Swede busted for selling chewing tobacco without work permit

[craigt3365]

19 minutes ago, khunpa said:

 

Because the informer is in trouble himself and now the Swedish guy can rat  someone else out  :-)

 

A story like this is a good example of why I would never do business here and why I never hang out with other Farangs here.

The informer, as mentioned above, was probably a police volunteer.  They are used like this on a regular basis. 

 

The law is pretty clear.  You can't work here without a permit.  Do so at your own risk.  Not sure why you guys are so upset.  He can get a work permit and then he's legal.

 

Also, they are cracking down on stuff being sold via social media.  They've caught people selling guns, drugs, endangered species, girls, etc.  This guy might have gotten caught by those looking for offenders like this.  And he is an offender.

[Gandtee]

Farang police informer! Another cunning stunt.

[Regyai]

I think the golden rule is dont conduct questionable business with farangs...the incidence of lowlife grasses is just far too high

Edited November 17, 2017 by Regyai
Typo

[gk10002000]

To me, this seems like good warning to those people that work online, play poker online, write travel blogs for months on end on line.  The Thai laws about working in Thailand can be interpreted by the Thai authorities in ways you may not like. 

[Lupatria]

57 minutes ago, Time Traveller said:

If you are doing it for a profit, then yes. If you're just clearing out unwanted stuff from your garage, then no.

They are probably working on that and bust you for selling 4 family members bicycles over an expat forum.

[impulse]

38 minutes ago, stanleycoin said:

One of our own,  doing this sort of thing to the guy.

shameful. how low can you go. there is real nasty crime in this town

and on the roads.  but you help the Bib do this.

I wish you a bucketful,    of Bad karma, who ever you were. 

 

Without any background on the guy, it's hard to pass that kind of judgment. 

 

Could just be a guy selling tobacco.  (In which case, I'd agree with you)  Or he could be under suspicion of any number of other things, and a WP violation was the easiest way to get him off the streets. 

 

If I see one of my foreign neighbors selling tobacco, I won't bat an eyelash.   If I suspect one of fiddling with the local kids, I'll grass him up on whatever the BIB ask me to... The WP violation is a lot easier and more certain than a he-said, she-said contest in court.

 

[bkkcanuck8]

50 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

Why would any foreigner get involved in an undercover sting operation to set-up a guy over a relatively minor offence? There are reportedly foreigners engaging in boiler room and property fraud in Thailand who are noted "pillars of the community" ... I wonder why they are never targeted?

Shipping "sin" tax items across borders without proper shipping/customs manifests is not taken lightly.... and since they likely could not arrest him directly, they co-operated with Thai police to nab him.  (my guess)

[khunpa]

15 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

The informer, as mentioned above, was probably a police volunteer.  They are used like this on a regular basis. 

 

The law is pretty clear.  You can't work here without a permit.  Do so at your own risk.  Not sure why you guys are so upset.  He can get a work permit and then he's legal.

 

Also, they are cracking down on stuff being sold via social media.  They've caught people selling guns, drugs, endangered species, girls, etc.  This guy might have gotten caught by those looking for offenders like this.  And he is an offender.

Yes, Thailand is a prime example, when it comes to justice and law-enforcement. And good they got this guy. Up next... the Red Bull guy!

Edited November 17, 2017 by khunpa

[bkkcanuck8]

He will likely be fined and then deported to face more serious offences in another country over smuggling through the post.

[NextStationBangkok]

I know there are lot of freelancers, selling Thai products on eBay.

 

Is it a crime ?

[AlexRich]

15 minutes ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

Shipping "sin" tax items across borders without proper shipping/customs manifests is not taken lightly.... and since they likely could not arrest him directly, they co-operated with Thai police to nab him.  (my guess)

Yet wide scale fraud were people are losing millions is taken lightly? Is it because some people are making money from it? I've no problem with the law being upheld as long as it is upheld and applied to every crime.

[wvavin]

I bought many stuffs from China online store but do they need to have work permit to do trading with buyers in Thailand?

[SymS]

Interested in what will happen to him now? Fine? Jail time? Deportation?

[Naamblar2014]

1 hour ago, spermwhale said:

Even stranger... why would a foreigner target this guy and go to the police to set up a sting with them? 

Thai love Thai

 

Foreigners don't love foreigners

 

Thais have that going for them.

Foreign snitches should be ashamed

[seancbk]

1 hour ago, RichardColeman said:

Oh well, there goes that cunning plan to get round the tabacco fag ban on the beaches !

You can use chewing tobacco on the beach, just not sell it openly.   Although if you do use it, please spit in a cup and not onto the sand!

 

[craigt3365]

18 minutes ago, NextStationBangkok said:

I know there are lot of freelancers, selling Thai products on eBay.

 

Is it a crime ?

Yes.

9 minutes ago, Naamblar2014 said:

Thai love Thai

 

Foreigners don't love foreigners

 

Thais have that going for them.

Foreign snitches should be ashamed

You don't know much about Thais.  They snitch on each other all the time...especially when there's a bit of money involved.

[Briggsy]

2 hours ago, dictater said:

How in this instance is he denying a Thai person work/income or profit? I know that is not the regulations on which the work permit is given but it is the basis on which the labor law was created. 

There are multiple offences here but the cops have just gone with the easiest option.

Chewing tobacco is banned in Thailand.

The tobacco was smuggled.

No income tax was being paid.

No excise duty was being paid.

[impulse]

51 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

To me, this seems like good warning to those people that work online, play poker online, write travel blogs for months on end on line.  The Thai laws about working in Thailand can be interpreted by the Thai authorities in ways you may not like. 

 

 I don't think it was the online component that got the guy in trouble, though it does apparently violate WP laws.  I suspect the guy would have been fine if he hadn't actually delivered the goodies in Thailand (and in person, to boot). 

 

I struggle to see where travel blogging, online poker or shipping Thai made EBay goods overseas from Thailand would even ping the radar.  While technically illegal, the odds of getting caught are minuscule, and may be worth the risk for someone who can't afford to stay in Thailand without funding it somehow.  If they have to leave anyway due to no money, there's not much downside to making some YouTube money...

 

Edited November 17, 2017 by impulse

[hansnl]

1 hour ago, spermwhale said:

With so many serious criminals in this country -- murderers, kidnappers, people traffickers, hit and run drivers, serious embezzlers and thieves -- once again the useless Thai cops go for the low-hanging fruit. This country never changes. 

 

Well, that might be the easiest way to score, don't you think.

But never mind, police forces all over the world like easy pickings.

And of course arresting small fry, end users.

[spectrumisgreen]

2 hours ago, spermwhale said:

With so many serious criminals in this country -- murderers, kidnappers, people traffickers, hit and run drivers, serious embezzlers and thieves -- once again the useless Thai cops go for the low-hanging fruit. This country never changes. 

You seem to assume that all the above crims were bypassed to go just for this guy or suchlike.. Er, you know that how? Oh, I get it, the usual 'I just do, its just the way it is here!'.. again, er.. right.. so you're just another Negative Ninny, then, really? And, anyway, even if it were so, hardly something NOT thrown at law officers all around the world is it?.. You know, like "Shouldn't you be out catching serious criminals?', but, for the sake of not wanting to be  a foreigner heard NOT whinging constantly about something, here, lets make Thailand a 'special case' again and again and again, ad nauseum, ad infinitum, yeah?...  

Edited November 17, 2017 by spectrumisgreen

[PoorSucker]

17 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

There are multiple offences here but the cops have just gone with the easiest option.

Chewing tobacco is banned in Thailand.

The tobacco was smuggled.

No income tax was being paid.

No excise duty was being paid.

Here you can buy it, made in Thailand

https://www.siamsnus.com/

http://svensktsnus.co.th/?i=en

 

Cheaper than buying in Sweden and smuggle it.

[PoorSucker]

20 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

There are multiple offences here but the cops have just gone with the easiest option.

Chewing tobacco is banned in Thailand.

The tobacco was smuggled.

No income tax was being paid.

No excise duty was being paid.

Smokeless tobacco products such as snus may not be imported into Thailand. However, shredded tobacco is typically used for both hand-rolled cigarettes and smokeless tobacco products. Therefore, the health warnings for shredded tobacco and blended shredded tobacco are cited here. Picture and text warnings must occupy 55% of both PDAs (30% if the package is not rectangular) and be printed in four colors. There are four warnings prescribed and rotation must be at the rate of 500 packs/cartons per image. It should be noted, however, that the warnings pertain to “smoking” rather than chewing.

 

https://www.tobaccocontrollaws.org/legislation/country/thailand/pl-health-warnings

[Briggsy]

1 minute ago, PoorSucker said:

Here you can buy it.

https://www.siamsnus.com/

 

Cheaper than buying in Sweden and smuggle it.

There was an announcement several years ago about it being banned. Dunno if they backtracked on that, looks like they did.

 

These guys must be the connected, 50% cops beneficial ownership, the law doesn't apply, monopolistic sellers (just joking) (well 50%)  (actually not sure if I'm joking or not)

 

If you were showing me where I could buy some for myself, no thanks, I would rather suck on a pair of my sweaty socks.

[Moti24]

2 hours ago, dictater said:

How in this instance is he denying a Thai person work/income or profit? I know that is not the regulations on which the work permit is given but it is the basis on which the labor law was created. 

You'd be surprised at some of the things you can't do without a work permit.  I try not to think about it every time I sweep the soi outside the house.  But, if I don't do it, I'll have to wait for gale-force winds.  I really do despair sometimes.

[Raymonddiaz]

3 hours ago, bkkenglish said:

I wonder if the foreign police informant had a Work Permit?

I don't like rats

[PoorSucker]

7 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

If you were showing me where I could buy some for myself, no thanks, I would rather suck on a pair of my sweaty socks.

 

It helped me stop smoking 10 years ago.

[EcigAmateur]

3 hours ago, bkkenglish said:

I wonder if the foreign police informant had a Work Permit?

 

 

Of course not ! But snitches all over the world finally get punished for being SB, just be patient.

 

 

 

 

 

[jenny2017]

1 hour ago, khunpa said:

 

Because the informer is in trouble himself and now the Swedish guy can rat  someone else out  :-)

 

A story like this is a good example of why I would never do business here and why I never hang out with other Farangs here.

Another speculation that came to mind, because I do not understand the foreigner's action.

 

    Is it possible that they know each other and maybe run a business together? Or is it just the guy's wife, he'd like to have?

 

  Something doesn't add up here and smells damn fishy. 

[Briggsy]

1 minute ago, PoorSucker said:

 

It helped me stop smoking 10 years ago.

Were you then able to give up the chewing tobacco?

 

I gave up smoking 12 years ago by getting very drunk and smoking over a packet in a night. (not recommended method)

[bkkcanuck8]

22 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

 I don't think it was the online component that got the guy in trouble, though it does apparently violate WP laws.  I suspect the guy would have been fine if he hadn't actually delivered the goodies in Thailand (and in person, to boot). 

 

I struggle to see where travel blogging, online poker or shipping Thai made EBay goods overseas from Thailand would even ping the radar.  While technically illegal, the odds of getting caught are minuscule, and may be worth the risk for someone who can't afford to stay in Thailand without funding it somehow.  If they have to leave anyway due to no money, there's not much downside to making some YouTube money...

 

Playing poker online from Thailand would likely be considered an offence since you are gambling online from Thailand and gaming in Thailand is illegal.   If you are exporting physical goods from Thailand you are doing business in Thailand.  If you have a customer who has operations in Thailand you are doing business in Thailand.  If however you are doing online work (blogging, writing, software development) where you do no physical business in Thailand and you are not violating any laws elsewhere in the process (running a pirate site) -- then it is a grey area and you are safe under current enforcement (technically working illegally, but current interpretation is not).  This state of affairs with interpretations could change at any time.  Technically you could be on holiday and answering work emails - you are technically working illegally but the interpretation differs.  

 

The part that the individual probably ran afoul of was that he was doing physical business in Thailand (export).  He was therefore taking business away (likely at least some) from other operators that are legal businesses in Thailand.  Rule of thumb, don't do anything considered illegal in Thailand; Don't have any physical operations (customer or supplier; or ship from) in Thailand and you likely will never have any problems (interpretations could change at anytime).  

 

The other thing he ran afoul of is that there are certain products that are controlled and shipping products without the proper export/import licenses in place -- will get you into trouble and could get you deported to face justice in another country (i.e. if a certain product is legal in Thailand but you are shipping that product into a country where the product is controlled or illegal).