German couple killed on motorcycle at Cha-Am U-turn

[manarak]

16 hours ago, balo said:

I also watched the video , they are both to blame.

 

The German rider must have been thinking he was back in Germany and just turned into the road slowly trying to cross it without even look for cars behind him.  The Thai driver was probably speeding around 100-110 km/h , still he had time to spot the motorbike and just hit the brakes a couple of seconds before they hit them, but in Thailand this happens quite often .

It's always the responsibility of the rider of the motobike to look for speeding cars and trucks . 

I'm not sure if the outcome would have been different if the car was driving at 90 Kph instead of 110.

[wakeupplease]

Teach them how to use it?  Good luck with that.

 

just a few more bits and you are spot on with your comment  Fookhaht

 

teach them manners, respect to giveway how to read (Signs) what a brake pedal is for, BIB to do some traffic work This could go on all day so lets leave it there

 

[Flustered]

 

Put it down to inexperience, sad but true.

 

When someone is being taught to ride a motorbike in the UK, there is one golden rule that is driven into everyones tiny brain. It's called the "Life Saver". Automatic fail on the Advanced Drivers (IAMS) test if not carried out.

http://begin-motorcycling.co.uk/the-5-elements-of-cbt/element-c/indicating-observation-osmpsl/

 

It is taught at the very beginning of motorcycle training on the Compulsory Basic Training course (CBT) and is the foundation of the course. I know he was German but probably very inexperienced, much like that Australian lady who was badly hurt.
 

If only people would take their brains on holiday with them it would save a lot of lives.

 

[piersbeckett]

On 15/02/2017 at 10:24 AM, 01322521959 said:

Why not get rid of these u turns. Put something called roundabouts in and teach the Thais how to use them! Christ! Why don't the authorities look at my home country, the UK. You don't have all these dangerous u turns all over the place.


Sent from my i-mobile_i-STYLE_219 using Thaivisa Connect mobile app
 

I think in general, the road lay-out is modeled on the N. American system and the idea that the 'through' traffic must always have priority.  Lots of roundabouts and traffic lights just slow things down but they (the Thais) forgot that Thailand is only a small country and millions of people in it travel by motorbike, innit!

[Flustered]

2 hours ago, piersbeckett said:

I think in general, the road lay-out is modeled on the N. American system and the idea that the 'through' traffic must always have priority.  Lots of roundabouts and traffic lights just slow things down but they (the Thais) forgot that Thailand is only a small country and millions of people in it travel by motorbike, innit!

You do of course mean European and not N.American.

 

America has had very little influence in the development of Thailand pre Vietnam War days.

 

Driving on the left and priority to through traffic was always the rule until Napolean (who was left handed) changed the French and Henry Ford got confused and put the steering wheel on the left.

 

Historically, People rode horses on the left as their sword hand was the right one and the right eye was stronger.

 

In this case, Left is right so to speak......555

[smotherb]

On 2/15/2017 at 10:24 AM, 01322521959 said:

Why not get rid of these u turns. Put something called roundabouts in and teach the Thais how to use them! Christ! Why don't the authorities look at my home country, the UK. You don't have all these dangerous u turns all over the place.


Sent from my i-mobile_i-STYLE_219 using Thaivisa Connect mobile app
 

Hatyai has recently constructed roundabouts at several busy intersections. I sat for several minutes in the circle on my Harley pointing to the sign that said in both Thai and English, "Yield right-of-way to vehicles in the circle."  Perhaps no one could read, no one cared to do so, no one knew what "yeild" meant, no one knew what "right-of-way" meant, or all of the above. However, I'll wager no one wanted to wait for anyone else.

[Flustered]

1 minute ago, smotherb said:

Hatyai has recently constructed roundabouts at several busy intersections. I sat for several minutes in the circle on my Harley pointing to the sign that said in both Thai and English, "Yield right-of-way to vehicles in the circle."  Perhaps no one could read, no one cared to do so, no one knew what "yeild" meant, no one knew what "right-of-way" meant, or all of the above. However, I'll wager no one wanted to wait for anyone else.

I was taught by my "sister" many years ago that in Thailand, "Might has Right" on the roads.

 

Never a truer word spoken especially with these cement rucks that crush everyone.

[FitnessHealthTravel]

On 16/02/2017 at 9:33 AM, xerostar said:

Is it possible that the German guy had a lapse in concentration, thinking he was back in Germany ?

He may have been Looking right to see if there was any traffic coming and seeing nothing pulls out in front of the Honda coming from his left.

I did this sort of mistake when changing from UK driving on the left side to driving in France on the right side (first day ever in France).

I was able to avoid a head on collision by driving onto the median strip. I took more care after that scare!

So true. I watched a women get run over by a Taxi in KL outside the twin towers. She walked out looked the wrong way and walked into the path of the taxi. It was shocking to see.

[smotherb]

4 hours ago, Flustered said:

I was taught by my "sister" many years ago that in Thailand, "Might has Right" on the roads.

 

Never a truer word spoken especially with these cement rucks that crush everyone.

Yes, you learn early when riding a bike; in fact, I learned 50 years ago in Vietnam. However, you apparently missed my point; no one stopped, not even the scooters. The Thais seem to have no concept of traffic circles.

[Flustered]

47 minutes ago, smotherb said:

Yes, you learn early when riding a bike; in fact, I learned 50 years ago in Vietnam. However, you apparently missed my point; no one stopped, not even the scooters. The Thais seem to have no concept of traffic circles.

Don't worry, I got it. I have been riding/driving in Thailand on and off for over 35 years. I have seen Phuket change from a sensible town into a nightmare. It reminds me of Washington DC where they have a few roundabouts. Even now, the Americans cannot get their brains around the concept of a roundabout. If it wasn't so dangerous it would be funny.

[chocdee120]

I can't understand why they can't make more U turn gaps stopping both directions U turning in the same slot. It's a nightmare trying to U turn and not been able to see the oncoming traffic.

[Los Luver]

Quote

He said that the motorcycle came into the path of his car and he was unable to brake in time.

That's how tooooo many people lost their lives !!!  this is exactly what the autorities MUST fight !!!   to teach people how to break. the only thing they all know is how to speed !!!!

[metisdead]

Some insulting troll posts have been removed. 

[RocketDog]

On 02/14/2017 at 4:06 PM, colinneil said:

What a tragic loss r.i.p.

It is not how you drive here, that is the problem, it is how others drive.

Ok show police your dashcam video, but 1 think it dosent show is how fast you were going at the time.

Wrong. How you drive here is to expect all other drivers to be trying to kill you and act accordingly. Every minute I'm on my motorbike I recite my driving mantra. "eyes on the road, eyes on the traffic"

Thiking of anything else is too dangerous.

[Flustered]

Or as is driven home to everyone who takes motorbike lessons in the UK,,,LIFESAVER

 

• take a 'lifesaver' glance over your shoulder before carrying out manoeuvres, so you know where others are and what they’re doing

[YetAnother]

recent road-widening in our area introduced new UTurns; the road is much less safe now with Uturns backing up and people scrambling to avoid the UTurns; the locals are the losers, the non-local people going thru are the winners

[gmac]

19 minutes ago, YetAnother said:

recent road-widening in our area introduced new UTurns; the road is much less safe now with Uturns backing up and people scrambling to avoid the UTurns; the locals are the losers, the non-local people going thru are the winners

Seems like normal procedure all over Thailand.  Make the roads wider to help the non-locals stuff the residents.  On a 4 km stretch of road passing my house a 1km trip to make a u-turn instead of turning right as I used to and if I go out to the left, to get back home I now have to drive 0.75km past my house and sit in a queue of homeward bound Bangkokians at a traffic light before making a u-turn at the lights to get back.  Local Thais drive quite long distances on the wrong side of the road (cars, bikes, pick-ups even vans and trucks on occasion) to avoid these onerous turns.

[MaxYakov]

On 2/15/2017 at 4:40 AM, Raymonddiaz said:

Very sad.RIP. This happens daily in LOS. How to stop the slaughtering?

Easy! Take away the motorbikes*. Obviously the minimal protection they provide makes them unsuitable for road use. The statistics I saw yesterday indicate that >70% of the road deaths are due to motor bike accidents.

 

* = Yes, I know easier stated than done and it's not going to happen! Oh well, usually it's the careless and the unfit that get "taken away", permanently.

[Laab Muu]

On ‎15‎/‎02‎/‎2017 at 0:06 AM, colinneil said:

Ok show police your dashcam video, but 1 think it dosent show is how fast you were going at the time.

Most dash cams with GPS logging will record footage with GPS data included and speed and coordinates are logged to each video file.

[jimster]

On 2/15/2017 at 4:55 AM, Carib said:

Getting rid of U-turns would help.

 

 

Absolutely. No other country in the world uses u-turns as liberally as Thailand. Not Malaysia, not Cambodia (which has very few multi-lane roads anyway), not Vietnam, not China. U-turns on highways, except in very rural areas should be eliminated. All multi-lane roads where there is a need for a u-turn should have them converted into u-turn bridges or underpasses. Expressways separating local and long-distance traffic should be built urgently. In Bangkok, they really need to link sois with each other, bypassing the need to enter or re-enter congested main roads.

 

If I was a roads minister in the Thai government I'd be embarrassed that a poorer country like Vietnam is about to have more km of expressway than Thailand, which, aside from Bangkok currently only has 120km of expressway extending from Bangkok to Pattaya and a 62km stretch from Bang Na to Bang Pa-in.

 

A 100+km section of expressway near Danang opened recently and the Vietnamese government reportedly expects to have an expressway covering the entire 1700km stretch between Hanoi and Ho Chi Minh completed by around 2020, along with the existing highway being entirely converted to 4-lanes, which is already 70-80% done and all within just a couple of years....amazing. There are even plans to build an expressway in Laos from Pakse to Vientiane and from Vientiane to Hanoi. Will they be completed before Thailand's third, long overdue expressway from Bang Pa-in to Nakorn Ratchasima will be completed? I wouldn't be surprised.

 

Meanwhile until the 20-year overdue Thai expressway masterplan, which envisions expressways linking the Malaysian, Burmese, Cambodian and Lao borders with Bangkok is completed, thousands of lives will needlessly end due to collisions at u-turn bays. The vast majority of accidents will involve motorcycles (80-90%) as will injuries and fatalities. Many of these will be locals who have the misfortune of living next to major highways such as the one described in this story. In tourist areas, tourists are also at risk.

[jackdd]

I'm always wondering the behaviour of Thais at U-turns. They nearly always try to merge in the outer most lane after a U-turn and thus having to cross all lanes.

As in the picture attached instead of going for the middle lane (being the car) and thus at least keeping one lane free, they go for the outer most lane. And especially i never understand the motorbikes. I'm in the situation as on the picture every day. The car is "shielding" the inner lane from any cars, but the motorbikes are waiting until they can somehow find a spot, often risky, to go across all 3 lanes. I just try to find a way in between the motorbikes waiting there and just turn around in the shadow of the car sticking to the inner lane where i'm sure nobody will go because the car is blocking the lane.

[masuk]

On 15/02/2017 at 5:25 AM, jerojero said:

U turns dangerous. Motorbikes high risk vehicles. Old guys driving, higher risk. Us oldies need to realize our aging limitations in motor skills, hearing, eyesight and driving skills! RIP to the couple.

 

I really think that U turns should be controlled at traffic lights.  It seems slightly odd to me to have a set of lights 150 metres away, yet a U turn before you get there.  

Highways in most countries have these, why not here?

[Get Real]

On 2017-02-15 at 1:06 AM, colinneil said:

What a tragic loss r.i.p.

It is not how you drive here, that is the problem, it is how others drive.

Ok show police your dashcam video, but 1 think it dosent show is how fast you were going at the time.

Yes it do show the speed. If you calculate one point and how long time it takes to reach another point. After that calculate the length between the 2 points you will easily be able to obatain your answer.

[MaxYakov]

On 10/6/2017 at 9:28 PM, jackdd said:

I'm always wondering the behaviour of Thais at U-turns. They nearly always try to merge in the outer most lane after a U-turn and thus having to cross all lanes.

As in the picture attached instead of going for the middle lane (being the car) and thus at least keeping one lane free, they go for the outer most lane. And especially i never understand the motorbikes. I'm in the situation as on the picture every day. The car is "shielding" the inner lane from any cars, but the motorbikes are waiting until they can somehow find a spot, often risky, to go across all 3 lanes. I just try to find a way in between the motorbikes waiting there and just turn around in the shadow of the car sticking to the inner lane where i'm sure nobody will go because the car is blocking the lane.

A lot of Thai MV operators are not good tactical/defensive thinkers (albeit, I haven't noticed this "outside lane" tendency on U-turns). This may be because they have a destination that is near the U-turn and want to go to the curb lane immediately during the U-turn rather than cut across lanes of traffic while moving and/or even be forced to proceed past their destination by left-side traffic (if they had U-turned into to the inside lane)?

 

I ride a bicycle and carefully use "vehicle shielding" as a defensive cycling ploy, but you won't find me navigating a potentially dangerous U-turn with MVs because It would probably require my being in the inside lane with potentially fast-moving cars.

 

However, with "vehicle shielding", one does not want to be caught in a "discover check situation" or near a "shield vehicle" that could itself be hit  and pushed into you. These unlikely scenarios could result in "checkmate, game over".

 

I'd go down to the nearest light and either make two right turns (or a U-turn) there or use the pedestrian crosswalks to effectively make my U-turn.

 

PS: Good observation and description, BTW. 

[gintis0604]

On 2/15/2017 at 4:55 AM, Carib said:

Getting rid of U-turns would help.

 

Yes. Teach the Thais to use roundabouts and close all U-turns.