Phuket as a full-time home

[LivinginKata]

2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

I was told the increase was a few thousand a month. Third hand information though.

 

Hard to believe only a 'few thousand'. They could pay that sort of increase.

[NamKangMan]

35 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

 

Depends on how much of a rent increase was asked ?  This was an incredible successful restaurant for as long as I can remember, packed high and low season, people actually queued waiting for a table to come free, yet there were plenty other good eateries a stones throw away. Personally I did not rate the food style the one time I ate there about 15 years ago, not so cheap,  Never went back. Looked like a simple  single level Thai house set back from the road and  a canopy had been erected with open sides to accommodate the tables.

 

I suspected they had a very long lease and the owner wanted them to knock down the house and erect a multi floor large business complex, So when the lease was renegotiated there would be a huge increase.That's just my own speculation.

 

I accept what you say as being possible. 

 

It will be interesting if the land is developed by the owner, or the same structure remains, with yet ANOTHER "For Sale" or "For Lease" sign on it. 

[NamKangMan]

5 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

 

Hard to believe only a 'few thousand'. They could pay that sort of increase.

 

Only they know their margins.

 

Maybe the rent was already really high, and this increase would have made the business not viable. 

[LivinginKata]

9 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

Only they know their margins.

 

Maybe the rent was already really high, and this increase would have made the business not viable. 

 

Doubt it. From what I have observed the house was likely rented at a 'house' price over 20 years ago. I wonder if they had a 30 years lease ?. Turned it into a very successful business. Owner was pissed and asked them to pay commercial rates. Just.  my guess.

 

There are very few empty buildings or for rent signs  along that stretch of Karon. Tania road in Kata is a completely different story. 20 years ago was buzzing, now half the shops are shuttered.

[stevenl]

NKM, do you know the restaurant, old or new location?

[NamKangMan]

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

NKM, do you know the restaurant, old or new location?

 

Have rode past many times, never been for a meal. 

[KarenBravo]

8 hours ago, LivinginKata said:

There are very few empty buildings or for rent signs  along that stretch of Karon. Tania road in Kata is a completely different story. 20 years ago was buzzing, now half the shops are shuttered.

And yet, Taina road is the only location in Kata / Karon that is designated an entertainment zone.........as is Soi Bangla in Patong.

Just sayin'....

[Old Croc]

Tania Road.

My lady recently closed her last massage shop in Patong (Nanai) and opened one in Tania Road.

(Before the usual F W trolls start with their 20 questions or hilarious "boiled frog" rubbish, I will point out that her "hobby" shops cost me much more than any revenue they make. They keep her happy and provide people from her village with work and accommodation)

I am happier because this place is much closer to where we live, the rent is half she was paying in Patong,  there was no key money involved with the new place, and a lot of the furniture and equipment that was clogging up the house have been moved there. (I was about to hire storage elsewhere for all this junk).

 

A few interesting, current facts about Tania road.

There is a new resort hotel under construction, opposite Dr Chusaks clinic. This will bring more tourists to the area and may be partly responsible for a few of the new startups in the street. Since she started there others have followed. Things are moving.

There were plans to demolish many buildings on the north side to expand the road and make a footpath. The usual Thai holdouts may have scuttled this plan. 

Alternatively there are plans to make the road one way (I don't know which direction) and open up the north side with food/market type places.

It seems some want to breathe life back into that road.

I don't expect my Lady's business to suddenly get in the black, but will see what the next high season brings.

 

 

[Scott]

An unhelpful post has been reported and removed.   Please keep this rule in mind when posting:

 

7) You will respect fellow members and post in a civil manner. No personal attacks, hateful or insulting towards other members, (flaming) Stalking of members on either the forum or via PM will not be allowed.

[gk10002000]

I happen to greatly enjoy swimming in the ocean. On my two trips to Phuket, Karon beach was pretty good. Patong too crowded and some pollution may be getting out of hand.  But I would think there are some other beaches like Kamala for example that might be good.  I can appreciate Isaan and the country, but I would not want to be landlocked for the whole year. 

[xylophone]

44 minutes ago, Old Croc said:

Tania Road.

My lady recently closed her last massage shop in Patong (Nanai) and opened one in Tania Road.

(Before the usual F W trolls start with their 20 questions or hilarious "boiled frog" rubbish, I will point out that her "hobby" shops cost me much more than any revenue they make. They keep her happy and provide people from her village with work and accommodation)

I am happier because this place is much closer to where we live, the rent is half she was paying in Patong,  there was no key money involved with the new place, and a lot of the furniture and equipment that was clogging up the house have been moved there. (I was about to hire storage elsewhere for all this junk).

 

A few interesting, current facts about Tania road.

There is a new resort hotel under construction, opposite Dr Chusaks clinic. This will bring more tourists to the area and may be partly responsible for a few of the new startups in the street. Since she started there others have followed. Things are moving.

There were plans to demolish many buildings on the north side to expand the road and make a footpath. The usual Thai holdouts may have scuttled this plan. 

Alternatively there are plans to make the road one way (I don't know which direction) and open up the north side with food/market type places.

It seems some want to breathe life back into that road.

I don't expect my Lady's business to suddenly get in the black, but will see what the next high season brings.

 

 

I must have another scout around Kata because the few times I have been there I have liked the place and the feel of it.

 

I am not familiar with the road names etc, so I think I will pay a visit over the next week or so just to familiarise myself with the place as I always like to keep up with areas which are changing, and if they are changing for the better, then better still!

[madmax2]

All speculating, and the most accurate speculation was from LIK who is a long term property owner in Kata/Karon and knows how property values and rents have increased over the last 20 years

Good for him gets really good capitol gains and lives rent free in his own business premises at the same time 

Only way to go anywhere in the world as people who invest in property know, renting is for mugs with no money to invest here, although in the current overpriced property market you are better of renting until properties drop to their true value, which has to happen soon if the owners really want to sell property here 

[perthperson]

3 minutes ago, madmax2 said:

All speculating, and the most accurate speculation was from LIK who is a long term property owner in Kata/Karon and knows how property values and rents have increased over the last 20 years

Good for him gets really good capitol gains and lives rent free in his own business premises at the same time 

Only way to go anywhere in the world as people who invest in property know, renting is for mugs with no money to invest here, although in the current overpriced property market you are better of renting until properties drop to their true value, which has to happen soon if the owners really want to sell property here 

 

There is a house near mine that has been on sale now for over four years. The owner periodically adjusts the price upwards to reflect what she believes to be its true value! 

[NamKangMan]

1 hour ago, Old Croc said:

Tania Road.

My lady recently closed her last massage shop in Patong (Nanai) and opened one in Tania Road.

(Before the usual F W trolls start with their 20 questions or hilarious "boiled frog" rubbish, I will point out that her "hobby" shops cost me much more than any revenue they make. They keep her happy and provide people from her village with work and accommodation)

I am happier because this place is much closer to where we live, the rent is half she was paying in Patong,  there was no key money involved with the new place, and a lot of the furniture and equipment that was clogging up the house have been moved there. (I was about to hire storage elsewhere for all this junk).

 

A few interesting, current facts about Tania road.

There is a new resort hotel under construction, opposite Dr Chusaks clinic. This will bring more tourists to the area and may be partly responsible for a few of the new startups in the street. Since she started there others have followed. Things are moving.

There were plans to demolish many buildings on the north side to expand the road and make a footpath. The usual Thai holdouts may have scuttled this plan. 

Alternatively there are plans to make the road one way (I don't know which direction) and open up the north side with food/market type places.

It seems some want to breathe life back into that road.

I don't expect my Lady's business to suddenly get in the black, but will see what the next high season brings.

 

 

 

It was my reply that was deleted. 

 

Not sure why, because I actually commended you on your honesty.

 

Anyway, I'll rephrase the question.

 

Do you think "hobby shops" are good examples as to what really is going on with businesses on Phuket?

 

 

**** To the mods, this is a serious question in the context of discussing the Phuket economy. ****

[NamKangMan]

26 minutes ago, madmax2 said:

All speculating, and the most accurate speculation was from LIK who is a long term property owner in Kata/Karon and knows how property values and rents have increased over the last 20 years

Good for him gets really good capitol gains and lives rent free in his own business premises at the same time 

Only way to go anywhere in the world as people who invest in property know, renting is for mugs with no money to invest here, although in the current overpriced property market you are better of renting until properties drop to their true value, which has to happen soon if the owners really want to sell property here 

 

"Good for him gets really good capitol gains" - "until properties drop to their true value" - so, what does this do for his "capital gain?"

 

"renting is for mugs with no money to invest here" - or renting is for people who have invested elsewhere.  Who says just because you live in Thailand, you have to invest in Thailand????  I have properties in three different countries, on three different continents, but not in Thailand. 

 

"although in the current overpriced property market you are better of renting" - but "renting is for mugs" isn't it????  

 

"which has to happen soon if the owners really want to sell property here" - you are assuming there are buyers out there.  If there are no buyers, due to Phuket becoming an undesirable place to live / work / retire, then your property is nothing more than a pile of bricks and mortar that can't be liquidated, so it has no real value to you unless you can convert it into cash.

 

That said, LIK has been here a long time, and bought in many years ago.  Yes, if he could sell, he would make a few baht, but there's not many here that bought property so long ago, before the boom. 

 

If someone bought property here 10 years ago - what have they got to sell now, and how much would they have to sell it for, just to be able to sell it, even if they could????  Do you think they would make a "capital gain?"

[xylophone]

16 minutes ago, perthperson said:

 

There is a house near mine that has been on sale now for over four years. The owner periodically adjusts the price upwards to reflect what she believes to be its true value! 

Yes, I can believe that as I have seen it happen in my old soi, although an occasional rumour goes round that the price has dropped, but when no takers it goes up again! And these are farangs, not Thai folk (must have been here too long!).

[Old Croc]

I have a characterful dog called Blue. He's not the smartest dog in the world, but a long way from the dumbest. He has learnt enough about his world to understand a few simple facts, such where and when to defecate, and commands such as come, go, shut up, bite and similar.

It's never taken him 3 years to learn anything,  yet one poster here still dissects my posts and asks stupid off topic questions despite me ignoring his bleating's for at least 3 years.

One has to wonder.

 

[Old Croc]

Just now, xylophone said:

Yes, I can believe that as I have seen it happen in my old soi, although an occasional rumour goes round that the price has dropped, but when no takers it goes up again! And these are farangs, not Thai folk (must have been here too long!).

A neighbor of mine (not Thai) has had a for sale sign on his fence for a decade. People enquire occasionally, but don't like his inflated price.

He says if anyone wants to pay his price they can have it, but otherwise he's happy where he is. If some one was silly enough to buy he will get more land, build again and pocket a good profit.

[NamKangMan]

8 minutes ago, xylophone said:

Yes, I can believe that as I have seen it happen in my old soi, although an occasional rumour goes round that the price has dropped, but when no takers it goes up again! And these are farangs, not Thai folk (must have been here too long!).

 

A lot of these people bought in the Phuket property boom. 

 

If they were to be lucky to find a buyer these days, they would not receive anywhere near the price they paid.

 

Many of these people simply can't afford to take a substantial loss on the property, so are forced to keep it, with many also forced to remain living here until the market meets their price, which, I can't see happening. 

 

They have locked themselves in. 

 

 

[madmax2]

38 minutes ago, perthperson said:

 

There is a house near mine that has been on sale now for over four years. The owner periodically adjusts the price upwards to reflect what she believes to be its true value! 

She does not really want to sell, all property eventually goes up in value even if you buy at the end of a boom, it just takes longer before it starts to increase in value, as any true investor in real estate knows, people in the know buy at the beginning of a real estate boom, watch whats happening daily in the real estate market and sell out before the bust if they are looking for a quick profit, or just keep the property as it will always be a good investment long term

For a lot of people the only true asset they have is the house they are buying/own and they live in it

at the same time so pay no rent, and can paint it purple with pink spots if they want to without getting someone else's permission  

[perthperson]

1 minute ago, madmax2 said:

all property eventually goes up in value even if you buy at the end of a boom,

 

Have you noted the vast amount of "for sale" property on the island?  A 'boom' will be a long time coming and property prices are currently out of kilter  with reality.

[eisfeld]

11 minutes ago, madmax2 said:

... all property eventually goes up in value...

property ... will always be a good investment long term...

That's evidently and obviously wrong. There's tons and tons of property in Thailand - especially condos - that lost value and will never ever rebound back. Even if you think about inflation (which doesn't increase real value anyways) and wait for 50 years.

[NamKangMan]

7 minutes ago, madmax2 said:

She does not really want to sell, all property eventually goes up in value even if you buy at the end of a boom, it just takes longer before it starts to increase in value, as any true investor in real estate knows, people in the know buy at the beginning of a real estate boom, watch whats happening daily in the real estate market and sell out before the bust if they are looking for a quick profit, or just keep the property as it will always be a good investment long term

For a lot of people the only true asset they have is the house they are buying/own and they live in it

at the same time so pay no rent, and can paint it purple with pink spots if they want to without getting someone else's permission  

 

 

"all property eventually goes up in value even if you buy at the end of a boom" - I know what you are getting at, but what does constant oversupply do to this theory????

 

Niche market properties aside, the property market operates under market forces - supply and demand. 

 

Whilst we debate the current "demand" on Phuket, they keep building, and building, and building here.

 

With a glut of properties on the market, yet still more being built, we are probably looking at decades before property here increases in value, and by then, a lot of the current stock will be old and in need of renovation. 

[Old Croc]

10 minutes ago, perthperson said:

 

Have you noted the vast amount of "for sale" property on the island?  A 'boom' will be a long time coming and property prices are currently out of kilter  with reality.

I agree that the next price boom may be a number of years away, but it hasn't stopped a building boom in my vicinity.

Since I last wrote a lengthy post about the quantity of new houses going up nearby (and set the trolls off in a frenzy!), I've heard that another three (foreigners) houses have started building not far from me.

I have little interest in, nor knowledge of, condo projects and prices, but there is a definite increase in house construction. I think when a number of matters settle down or are finalised the Island will regenerate and real estate prices will rise.

Matters such as infrastructure (tunnels, rail) a possible casino, and the eventual (inevitable) slowdown of official and transport corruption.

Or perhaps I'm just an infernal optimist and The Pearl of the Andaman Sea will sink into oblivion.

[LivinginKata]

1 hour ago, madmax2 said:

All speculating, and the most accurate speculation was from LIK who is a long term property owner in Kata/Karon and knows how property values and rents have increased over the last 20 years

Good for him gets really good capitol gains and lives rent free in his own business premises at the same time 

Only way to go anywhere in the world as people who invest in property know, renting is for mugs with no money to invest here, although in the current overpriced property market you are better of renting until properties drop to their true value, which has to happen soon if the owners really want to sell property here 

 

All I know if that prices were on the rise for years until about 2006. That was the start of the decline We were lucky enough to just get in before prices got way too high.  This has allowed us to keep rents  reasonable and we have not been able to increase more than out prices of 19 years ago. So much for greedy landlords as bashed by some of our members.

 

Would we make a capitol gain ? No doubt that we could sell for what it cost us all those years ago, although my Thai wife would never think of that as she values at current land purchase price and building costs.  The big plus is that we have a good income all the years, indeed covered the initial cost multiple times over our 19 years in Patong. Kata land and build was expensive as just about the last 3 years of the boom in 2004/5. So we have only just about made our initial cost back, but we live rent free. We have 2 vacant land plots that we could sell at a good profit, enough people looking for sea view plots and willing to pay. 2 virgin plots sold on our street in the last year 2015/16 and now have large scale homes built or being built.

 

For me it comes down to the comfort/satisfaction of owning. I've rented a very few times in my life, hated it. I know NKM will jump in and say I don't own anything.  Not exactly true as I am married to a Thai and have some rights and I have 49% shares in the company. I have no doubt I could be diddled out of any rights, But so what - I accept that with eyes wide open.  I've squirreled away enough money outside Thailand to live well for the rest of my life and I have 2 pensions and monthly dividend income from a fund, money just goes straight back in the fund as we make enough from our business here in Phuket. 

 

 

 

[Ron19]

A post that was reported as bickering has been removed

[NamKangMan]

5 minutes ago, Old Croc said:

I agree that the next price boom may be a number of years away, but it hasn't stopped a building boom in my vicinity.

Since I last wrote a lengthy post about the quantity of new houses going up nearby (and set the trolls off in a frenzy!), I've heard that another three (foreigners) houses have started building not far from me.

I have little interest in, nor knowledge of, condo projects and prices, but there is a definite increase in house construction. I think when a number of matters settle down or are finalised the Island will regenerate and real estate prices will rise.

Matters such as infrastructure (tunnels, rail) a possible casino, and the eventual (inevitable) slowdown of official and transport corruption.

Or perhaps I'm just an infernal optimist and The Pearl of the Andaman Sea will sink into oblivion.

 

"I've heard that another three (foreigners) houses have started building not far from me." - "there is a definite increase in house construction." - so what does this mean for the current owners trying to sell their existing houses????

[LivinginKata]

1 minute ago, NamKangMan said:

 

"I've heard that another three (foreigners) houses have started building not far from me." - "there is a definite increase in house construction." - so what does this mean for the current owners trying to sell their existing houses????

 

Most often buying land and building is economic compared with buying 2nd market as owners have idea of asking a high sell price as no one want to loose money on the initial buy price, want to be seen as making a profit. Be 'seen' is key, no one want anyone to know what the actual sell price was.

 

As for building, you get to design the layout you want, can control the build and material quality. Downside - might not get you outlay back quickly if need to sell.

[Ron19]

A flame/troll post has been removed.

[NamKangMan]

22 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

 

Most often buying land and building is economic compared with buying 2nd market as owners have idea of asking a high sell price as no one want to loose money on the initial buy price, want to be seen as making a profit. Be 'seen' is key, no one want anyone to know what the actual sell price was.

 

As for building, you get to design the layout you want, can control the build and material quality. Downside - might not get you outlay back quickly if need to sell.

 

I agree, LIK.

 

So, hypothetically, would than mean ALL the available land on Phuket to build on, would have to be actually built on, before the property market on Phuket stabilizes? 

 

In other words, basically, the massive oversupply finally ceases, thus allowing true supply and demand market forces to influence the property market here.

 

Yes, sounds ridiculous, but would that be what it would take, because currently they are not allowing development in "stages" to offer confidence to investors, or owner occupiers.  Currently, it's just build, build, build and it's driving the market down, or leaving people with properties that can not be sold, and we are looking at an oversupply here to last decades.