubts about whether the correct people are on trial.

[nikmar]

The repercussions of this are enormous given the the alleged Erawan bombers have just been arrested and charged.

The repercussions are enormous also because the General has thrown his weight behind this 100%

"The perfect case."

[007cableguy]

So they should walk I would guess

Why should they? If the prosecution was using a DNA match between the two defendants and the murder weapon yes they should. But that's not what they are basing their case on, the DNA results could be from any other person that handled the hoe before or after the murders.

One set of DNA is almost certainly from the beach cleaner/gardener. It is highly probable that the other is from the assailant who smashed Hannah's head in. It is clutching at straws to suggest otherwise.

At any rate, it appears the "perfect investigation" using a magnifying glass to check for DNA, was not quite as effective as real forensic analysis.

I just stated the obvious, this is not positive proof of the innocence of the two Burmese; clutching at straws is, IMO, declaring that the case is over based on DNA results from a source that has been known to be contaminated since day one.

Once again, the case was not built upon a DNA match between the hoe and the defendants.

So really what your saying is that this new information doesn't effect the RTP 100% perfect job?.....and the conviction of the 2 Burmese guys is still on track?

[thailandchilli]

I just stated the obvious, this is not positive proof of the innocence of the two Burmese; clutching at straws is, IMO, declaring that the case is over based on DNA results from a source that has been known to be contaminated since day one.

Once again, the case was not built upon a DNA match between the hoe and the defendants.

Thanks for stating the obvious.

I'll also state the obvious, this seriously calls into question the whole re enactment, confessions and the whole case against the B2 as presented by the Prosecution, perhaps the blonde hair found in Hannah's hand would also prove to be a match with one of the DNA samples on the hoe. Unfortunately nobody knows where they set aside this hair sample........mmmmmm

The current case against them is seriously flawed, yes the case should be over now and a REAL investigation carried out!! The only person clutching at straws is now you

[StealthEnergiser]

http://news.sky.com/story/1550571/thai-murders-dna-does-not-match-defendants

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/11/dna-weapon-not-match-men-accused-killing-british-tourists-thailand?CMP=share_btn_tw

Disgraceful

from that article

The DNA analysis was ordered by the defence after police failed to carry out their own tests after the murders.

They also treated the murder scene haphazardly, Porntip Rojanasunand told the trial on the island of Koh Samui.

Blood was not DNA tested for instance, at least one of the bodies was moved - potentially destroying evidence, and not enough photos were taken.

[balo]

So they should walk I would guess

Why should they? If the prosecution was using a DNA match between the two defendants and the murder weapon yes they should. But that's not what they are basing their case on, the DNA results could be from any other person that handled the hoe before or after the murders.

We have now confirmed that the DNA from the hoe did not belong to the B2. Yes maybe they should walk and that would be the end of the story but still they could be involved in some way, they are still a part of this mystery.

And please stay on topic this time , before you consider attacking "RTP defenders".

[StealthEnergiser]

Follow

Andy Hall‏@Atomicalandy

Andy Hall retweeted Mark Farmaner

Mark Farmaner @burmacampaignuk keeps alive important issue adequacy of UK gov response to Koh Tao case @KentBKK

Andy Hall added,

Mark Farmaner @MarkFarmaner

Koh Toa case, torture used for confessions and now new DNA evidence. How much of this did UK gov know and keep silent on?

Follow

Andy Hall‏@Atomicalandy

Today during defense lawyers Koh Samui prison visit Zaw Lin wore 'I need freedom' t-shirt and Wai Phyo doves of peace

[partington]

So they should walk I would guess

Why should they? If the prosecution was using a DNA match between the two defendants and the murder weapon yes they should. But that's not what they are basing their case on, the DNA results could be from any other person that handled the hoe before or after the murders.

One set of DNA is almost certainly from the beach cleaner/gardener. It is highly probable that the other is from the assailant who smashed Hannah's head in. It is clutching at straws to suggest otherwise.

At any rate, it appears the "perfect investigation" using a magnifying glass to check for DNA, was not quite as effective as real forensic analysis.

I just stated the obvious, this is not positive proof of the innocence of the two Burmese; clutching at straws is, IMO, declaring that the case is over based on DNA results from a source that has been known to be contaminated since day one.

Once again, the case was not built upon a DNA match between the hoe and the defendants.

This is just common sense.

I hope I have a neutral point of view about this case, but clearly if the police testified that they never looked for DNA on the hoe, then saying the suspects' DNA was on the hoe can never have been part of the prosecution's case. This is just simple fact.

That the suspect's DNA was not found on the hoe is a very telling suggestion that the police's reconstruction of what happened may be wrong, and the fact that they didn't look for DNA on the hoe suggests deep problems and probable bias in the investigation.

Nevertheless as a matter of fact it would be possible for an object to be handled by an individual, then handled by several other individuals and the traces of DNA from the first to be undetectable or swamped out by the contaminating DNA, so while this is yet another piece of circumstantial evidence that completely fails to support the police's version of events it does not destroy the case.

DNA from the rape kit samples not matching the suspects destroys the police case beyond reasonable doubt.

I admit to being very wrong about Pornthip - I was convinced she would subtly undermine the defence to facilitate the establishment's desire to end the case with a conviction of the suspects. Good for her that she seems not to be doing this.

[Briggsy]

No wonder the police had to come up with the "used up" lie.

If the hoe doesn't match the B2, imagine what the rape kit samples might show or who they might point to and a ton of other bloodied evidence that has been destroyed.

[oldsailor35]

https://twitter.com/pakhead/status/642202002634743808

Then they need to retest all DNA which was taken against what they have , also demand DNA from anyone who refused the earlier test.

[NickJ]

They should update the board game Clue or perhaps come out with a Ko Tao version.

[darren84310]

https://twitter.com/pakhead/status/642202002634743808

Now, run, run, run for your life, Dr. Porthip,... the mafia is gonna witch hunt you now....

She has done this many times before so I doubt she's easily scared. The RTP already hate her and have done so for many years for exposing their incompetence.

And as for those that said she wouldn't reveal the truth because she's on the side of the Pro Monarchy Yellows/Coup Makers and against the Reds, well what have you to say now?

My knowledge of Dr. Porntip is that she is a shining light amidst a dark world here.

[26vinny]

RTP says dna match we say no it doesn`t, who`s lying,m we know that answer don`t we RTP , it matters little anyway, thai justice is who pays the jugdes the most $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$, not justice like the real world

[menzies233]

I cannot see what all the fuss is about!

What difference does it make that there is no DNA match to the defendants? I mean this is the RTP here after all, evidence is just an inconvenience for them. The two lads are "obviously" guilty as they provided a full confession, and of course did a re-enactment video complete with finger pointing, what more does the RTP need? They already have all this on, it is a watertight case!​​

[StealthEnergiser]

Crime scene blunder stopped murder weapon DNA test

Another Burmese migrant worker, known as O, who worked at a local resort, told the second day of the murder trial, which is being held on the nearby island of Koh Samui, that he was first to stumble across the bodies. He said he owned the heavy hoe that police say was used to kill the Britons, and had taken it away from the scene.

“I saw my hoe [near the slain holidaymakers] and took it back to my vegetable garden,” he told the court.

The defence questioned how he had failed to notice blood on the hoe but he said it had been too dark.

Police eventually found the tool hidden by rubbish bags in the garden of the resort where he worked.

http://www.thetimes....icle4493211.ece

[swifty5x5]

Is it just me, or is this somewhat confusing?

The DNA on the hoe would most likely be the victims,no?

The article seems to insinuate there is unknown DNA on it,

yet it doesnt go as far as to say the DNA doesnt belong to the victims either.

It also doesnt state that the DNA was sourced from blood or otherwise

Logic would have it, if the DNA wasnt blood based, it could be DNA from the gardener or anyone that used the hoe for gardening or whatever innocent purpose.

But surely they would already have taken the DNA of the gardener to exclude from the evidence pool?

You can get DNA off of sweat from palms nowadays.

[Jonathan Fairfield]

DNA on weapon does not match men accused of killing British tourists in Thailand

Oliver Holmes in Bangkok

KOH SAMUI:-- Forensic expert says DNA found on bloodied garden hoe does not belong to two men standing trial for deaths of Hannah Witheridge and David Miller

DNA samples taken from a garden hoe believed to have been used in the murder of British tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller in Thailand last year does not belong to the two men who are standing trial, a top Thai forensic expert has told the court.

The revelation is the latest in a string of inconsistencies in the police investigation into the brutal killings. During a three-month trial, police have been accused of improperly collecting evidence at the crime scene, intimidation and abuse of witnesses.

Thai police deny any wrongdoing.

The head of the Thai forensics institute, Porntip Rojanasunand, told judges on the island of Koh Samui that her team had identified DNA on a garden hoe, found bloodied near the deceased on a beach on Koh Tao island in September last year. The samples belonged to two males but there was no match with the defendants, she said.

Read more: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/11/dna-weapon-not-match-men-accused-killing-british-tourists-thailand

-- The Guardian 2015-09-11